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Thread: Ford releases Mock 6.

  1. #51
    100 Miles from the B count55's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ford releases Mock 6.

    Quote Originally Posted by avoidingtheclowns View Post
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    look, you have to move tinsley but you can't cut off your nose to spite your face. that includes trading your best assets (granger, #11, o'neal) and devaluing them for the sake of moving one player. if it is going to take #11 to move tinsley you just don't do it. it isn't worth it. you move tinsley for anything and everything that is offered in return but not at the cost of destroying your other assets. but losing/devaluing other assets puts the team in much worse shape than if tinsley just stayed.

    trade tinsley for other unappealing contracts like jared jeffries, jerome james, tim thomas... but devaluing your best assets (like three years of cap space if you buy him out, trading a draft pick without getting a pick or anything of value back in return) is never a good idea. use guys like ike and quis to sweeten tinsley for people but not granger or first round picks.


    overall my point was jeff foster under no circumstances is worth the #5 pick. none. that is fourteen types of ridiculous. especially for a team as far away as the grizzlies are from competing.
    Quote Originally Posted by Justin Tyme View Post
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    Your opinion is duely noted, but I stick with my response. It would be a hard decision, but one I'd take much deliberation in making. Being ownership, I couldn't afford Tinsley... salarywise nor possible PRwise. The window of opportnity is closing fast on any GM sticking their neck out to take a chance on Tinsley. I'm not sure at this point any GM would/will take a chance on Tinsley. There comes a time when one has to cut their loss in business or a relationship. You try to do it the cheapest/easiest way you can.
    I think this is an interesting convo, and while it may be highjacking this thread a little, I'm conducting an experiment.

    I tend to agree with atc in that I think we can move Tinsley without packaging 1st rounders or Danny. I also think that a buyout is a poor decision. However, I feel he absolutely, positively, must go.

    It's far from scientific, but I wanted to get some more opinions on it. Fans from other teams are just as biased as we are, but they're at least a different perspective, so I posted this thread on the RealGM trade board to see what we'd get.

    It's already gotten the Jeffries/James offers, which I'd be fine with. I figure if no interest at all came back, then a buyout might be a more realistic option. I also thought getting other guys from other teams to look would come up with crap contracts that I couldn't.

    Like I said, it's not scientific in the least, but it is some different perspective. I feel like I, personally, am in brain lock about Droopy, and I suspect I'm not the only one that feels this way.

  2. #52
    White and Nerdy Anthem's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ford releases Mock 6.

    Quote Originally Posted by MillerTime View Post
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    Bird said that Randolph is the most talented big man in the draft.
    I try not to be as negative as Kegboy, but at this point I'm not exactly in awe at Bird's ability to scout talent.
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  3. #53
    Seize The Day carpediem024's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ford releases Mock 6.

    I'm just really hoping for the Pacers to acquire Gordon... someway he'll fit for us.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YMltKsoDwe8&NR=1
    press pause on the second slow-mo replay around 0:12 mark

  4. #54

    Default Re: Ford releases Mock 6.

    Quote Originally Posted by Anthem View Post
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    I try not to be as negative as Kegboy, but at this point I'm not exactly in awe at Bird's ability to scout talent.
    You mean like the James White fiasco, or never seeing the real talent when scouting Runi.... Anthony Parker? BC stole the prize right out from under Bird's nose. That truly bothers me more than the James White drafting.

    I'm not a believer in Bird's ability to know talent, and have been extremely harsh on him the last few years. I've eased up lately giving him some room to make me either eat crow down the road, or hang himself. I know what I'd prefer, but the Pacers come 1st. I'm just afraid he'll botch this draft. I truly hope he doesn't for the Pacers sake.

    Even if Bird doesn't pick players I want, he needs to choose ones that will be good future players for the franchise's sake, and his own future.

  5. #55
    Lifer 2minutes twowa's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ford releases Mock 6.

    Quote Originally Posted by Justin Tyme View Post
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    You mean like the James White fiasco, or never seeing the real talent when scouting Runi.... Anthony Parker? BC stole the prize right out from under Bird's nose. That truly bothers me more than the James White drafting.

    I'm not a believer in Bird's ability to know talent, and have been extremely harsh on him the last few years. I've eased up lately giving him some room to make me either eat crow down the road, or hang himself. I know what I'd prefer, but the Pacers come 1st. I'm just afraid he'll botch this draft. I truly hope he doesn't for the Pacers sake.

    Even if Bird doesn't pick players I want, he needs to choose ones that will be good future players for the franchise's sake, and his own future.
    I know what you mean. You couldn't judge him on the no-brainer Granger pick or last years 1st round absence. One thing's for sure, he is the man now, so it's time to step back and see what he can do
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  6. #56
    100 Miles from the B count55's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ford releases Mock 6.

    Quote Originally Posted by 2minutes twowa View Post
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    I know what you mean. You couldn't judge him on the no-brainer Granger pick or last years 1st round absence. One thing's for sure, he is the man now, so it's time to step back and see what he can do
    I never agree with not giving any credit for the Granger pick. In my 15 years experieince in multiple industries, it never ceases to amaze me at the sheer volume of stupid decisions that get made and stupid actions that get taken. There is no such thing as a "no-brainer" because there's always that risk that someone will want to be too smart, too clever for their own good. [Edit: Ladies and Gentlemen, I give you Sam Bowie over Michael Jordan (and arguably Olajuwon, but that's less clear.)]

    I mean, how many times on this board alone have people advocated taking the exciting pick of a Randolph or a Jordan over a less attractive, but far less risky alternative? I'd bet a surprising number of GM's would've taken Gerald Green because "he could be a star".

    I guess my point is, until people stop jabbing themselves in the eye with sharp sticks on a regular basis just to be clever, I think it's good to acknowledge and reinforce sound, if unexciting, decisions.

    Was it the shrewdest move in the history of basketball? No. Was it the best (and perhaps only good) thing to happen to this franchise since the brawl? Yeah, probably.
    Last edited by count55; 06-24-2008 at 01:52 PM.

  7. #57
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    Default Re: Ford releases Mock 6.

    Quote Originally Posted by count55 View Post
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    I never agree with not giving any credit for the Granger pick. In my 15 years experieince in multiple industries, it never ceases to amaze me at the sheer volume of stupid decisions that get made and stupid actions that get taken. There is no such thing as a "no-brainer" because there's always that risk that someone will want to be too smart, too clever for their own good. [Edit: Ladies and Gentlemen, I give you Sam Bowie over Michael Jordan (and arguably Olajuwon, but that's less clear.)]

    I mean, how many times on this board alone have people advocated taking the exciting pick of a Randolph or a Jordan over a less attractive, but far less risky alternative? I'd bet a surprising number of GM's would've taken Gerald Green because "he could be a star".

    I guess my point is, until people stop jabbing themselves in the eye with sharp sticks on a regular basis just to be clever, I think it's good to acknowledge and reinforce sound, if unexciting, decisions.

    Was it the shrewdest move in the history of basketball? No. Was it the best (and perhaps only good) thing to happen to this franchise since the brawl? Yeah, probably.
    I tend to agree here. In fact, weren't some people on the board (or it could have been RATS) upset that Green wasn't taken, because "he could be the next T-Mac."?

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    Default Re: Ford releases Mock 6.

    Bird's trip up on Runi, wasn't that much of a trip up to begin with.

    Indiana was in a dog fight with several other teams to get him. It's not like he went over and thought he found an undiscovered gem. Runi was being sought after by several teams.

    Bird was able to convince him to sign here for less money than Cleveland, and Clev. also has Z on their roster who just happens to be Runi's bestfriend.

    It was an amazing signing considering how he got him. Only if he would have signed 3-4 years earlier when he actually could have produced in the NBA.

  9. #59
    Lifer 2minutes twowa's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ford releases Mock 6.

    Quote Originally Posted by count55 View Post
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    I never agree with not giving any credit for the Granger pick. In my 15 years experieince in multiple industries, it never ceases to amaze me at the sheer volume of stupid decisions that get made and stupid actions that get taken. There is no such thing as a "no-brainer" because there's always that risk that someone will want to be too smart, too clever for their own good. [Edit: Ladies and Gentlemen, I give you Sam Bowie over Michael Jordan (and arguably Olajuwon, but that's less clear.)]

    I mean, how many times on this board alone have people advocated taking the exciting pick of a Randolph or a Jordan over a less attractive, but far less risky alternative? I'd bet a surprising number of GM's would've taken Gerald Green because "he could be a star".

    I guess my point is, until people stop jabbing themselves in the eye with sharp sticks on a regular basis just to be clever, I think it's good to acknowledge and reinforce sound, if unexciting, decisions.

    Was it the shrewdest move in the history of basketball? No. Was it the best (and perhaps only good) thing to happen to this franchise since the brawl? Yeah, probably.
    Agreed. But when a top 7 guy drops to you at 17, the blame is more likely to be placed on the player than management if he's a bust. The same could be said about the Colts. When they drafted Wayne and Clark, I wasn't too happy because we needed defense at the time. When your in the organization, the big picture is a whole lot clearer than when your on the outside looking in. Sorry, I know this isn't a Colts thread
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    Default Re: Ford releases Mock 6.

    Quote Originally Posted by Since86 View Post
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    Bird's trip up on Runi, wasn't that much of a trip up to begin with.

    Indiana was in a dog fight with several other teams to get him. It's not like he went over and thought he found an undiscovered gem. Runi was being sought after by several teams.

    Bird was able to convince him to sign here for less money than Cleveland, and Clev. also has Z on their roster who just happens to be Runi's bestfriend.

    It was an amazing signing considering how he got him. Only if he would have signed 3-4 years earlier when he actually could have produced in the NBA.

    If your reply is in referrence to my post concerning Bird mistake, my comment was about how he MISSED the better player in Anthony Parker when scouting Runi. My comment was in referrence to Bird's ability to judge talent nothing about whether the signing of Runi was a mistake.

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    Member Since86's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ford releases Mock 6.

    Hindsight is 20/20.

    Runi is actually a year younger, and had accomplished quite a bit on the international level against the US team. He was also considered the engine that ran Tel Aviv.

    EDIT: IIRC he was also considered one of, if not the best player in Europe at the time. He just busted, but everyone was fooled by him. Everyone wanted him.

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