i'm officially on the westbrook bandwagon. i like what i'm reading.
i'm officially on the westbrook bandwagon. i like what i'm reading.
I completely agree. Westbrook is exactly what we need and we could turn the corner as a team with a player of his abilities. I like Augustin but there's no question that defense is our biggest weakness. In either case, we have to take a point guard without a doubt.
I'm really torn on the idea of drafting Westbrook. He could be a steal or a complete dud.
1) He does not have the size to be a great defender at the 2 guard, IMO. While he will be able to bother some guys with his quickness, others will abuse him with thier strength advatage. Seems to me that if he is going to be worth the 11th pick, he has got to be able to play PG. He does intrigue me as a PG prospect, and could be a Rajon Rondo type lead guard. But I haven't seen him enough to feel comfortable with us taking him.
2) He has not played enough point guard to be able to tell if he can play it at the NBA level. PG is one position where there is a huge leap from NCAA to NBA. The draft camps and workouts will go along way to help make the determination, but it's still a complete guessing game.
3) If he can't play either position effectively, you cannot have him on the floor. Therefor, his defensive abilities are a complete waste. An example of this is Greg Buckner, who is a tenacious defender. But he does not have the size or skillset to play either position well enough to be a major contributor. And whatever team he is on can't play him down the stretch of important games because of his glaring weaknesses, when his defensive abilities are needed most.
I agree that if he can play the point effectively, he fills some glaring weaknesses we have very well. I hope he's there so we have the choice. But if he looks like he needs a lot of work to be able to play the point, I would rather us take Deandre Jordan and put the time in development into him.
Wow. I think Westbrook can be a good player, but I certainly don't see him being a star. Not even close.
It's a sign of a bad draft when everyone is talking about trading down.
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Hey, if he drops to 11 I'll be thrilled. Basically somebody has to drop. I just hope it's not Augustin.
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Nothing else needs to be said
I see Westbrook, at worst, as finding his niche being a defensive stopper. Hopefully he develops some kind of consistent jumper and becomes a great perimeter player on offense as well.
westbrook has the physical abilities to be a legit all-star. few pg's in the league would have his size and athletic ability. the minute he's drafted, he's already an above average defender at the point position. he literally shut down guys like mayo and bayless all season long. all he needs to do is develop pg instincts and a jump shot. everything i have read says he is a gym rat, which tells me that that development is possible.
augustin is a nice player, but he's not a starting pg on a contending team. he's a rich man's jameer nelson. pg's like arenas, billups, williams, etc would eat him for lunch.
i'm willing to take the risk on westbrook. at worst he's a defensive stopper off the bench.
No small feat.
Nobody's worried about his defense at the 1 spot, or even his ability to score on opposing PGs. We need more than that from a point man, though. You don't learn to run a team by working out in a gym.
Not saying he can't (and I'd be glad to draft him) but it's not a sure thing.
Last edited by Anthem; 06-02-2008 at 10:31 PM.
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Augustin at #6? Really?
And I still say we need to trade into a late first and nab Chalmers, even if we take Augustin/Westbrook at #11. In fact, especially if we take Westbrook, because he's more of a SG anyway.
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I'd be fairly happy if we could get Westbrook.
the pacers really need to try to steal that #13 from portland...foster for pryz + #13?
EDIT: or maybe some sort of deal involving jo and that #13 pick being the key...i'd be less inclined to want granger gone if we could somehow acquire a solid pick without giving him up...
Last edited by croz24; 06-02-2008 at 11:36 PM.
Lopez is slipping a lot. He was projected to go around 3 a few months ago. I hope he keeps dropping, I would rather have him than a PG
You know i'm not a fan of most of the bigs in this draft but if we take one we might as take that French big. Trade for a later pick maybe.
I never seen him play but there are just so many question marks surronding most these bigs this french big man sounds as good as any of em.
I've stuck up for Westbrook other than the non-PG thing, but at the same time I don't see it as a HR pick. I'd be far more thrilled with Love and his game smarts. It's just that I do see the athletic ability in Westbrook and think that part is legit.
However I think he might have the impact of an Augman perhaps, though it's Weaver who reminds me most of SA in terms of body type and playing style.
Not necessarily at 11, but the guys I most want to be Pacers after watching them play at least a couple of games, in order:
Love, Mayo, Rush, Chalmers, Arthur, Weaver, Lee, Westbrook, Walker
Rose and Beas I didn't even bother naming, and I almost left Mayo off too. EJ and Lopez I'd be fine with at 11 but I wouldn't trade up to go get them. There are some other potentially talented guys out there but most of them didn't grab me as someone I really want on the team (or don't want for that matter, more like meh).
Some guys on my list I like more specifically because I think the Pacers could get them with their 2nd pick or trading back into round 1/up from their 2nd pick.
You want highlights try this instead of 'brook dunking on a guy that should have had the charge taken.
Love, taking it out of the net on a make, 2 hand chest pass instant fastbreak. You don't need to run to be part of a running game...
BTW, he did this EVERY game I saw him play.
Everytime I see Russell Westbrook -I see Fred Jones -- sorry that doesn't thrill me at all.
One more, Weaver pulls a Prince and runs down Westbrook. Weaver plays a little wing point and is a monster defender, and can be had in the late first or maybe even early 2nd. He's also got a really solid family situation and work ethic that puts him in line with Augustin somewhat. Wingspan is probably an issue, as is consistent offense, but he does give you a lot of what you want from Westbrook for a lot cheaper.
Last edited by Naptown_Seth; 06-03-2008 at 01:13 AM.
As I keep saying, Love scores from below the shoulders already, he pushes off, steps away or just gets things up quick. This is why I compare him to McHale. Watch the YouTube of Love's output vs Oregon and compare to the McHale footage ESPN Classic is running for the BOS/LAL series.6'8 1/2" without shoes does scare me
It's very similar in a "he got stats doing it THAT way" style. He didn't use height or speed at UCLA to have success, so it doesn't bother me that he won't have those to lean on in the NBA either.
I actually worry more when I see the Westbrook leaner dunk on a guy almost taking a charge because at the next level I don't think he gets that play. However I think Westbrook is great in the loose ball/improv situations so I still like him.
naptown - but do you really believe that style can translate to the nba? i'm not sure i can name you one successful big man with love's size, body type, and athleticism in the nba right now...he could be THE exception, but it'd definitely be a risk hoping he is.
i still don't understand the infatuation with westbrook. it seems those who watched him extensively at ucla, are a little down on him. those going by the scouting reports and camp results are obsessed with him.
He is big, athletic, capable of defending, hard worker, coachable, teamplayer, etc. He is a fairly safe pick. Compared to the bigs like McGee, Jordan they have some serious question marks. There is really no safe big man to take in this draft aside from Michael Beasley.
I'm not someone who is obsessed with Westbrook by any means. But I do like him as a prospect. I also don't expect him to be a top player. I always like to think of him to be similar to Antonio Daniels.
If Pacers want a home run type of pick they better move up to get Eric Gordon or look at DJ Augistin (better chance of being a star than Westbrook IMO) or look at maybe Donte Greene or one of the big guys.
Westbrook, IMO, is a safe pick.
but yes, really any time you have a hard worker like westbrook they are ultimately safe picks and tend to improve through the years. this is the reason i like joe alexander so much. the pacers need the fire and intensity they've lacked since ron was here. if we do indeed draft westbrook, hopefully he can bring that. for that same reason, i don't like ej. ej just has never been disciplined off the court, almost never shows any sort of fire (typical of most indiana high schoolers), and just doesn't have that great of a work ethic.
i crave for that competitve spirit in players. guys who i've seen with the passion and work ethic you speak of imo are (in order): oj mayo, joe alexander, russell westbrook, derrick rose, anthony randolph, kevin love, jerryd bayless and then the drop off...
i'd say you are correct about the bigs. the bigs in this draft have potential, but there really is no safe pick there. the safest bigs would probably be jason thompson and joey dorsey ("safe" lol) based on where they're likely to be drafted and their potential roles on the teams who draft them.
Last edited by croz24; 06-03-2008 at 01:54 AM.