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Thread: Fix your face, mainstream music

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    Default Fix your face, mainstream music

    Unfortunately I decided to listen to the radio this morning on my way home after my final. Normally I don't partake in such activities - not only because I don't have any desire to be brainwashed by Clear Channel and their blatant disregard for human intelligence - but because the mainstream music nowadays is completely intolerable for the most part. I've constructed a list of helpful suggestions for bringing mainstream radio and music back to some level of respectability...

    1) Song title should be accompanied by the track's producer, not the artist. If your song is a mainstream hit, it's obviously not a result of profound and pleasing lyrical quality - it's because the production value is great and the beat is catchy and keeps your attention (and distracts you from the artist slobbering all over it). For instance, Usher's new song (I'm actually not sure if it's new but I assume it's a recent song) should be labeled as such: "**** in this ****" by Polow da Don featuring Usher. I'll elaborate on the asterisks in my next point. How many times have you been captivated by the eloquent message conveyed by a mainstream artist as of late? I'd be willing to guess it pretty much never happens that way. Conversely, if you hear a hot beat you'll be more inclined to listen to the song regardless of the lyrics that you must sit through.

    2) Certain words/phrases need to be censored or banned completely: Hustle, club, shine, love, drank, on lock, rims, shawty, boss, sippin', make it rain, grill, and the like. I can't think of any more (thank god) but feel free to add some more as racking my brain for these linguistic abominations is making me more stupid by the second.

    3) Old school is not Mase. Old school is not a limited selection of Tupac and Biggie singles from 1995-96. That is a pathetic sample size and marginalizes an entire generation's musical contributions. Old school should be Wu-Tang, N.W.A., Run DMC, ATCQ, Public Enemy, Pete Rock, and the like. Otherwise don't even bother fooling your audience with flashback tracks that are so limited in selection that it is only a disservice to that entire genre (my examples were rap-centric, but I'm sure those of you with varied tastes can understand this sentiment as well).

    4) All "musicians" from Atlanta - except Andre 3000 and Cee-Lo - should have their recording contracts immediately terminated. There's just nothing of substance there and there definitely won't be, at least for the foreseeable future. However, the record companies are perpetuating the cycle by pushing this region's "music" on the rest of the country, assuming we'll value it for its "originality." That's bullsh*t. There's nothing original about making music with no rhythm or point.

    5. Eliminate T-Pain and Akon. While we're at it, eliminate the clowns who felt it was necessary to completely saturate the market with their music. You take away the voice manipulation and heavy studio editing, and these two are flipping burgers for a living. Nothing further needs to be said.

    6. Lazy, uninspired repetition does not equate to forming a catchy hook (that's the chorus for you old folks) and should not be utilized as it's very obviously the easiest way out. Additionally, for some reason these modern-day musicians find it reasonable to copy phrases used previously in other recent songs and assume nobody will notice.

    7. Being "talented" should only get you so far. I hear people telling me all the time that Alicia Keys is legitimately talented and should be commended. At some point, you have to disregard someone's talent if their lyrical versatility is so severely limited that they only speak about one incredibly generic topic (in her case, men and love troubles). I'm sure women across the world are sincerely glad that female musicians commonly declare their physical and emotional dependance on men - that's progress, right? Can anyone remember the last time a female artist freely and forcefully expressed their opinion on an important issue that mobilized women everywhere to further that cause? I find it disappointing - not just in the music industry, but in the entire spectrum of American media and culture - that most women are oblivious to how much more they need to fight for and how much more they deserve. There's a quote that aptly describes this American phenomenon: "You are a nation that exploits women like consumer products... You then rant that you support the liberation of women." Okay, I definitely veered off course on that one but my point remains the same.


    Let's see some more suggestions, I'm sure I forgot something that must irritate someone else.

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    Default Re: Fix your face, mainstream music

    The appropriate title for this thread is:

    ROT IN HELL, MAINSTREAM MUSIC!!!

    With that said, I don't think I'll ever understand the appeal of rap in the first place. Just like I don't get country or stuff like the Macarena.

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    Administrator Peck's Avatar
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    Default Re: Fix your face, mainstream music

    While I agree with many of your assertions, I have to ask. Are you equating mainstream music only hip/hop rap?

    I mean while your old school RUN DMC, NWA, etc., etc. are fine they are very much only rap stars.

    I have also recently made it a point to listen to modern music, I tend to do this about every 7 years or so, and I was very much suprised that a lot of the music from today was not generated by rap/soul/hip/hop artist.

    Actaully I was shocked to hear songs like Money Honey and In love with a girl were actually popular. I was even more stunned that I actually liked the song Money Honey.

    While I notice that Rihanna, Lil Wayne and Usher are still up on top it was actually kind of suprising that other forms of music are starting to creep back into the mainstream.

    Actually I guess my question is, and please remember I'm an old man, does hip/hop still rule the mainstream like it did and if not how long has this been?

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    Default Re: Fix your face, mainstream music

    I was once a fan of the Hip hop. But do to fortunate events in my life I have chosen to forsake Hip Hop that contradict those events.

    But looking back I realize that the goal is to make money. Everyone "sells out" to sell more. No matter what, they make records to make a living. And when the majority of buyers are in one demographic (not talking about a racial demographic either, more an age demographic) they will milk those buyers interests.

    I'm sure women across the world are sincerely glad that female musicians commonly declare their physical and emotional dependance on men - that's progress, right?
    This will never change. Both men and women feel that the other can validate them as men and women. Hooking up with 47 women does not make you a man. Just like having a man taking care of you does not make you a woman. What really gives us validation anyway?



    Last edited by Major Cold; 05-19-2008 at 12:40 PM.

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    Default Re: Fix your face, mainstream music

    I am personally equating mainstream music with mainstream hip hop, for the most part. I just don't really listen to the other genres in general - haven't for about 10 years now.

    I would say hip hop doesn't rule the mainstream but it dominates a lot of trends in mainstream and is a significant portion of what young people listen to.

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    Default Re: Fix your face, mainstream music

    I decided I should add a bit more to the thread:

    Quote Originally Posted by ajbry View Post
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    2) Certain words/phrases need to be censored or banned completely: Hustle, club, shine, love, drank, on lock, rims, shawty, boss, sippin', make it rain, grill, and the like. I can't think of any more (thank god) but feel free to add some more as racking my brain for these linguistic abominations is making me more stupid by the second.
    I would love to hear a rap song with proper English. Or even one complete sentence. It would blow my mind.

    3) Old school is not Mase. Old school is not a limited selection of Tupac and Biggie singles from 1995-96. That is a pathetic sample size and marginalizes an entire generation's musical contributions. Old school should be Wu-Tang, N.W.A., Run DMC, ATCQ, Public Enemy, Pete Rock, and the like. Otherwise don't even bother fooling your audience with flashback tracks that are so limited in selection that it is only a disservice to that entire genre (my examples were rap-centric, but I'm sure those of you with varied tastes can understand this sentiment as well).
    It's quite clear that "old school" refers to M.C. Hammer and...uh...Vanilla Ice.

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    4) All "musicians" from Atlanta - except Andre 3000 and Cee-Lo - should have their recording contracts immediately terminated. There's just nothing of substance there and there definitely won't be, at least for the foreseeable future. However, the record companies are perpetuating the cycle by pushing this region's "music" on the rest of the country, assuming we'll value it for its "originality." That's bullsh*t. There's nothing original about making music with no rhythm or point.
    As long as people keep buying crap, crap will keep coming down the pipeline.

    5. Eliminate T-Pain and Akon. While we're at it, eliminate the clowns who felt it was necessary to completely saturate the market with their music. You take away the voice manipulation and heavy studio editing, and these two are flipping burgers for a living. Nothing further needs to be said.
    That could be said of a looooot of musicians. I guess this is one reason I don't like rap; I can't appreciate it. It just doesn't seem to require much talent to be a rap artist. No singing, no instruments...just rhyming. Yay.

    6. Lazy, uninspired repetition does not equate to forming a catchy hook (that's the chorus for you old folks) and should not be utilized as it's very obviously the easiest way out. Additionally, for some reason these modern-day musicians find it reasonable to copy phrases used previously in other recent songs and assume nobody will notice.
    Not to mention the overflow of cover songs that keep flooding the market. Talk about originality.

    7. Being "talented" should only get you so far. I hear people telling me all the time that Alicia Keys is legitimately talented and should be commended. At some point, you have to disregard someone's talent if their lyrical versatility is so severely limited that they only speak about one incredibly generic topic (in her case, men and love troubles). I'm sure women across the world are sincerely glad that female musicians commonly declare their physical and emotional dependance on men - that's progress, right? Can anyone remember the last time a female artist freely and forcefully expressed their opinion on an important issue that mobilized women everywhere to further that cause? I find it disappointing - not just in the music industry, but in the entire spectrum of American media and culture - that most women are oblivious to how much more they need to fight for and how much more they deserve. There's a quote that aptly describes this American phenomenon: "You are a nation that exploits women like consumer products... You then rant that you support the liberation of women." Okay, I definitely veered off course on that one but my point remains the same.
    Obviously, talent evaluation is in the eye of the beholder, but I consider someone talented when I admire what they can do. I have yet to hear a rap artist that I admire. I think, with rap in particular, it's more about the message than the music.

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    Administrator Peck's Avatar
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    Default Re: Fix your face, mainstream music

    Quote Originally Posted by ajbry View Post
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    I am personally equating mainstream music with mainstream hip hop, for the most part. I just don't really listen to the other genres in general - haven't for about 10 years now.

    I would say hip hop doesn't rule the mainstream but it dominates a lot of trends in mainstream and is a significant portion of what young people listen to.
    Ok, cool thanks.

    BTW, just out of curiostiy what other forms of music did you listen to 10 years ago and why did you stop?

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    Default Re: Fix your face, mainstream music

    Quote Originally Posted by Shade View Post
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    I would love to hear a rap song with proper English.

    Why?
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    Default Re: Fix your face, mainstream music

    Quote Originally Posted by SoupIsGood View Post
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    Why?
    Because then I could actually understand what is being said.

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    Default Re: Fix your face, mainstream music

    Quote Originally Posted by Peck View Post
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    Ok, cool thanks.

    BTW, just out of curiostiy what other forms of music did you listen to 10 years ago and why did you stop?
    Ten years ago, I guess when I was about 9 or 10, I'd just listen to whatever was on the radio. You name it and my friends and I probably loved it. Smashmouth, TLC, Eiffel 65, Alanis Morissette, Will Smith, etc.

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    It Might Be a Soft J JayRedd's Avatar
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    Default Re: Fix your face, mainstream music

    Stopped listening to the radio myself a while back. I still hear some of that nonsense, but since I'm rarely in cars nowadays nor do I go to clubs where they play the current "bangers" much lately, I find myself woefully ignorant for the most part. I even miss out on a lot of the mixtape stuff now, too.

    I'm not saying any of this is a bad thing, but I just don't hear much mainstream stuff aside from the real heavyweights like Jay, Kanye, Nas, etc...and of course Weezy, who I make sure to track down on Hip Hop Game and the like.

    There's still a lot of good hip hop out there if you look around though, as I'm sure you know. And really, I think it's for the best that that mainstream stuff is horrible. It's largely been trash since like 2004 and this can't go on for much long before the whole genre falls out of popular flavor. And once it crawls back into the basement it has to improve...or at least change the subject matter away from pretending to have money.

    Cause at this point, it's like the early 00s NBA where everyone -- including Ricky Davis -- wanted to be Mike. In the rap game, everyone wants to be Jay and they're swaggerjacking his whole demeanor. It was cool for him and worked cause it was real, but you can't have 100 mainstream rappers all walking around thinking they're the coolest, richest and ballingest dude in the industry. It's just tacky and unoriginal.

    Take it back to the basement and we'll get more Little Brothers, Techniques, Co Flows, Dilateds, Ghosts, Masta Aces, Jedi Minds, De Las and Redmans coming out of the woodwork.

    Also...On ATL: Luda can keep spitting. And if Cee Lo could track down the rest of Goodie Mob, I would rejoice.

    And Alicia Keys is really talented. She can sing about duct tape if she wants and it will still often be good.
    Last edited by JayRedd; 05-19-2008 at 01:35 PM.

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    Default Re: Fix your face, mainstream music

    I stopped listening to hip/hop as my main music genre early in college. I guess I just grew out of it (I only really listened to it for like a couple years). I like more mellow stuff, and more catchy stuff.

    And I still enjoy my classical. Can't beat that
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    Default Re: Fix your face, mainstream music

    Quote Originally Posted by JayRedd View Post
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    There's still a lot of good hip hop out there if you look around though, as I'm sure you know. And really, I think it's for the best that that mainstream stuff is horrible. It's largely been trash since like 2004 and this can't go on for much long before the whole genre falls out of popular flavor. And once it crawls back into the basement it has to improve...or at least change the subject matter away from pretending to have money.

    Cause at this point, it's like the early 00s NBA where everyone -- including Ricky Davis -- wanted to be Mike. In the rap game, everyone wants to be Jay and they're swaggerjacking his whole demeanor. It was cool for him and worked cause it was real, but you can't have 100 mainstream rappers all waling around thinking they're the coolest, richest and ballingest dude in the industry.
    Bingo. That's good *** analysis.

    But what if current rap doesn't actually fall out of favor? It's held on for several years at this level and shows no signs of slowing. I mean, Soulja Boy is still relevant - if he's not enough to wake up the general public and begin the gradual downfall of modern rap, what will?

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    Default Re: Fix your face, mainstream music

    Quote Originally Posted by JayRedd View Post
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    but since I'm rarely in cars nowadays...
    Amazing.

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    Default Re: Fix your face, mainstream music

    Other than cabs -- which play 90% salsa, merengue or bachata -- I don't think I've been in a car in close to a month.

    You may be right, ajbry. But tastes are cyclical and you'd think it would have to change soon, right? Rap has been dominant since like, what, 1998 at this point?

    I guess this nonsense has been able to hold on so long because the biggest demographic for music is probably 10- to 18 year-olds, who we all know are pretty dumb and, among the current generation anyway, aren't really looking for any sort of depth of content. The "catchyness" of beat making has to help as well, but this just can't go on forever.

    But a new version of grunge, disco or punk has to emerge eventually and take the youth of America by storm eventually, right?
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    Default Re: Fix your face, mainstream music

    Quote Originally Posted by ajbry View Post
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    Bingo. That's good *** analysis.

    But what if current rap doesn't actually fall out of favor? It's held on for several years at this level and shows no signs of slowing. I mean, Soulja Boy is still relevant - if he's not enough to wake up the general public and begin the gradual downfall of modern rap, what will?
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    Default Re: Fix your face, mainstream music

    Quote Originally Posted by JayRedd View Post
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    But a new version of grunge, disco or punk has to emerge eventually and take the youth of America by storm eventually, right?
    I'd put money on it that the next trend - whenever it does indeed rise up - will be something heavily electronic-based. The culture of music and the culture of nightlife and clubs are so intertwined these days to the point that the two are inseparable. The demographic that record companies aim at won't be enthusiastic about traditional music. Some Americans are already into house, trance, and the like... I can see that being the path to the next big thing. God, that's going to suck.

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    Default Re: Fix your face, mainstream music

    I'd be curious to see what the breakdown is between the various musical worlds.

    I know there are legions of the country music folk out there too and that world is going strong.

    I'm in neither of these worlds. Of course I'm old and irrelevant but I did get my first ipod this month.


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    Default Re: Fix your face, mainstream music

    Quote Originally Posted by ajbry View Post
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    I'd put money on it that the next trend - whenever it does indeed rise up - will be something heavily electronic-based. The culture of music and the culture of nightlife and clubs are so intertwined these days to the point that the two are inseparable. The demographic that record companies aim at won't be enthusiastic about traditional music. Some Americans are already into house, trance, and the like... I can see that being the path to the next big thing. God, that's going to suck.
    I'm afraid you're right.

    I've often thought how funny it's going to be when I'm in my 50s and listening to "Classic Hip Hop" like Raekwon, Illmatic and Big L and my kids are going to think I'm some lame old man listening to dinosaur music that wasn't made by computers. And I'm going to think their stuff is just as incomprehensible, obnoxious and non-musical as my parents thought 36 Chambers and Ready to Die were.
    Last edited by JayRedd; 05-19-2008 at 02:16 PM.

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    Default Re: Fix your face, mainstream music

    Quote Originally Posted by JayRedd View Post
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    I've often thought how funny it's going to be when I'm in my 50s and listening to "Classic Hip Hop" like Raekwon, Illmatic and Big L and my kids are going to think I'm some lame old man listening to dinosaur music that wasn't made by computers. And I'm going to think their stuff is just as incomprehensible, obnoxious and non-musical as my parents thought 36 Chambers and Ready to Die were.


    And that speaks perfectly to the point you made about it being cyclical. Either way, your tastes are going to be disconnected from the next generation regardless of what the music actually sounds like.

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    Default Re: Fix your face, mainstream music

    If we could load Soulja Boy and his ilk onto a bus I would drive to the edge of the ocean and put the rock on the pedal.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Shade View Post
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    I would love to hear a rap song with proper English. Or even one complete sentence. It would blow my mind.
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    Default Re: Fix your face, mainstream music

    I can listen to any genra of music, from country to rap to classical, but I rarely listen to them outside of the Christian music field now. Music is very personal to me and I like getting good messages with a variety of styles.

    I know who most of the current stars are through reading about them, but I have no clue what their songs are.

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    Default Re: Fix your face, mainstream music

    Quote Originally Posted by ajbry View Post
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    I'd put money on it that the next trend - whenever it does indeed rise up - will be something heavily electronic-based. The culture of music and the culture of nightlife and clubs are so intertwined these days to the point that the two are inseparable. The demographic that record companies aim at won't be enthusiastic about traditional music. Some Americans are already into house, trance, and the like... I can see that being the path to the next big thing. God, that's going to suck.

    I would think whatever would take off next would be something that is different from current trends rather than some melting pot of them. There could/would certainly be flavors of them around but overall I'd expect the final product to be more different.
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    Default Re: Fix your face, mainstream music

    I've heard good things about Mos Def, especially from the activist community. I think rap music can have - and indeed has had - the same transformative power as some folk and rock music did in the 1950s and 1960s, which is why, even though I myself do not find it culturally relevant, I can see its value.

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