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How will Artest act if.....

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  • How will Artest act if.....

    he is relagated to our third option on offense?

    Let's assume for a min. that Al & (fill in the blank) are traded for a guard who fills the need. Somebody who can stick the outside jumper & can create his own shot.

    Would Ron be satisfied with being the third scoring option?

    Does winning sooth all wounds & would he gladly accept it if the team were winning?

    I was wondering this yesterday.

    Let's actually take a vote on this.

    How many of you think Ron would do whatever was best for the team & gladly fall in line for a better shooter?

    How many of you think that Ron would go with whatever mood struck him based on good & bad times?

    How many of you think that Ron would hate & would eventually revolt from an offensive system that got him less shots a game than he gets now?


    Basketball isn't played with computers, spreadsheets, and simulations. ChicagoJ 4/21/13

  • #2
    Re: How will Artest act if.....

    Considering the fact that he only takes a lot of shots if the team "runs bad" i.e. the offense is not firing on all cylinders.
    Considering he gladly passes off to "open" players of JO (see his Assist)
    Considering winning is ALL important to Ron
    Considering his strength and pride lies in defense, not offense, and
    Considering he has never said he wanted to be 1st or 2nd option, he only said(says) that they should go to him when things are on the line.

    I think Ron does not care one bit if he were 5th option in offense, providing the others "do their job".

    His assistnumbers wouldn't be where they are if he were unwilling to share, unlike some.

    It is more the blackhole mentality on some on the team that he is objecting to and then he says that he is a better option (which happens to be true).

    Ron's only "revolt" from the offense has been one shared by the others on the team, they feel they can do a lot more then half-court grind out.

    Yes, with Tins this team can run, something we missed more then most of you are considering against Detroit, we simply did not have our speed in the offense, resulting in a ready defense, and grindout play that does not really work against Detroit.

    Ron merely tried to force in some games and not in others, what no one seems to notice is that A. a lot of Ron's shots are "winding down shotclock shots", B. When we win he takes more then when we lose:


    Detroit series: Game 1 win, 6 - 23, Game 2 Loss, 5 - 21, Game 3 Loss, 4 - 13, Game 4 Win, 8 - 19, Game 5 Loss, 4 - 15, Game 6 Loss, 4 - 13

    Ron does sometimes (a lot of times) save us, he creates when all else fails and then often "saves the day" he is not the type of player that demands shots, or turns into a black hole.

    He averages 3.2 Ast over the Playoffs, #3 on the team.
    So Long And Thanks For All The Fish.

    If you've done 6 impossible things today?
    Then why not have Breakfast at Milliways!

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: How will Artest act if.....

      At times Ron also turns into an overgrown Travis Best. Holding the ball at the 3-point arch trying to figure out what to do with the ball until it is almost too late. I like Ron, but he helps stagnate the offense sometimes. Now maybe this is partially his teamates blame and partially the offensive set's balme, but I'd sure like to see more ball movement out there and less "thinking about it".

      However, I don't think he'd care about being, 3rd, 4th, or even 5th option as long as we win. But I also fear that in a tight crucial game he may revert back to the guy we say in game 6 who broke off plays and decided he knew best how to win the game.
      Ever notice how friendly folks are at a shootin' range??.

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: How will Artest act if.....

        he is relagated to our third option on offense?

        Let's assume for a min. that Al & (fill in the blank) are traded for a guard who fills the need. Somebody who can stick the outside jumper & can create his own shot.

        Would Ron be satisfied with being the third scoring option?

        [color=darkred:392e43b740]No, but I don't think he would be. To get Tmac, Pierce, or Allen we would have to give up Ron. Those are the only guys I can think of that would get more shots than him. Remember Carlisle likes to work inside out, so most guards are going to get less shots.[/color]

        Does winning sooth all wounds & would he gladly accept it if the team were winning?

        I was wondering this yesterday.

        Let's actually take a vote on this.

        How many of you think Ron would do whatever was best for the team & gladly fall in line for a better shooter?

        How many of you think that Ron would go with whatever mood struck him based on good & bad times?
        [color=darkred:392e43b740]More or less this option. Ron is strong willed. As long as the team is winning he doesn't complain because winning is what he's about. When the team is losing Ron tries to do more and goes off on his own.[/color]
        How many of you think that Ron would hate & would eventually revolt from an offensive system that got him less shots a game than he gets now?

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: How will Artest act if.....

          I would like to nominate able's post for "post of the year". No, make that post of the century.

          As much as I would like to add something, there is nothing to add, adjust or comment on what able has posted.

          Except to say those are my thoughts exactly.


          While everyone is answering Peck's very good question. Let me ask a related question.

          How will Harrington react if he is the third option? Well we can easily answer that question because we saw how he reacted this past season. Granted he will be starting

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: How will Artest act if.....

            I am going back and forth on the Artest subject - but he is my favourite player and I would hate to see him go.

            I think that he will continue to mature as a player, and develop the same as he did this year. Assuming this happens, and Ron realizes that the new SG has a great shot and should be seen as a second option, I think he could accept the role as a 3rd option.

            I can't bare to lose what led Ron to be my favourite player nowadays - his desire to win and his intensity on the floor. Defense is a big part of our team, and taking Ron out of the defensive framework completely changes things. I believe that if a new 2nd option comes to our team - Ron's desire to win will prevail - causing things to work out nicely.

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: How will Artest act if.....

              Ron SHOULD be the third option on offense... He is great at some things offensively, but skillwise (purely offensively), he is about the level of a third scorer on most other good teams...

              He would still be the second (or at some stretches first) most valuable player on the team, and would still get his opportunities to score... His ability to get to the basket, draw a foul, create his own opportunities and occasionally hit the jumper are too great for him not to get chances, but the reason why the pacers arent in the finals is because he is not skilled enough to be that second option....

              if you consider the premiere teams of the league...

              Detroit - Chauncey
              LA - Malone
              Minnesota - Sprewell
              NJN - Jefferson
              SAC - Bibby
              Spurs - Ginobilli

              these are who I would consider to be 3rd options...

              I would say offensively Ron is on par with these players...

              If we got someone who could be that second option, without losing Ron and JO (preferrably keeping Foster and Tinsley as well unless suitable replacements are found), I would have to say we should be the favorites to win the championship next year.

              For example if we were able to pull off a miracle trade of Al, Freddie, Croshere/Pollard and 2 first rounders for TMAc, I think the championship is ours to lose...

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: How will Artest act if.....

                I think Ron would do fine as the third option. He'd still get looks/touches/shots. Not as many, but if we're a winning team I don't think he'll care much. Not enough to throw a fit.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: How will Artest act if.....

                  Considering the fact that he only takes a lot of shots if the team "runs bad" i.e. the offense is not firing on all cylinders.
                  Considering he gladly passes off to "open" players of JO (see his Assist)
                  Considering winning is ALL important to Ron
                  Considering his strength and pride lies in defense, not offense, and
                  Considering he has never said he wanted to be 1st or 2nd option, he only said(says) that they should go to him when things are on the line.

                  I think Ron does not care one bit if he were 5th option in offense, providing the others "do their job".

                  His assistnumbers wouldn't be where they are if he were unwilling to share, unlike some.

                  It is more the blackhole mentality on some on the team that he is objecting to and then he says that he is a better option (which happens to be true).

                  Ron's only "revolt" from the offense has been one shared by the others on the team, they feel they can do a lot more then half-court grind out.

                  Yes, with Tins this team can run, something we missed more then most of you are considering against Detroit, we simply did not have our speed in the offense, resulting in a ready defense, and grindout play that does not really work against Detroit.

                  Ron merely tried to force in some games and not in others, what no one seems to notice is that A. a lot of Ron's shots are "winding down shotclock shots", B. When we win he takes more then when we lose:


                  Detroit series: Game 1 win, 6 - 23, Game 2 Loss, 5 - 21, Game 3 Loss, 4 - 13, Game 4 Win, 8 - 19, Game 5 Loss, 4 - 15, Game 6 Loss, 4 - 13

                  Ron does sometimes (a lot of times) save us, he creates when all else fails and then often "saves the day" he is not the type of player that demands shots, or turns into a black hole.

                  He averages 3.2 Ast over the Playoffs, #3 on the team.
                  Exactly ..sign it
                  Broadcasting Classic Rock Hits 24/7 SauceMaster Radio!!!!

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: How will Artest act if.....

                    You people are talking about the same Artest who complained about the offense being boring, got benched for jacking up shots and complained at the end of the series that he didn't get enough shots? All of which happened on a 61 win season.

                    Sure Ron likes to win. But Ron isn't happy when he plays poorly and the team wins. And Ron gadges his preformance heavily on the offensive side. So I think it is a very legitimate question of whether or not Ron is willing to accept a reduced role on the offensive side. I'm not going to say Artest can't because I like him and want to see him as a Pacer. I chalk a lot of it up to him being 24.

                    As far as the assist go they don't mean much to me. Iverson was second in assist for the Sixers and Pierce lead the Celtics. It's how much the ball is in his hands not just the number of shots that is going to change. With Reggie the longest he held the ball was to feed the post. I promise that will change with another SG.
                    "They could turn out to be only innocent mathematicians, I suppose," muttered Woevre's section officer, de Decker.

                    "'Only.'" Woevre was amused. "Someday you'll explain to me how that's possible. Seeing that, on the face of it, all mathematics leads, doesn't it, sooner or later, to some kind of human suffering."

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: How will Artest act if.....

                      I'm with arcaidian.

                      I would have said maybe he could even though he sometimes makes very selfish and poor offensive decisions. Exspecially in the first 2 detroit games. But after that series was over he was interviewed in the lockerroom saying that he wishes he had the ball more.

                      Now I don't know how a guy who is on a team with a legit MVP candidate and averaged 17.3 shots a game in the ECF could want the ball more.

                      This is what makes me think that he is barely content being the 2nd option, let alone the 3rd.
                      House Name: Pacers

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                      House Words: "We Kneel To No King"

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                      • #12
                        Re: How will Artest act if.....

                        Lord forbid anyone say anything outta frustration after a game the Pacers should have won , I guess none of you have said things in the Heat of the moment that you regret
                        Broadcasting Classic Rock Hits 24/7 SauceMaster Radio!!!!

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: How will Artest act if.....

                          Ron has it in his head that he wants to be a superstar... and superstars are usually judged primarily on their offense and secondarily on their defense/other help stats...

                          Hence.. I think that Artest would be disappointed if he became a lower option on offense... I think that if he remains able to score, and we acquire another option on offense (a better jumpshooter for example), he should be able to get just as many points as he did this season ... I think Ron is strongest near the basket and driving toward the hoop and hence would not be hurt if we obtained a pure shooter that can spot up or create his own long shot...
                          Here, everyone have a : on me

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: How will Artest act if.....

                            You people are talking about the same Artest who complained about the offense being boring, got benched for jacking up shots and complained at the end of the series that he didn't get enough shots? All of which happened on a 61 win season.

                            Sure Ron likes to win. But Ron isn't happy when he plays poorly and the team wins. And Ron gadges his preformance heavily on the offensive side. So I think it is a very legitimate question of whether or not Ron is willing to accept a reduced role on the offensive side. I'm not going to say Artest can't because I like him and want to see him as a Pacer. I chalk a lot of it up to him being 24.

                            As far as the assist go they don't mean much to me. Iverson was second in assist for the Sixers and Pierce lead the Celtics. It's how much the ball is in his hands not just the number of shots that is going to change. With Reggie the longest he held the ball was to feed the post. I promise that will change with another SG.
                            Man I agree with you 100%. Thats the big question about Artest can he handle being the 3rd option. I don't believe he can.At least not yet. He always wants the ball in his hand, hes made a couple of comments during the past season where he needs the ball more or we need to run the offense through him.

                            Ron is a confident guy he probably believes hes a better offensive player he really is. Ron may be able to fit in with a player who likes to move with out the ball like a Ray Allen, Richard Hamilton type of player. These are the types of players who don't need alot of shots to score because they shoot a high percentage but if you get a guy like T-Mac, or even a Quinton Richardson(I don't consider him a elite offensive player by the way but hes alwasy being brought up) who are low percentage shooters, they need alot of shots I think we could have some serious chemistry issues. Ron is one of the best two play players I've seen but I think we need an offensive player who is a little better then Ron to win a title. Instead of Ron Shooting 16 times a game can he handle only shooting 11-13 times a game and not have the ball in his hands as much.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: How will Artest act if.....

                              Originally posted by TheSauceMaster
                              Lord forbid anyone say anything outta frustration after a game the Pacers should have won , I guess none of you have said things in the Heat of the moment that you regret
                              Its not just that he said it but also that he displayed it during the end of that game when he was making selfish selfish plays. He clearly thought that he was the one and only person who was going to bring us back and totally abandoned team basketball.

                              And don't give me the Ron just wants to win line, cause I'm not buying it. No one on that floor wanted to lose. Ron wanted it no more than JO.
                              House Name: Pacers

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                              House Words: "We Kneel To No King"

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