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    Default Trading Gorden or OJ Mayo for Ron Murray

    For the life of me, I simply can't understand our GM's thought process in bringing in Ron Murray. This guy has been with 5 teams in 6 years, shoots 41% career (27% from the three), miserable A:TO ratio (actually less than 1 with the Pacers), and can't crack the starting lineup anywhere...and he'll be 29 this July.

    The irony of it all is this...if he manages to help us win enough games to make the playoffs (and then of course we get knocked out by Detroit), our GM will have essentially traded a legitimate shot at OJ Mayo or Gordon for Ron Murray. Nice job once again.

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    100 Miles from the B count55's Avatar
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    Default Re: Trading Gorden or OJ Mayo for Ron Murray

    Well, considering we're 2-5 now since we since we signed him, I wouldn't worry about him getting us into the playoffs.

    However, if you wanna see the impact that Eric Gordon or OJ Mayo would have on our wins and losses...just scan the records that Chicago (Ben Gordon) and New York (Jamaal Crawford) have.

    No saviors in this year's draft, and I'm beginning to think that a Darren Collison at 15 or 16 is going to have just as good of a chance of being a good NBA player as anybody in the draft not named Beasley or Derrick Rose.

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    Default Re: Trading Gorden or OJ Mayo for Ron Murray

    Quote Originally Posted by count55 View Post
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    Well, considering we're 2-5 now since we since we signed him, I wouldn't worry about him getting us into the playoffs.

    However, if you wanna see the impact that Eric Gordon or OJ Mayo would have on our wins and losses...just scan the records that Chicago (Ben Gordon) and New York (Jamaal Crawford) have.

    No saviors in this year's draft, and I'm beginning to think that a Darren Collison at 15 or 16 is going to have just as good of a chance of being a good NBA player as anybody in the draft not named Beasley or Derrick Rose.
    Both Gordon and Mayo are far bigger and athletic than the NBA players you compared them to. Mayo could just as easily be the next Dwyane Wade as the next Jamaal Crawful.

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    Member jcouts's Avatar
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    Default Re: Trading Gorden or OJ Mayo for Ron Murray

    Gordon can't even save a college team...how in the world is he going to save an NBA franchise?
    Sometimes a player's greatest challenge is coming to grips with his role on the team. -- Scottie Pippen

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    Jimmy did what Jimmy did Bball's Avatar
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    Default Re: Trading Gorden or OJ Mayo for Ron Murray

    It's getting to the point that I could see us MAKING the playoffs and STILL have the option of choosing Gordon.

    Gordon is starting to look more and more like the poster child for why the NBA wants/needs the current age/college rule in place.

    I don't see a franchise savior when I see Gordon.... I see a player that will be lucky to get minutes off the bench. His shot selection and poor decision making, along with his terrible handles, will make him too big of a liability for most teams to put on the court. Maybe he gets an initial shot at it but if he doesn't get some help with those problems, he's heading to the bench.

    The stiffer the competition, the worse he's looked.

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    Go Colts! Shade's Avatar
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    Default Re: Trading Gorden or OJ Mayo for Ron Murray

    Quote Originally Posted by Bball View Post
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    It's getting to the point that I could see us MAKING the playoffs and STILL have the option of choosing Gordon.

    Gordon is starting to look more and more like the poster child for why the NBA wants/needs the current age/college rule in place.

    I don't see a franchise savior when I see Gordon.... I see a player that will be lucky to get minutes off the bench. His shot selection and poor decision making, along with his terrible handles, will make him too big of a liability for most teams to put on the court. Maybe he gets an initial shot at it but if he doesn't get some help with those problems, he's heading to the bench.

    The stiffer the competition, the worse he's looked.

    -Bball
    I wish people would stop saying this, because it's simply not true.

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    Default Re: Trading Gorden or OJ Mayo for Ron Murray

    Quote Originally Posted by Shade View Post
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    I wish people would stop saying this, because it's simply not true.
    I don't know about that. I just took Gordon's season and divided into vs. good teams (17 games) and vs. bad teams (11 games) using the best 64 teams at kenpom.com

    FG% good vs. bad is .410 vs. .481
    3FG% .272 vs. .409
    ppg 20.2 vs. 22.7
    rpg 3.4 vs. 3.1
    apg 2.4 vs. 2.6
    turnovers 4.4 vs. 2.7

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    Go Colts! Shade's Avatar
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    Default Re: Trading Gorden or OJ Mayo for Ron Murray

    Quote Originally Posted by ChicagoPacer View Post
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    I don't know about that. I just took Gordon's season and divided into vs. good teams (17 games) and vs. bad teams (11 games) using the best 64 teams at kenpom.com

    FG% good vs. bad is .410 vs. .481
    3FG% .272 vs. .409
    ppg 20.2 vs. 22.7
    rpg 3.4 vs. 3.1
    apg 2.4 vs. 2.6
    turnovers 4.4 vs. 2.7
    vs. Wisconsin (game 2): 23 points on 41.2% shooting
    vs. Michigan State (game 1): 28 points on 60% shooting
    vs. Michigan State (game 2): 22 points on 50% shooting

    He's also had bad games against bad teams:

    vs. Coppin State: 15 points on 15.4% shooting
    vs. Chicago State: 22 points on 25% shooting
    vs. Illinois (game 2): 19 points on 23.1% shooting

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    Default Re: Trading Gorden or OJ Mayo for Ron Murray

    Quote Originally Posted by Shade View Post
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    vs. Wisconsin (game 2): 23 points on 41.2% shooting
    vs. Michigan State (game 1): 28 points on 60% shooting
    vs. Michigan State (game 2): 22 points on 50% shooting

    He's also had bad games against bad teams:

    vs. Coppin State: 15 points on 15.4% shooting
    vs. Chicago State: 22 points on 25% shooting
    vs. Illinois (game 2): 19 points on 23.1% shooting
    Please. You can cite all the exceptions you want. I'm talking about what he has averaged vs. good teams vs. what he has averaged vs. bad teams.

    Selectively picking a handful of games is kind of like the guy who comes back from Vegas saying he won a grand. Sure, he won a grand on one hand. But he lost 3 grand on the rest.

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    Default Re: Trading Gorden or OJ Mayo for Ron Murray

    Quote Originally Posted by Shade View Post
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    I wish people would stop saying this, because it's simply not true.
    Take a look at his box scores, you'll see it.

    He did pretty well when IU was playing a collection of Barber Colleges and Beauty Schools prior to the Big Ten season. But for the most part, the thing he has done best in the last couple of months is get to the free throw line.

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    Go Colts! Shade's Avatar
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    Default Re: Trading Gorden or OJ Mayo for Ron Murray

    Quote Originally Posted by Tom White View Post
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    Take a look at his box scores, you'll see it.

    He did pretty well when IU was playing a collection of Barber Colleges and Beauty Schools prior to the Big Ten season. But for the most part, the thing he has done best in the last couple of months is get to the free throw line.
    I have, and I already posted evidence to the contrary.

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    Default Re: Trading Gorden or OJ Mayo for Ron Murray

    Eric Gordon is Rashad McCants. Strong 6'4" SG with a nice shooting touch, but questionable ball handling and rebounding. He's not bad, but is he enough of a long-term upgrade over Dunleavy to be worth it when we need help at other positions?

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    Default Re: Trading Gorden or OJ Mayo for Ron Murray

    Quote Originally Posted by Kofi View Post
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    Eric Gordon is Rashad McCants. Strong 6'4" SG with a nice shooting touch, but questionable ball handling and rebounding. He's not bad, but is he enough of a long-term upgrade over Dunleavy to be worth it when we need help at other positions?
    EJ will be much better than McCants and Dunleavy in a few years. The question is whether we'd be willing to wait for him to develop.

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    Default Re: Trading Gorden or OJ Mayo for Ron Murray

    I'd say Gordon has slightly better range than McCants....

    It wasn't about being the team everyone loved, it was about beating the teams everyone else loved.

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    Default Re: Trading Gorden or OJ Mayo for Ron Murray

    He's a freshman, he's going to continue to get better. He's had a hand injury that effects shooting. If I had the eight pick or worse he would be drafted by me. If Hibbert was available I might re-think that.
    "He wanted to get to that money time. Time when the hardware was on the table. That's when Roger was going to show up. So all we needed to do was stay close"
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    Default Re: Trading Gorden or OJ Mayo for Ron Murray

    Shade...Please, take the cream and crimson glasses off.

    Eric Gordon has not done a fine job in the last month of silencing his critics.
    ...Still "flying casual"
    @roaminggnome74

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    Default Re: Trading Gorden or OJ Mayo for Ron Murray

    Quote Originally Posted by Roaming Gnome View Post
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    Shade...Please, take the cream and crimson glasses off.

    Eric Gordon has not done a fine job in the last month of silencing his critics.
    I'm not denying that EJ hasn't played well of late. But he also didn't play well at some points early in the season. He's been frustratingly inconsistent.

    I'm looking more at NBA potential with EJ, and though he hasn't developed them all yet, he has the tools.

    Is he still raw? Yes. But that doesn't mean he won't develop into what he's capable of becoming.

    There are ZERO quick-fix players in this draft. Whoever you're going to take, you're going to need to develop. And with EJ's stock likely dropping right now, he could potentially be a steal where he's taken.

  18. #18

    Default Re: Trading Gorden or OJ Mayo for Ron Murray

    seriously, those making excuses for ej need to stop...he has been TERRIBLE the past month+ of the season and there's now way around that...and stop talking about his age as the majority of the players in the draft will be just as young...

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    Default Re: Trading Gorden or OJ Mayo for Ron Murray

    Quote Originally Posted by kellogg View Post
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    For the life of me, I simply can't understand our GM's thought process in bringing in Ron Murray. This guy has been with 5 teams in 6 years, shoots 41% career (27% from the three), miserable A:TO ratio (actually less than 1 with the Pacers), and can't crack the starting lineup anywhere...and he'll be 29 this July.

    The irony of it all is this...if he manages to help us win enough games to make the playoffs (and then of course we get knocked out by Detroit), our GM will have essentially traded a legitimate shot at OJ Mayo or Gordon for Ron Murray. Nice job once again.
    What?

    Murray was the best opition for this team. We needed some major help in the backcourt without Jamaal. All we had was Travis Diener, Andre Owens, and Marquis Daniels playing point guard. Murray does help us.

    Larry never said Flip was going to be our guard of the future. If you don't mind seeing Diener play 40 minutes a night I guess signing Flip was a bad move. Oh well.

    Who cares if we don't get Mayo or Gordon? I do like Mayo's game but IDK about his character issues. And Gordon needs to stay in college at least another year for sure.

    I really don't see what the big deal is in signing Flip Murray. We needed help in the backcourt and he was the best opition avaliable. Sam Cassell wasn't going to sign with us and I doubt you want to trade Danny Granger for a guard. Sometimes you just gotta take what you can get and that was Flip.

  20. #20

    Default Re: Trading Gorden or OJ Mayo for Ron Murray

    Quote Originally Posted by rommie View Post
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    What?

    Murray was the best opition for this team. We needed some major help in the backcourt without Jamaal. All we had was Travis Diener, Andre Owens, and Marquis Daniels playing point guard. Murray does help us.

    Larry never said Flip was going to be our guard of the future. If you don't mind seeing Diener play 40 minutes a night I guess signing Flip was a bad move. Oh well.

    Who cares if we don't get Mayo or Gordon? I do like Mayo's game but IDK about his character issues. And Gordon needs to stay in college at least another year for sure.

    I really don't see what the big deal is in signing Flip Murray. We needed help in the backcourt and he was the best opition avaliable. Sam Cassell wasn't going to sign with us and I doubt you want to trade Danny Granger for a guard. Sometimes you just gotta take what you can get and that was Flip.
    I would have completely agreed with you on this, except that the season is so far along. We have absolutely no chance whatsoever to make it past the first round of the playoffs...none. And so, for a chance at cracking that coveted 8th seed we give up the chance to select the 8th pick (or better)...sorry, but I'd just as soon have us win or lose the remaining 20 games with the group that started the season...and have more pingpong balls.

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    Our hero! GrangerRanger's Avatar
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    Default Re: Trading Gorden or OJ Mayo for Ron Murray



    If Jordan can play with a hurt wrist in the NBA and score 63, then Gordon (if he's even going to be a remotely decent player in the NBA) should be a able to keep the turnovers under control and shoot at a higher percentage.

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    Default Re: Trading Gorden or OJ Mayo for Ron Murray

    Quote Originally Posted by GrangerRanger View Post
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    If Jordan can play with a hurt wrist in the NBA and score 63, then Gordon (if he's even going to be a remotely decent player in the NBA) should be a able to keep the turnovers under control and shoot at a higher percentage.
    So let me get this straight. You just bashed Gordon because he's not like Michael Jordon? Really.

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    Default Re: Trading Gorden or OJ Mayo for Ron Murray

    Quote Originally Posted by Mal View Post
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    So let me get this straight. You just bashed Gordon because he's not like Michael Jordon? Really.
    If you're a "college superstar and sure fire NBA All Star", then yes. You should play more like Jordan than not when facing college players whom 99% of will never see an NBA jersey on their backs, and they know it.

    The funny thing is, I can remember a high turnover, bad shooting player a few years back that had wrist problems that everyone made excuses for. He had all the tools, to play PG, or SG, and if it wasn't for his bad wrist in college, would have been much better. He went high in the draft and for all the hoopla ..... you got Larry Hughes. Yay.

    Looking around the web I found this site, and this picture, thought it was hilarious.

    http://heylarryhughespleasestoptakin...bfantana_2.jpg

    -- Steve --
    Last edited by Pacersfan46; 03-16-2008 at 02:35 PM.

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    Default Re: Trading Gorden or OJ Mayo for Ron Murray

    Quote Originally Posted by Mal View Post
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    So let me get this straight. You just bashed Gordon because he's not like Michael Jordon? Really.
    Well, heck yes!

    Gordon is just lucky he hasn't had Dakich guarding him.


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    Member SycamoreKen's Avatar
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    Default Re: Trading Gorden or OJ Mayo for Ron Murray

    I have not seen AJ play much thanks to the Big 11 network, but everyone's sure fire #1 pick Beasley hasn't exactly come through at crunch time the past month. I'll search the SA Express News archives when i get time, but he was fading dramatically at the end of games.

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