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Thread: Vote of confidence: Jim O'Brien

  1. #1
    Administrator Peck's Avatar
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    Default Vote of confidence: Jim O'Brien

    Ok, I am going to run one of these for everyone in managment starting with the head coach.

    We've had more than half a season now to at least get a feel for where we stand on these guys.

    There can be all kinds of reasons, one way or the other, saying yes you have confidence or no you don't. Feel free to list them.

    But at this time I would like a vote.

    Here is the quesiton.

    Do you have confidence in Jim O'Brien as our head coach?
    It's either a yes or no question at this point. You can feel free to give your reasons.

    BTW, if you are going to say that you have faith in him if he had a better group of players that still counts as a yes you have faith.

    That is really the core of the question anyway. Do you have faith that Jim O'Brien is THE coach if we had the right set of players.

  2. #2
    Member Erik's Avatar
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    Default Re: Vote of confidence: Jim O'Brien

    Yes. I like the freedom that he gives to the team during games and how we have seen that he can still call a good play when we need it. Solid coach, I don't love him but I have confidence in him.

  3. #3

    Default Re: Vote of confidence: Jim O'Brien

    No.

    He's is not the right coach for the future. I believe his system could work if we had players who could hit shots when the games on the line. But his system as it stands, is entertaining but can not win games in the long run. Adding JO is not the answer either. Deiner is playing the point well. The ball movement is there but it ends up being another 3 shot. Why did the Pacers attack the basket in the first New Jersey game and settle for three's in the second one? I believe thats the coaching. I'm not convinced O'B knows what to do at the moment it needs done. If he makes adjustments it's always too late to affect the game.

    Maybe the Pacers are 1 Michael Redd away from making O'B look like a genius. I am not convinced.
    But an hour or so later, Hibbert wrote on his Twitter account: "Love this coach [and] I love this team. We can go far this year if we play like that. 2night we played our hearts out. Just didn't get the win."

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    10 - 32 - 50 31andonly's Avatar
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    Default Re: Vote of confidence: Jim O'Brien

    No. I don't think you can ever win a title with this style of basketball. This team is disregarding the defense over and over again, in close games it doesn't seem that he can call good plays, and jacking up rushed 3-pointers constantly is not my philosophy of good basketball.

  5. #5
    You are my Lucifer D-BONE's Avatar
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    Default Re: Vote of confidence: Jim O'Brien

    Quote Originally Posted by 31andonly View Post
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    No. I don't think you can ever win a title with this style of basketball. This team is disregarding the defense over and over again, in close games it doesn't seem that he can call good plays, and jacking up rushed 3-pointers constantly is not my philosophy of good basketball.
    Do we ever run a a set play given the situation?

    You precisely sum up my concerns with O'Briens philosophy. I have said it before-his offense has to much of a gimmick feel. Yes an offensive post threat might alter things to a degree, but not drastically IMO.

    And that's not even getting in to the defensive scheme. I will say that I like his intensity though. I'm willing to give him a shot with some talent upgrades a key spots to see if I'm wrong, but I don't believe it will turn out that way.
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    Running with the Big Boys BillS's Avatar
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    Default Re: Vote of confidence: Jim O'Brien

    Yes.

    An offensive go-to guy and a defensive stopper and suddenly JOB is a genius.
    BillS

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    Headband and Rec Specs rexnom's Avatar
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    Default Re: Vote of confidence: Jim O'Brien

    I'd say yes. He was certainly looking like a genius at the beginning of the year before JO and JT got injured. I'm sure he can do very well with better personnel.

  8. #8

    Default Re: Vote of confidence: Jim O'Brien

    Quote Originally Posted by Peck
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    Do you have faith that Jim O'Brien is THE coach if we had the right set of players.

    I wouldn't say he is "THE" coach. He's not the best coach in basketball history or the only guy capable of putting five guys in yellow on the floor. But I would say he is "a" good enough coach for the Pacers.

    I do not believe O'Brien is telling the players to go out and throw up 29 3-point attempts a game. The offensive scheme promotes ball movement in order to create open shots, and I like that. If the players take the wrong shots, or take good shots and miss them, is not a fault of the scheme.


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    Can try it out with all unspotted soldiers.


    Three years from now, the team will be better off because O'Brien stuck with his scheme and kept the development of the players-of-the-future on track rather than switching plans to get a few more wins this year out of Troy Murphy and Marquis Daniels.
    Last edited by Putnam; 02-24-2008 at 09:08 AM.
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  9. #9
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    Default Re: Vote of confidence: Jim O'Brien

    Yes from the interested observer category. The problem's not the coach. The problem's management not getting the coach the players he needs.

    Similar to last season . . .
    The poster formerly known as Rimfire

  10. #10
    How are you here? Kegboy's Avatar
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    Default Re: Vote of confidence: Jim O'Brien

    Yes.

    I didn't agree with his hiring, and I don't believe his system can ever be a contending one.

    However, he has shown that he is capable of being successful with at least some talent. I won't even say we need players that fit his system, we just need players with more talent. Every team needs a go-to guy, every single one. We don't have that, and the argument can be made we haven't had one in 3 years.

    Another thing to consider is his system is entertaining to watch. If we can start winning again, I think the seats will be easier to fill running his system as opposed to something like Rick's.

    My one concern about going forward with him is on player development, which will be crucial in the years to come. I've certainly been impressed with what he's gotten out of Travis and Rush, two players who I still feel aren't NBA caliber. But what about Ike? Is he really the lost cause Jim makes him out to be? To be fair, people complained for years about David's lack of PT, before we all realized he was a nutcase. But I still see Jim as the guy who'll lay the foundation for the next guy, and if he's not good at developing players, that's a big problem.
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  11. #11
    NaptownSeth is all feel Naptown_Seth's Avatar
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    Default Re: Vote of confidence: Jim O'Brien

    Quote Originally Posted by Peck View Post
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    Do you have confidence in Jim O'Brien as our head coach?
    It's either a yes or no question at this point. You can feel free to give your reasons.

    BTW, if you are going to say that you have faith in him if he had a better group of players that still counts as a yes you have faith.

    That is really the core of the question anyway. Do you have faith that Jim O'Brien is THE coach if we had the right set of players.
    A mild yes.

    If Rick had that same right set of players the team would win more, but JOB is better than just some hack too. Ultimately you could upgrade at coach but clearly after 2 coaches with previously solid winning records have lost big with this group of players you know the key issue is the roster.

    I don't like the offense, it's way too one on one (ironically after all the "iso" complaints on Rick) and the defense just gets killed from the corners...see NJ baseline alley-oops as just the latest exploitation of that.


    PS - still waiting to see Tins put up better numbers or play more games for JOB than he was for Rick...you know, the coach that was "holding him back". Ugh, can't believe people bought into that.


    Kegboy - I considered his odd, out of nowhere hiring as maybe a sign of pre-built fall guy. If you know the team has issues and you know that fans want a change, then why get into the big money and go after the big talent at coach if the roster is only going to end up with fans demanding his firing next. I've mellowed on that view since the summer, but it does nag at me still, that JOB is only here to ride out the roster reconfiguration. Then as that's sorted out the new guy is called in and "saves the day".

    But as you say, shouldn't that be a guy that can develop young talent at least? Sure, in a world where reason has a vote.
    Last edited by Naptown_Seth; 02-24-2008 at 10:25 AM.

  12. #12
    Wasting Light Hicks's Avatar
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    Default Re: Vote of confidence: Jim O'Brien

    Quote Originally Posted by Peck View Post
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    Ok, I am going to run one of these for everyone in managment starting with the head coach.

    We've had more than half a season now to at least get a feel for where we stand on these guys.

    There can be all kinds of reasons, one way or the other, saying yes you have confidence or no you don't. Feel free to list them.

    But at this time I would like a vote.

    Here is the quesiton.

    Do you have confidence in Jim O'Brien as our head coach?
    It's either a yes or no question at this point. You can feel free to give your reasons.

    BTW, if you are going to say that you have faith in him if he had a better group of players that still counts as a yes you have faith.

    That is really the core of the question anyway. Do you have faith that Jim O'Brien is THE coach if we had the right set of players.
    Yes I have faith in him, though it used to be much stronger. I want to see how his gameplan looks with more talent. I suspect we'd look considerably better on both sides of the ball with more talent. Though I still worry about the offense being too "free".

  13. #13
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    Default Re: Vote of confidence: Jim O'Brien

    Quote Originally Posted by BillS View Post
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    Yes.

    An offensive go-to guy and a defensive stopper and suddenly JOB is a genius.
    This is what I'm suspecting as well. Especially the offensive go-to guy part. What I really want is a guy who excels at attacking the basket.

  14. #14

    Default Re: Vote of confidence: Jim O'Brien

    "...they say your methods are unsound."
    "...so are they? are my methods unsound?"
    ....long pause ..."i don't see a method"



    my vote is NO but it's a moot point -

    i like jim o'brien and i think he's an OK
    coach, but i think his role here will be of
    the interim variety while TPTB shuffles
    through another season - or two - of
    trying to wrangle deals while saddled
    with impossible contracts, contracts
    negotiatied by mr. walsh.

    jim o'brien will last about as long as larry
    bird, which is not too much longer. probably
    another year. sorry i can't be optimistic, but
    i don't see a way out of this. this is going to
    take 2-3 years to straighten out.

    i wish i were wrong!

  15. #15
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    Default Re: Vote of confidence: Jim O'Brien

    No ( for now ).

    I have no problem in the offense/defense that he wants to implement. The problem is that I don't think that he has done a good job of implementing and running the offense the way that it should be run.

    We have known problems on the offensive end that I think that JO'B can fix. Problems like the typical 2nd half offensive drought and our constant fallback to the 3pt barrage / jumpshot fest IMHO can be fixed by simple in-game Coaching adjustments. JO'B can do something simple as telling the players to stop "jacking up 3's" or reigning in the offense more at critical streches of the game.....but for some reason; he has either failed to do so, doesn't want to make too many in-game decisions or ( worse ) he's letting the team run the offense this way.

    Either way, he hasn't done too much to remedy known problems that we have on our offense. Until he does something to remedy these problems on offense.....I'm not very confident in his abilities to effectively coach this team.
    Last edited by CableKC; 02-24-2008 at 01:20 PM.
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  16. #16
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    Default Re: Vote of confidence: Jim O'Brien

    I'm confident I don't like the style he coaches.

  17. #17
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    Default Re: Vote of confidence: Jim O'Brien

    I would have to say "NO"

    he is a good coach - he would be fine with a team that is full of veterans that can handle decision making. However we are not that team nor would we be in the near future...

    His "in-game" decisions have been bothersome for quite some time now. I don't know whether or not the players just don't follow his game plan out of time outs or if he just does not have a good plan to have it executed properly. Either way - my vote would be "NO"

    The sad part is I don't really think of any coach right now that I would be willing to have as a replacement - as in someone who is not running any other teams in the NBA.

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    Default Re: Vote of confidence: Jim O'Brien

    YES....no further comment necessary.


  19. #19

    Default Re: Vote of confidence: Jim O'Brien

    Jim is a good coach. He just simply doesn't have the right players, or healthy players.

    Until then the record will be as is.

  20. #20
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    Default Re: Vote of confidence: Jim O'Brien

    Sure. He's not going to become the Jerry Sloan of Indiana, where he never leaves, but he'll last longer than Jeff VanGundy did in Miami. He's in the transistion stage, where the roster is going to be a mess, so probably about the time we get the roster straightened out, everyone will be sick of him and we'll move on and the next guy will look great.

    Oh well. For now, he'll do fine because it's really not about winning or losing right now. As long as he can teach our young guys to pass like his system encourages, then make shots like his system encourages, he's fine.

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  21. #21
    The Last Great Pacer BlueNGold's Avatar
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    Default Re: Vote of confidence: Jim O'Brien

    No. Until the defense is addressed, I have no confidence in anyone in the Pacers organization except a few of the players.

    The Indiana Pacers allow the second most points in the NBA. That is undeniably due to our personnel to some extent. However, JOb does not strike me as a defensive minded coach. He talks the game, but I don't see it. Again, this may be the personnel, but he will take the hit nonetheless...

    Edit: The Celtics, Spurs and Pistons are the teams allowing the fewest points. That's the direction we need to head. Is that not obvious?

    Edit2: To address the original question more directly, no I don't think his style lends itself to winning championships. I do think he is warming the seat for awhile and will certainly not be around in 5 years. He's actually not a bad option for the moment, however. The style may not be terribly effective, but it is entertaining. ...and with this crew, that is all you can ask....
    Last edited by BlueNGold; 02-24-2008 at 10:39 PM.

  22. #22
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    Default Re: Vote of confidence: Jim O'Brien

    Since undecided isn't an option, I'll say yes.

    There's good NBA coaches, and bad NBA coaches, and those in the middle. I'd put him in the middle right now even though I'm not to fond of his substitutions.

  23. #23
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    Default Re: Vote of confidence: Jim O'Brien

    Yes. JOB needs healthy players. Take any other team and drop 2 starters for a long period and they lose. Backups are not prepared to play starter minutes and roles no matter how hard they try or believe they can. JOB has done an admirable job with the hand he was dealt. MIami is a nice example.

  24. #24
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    Default Re: Vote of confidence: Jim O'Brien

    Yes.

    Although I don't think he will ever lead the Pacers to a championship and I think that the best case scenario for him is to lead our team to the ECF or so and then management decides that his style is too demanding on players during the regular season, thus leaving us with no fuel for the playoffs. But that is a LONG way off at this point.

    But he's a decent coach and we could at least be somewhat successful if he had the proper talent to fit his system.

    He's not making anything worse right now, that's all I'm saying. I couldn't see another coach succeeding with the "talent" we have amassed.

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    Default Re: Vote of confidence: Jim O'Brien

    No. The offense is just like he said it would be and it isn't effective. The defense is NOTHING like he said, and he doesn't know how to fix it. There's a reason why he lasted one year in two gigs and was unemployed when we invited him here. He's not head coach material. Another example of LB's poor judgement.

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