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Thread: Trade deadline countdown - Feb. 22 '08

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    Default Trade deadline countdown - Feb. 22 '08

    OK, I figured I would start this thread becasue there is going to be a lot of talk about what we need to do, or even if we need to do anything at all.

    We are stuck in neutral, and there's no getting out. The only way yo get this bus (or tank maybe) to moving.

    I found this article and thought it could start some interesting discussion between now and February 22nd. There are some interesting names on there, but I dont think LB will pull the trigger this year. We've had 2 consecutive years with big trades in the middle of the season that disrupted the chemistry for better or worse.

    -------------------------------------------------
    LINK: http://bleacherreport.com/articles/6..._Sense_-160108

    REFERAL:
    Alexander Farahmandpour
    Bleacher Report.com
    -------------------------------------------------

    NBA Trade Deadline: What Deals Make Sense?

    The trade deadline is approaching and yet again big names are being thrown out. I've even heard Amare's name. Lets' start with the east,

    Atlanta- Need more experince and help for Joe, dont be surprised if Smith is dealt
    Boston- Need a experinced pg and some help from the bench
    Charlotte- Need some more help for the amazing duo of Richardson and Okafor
    Chicago- Disaster
    Cleveland- Theres Lebron, then the rest of the mediocre team
    Detriot- They dont need anyone
    Indiana - Time to Package Jermaine and get what you can
    Memphis- Retarded team wont ever deal Pau and wont make the playoffs (wanted Bosh, Bargnani, and first-round pick last year for Gasol)
    Miami- I guess storms and hurricanes do hit the hottest places in the States look for them to deal Williams
    Milwaukee- Everyone except Bogut and Yi can and most likely will be dealt
    New Jersey- their owner thinks the big 3 can win it all. In what world does he think they can? Maybe in Nba live 2008
    New York- " No Comment"
    Orlando- Dont need anyone
    Phillidelphia- Iguodala isnt happy, they want to move Miller, this teams in trouble,
    Raptors- Look for some big trades to happen because BC isnt scared to do it
    Washington- wow they are actaully doing good with out Arenas, i say deal him for someone anyone get the most you can out of him cause once Free agency starts you can say "bye bye"


    West
    Dallas- they need someone to take them to the next level, and no giving Stackhouse 3 years 21 million isnt the player im talking about. They should make a package of Terry and Diop and offer it to see what they get
    Denver- A reliable back up center no more NENE
    Golden State- need a allstar center
    LA Clippers- Time to rebuild trade Brand and if you can Cassel,
    La Lakers- They need a good PF-C...cause Bynum and Fisher are getting it done at the pg-c positions
    Minnesota- Rebuilding phase, yet some of their youth could be trade bait
    New Orleans- Peja and Mo pete combined 18 million a year, and almost do the same thing SHOOT, one needs to go
    Phoenix - no one
    Portland- one scary team, and lets see what happens when Oden comes
    Sacramento- OK so you got Martin good, now deal Bibby and Artest and rebuild this team or go on a run
    San Antonio- Cheerleaders?
    Seattle- Rebulding, could get alot for Luke Ridnour
    Utah- at the rate they are going half the team might get dealt, its a " dont like the coach your gone approach"

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    Member jeffg-body's Avatar
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    Default Re: Trade deadline countdown

    I think if we do a deadline trade with JO it will have to include one of our young guys. I wouldn't mind a JO and Ike to a team that will give us a descent PG and a expiring contract or two?

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    It Might Be a Soft J JayRedd's Avatar
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    Default Re: Trade deadline countdown

    Not sure where you got that article but it's one of the least insightful, rational and/or accurate things I've read in some time.

    As for the deadline and the Pacers are concerned, however, yeah...we better make at least some sort of a move.
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    Fat, Drunk and Stupid Lord Helmet's Avatar
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    Default Re: Trade deadline countdown

    I expect nothing from this franchise anymore.

    I think we'll stand pat.
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    Default Re: Trade deadline countdown

    Hopefully J.O. is healthy enough by the deadline to be tradeable.

    What are some teams that could be interested? I've got Cleveland, Dallas, Houston, Lakers, New Jersey, New York, and Phoenix.

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    Default Re: Trade deadline countdown

    I predict that JONeal will play on Feb 1st. This is a full 2 weeks AFTER the last game that he played and that the main reason why he is playing is to showcase that he is still capable of playing at a high level. He will have a full 2 weeks to show GMs before that trade deadline that he is still healthy.
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    This is David West, he is the Honey Badger, West just doesn't give a *****....he's pretty bad *ss cuz he has no regard for any other Player or Team whatsoever.

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    Default Re: Trade deadline countdown

    Quote Originally Posted by JayRedd View Post
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    Not sure where you got that article but it's one of the least insightful, rational and/or accurate things I've read in some time.

    As for the deadline and the Pacers are concerned, however, yeah...we better make at least some sort of a move.

    I was googling the trade deadline, and this was one of the articles. It looked like it could spark some conversation on here. I agree though, the guy who wrote it did not put much thought into it, just some quick speculation i suppose.

    If any of his "insight" has any truth to it, then I wouldn't mind us try to do something with Dallas for Terry, or Seattle for Ridnour, or even Philly for Andre Miller and maybe Dalembert. Maybe even still the lakers if we could get future picks, and Farmar or JCrit. Probably have to take Mihm or Vlad back too.

    AK47 for JO maybe?

    Just take short contracts back if we are rebuilding.

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    Default Re: Trade deadline countdown - Feb. 22 '08

    Andre would probably be a great 4 in our small-ball lineup. Of course, that would mean Mike or Danny coming off the bench. I don't think Utah would want JO anyway.

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    Member idioteque's Avatar
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    Default Re: Trade deadline countdown - Feb. 22 '08

    We'll stand pat.

    Larry will probably heat up warm glasses of milk for Murphleavy and they'll all go to bed at 8pm when other teams are wheeling and dealing.

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    Default Re: Trade deadline countdown - Feb. 22 '08

    I think we need to package JO with people we want out of Indy. Put him with Murph for shorter contracts and draft picks.

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    Default Re: Trade deadline countdown - Feb. 22 '08

    No offense Bridge but can you name one team that will give us draft picks & ending contracts for 2 over paid under productive players on the down side of their careers?

    I'm not saying we might not find a team to take one of these guys but not both, not with the money they make. Not that I'm real picky what we get back but it would be 3rd rate talent.

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    Default Re: Trade deadline countdown - Feb. 22 '08

    Quote Originally Posted by Jose Slaughter View Post
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    No offense Bridge but can you name one team that will give us draft picks & ending contracts for 2 over paid under productive players on the down side of their careers?

    I'm not saying we might not find a team to take one of these guys but not both, not with the money they make. Not that I'm real picky what we get back but it would be 3rd rate talent.

    I'm starting to think this "talent" business is way too overated, and perhaps
    it's time to not so much worry about if whomever we get in return in a trade
    is of equal talent, but if he is durable and won't be seeing alot of down
    time.

    The Pacers medical staff needs to be much more involved and proactive
    when evaluting these players before bringing them in. Make an in-depth
    study of NBA "iron men" past and present who have had long and relatively
    injury free careers. Before bringing in a prospect, look closely for these
    characteristics in the player. Look closely at his build, his body style, his
    bone structure. Look even closer at his knees, ankles, and other joints,
    and the health of his cartilage tissue.

    Moving forward we need to build a team with players who naturally have
    a higher resistance to injury rather than just looking at raw talent and
    potential. Overly rating talent before durability has cost the team millions
    of $$$ in recent history, as well as cost us alot of games with "star potential"
    players either playing injured or riding the pine.

    So basically even if we get a player back in a trade who is a "3rd rate talent",
    it might actually be a good thing if he is durable and can stay out on the floor
    to give us some athleticism without having to be continually concerned about
    his getting injured. I would be fine with us sacrificing talent for durability, at
    least at this point.
    Last edited by RamBo_Lamar; 01-26-2008 at 10:44 AM. Reason: clarification

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    Default Re: Trade deadline countdown - Feb. 22 '08

    We have talent but not chemistry. If JO is healthy at the deadline you have to take what you can get. He could help a team get over a hump, provided he stays healthy. We need one expiring contract + ?. Look at what Portland has done with all their young guys.
    "He wanted to get to that money time. Time when the hardware was on the table. That's when Roger was going to show up. So all we needed to do was stay close"
    Darnell Hillman (Speaking of former teammate Roger Brown)

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    Default Re: Trade deadline countdown - Feb. 22 '08

    I know its boring, but I think nothing happens at the deadline, but I think at the draft you'll see wholesale changes. This is a time that stuff actually happens in a big way, teams looking to unload vets, overvaluing picks. You can really remake a teams direction then or start to.

    Lets face it, we are more than a move or 3 away from any direction they choose to rebuild or make a run.

    I'd rather have 2 good moves at the draft than one forced desperate move at the deadline.

    Birds pretty much handcuffed in adding any payroll to try to get better now and he doesn't have players that people are high enough on to move for a high draft pick. It'll just be interesting, but I'm not optimistic unless they fall into another Paul Pierce draft scenario. Otherwise, Bird is stuck in a 3 year cycle of whatever he does, imho.

    Lastly, I think if you can somehow unload bad contracts anytime, thats a good thing. If you can find a team who feels they need shooting, an unloading of Murphy could work. There are lots of things. The toughest part is almost all of the stupid GMs are gone and all that is left are guys who have to be fiscally responsible. You have to make room to at least be make a competitive offer for Rush if he's your 2 guard. Obie is trying to win and I appreciate that, but he's really screwing Bird on how he can manage personnel.

    Or obviously Ike could have value, but Obie won't play him to embellish that, at all. Obie's line up changes are mind boggling. It's like his days in Phillie all over again, he won't play young guys, anyway thats for another day. Where's Isiah when you need him to be on the bad side of a good deal.
    Last edited by Speed; 01-26-2008 at 09:06 AM.

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    How are you here? Kegboy's Avatar
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    Default Re: Trade deadline countdown - Feb. 22 '08

    I wouldn't get your hopes up. We still haven't made the trade to shore up our backcourt that we were expecting a year ago.
    Come to the Dark Side -- There's cookies!

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    Default Re: Trade deadline countdown - Feb. 22 '08

    Speed-

    Who knows if Bird will even be around another 3 yrs ? TBTP just
    seems to be flying by the seat of it's/their/his pants right now.
    If there's a plan of any kind aimed at getting back to legit
    contending status anytime in the next few years, it's being
    hidden awfully well.

    Frankly, for all the good Donnie did in the past, I wish he'd go
    ahead and hang up his spurs so Bird can sink or swim. I don't
    really care which it is. But one way or the other, we need a
    professional GM with a vision running things asap.

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    Default Re: Trade deadline countdown - Feb. 22 '08

    Quote Originally Posted by Rajah Brown View Post
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    Speed-

    Who knows if Bird will even be around another 3 yrs ? TBTP just
    seems to be flying by the seat of it's/their/his pants right now.
    If there's a plan of any kind aimed at getting back to legit
    contending status anytime in the next few years, it's being
    hidden awfully well.

    Frankly, for all the good Donnie did in the past, I wish he'd go
    ahead and hang up his spurs so Bird can sink or swim. I don't
    really care which it is. But one way or the other, we need a
    professional GM with a vision running things asap.

    I agree. I think in the fans minds that time is now for Bird. Its been unequivocally said he has the reigns as of the beginning of this year. Now they may go back and have Donnie take a bullet for Bird, so to speak, but I don't think there is one person who would buy it. I look at Toronto and what they've done in a short time with Colangelo, amazing. Other than New York, there isn't one team I wouldn't want to change positions with.

    I don't see any plan at all. It's almost an addiction to mediocrity. Your just hoping they hit bottom, so they are forced to deal with the issues.

    Everyone is in a pretty rough spot until then, imo.

    Simons are in a rough spot, they feel like Bird is a legend, which as a player he is. They feel like they owe Walsh for all he's done for the team.

    Walsh is in a rough spot because he has to feel his legacy is horribly tarnished.

    Bird is in a rough spot, big payroll, losing team, hardly any valueable pieces to move to improve or to rebuild.

    Obie is in a rough spot, trying to win with mismatched pieces.

    JO is in a rough spot, wants to be healthy, feels like he owes the franchise who uncovered him, but wants to be with a team that has a chance at the end of his career.

    Tinsley is in a rough spot, TPTB want him to be more than he is and he wants to be appreciated for what he is (and doesn't see anything wrong with that)

    Harrison is in a rough spot because it isn't fair he can't smoke dope and be a starting center without having all of these unfair fouls called on him AND be allowed to do the cool water purifier commercials on the side....

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    Go Colts! Shade's Avatar
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    Default Re: Trade deadline countdown - Feb. 22 '08

    For everyone saying to trade JO for a Happy Meal, remember the phrase:

    "Buy low, sell high."

    JO's trade value will probably never be lower than it is right now, so why not wait things out and see if he can return and improve first?

    Of course, if a good deal is on the table, you have to consider taking it. But there's no point at all in trading JO for trash.

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    J.O. To The T.O. Oneal07's Avatar
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    Default Re: Trade deadline countdown

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Helmet View Post
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    I expect nothing from this franchise anymore.

    I think we'll stand pat.
    Larry Bird said he does want to do something. I doubt we'll stand pat!!! I think the guy we really have to trade is Jamaal.
    R.I.P. Bernic Mac & Isaac Hayes

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    Default Re: Trade deadline countdown - Feb. 22 '08

    Quote Originally Posted by aceace View Post
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    We have talent but not chemistry. If JO is healthy at the deadline you have to take what you can get. He could help a team get over a hump, provided he stays healthy. We need one expiring contract + ?. Look at what Portland has done with all their young guys.
    Look at what Minny got for Garnett.

    We need JO to be healthy in order to trade him for anything more than a Kwame and a can of beans.

    I don't think JO is the problem and if healthy has the ability to be a feature of this team.

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    Default Re: Trade deadline countdown - Feb. 22 '08

    Quote Originally Posted by iPACER View Post
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    Look at what Minny got for Garnett.

    We need JO to be healthy in order to trade him for anything more than a Kwame and a can of beans.

    I don't think JO is the problem and if healthy has the ability to be a feature of this team.
    Well we could use Kwame's expiring contract, especially after reading the piece on the Pacers losing 13 million over the past few years. Plus we could feed the can of beans to Diener and maybe he'd be able to bench the bar? eh?

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    Default Re: Trade deadline countdown - Feb. 22 '08

    Fellow Digest members,

    This thread was deleted for good reason, and it's a problem we've been having from many people and it's past due that I do a better job of bringing attention to it.

    Whenever you post an article from somewhere on the web, we need to see NOT JUST A LINK, but ALSO A REFERAL. This means WHO WROTE IT and WHAT WEBSITE THE ARTICLE IS POSTED ON. I've made RED EDITS to the first post of the thread to highlight what is needed EVERY time. If those THREE THINGS are listed, we're good.

    But if not, threads will be removed. It's a LIABILITY ISSUE for the site that we MUST be strict about to cover our collective butts. Thank you very much!

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    Member BoomBaby33's Avatar
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    Default Re: Trade deadline countdown - Feb. 22 '08

    Quote Originally Posted by Mal View Post
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    Fellow Digest members,

    This thread was deleted for good reason, and it's a problem we've been having from many people and it's past due that I do a better job of bringing attention to it.

    Whenever you post an article from somewhere on the web, we need to see NOT JUST A LINK, but ALSO A REFERAL. This means WHO WROTE IT and WHAT WEBSITE THE ARTICLE IS POSTED ON. I've made RED EDITS to the first post of the thread to highlight what is needed EVERY time. If those THREE THINGS are listed, we're good.

    But if not, threads will be removed. It's a LIABILITY ISSUE for the site that we MUST be strict about to cover our collective butts. Thank you very much!
    Sorry Mal. I thought all I needed was the link. It was not my intent to give the website a bad name. We Pacer fans appreciate having a forum like this to express our thoughts and ideas.

    There have been some very knowledgable posts in this thread that I hope can stay on here.

    Thanks for fixing it.

    BB33

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    Default Re: Trade deadline countdown - Feb. 22 '08

    Quote Originally Posted by BoomBaby33 View Post
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    Sorry Mal. I thought all I needed was the link. It was not my intent to give the website a bad name. We Pacer fans appreciate having a forum like this to express our thoughts and ideas.

    There have been some very knowledgable posts in this thread that I hope can stay on here.

    Thanks for fixing it.

    BB33
    BB33,

    Thank you for being so considerate. I'm glad to fix it. It's far, far from being a problem of you or a few individuals. I don't think 99% of our members know this is a rule we have, and so now I'm turning the corner in making it very clear. I certainly don't blame you as I would not blame any one poster for this. It's a forum-wide issue and it just so happened that your post was the one where things moved forward in making the policy clear to everyone.

    As for the thread and its posts, obviously it's un-deleted now and there are no plans to delete it again unless new information is brought to my attention that would warrant it.

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    Member BoomBaby33's Avatar
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    Default Re: Trade deadline countdown - Feb. 22 '08

    Quote Originally Posted by Shade View Post
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    For everyone saying to trade JO for a Happy Meal, remember the phrase:

    "Buy low, sell high."

    JO's trade value will probably never be HIGHER than it is right now

    Of course, if a good deal is on the table, you have to consider taking it. But there's no point at all in trading JO for trash.
    Fixed, IMO! His value will sink even farther. At least right now, the hope is for another desperate team that thinks when he gets healthy he could potentially be dominate again, at least for the short term. 2 games before his knee went bad again, he had a 27 point, something like 6 rebounds. Thats pretty good stats, but we lost the game though.

    Its OK to trade for "trash" if we are rebuilding, as long as the "trash" is expiring contracts and picks. No more 3-4 year bad contracts like Murphy's.

    IMO, JO just needs to go. His time is up here, as is Tins IMO.

    OTOT, dcpacerfan, probably has it right here in reality with the new coach and sticking it out with what we have till the end of this year.

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