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Thread: Pacers/Warriors Post Game 39: Can't stick it to the Dubs

  1. #26
    NaptownSeth is all feel Naptown_Seth's Avatar
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    Default Re: Pacers vs. Warriors Post-Game Thread: Same ****, different day

    Quote Originally Posted by Shade View Post
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    What can you say? It's like a script.
    Wait a second, does the WGA realize someone has crossed the line. I thought we were making the season up as it goes along for now.

    Frankly this game went way better than I expected. Granted I have low expectations.

    Quote Originally Posted by LoneGranger33 View Post
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    Jermaine played his ****ing heart out, and I don't want anyone telling me otherwise.
    I want someone to tell me that every time JO hit the floor the Pacers got killed and every time Diener was out there they kicked butt. The +/- is just an illusion created by keeping track of the actual score, not a real stat.


    Quote Originally Posted by Shade View Post
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    Yeah, and I'm not going to take that away from him.

    But do you know what?

    He didn't block out Biedrins at the end. And it cost them.
    Yes, because that was a 15 point play. And in no way did Tins/Diener getting beat to the rim like a rented mule by Davis/Ellis have any impact on the outcome. How about the block outs prior to that, I mean at least Biedrens is a solid rebounder with tons of size, how does Ellis get a flying jump to the rim free of charge?
    Last edited by Naptown_Seth; 01-14-2008 at 12:09 AM.

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    Default Re: Pacers/Warriors Post Game 39: Can't stick it to the Dubs

    wowwww foster didn't play at all!? no wonder we got beat on the damn glass all night!
    "GIMMIE DAT!"-DANGER

  3. #28
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    Default Re: Pacers/Warriors Post Game 39: Can't stick it to the Dubs

    Quote Originally Posted by tora tora View Post
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    Am I the only one who thinks that Jeff Foster is way too valuable to get a dnp? Is he injured or something?
    I'm waiting to hear Unclebuck's take on it...

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  4. #29
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    Default Re: Pacers/Warriors Post Game 39: Can't stick it to the Dubs

    Quote Originally Posted by indygeezer View Post
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    So...what was the deal on the DNP for Jeff Foster???
    M-Boyle said he was dressed and able to play. He's just a casualty of JOB's small lineup. I absolutely hate how Jeff gets screwed around. I personally feel that it is absolute crap that Murphy gets time over him.

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    Default Re: Pacers/Warriors Post Game 39: Can't stick it to the Dubs

    Second night without a legitimate low-post threat, especially since Don Nelson abuses Andris Biedrins.

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    Default Re: Pacers/Warriors Post Game 39: Can't stick it to the Dubs

    Quote Originally Posted by OnlyPacersLeft View Post
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    wowwww foster didn't play at all!? no wonder we got beat on the damn glass all night!
    If I remember they had a 50-43 rebounding edge. The problem was that they got some key offensive rebounds at the end.

    I don't really get Jim not playing Jeff. Jeff has showed more than Troy. And we are going to be playing small ball which is fine but Jeff is better for it. I mean he will fight, and scrap, and rebound. We don't need Troy out there shooting 3s. The other 4 out there with him can do that.

    Would be a good question for Jim's next show as to why Jeff isn't getting minutes.

  7. #32

    Default Re: Pacers/Warriors Post Game 39: Can't stick it to the Dubs

    Good Game pacers.

    Couldnt see the game but it seemed like O'Neal had a great game.

  8. #33
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    Default Re: Pacers/Warriors Post Game 39: Can't stick it to the Dubs



    Caption this.

    It's immediately after JT misses the "drawn-up" three at the end that would've tied it.

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    Default Re: Pacers/Warriors Post Game 39: Can't stick it to the Dubs

    Tinsley - Did you see the rack on Stacy Paetz? I could just....

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    Default Re: Pacers/Warriors Post Game 39: Can't stick it to the Dubs

    I have seen both games where we went small ball....and I can tell you that I don't like it that much. So far, we have played 2 teams that we could use a Small Ball lineup against.....but I think that the lack of Foster in the Frontline really leaves our interior defense lacking. JONeal can oly do so much....especially if he plays for 30+ minutes and is ( likely ) tired by the 4th QTR. For example, at the end, when JONeal was trying to make it back....the Warriors pushed the ball up quickly and ( I think ) Barnes quickly took the ball to the hoop.

    I think that it made a HUGE difference that Barnes and Biedrins were kept out of the majority of the game until the end. Although Biedrins was being owned by JONeal at first......he had fresh legs to give JONeal problems at the end who appeared tired by the end.

    I don't think that Small Ball lost the game for us....but as we use it more.....I think that we are going to see the same problems that the Warriors have seen when it comes to defense and offense....but multiplied by 2.
    Ash from Army of Darkness: Good...Bad...I'm the guy with the gun.

    This is David West, he is the Honey Badger, West just doesn't give a *****....he's pretty bad *ss cuz he has no regard for any other Player or Team whatsoever.

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    Default Re: Pacers/Warriors Post Game 39: Can't stick it to the Dubs

    Quote Originally Posted by rommie View Post
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    If I remember they had a 50-43 rebounding edge. The problem was that they got some key offensive rebounds at the end.

    I don't really get Jim not playing Jeff. Jeff has showed more than Troy. And we are going to be playing small ball which is fine but Jeff is better for it. I mean he will fight, and scrap, and rebound. We don't need Troy out there shooting 3s. The other 4 out there with him can do that.

    Would be a good question for Jim's next show as to why Jeff isn't getting minutes.
    Ever since we have gone with "Small Ball", we have gone with a more "offensive" lineup where everyone can shoot the ball. Diener has gotten the nod over Owens...and Murphy has gotten the nod over Foster.

    I can see advantages in using Diener....but I simply don't see why Foster can't play at the Center Spot and Murphy playing at the PF spot.
    Ash from Army of Darkness: Good...Bad...I'm the guy with the gun.

    This is David West, he is the Honey Badger, West just doesn't give a *****....he's pretty bad *ss cuz he has no regard for any other Player or Team whatsoever.

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    Default Re: Pacers vs. Warriors Post-Game Thread: Same ****, different day

    I don't know if you could hear it on TV.....but EVERYTIME Dunleavy touched the ball....he was BOOED VERY LOUDLY. At the beginning of the game....he was very passive. He just passed the ball and didn't really seem to get involved on the offensive end until later.

    I really hope that when SJax and Harrington return to Conseco...that they get the same treatment from the half-empty stadium.
    Ash from Army of Darkness: Good...Bad...I'm the guy with the gun.

    This is David West, he is the Honey Badger, West just doesn't give a *****....he's pretty bad *ss cuz he has no regard for any other Player or Team whatsoever.

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    Default Re: Pacers/Warriors Post Game 39: Can't stick it to the Dubs

    Thing is the Indy fans have legit beef with Al and Jack. Jack for the obvious multitude of reasons, and Al for the fact that he trashed the organization after he was traded away. Pretty classless. The only crime MDJ committed against the Warriors fans was not living up to his draft pick, but he was boo'd as bad if not worse than Artest or Jackson were boo'd either of their first games back in Indy.

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    Default Re: Pacers/Warriors Post Game 39: Can't stick it to the Dubs

    I have to wonder why the crowd was just so into booing MDJ. He was nothing but a high class guy while he was there and never said a bad word about the Warrior organization or the fans. My only guess is that it's Oakland fans frustrated from a year of playing russian roulette with QB's.

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    Default Re: Pacers/Warriors Post Game 39: Can't stick it to the Dubs

    I just came back from the game. Pretty entertaining for most of it.

    A very good game from the Pacers, Dunleavy and Jermaine. A very solid performance from Granger as well.

    The Pacers outplayed the Warriors for most of the game. As expected, they did the right thing and packed it in and forced the Warriors to shoot from the outside, which they did poorly for most of the game. They also did a good job of pushing the ball up the floor to create a few open looks after the Warriors scored (essentially giving some of their own medicine).

    Jermaine physically isn't what he used to be, but he still looks very effective on help defense. He erased shot after shot. Scorer gave him 6 blocks but it seemed like more. Whenever you guys took him out and put Murphy in at center, it was basically a free lane to the basket for the Warriors. In fact I felt having Murphy in there for a couple stretches in each half is what kept the Warriors in the game. Biedrins has a deep thigh bruise from the game against Memphis and Nellie was careful using him. Jermaine mostly had his way inside, but he forced a few shots in the 2nd half against double/triple teams. He's just never been a great passer out of the post.

    What the game came down to was the Warriors getting offensive rebounds (you guys missed Foster here) and forcing turnovers, which they are usually pretty good at.

    On the last shot, the Warriors wisened up and kept Granger from getting the open look at the 3, daring Tinsley to shoot it instead. I think Granger is a very solid player with a good looking shot. Judging from just this one game though, he looks like a guy who if I'm playing against would rather force him to put the ball on the floor as opposed to giving him the open look. He's not exactly Clyde Drexler off the dribble when a guy runs at him.

    As for the Warriors, they played like garbage most of the night. Jackson played with the flu and he stunk, but he's really stunk it up for a couple weeks now. Really, he's being miscast as a #2 option because the W's don't really have anyone else who can step into that role right now. Overall, he's just not a talented enough guy to take on that much of the offensive load, especially when he's got to expend energy guarding the opposing team's best player every night.

    I thought the Warriors really were going to shop Monta Ellis around the trade deadline, but he's upped his game and is proving to be too valuable right now. He's cut down on his turnovers and improved his mid-range game. He was simply too fast and explosive when he got going for the Pacers to handle. Tinsley's flagrant seemed to fire him up.

    A good game from the Pacers. Came out looking pretty determined and opened the game with more energy, which is impressive because they were the road team on a back to back. Dunleavy played very well through the boos and silenced the crowd a couple of times with big shots. A good game from him, tho he did miss a pretty key free throw down the stretch. He seemed to get a warm embrace from every one of his Warrior teammates. Good for him.

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    Default Re: Pacers/Warriors Post Game 39: Can't stick it to the Dubs

    Quote Originally Posted by mb221 View Post
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    Thing is the Indy fans have legit beef with Al and Jack. Jack for the obvious multitude of reasons, and Al for the fact that he trashed the organization after he was traded away. Pretty classless. The only crime MDJ committed against the Warriors fans was not living up to his draft pick, but he was boo'd as bad if not worse than Artest or Jackson were boo'd either of their first games back in Indy.
    Although I am very glad that he put up a VERY QUIET but outstanding 18pts/10reb/7assists on 54% shooting from the field....I really think that the booing really affected his game and how aggressive he would be.
    Ash from Army of Darkness: Good...Bad...I'm the guy with the gun.

    This is David West, he is the Honey Badger, West just doesn't give a *****....he's pretty bad *ss cuz he has no regard for any other Player or Team whatsoever.

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    Default Re: Pacers/Warriors Post Game 39: Can't stick it to the Dubs

    Quote Originally Posted by jeffg-body View Post
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    I have to wonder why the crowd was just so into booing MDJ. He was nothing but a high class guy while he was there and never said a bad word about the Warrior organization or the fans. My only guess is that it's Oakland fans frustrated from a year of playing russian roulette with QB's.
    The reason Dunleavy is disliked isn't that simple. It's kind of like explaining why Dunleavy was never any good until this year.

    First of all, he was high profile coming from Duke (and everyone hates Duke). He was a coach's son. He was the #3 pick. He didn't work for anyone or against anyone in pre-draft camps (Caron Butler was incredibly pissed that Dunleavy went that high w/o working out) but still went high.

    When he initially played, he stunk and the team struggled. He was the #3 pick who got outplayed by castoff guys like Brian Cardinal and Earl Boykins. He was seen as the guy with the silver spoon in his mouth who got picked #3 because of his Daddy's name and was getting his lunch money taken away by scrubs who were just trying to scrape by in the league.

    And throughout it all, he'd never say "I need to pick it up." If he and the team were stinking, he'd never accept the accountability publicly. He'd basically infer that "Well, I'm playing the game the right way, so don't blame me." He also made a backhanded comment towards Warriors fans after the trade by saying that he was glad he was finally going to a place where fans understood the game (or something very close to those words).

    The Summary: Right or wrong, Dunleavy in the Bay Area is viewed as a guy who was made to be important (#3 overall pick), was paid to be important ($45M contract) and wanted to have the status of a guy who was important but didn't want the criticism, expectations and pressure that came along with it.

    It's not his fault that he was made to be the #3 overall pick. He shouldn't have gone that high. He's simply not that talented of a guy. Being somewhere else means he no longer has that type of pressure and expectation on him and that's probably the biggest reason he's doing better.

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    Default Re: Pacers/Warriors Post Game 39: Can't stick it to the Dubs

    Quote Originally Posted by jeffg-body View Post
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    I have to wonder why the crowd was just so into booing MDJ. He was nothing but a high class guy while he was there and never said a bad word about the Warrior organization or the fans. My only guess is that it's Oakland fans frustrated from a year of playing russian roulette with QB's.
    Warrior fans always hated that he underperformed as a Warrior.....they hated that he was inconsistent at times....they hated that he never lived up to being a #3 pick....they hated that he never lived up to the overpaid contract that he was given.

    They did boo Murphy....but I think it faded as the game got along.

    The only part that I loved was towards the end of the game where we were close....the crowd was standing and screaming "Defense"...and then Dunleavy got the ball and drained a jumpshot...quickly silencing the crowd.
    Ash from Army of Darkness: Good...Bad...I'm the guy with the gun.

    This is David West, he is the Honey Badger, West just doesn't give a *****....he's pretty bad *ss cuz he has no regard for any other Player or Team whatsoever.

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    Default Re: Pacers/Warriors Post Game 39: Can't stick it to the Dubs

    Quote Originally Posted by CableKC View Post
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    Warrior fans always hated that he underperformed as a Warrior.....they hated that he was inconsistent at times....they hated that he never lived up to being a #3 pick....they hated that he never lived up to the overpaid contract that he was given.

    They did boo Murphy....but I think it faded as the game got along.

    The only part that I loved was towards the end of the game where we were close....the crowd was standing and screaming "Defense"...and then Dunleavy got the ball and drained a jumpshot...quickly silencing the crowd.
    The main thing is that he underperformed. But on top of that, he kind of gave off the vibe of "It's not my fault because I play the game the right way". He was picked high. A lot was invested in him. Trades were made just to accommodate him. Coaches were hired specifically for him. Lineups were changed just to try to get him going. Through it all, he could just never get going and the view was that he never dug deep enough to try to take the bull by the horns.

    It just wasn't the right situation for anyone and he needed to go, just like Stephen Jackson.

    They really don't care that much about Murphy. He got paid big and underperformed but the fans never viewed him as a snob the way they viewed Dunleavy.

    When Jason Richardson comes to town in a couple of weeks, I expect that this man will get a two minute standing ovation before the game and will probably get another big ovation after the game. Fans will want pictures with him before and after the game. They'll probably have a video tribute. Little kids will probably give him flowers.

    We're not total haters.

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    Default Re: Pacers/Warriors Post Game 39: Can't stick it to the Dubs

    BTW,

    Dunleavy loves us Warrior fans too

    OAKLAND, Calif. (AP) -- From Mike Dunleavy's opening introduction to his final missed 3-pointer, the booing Golden State fans let their least favorite player know just how much they still despise him.

    And after the Warriors finished their 106-101 comeback victory Sunday night over Dunleavy and his Indiana Pacers, the much-reviled forward confirmed that the feeling is mutual.

    "I wouldn't want it any other way," said Dunleavy, who spent his first 4½ NBA seasons with the Warriors. "I couldn't care less. It's hard to pay attention and care about something somebody says when you have no respect for them. They can do whatever they want."

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    Default Re: Pacers/Warriors Post Game 39: Can't stick it to the Dubs

    Quote Originally Posted by d_c View Post
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    Jermaine physically isn't what he used to be, but he still looks very effective on help defense. He erased shot after shot. Scorer gave him 6 blocks but it seemed like more. Whenever you guys took him out and put Murphy in at center, it was basically a free lane to the basket for the Warriors. In fact I felt having Murphy in there for a couple stretches in each half is what kept the Warriors in the game. Biedrins has a deep thigh bruise from the game against Memphis and Nellie was careful using him. Jermaine mostly had his way inside, but he forced a few shots in the 2nd half against double/triple teams. He's just never been a great passer out of the post.
    There are 2 parts to JONeal's rather ineffective post-offense:

    1 ) I still think that the rest of the team does a VERY POOR job of moving around to get not only open...but in a place where JONeal can pass the ball to.

    2 ) When he does try to take the ball to the hoop...but is cut off in the paint.....I think that he commits before realizing that the paint is closed off to him and ends up trying to force the ball into the hoop. It really looks like he's trying to push the ball into the hoop rather then take a good shot. He did that 2 or 3 times in the game where he started off from the the right side of the basket...tried to bull his way into the paint then saw 2/3 players there guarding and he ended up doing a fadeaway shot that just clanked off the basket.

    I blame the players lack of rotating to JONeal's side more then his inability to take a good shot in the paint and settling for a forced shot.
    Ash from Army of Darkness: Good...Bad...I'm the guy with the gun.

    This is David West, he is the Honey Badger, West just doesn't give a *****....he's pretty bad *ss cuz he has no regard for any other Player or Team whatsoever.

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    Default Re: Pacers/Warriors Post Game 39: Can't stick it to the Dubs

    Quote Originally Posted by d_c View Post
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    "I wouldn't want it any other way," said Dunleavy, who spent his first 4½ NBA seasons with the Warriors. "I couldn't care less. It's hard to pay attention and care about something somebody says when you have no respect for them. They can do whatever they want."
    I do wish that he would take the high-road in regards to this.....but I admit that I am glad that he publically said that no love for the Oakland fans.

    The only thing that I was really happy with him was that he was able to step up and play very well.
    Ash from Army of Darkness: Good...Bad...I'm the guy with the gun.

    This is David West, he is the Honey Badger, West just doesn't give a *****....he's pretty bad *ss cuz he has no regard for any other Player or Team whatsoever.

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    Default Re: Pacers/Warriors Post Game 39: Can't stick it to the Dubs

    The commentators were mentioning that the W's often start out slowly because they are playing 1 on 1 instead of as a team. It seems like the P's do the opposite in their losses. Come out strong with a lot of movement then slowly revert to more individual play.

    Not a bad outing, but not a win. Hard to tell if Mike went away towards the end or whether there was just to much isolation play.

    JO looked good, but when he dribbled until Ellis was able to steal the ball of the weak side it killed me.

    I was thinking that last night was a good example of how to play with JO. Tonight may be the example of when JO is solid, but we needed different things from him.

    Agree with above post - guys need to move to get to where JO can dish to them.

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    Default Re: Pacers/Warriors Post Game 39: Can't stick it to the Dubs

    Quote Originally Posted by d_c View Post
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    The main thing is that he underperformed. But on top of that, he kind of gave off the vibe of "It's not my fault because I play the game the right way". He was picked high. A lot was invested in him. Trades were made just to accommodate him. Coaches were hired specifically for him. Lineups were changed just to try to get him going. Through it all, he could just never get going and the view was that he never dug deep enough to try to take the bull by the horns.

    It just wasn't the right situation for anyone and he needed to go, just like Stephen Jackson.

    They really don't care that much about Murphy. He got paid big and underperformed but the fans never viewed him as a snob the way they viewed Dunleavy.
    Could you elaborate on what you mean by "trades were made to accomodate him"?

    I'm not going to fault him for the Warriors picking him as the 3rd pick in the draft...I'm not going to fault him for the Warriors conceding to overpay him they didn't have to during a time when EVERYONE was being overpaid. I can understand that he has always underperformed.....and that a change in scenery was really needed......but he is what he is what he is.
    Ash from Army of Darkness: Good...Bad...I'm the guy with the gun.

    This is David West, he is the Honey Badger, West just doesn't give a *****....he's pretty bad *ss cuz he has no regard for any other Player or Team whatsoever.

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    Default Re: Pacers/Warriors Post Game 39: Can't stick it to the Dubs

    Quote Originally Posted by CableKC View Post
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    I do wish that he would take the high-road in regards to this.....but I admit that I am glad that he publically said that no love for the Oakland fans.

    The only thing that I was really happy with him was that he was able to step up and play very well.
    We hate him and he hates us. We think he's a snob who underperformed and he thinks we're crude fans with no basketball knowledge. We boo him and he tries to stick it to us.

    It's all good. I have no problems with anything because it really doesn't matter. The Warriors are better off after the trade and so is Mike. It's all part of sports: You cheer for who you like and boo who you don't. That's what makes being a fan fun.

    He performed well tonight, as I would expect anyone with any pride to do. Good for him.

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