Announcement

Collapse

The Rules of Pacers Digest

Hello everyone,

Whether your are a long standing forum member or whether you have just registered today, it's a good idea to read and review the rules below so that you have a very good idea of what to expect when you come to Pacers Digest.

A quick note to new members: Your posts will not immediately show up when you make them. An administrator has to approve at least your first post before the forum software will later upgrade your account to the status of a fully-registered member. This usually happens within a couple of hours or so after your post(s) is/are approved, so you may need to be a little patient at first.

Why do we do this? So that it's more difficult for spammers (be they human or robot) to post, and so users who are banned cannot immediately re-register and start dousing people with verbal flames.

Below are the rules of Pacers Digest. After you have read them, you will have a very good sense of where we are coming from, what we expect, what we don't want to see, and how we react to things.

Rule #1

Pacers Digest is intended to be a place to discuss basketball without having to deal with the kinds of behaviors or attitudes that distract people from sticking with the discussion of the topics at hand. These unwanted distractions can come in many forms, and admittedly it can sometimes be tricky to pin down each and every kind that can rear its ugly head, but we feel that the following examples and explanations cover at least a good portion of that ground and should at least give people a pretty good idea of the kinds of things we actively discourage:

"Anyone who __________ is a liar / a fool / an idiot / a blind homer / has their head buried in the sand / a blind hater / doesn't know basketball / doesn't watch the games"

"People with intelligence will agree with me when I say that __________"

"Only stupid people think / believe / do ___________"

"I can't wait to hear something from PosterX when he/she sees that **insert a given incident or current event that will have probably upset or disappointed PosterX here**"

"He/she is just delusional"

"This thread is stupid / worthless / embarrassing"

"I'm going to take a moment to point and / laugh at PosterX / GroupOfPeopleY who thought / believed *insert though/belief here*"

"Remember when PosterX said OldCommentY that no longer looks good? "

In general, if a comment goes from purely on topic to something 'ad hominem' (personal jabs, personal shots, attacks, flames, however you want to call it, towards a person, or a group of people, or a given city/state/country of people), those are most likely going to be found intolerable.

We also dissuade passive aggressive behavior. This can be various things, but common examples include statements that are basically meant to imply someone is either stupid or otherwise incapable of holding a rational conversation. This can include (but is not limited to) laughing at someone's conclusions rather than offering an honest rebuttal, asking people what game they were watching, or another common problem is Poster X will say "that player isn't that bad" and then Poster Y will say something akin to "LOL you think that player is good". We're not going to tolerate those kinds of comments out of respect for the community at large and for the sake of trying to just have an honest conversation.

Now, does the above cover absolutely every single kind of distraction that is unwanted? Probably not, but you should by now have a good idea of the general types of things we will be discouraging. The above examples are meant to give you a good feel for / idea of what we're looking for. If something new or different than the above happens to come along and results in the same problem (that being, any other attitude or behavior that ultimately distracts from actually just discussing the topic at hand, or that is otherwise disrespectful to other posters), we can and we will take action to curb this as well, so please don't take this to mean that if you managed to technically avoid saying something exactly like one of the above examples that you are then somehow off the hook.

That all having been said, our goal is to do so in a generally kind and respectful way, and that doesn't mean the moment we see something we don't like that somebody is going to be suspended or banned, either. It just means that at the very least we will probably say something about it, quite possibly snipping out the distracting parts of the post in question while leaving alone the parts that are actually just discussing the topics, and in the event of a repeating or excessive problem, then we will start issuing infractions to try to further discourage further repeat problems, and if it just never seems to improve, then finally suspensions or bans will come into play. We would prefer it never went that far, and most of the time for most of our posters, it won't ever have to.

A slip up every once and a while is pretty normal, but, again, when it becomes repetitive or excessive, something will be done. Something occasional is probably going to be let go (within reason), but when it starts to become habitual or otherwise a pattern, odds are very good that we will step in.

There's always a small minority that like to push people's buttons and/or test their own boundaries with regards to the administrators, and in the case of someone acting like that, please be aware that this is not a court of law, but a private website run by people who are simply trying to do the right thing as they see it. If we feel that you are a special case that needs to be dealt with in an exceptional way because your behavior isn't explicitly mirroring one of our above examples of what we generally discourage, we can and we will take atypical action to prevent this from continuing if you are not cooperative with us.

Also please be aware that you will not be given a pass simply by claiming that you were 'only joking,' because quite honestly, when someone really is just joking, for one thing most people tend to pick up on the joke, including the person or group that is the target of the joke, and for another thing, in the event where an honest joke gets taken seriously and it upsets or angers someone, the person who is truly 'only joking' will quite commonly go out of his / her way to apologize and will try to mend fences. People who are dishonest about their statements being 'jokes' do not do so, and in turn that becomes a clear sign of what is really going on. It's nothing new.

In any case, quite frankly, the overall quality and health of the entire forum's community is more important than any one troublesome user will ever be, regardless of exactly how a problem is exhibiting itself, and if it comes down to us having to make a choice between you versus the greater health and happiness of the entire community, the community of this forum will win every time.

Lastly, there are also some posters, who are generally great contributors and do not otherwise cause any problems, who sometimes feel it's their place to provoke or to otherwise 'mess with' that small minority of people described in the last paragraph, and while we possibly might understand why you might feel you WANT to do something like that, the truth is we can't actually tolerate that kind of behavior from you any more than we can tolerate the behavior from them. So if we feel that you are trying to provoke those other posters into doing or saying something that will get themselves into trouble, then we will start to view you as a problem as well, because of the same reason as before: The overall health of the forum comes first, and trying to stir the pot with someone like that doesn't help, it just makes it worse. Some will simply disagree with this philosophy, but if so, then so be it because ultimately we have to do what we think is best so long as it's up to us.

If you see a problem that we haven't addressed, the best and most appropriate course for a forum member to take here is to look over to the left of the post in question. See underneath that poster's name, avatar, and other info, down where there's a little triangle with an exclamation point (!) in it? Click that. That allows you to report the post to the admins so we can definitely notice it and give it a look to see what we feel we should do about it. Beyond that, obviously it's human nature sometimes to want to speak up to the poster in question who has bothered you, but we would ask that you try to refrain from doing so because quite often what happens is two or more posters all start going back and forth about the original offending post, and suddenly the entire thread is off topic or otherwise derailed. So while the urge to police it yourself is understandable, it's best to just report it to us and let us handle it. Thank you!

All of the above is going to be subject to a case by case basis, but generally and broadly speaking, this should give everyone a pretty good idea of how things will typically / most often be handled.

Rule #2

If the actions of an administrator inspire you to make a comment, criticism, or express a concern about it, there is a wrong place and a couple of right places to do so.

The wrong place is to do so in the original thread in which the administrator took action. For example, if a post gets an infraction, or a post gets deleted, or a comment within a larger post gets clipped out, in a thread discussing Paul George, the wrong thing to do is to distract from the discussion of Paul George by adding your off topic thoughts on what the administrator did.

The right places to do so are:

A) Start a thread about the specific incident you want to talk about on the Feedback board. This way you are able to express yourself in an area that doesn't throw another thread off topic, and this way others can add their two cents as well if they wish, and additionally if there's something that needs to be said by the administrators, that is where they will respond to it.

B) Send a private message to the administrators, and they can respond to you that way.

If this is done the wrong way, those comments will be deleted, and if it's a repeating problem then it may also receive an infraction as well.

Rule #3

If a poster is bothering you, and an administrator has not or will not deal with that poster to the extent that you would prefer, you have a powerful tool at your disposal, one that has recently been upgraded and is now better than ever: The ability to ignore a user.

When you ignore a user, you will unfortunately still see some hints of their existence (nothing we can do about that), however, it does the following key things:

A) Any post they make will be completely invisible as you scroll through a thread.

B) The new addition to this feature: If someone QUOTES a user you are ignoring, you do not have to read who it was, or what that poster said, unless you go out of your way to click on a link to find out who it is and what they said.

To utilize this feature, from any page on Pacers Digest, scroll to the top of the page, look to the top right where it says 'Settings' and click that. From the settings page, look to the left side of the page where it says 'My Settings', and look down from there until you see 'Edit Ignore List' and click that. From here, it will say 'Add a Member to Your List...' Beneath that, click in the text box to the right of 'User Name', type in or copy & paste the username of the poster you are ignoring, and once their name is in the box, look over to the far right and click the 'Okay' button. All done!

Rule #4

Regarding infractions, currently they carry a value of one point each, and that point will expire in 31 days. If at any point a poster is carrying three points at the same time, that poster will be suspended until the oldest of the three points expires.

Rule #5

When you share or paste content or articles from another website, you must include the URL/link back to where you found it, who wrote it, and what website it's from. Said content will be removed if this doesn't happen.

An example:

If I copy and paste an article from the Indianapolis Star website, I would post something like this:

http://www.linktothearticlegoeshere.com/article
Title of the Article
Author's Name
Indianapolis Star

Rule #6

We cannot tolerate illegal videos on Pacers Digest. This means do not share any links to them, do not mention any websites that host them or link to them, do not describe how to find them in any way, and do not ask about them. Posts doing anything of the sort will be removed, the offenders will be contacted privately, and if the problem becomes habitual, you will be suspended, and if it still persists, you will probably be banned.

The legal means of watching or listening to NBA games are NBA League Pass Broadband (for US, or for International; both cost money) and NBA Audio League Pass (which is free). Look for them on NBA.com.

Rule #7

Provocative statements in a signature, or as an avatar, or as the 'tagline' beneath a poster's username (where it says 'Member' or 'Administrator' by default, if it is not altered) are an unwanted distraction that will more than likely be removed on sight. There can be shades of gray to this, but in general this could be something political or religious that is likely going to provoke or upset people, or otherwise something that is mean-spirited at the expense of a poster, a group of people, or a population.

It may or may not go without saying, but this goes for threads and posts as well, particularly when it's not made on the off-topic board (Market Square).

We do make exceptions if we feel the content is both innocuous and unlikely to cause social problems on the forum (such as wishing someone a Merry Christmas or a Happy Easter), and we also also make exceptions if such topics come up with regards to a sports figure (such as the Lance Stephenson situation bringing up discussions of domestic abuse and the law, or when Jason Collins came out as gay and how that lead to some discussion about gay rights).

However, once the discussion seems to be more/mostly about the political issues instead of the sports figure or his specific situation, the thread is usually closed.

Rule #8

We prefer self-restraint and/or modesty when making jokes or off topic comments in a sports discussion thread. They can be fun, but sometimes they derail or distract from a topic, and we don't want to see that happen. If we feel it is a problem, we will either delete or move those posts from the thread.

Rule #9

Generally speaking, we try to be a "PG-13" rated board, and we don't want to see sexual content or similarly suggestive content. Vulgarity is a more muddled issue, though again we prefer things to lean more towards "PG-13" than "R". If we feel things have gone too far, we will step in.

Rule #10

We like small signatures, not big signatures. The bigger the signature, the more likely it is an annoying or distracting signature.

Rule #11

Do not advertise anything without talking about it with the administrators first. This includes advertising with your signature, with your avatar, through private messaging, and/or by making a thread or post.
See more
See less

Here's how to turn things around -- demand better

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Here's how to turn things around -- demand better

    http://www.oregonlive.com/sports/ore...140.xml&coll=7

    Who turned the Blazers around? The fans
    Monday, January 07, 2008

    It was family night out, so Trail Blazers forward James Jones took his daughter, wife and infant son to one of those Chuck E. Cheese's chain restaurants and arcades the other night.

    Turns out Jones is more popular and approachable than the chain's anthropomorphic mouse, because, as Jones put it, "I finally told my wife, 'I'm being a distraction, I'll be over in the corner, holding our son, and hiding out.' "

    The Blazers have won 16 of their last 17 games. The NBA franchise has undergone one of the most remarkable wholesale transformations in major professional sports. And the off-court stories that used to involve strip clubs, guns, middle fingers, pit bulls, drag racing and police, now instead begin with, "You'll never guess who I saw playing Skee-Ball."

    So who gets the credit?

    I suppose you commend general manager Kevin Pritchard for orchestrating draft-day deals that landed Brandon Roy and LaMarcus Aldridge. And for convincing Joel Przybilla that Portland was a better fit for him than San Antonio or Detroit. And for signing Steve Blake. And for re-signing Travis Outlaw, who was drafted by former Blazers' executive Bob Whitsitt (who also deserves a salute for the pick).

    I guess you could praise coach Nate McMillan and his staff of assistants for their patience, vision and brilliant work with the league's youngest roster. And you could hail team president Larry Miller and right-hand executive Mike Golub for keeping their eyes on the ball. And you could praise the players for their growth and heart.

    Also, you could give owner Paul Allen credit for buying the Rose Garden arena back and, also, for signing the checks, and for flushing his former management team once he realized it was poisoning the organization. And you could give the scouts, assistant general manager Tom Penn and support staff loads of credit, too.

    You could do these things, but you shouldn't until you celebrate the party most responsible for the Trail Blazers' turnaround.

    That would be you.

    Because you must realize you forced all of this.

    You decided that you had high standards. You decided that you wouldn't tolerate malfeasance. You announced, like no other professional sports market in history, that you expected more than athleticism from the players wearing your city's name across their chests.

    When Blazers disrespected fans with obscene gestures, you refused to buy tickets. When a player berated his coach, you were outraged. When management presented you with a phony smile and a hollow 25-point pledge, it was you who said, "Let me know when you get serious about this."

    You made character matter.

    You created the culture everyone is talking about.

    You, not the Blazers, dictated the terms of your relationship.

    So take a bow, today.

    Because the Blazers are inspiring, and formidable, and altogether impressive. They're turning heads, and giving you butterflies. They're athletic, and well-coached, and this season feels special. And while managers manage, and coaches coach, and players play, the franchise was mostly just reacting to you.

    It was you who wouldn't tolerate creeps in uniform. And you who ignored clever marketing, and insisted what was inside the package mattered more. And you decided you could live with as many miserable draft-lottery seasons as were necessary if it meant that things would change someday.

    When Greg Oden was picked No. 1 overall, you showed up at Pioneer Courthouse Square to let him know he was welcome. Now, you're casting All-Star votes for Roy. And you've apparently decided you've seen enough traction that you're willing to come back and sell out the home arena again.

    I met a 22-year old man named Tim Bush on Sunday. He's a college student, studying at the Art Institute of Portland. He also has muscular dystrophy and uses a wheelchair since the third grade. When he was 16, the Make-A-Wish Foundation offered to grant one wish for Bush. He told them he wanted to meet the Trail Blazers, see a game, and have his basketball autographed by the team.

    They granted his wish five years ago.

    Bush waited for the Blazers after the game, outside the locker room, holding a pen and a basketball. One by one, the players skated past, signing their names and hurrying off. Bonzi Wells told a joke, then signed, and walked off, proud of himself. And then, here came Rasheed Wallace, who was told that there was a kid in a wheelchair waiting down the way, who wanted nothing more than a signature, and a couple of minutes of conversation with the team's best player.

    Said Bush: "I tried to talk to him but he just signed my basketball and looked at me like I was scum as he exited the building."

    Bush hates that autographed basketball, even now. He said it pains him to look at it. But you know, he can't stop looking at this 2007-08 Blazers. And every time he watches them play, it feels like wishes are coming true.

    Cheer yourselves today.

    You caused this.

    John Canzano: 503-294-5065; JohnCanzano@aol.com To read his blog, go to http://blog.oregonlive.com/ johncanzano; Catch him on the radio on "The Bald-Faced Truth" from 6-8 p.m. weekdays on KXL (750)

  • #2
    Re: Here's how to turn things around -- demand better

    Thanks, Roy.
    And I won't be here to see the day
    It all dries up and blows away
    I'd hang around just to see
    But they never had much use for me
    In Levelland. (James McMurtry)

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Here's how to turn things around -- demand better

      The loudest message the fans can send that enough is enough, is the color green (empty green seats, and missing green backs). I do keep the hope that my beloved Pacers will start an upward trend. I think this upcoming off-season will somehow redefine our franchise, but I'm not exactly sure how.

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Here's how to turn things around -- demand better

        wow...Bonzi i knew was kind of a jerk but damn rasheed...why is this guy such an ***? one day he needs to get caught blazing the ganja so he can get kicked out of the league.
        "GIMMIE DAT!"-DANGER

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Here's how to turn things around -- demand better

          Originally posted by OnlyPacersLeft View Post
          wow...Bonzi i knew was kind of a jerk but damn rasheed...why is this guy such an ***? one day he needs to get caught blazing the ganja so he can get kicked out of the league.
          NBA doesn't test for pot and I don't think a marijuana arrest would get you kicked out anyway.

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Here's how to turn things around -- demand better

            I suppose I sent the wrong message making this my first year to have season tickets, eh?

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Here's how to turn things around -- demand better

              When fans get serious about demanding character issues be addressed, then things can get done. But when fans get really, really serious and uptight about peformance issues, does it have the same good effect, or could it have the opposite?


              [~]) ... Cheers! Go Pacers!

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Here's how to turn things around -- demand better

                Here's hoping Donnie/Larry somehow reads this and takes it to heart. I think such a change needs to occur here. Most of the time, winning cures everything. But when a team is constantly sandbagged by incident after incident like Portland was and now Indiana, winning can only do so much.

                Portland is a now an example of how sacrificing 3 or 4 years of winning in order to build a team with character guys can produce results -- and put butts in seats. I realize that the Portland GM worked some magic through great draft-day trades and that those most likely sped up the rebuilding process. All I'm saying is that it can be done.

                I read Tony Dungy's book last week (I would recommend it, by the way). In the book, he talks about how he helped turn around the Bucs. One of the ways he did it was by trying to instill character values in the team. He really emphasized the importance of players making a positive impact on the community. Guys like Derrick Brooks and Warrick Dunn especially took it to heart. He also said that he gives all of his players a list:

                "Five Things That May Get You in USA Today."
                1. ALCOHOL OR ILLEGAL DRUGS
                2. BEING OUT AFTER 1:00 A.M.
                3. DRIVING MORE THAN 20 MPH OVER THE SPEED LIMIT
                4. GUNS
                5. WOMEN THAT YOU DON'T KNOW WELL ENOUGH (OR THAT YOU KNOW TOO WELL)

                Reading that section of the book really made me smile, considering how pertinent it was to the Pacers. (Another thing that surprised me, was how he came to the Colts. After he was fired by the Bucs, Jim Irsay left a 15 minute message on his answering machine basically begging him to come to the Colts. His primary reason? Dungy's emphasis on character. After considering an offer from the Panthers, Dungy took the Colts job, mainly because of Irsay's desire to have a team with good character.)

                The Pacers need to find the NBA equivalent of Tony Dungy or they need to do what the Blazers have done. I really think that's what it's going to take to turn the team around.
                Last edited by Aw Heck; 01-07-2008, 09:00 PM.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Here's how to turn things around -- demand better

                  I thought Sheed was a good dude, but apparently for once the media has it right. That's insanely low.

                  The Blazers current situation is the absolute perfect combination of a lot of factors. A lot of teams wouldn't be able to turn it around if the fans demanded better and the results would be similar for years and years.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Here's how to turn things around -- demand better

                    What if Sheed just found out that a niece has MS? May not be the case but it maybe the case. Who knows, maybe the reason that he did not say anything was because he was afraid. I don't know for sure, but you never know.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Here's how to turn things around -- demand better

                      Portland has made some terrific moves and had a fair amount of luck.
                      But they were also either willing to suck for awhile or at least didn't
                      cling to the notion that making the playoffs is the be all and end all.
                      Maybe that was because they sold the Rose Garden out regardless
                      and maybe not. I don't have a clue about that. But TBTP isn't or
                      hasn't been willing to do so.

                      Without an awful lot of freakish luck, you don't acquire stars without
                      upper level, Lottery picks. You don't get those unless you suck for
                      awhile.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Here's how to turn things around -- demand better

                        I think all of our guys are good character guys though, even Stephen Jackson was to a large degree.

                        I defy anyone to tell me which current Pacer player - besides Jeff Foster - is a jerk when it comes to fans. Maybe a knucklehead, but no jerks.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Here's how to turn things around -- demand better

                          Umm...The Blazers had good guys last season. Where were all these fans when they were losing?

                          Also, when the "Jail Blazers" were in the WCF Game 7 against the Lakers in 2000, their fans were still showing up, selling the Rose Garden out!

                          I'm sorry, I'm not buying this happy horse **** about the fans comming back JUST because they got rid of the a-holes on the team. If that were the case, the fans would have came back as soon as they cleaned house and that play-off run would have been in front of an empty @ss arena.

                          The Blazers didn't become an embarrasment to their own fans until they started losing on the court....Then the fans started to get annoyed with the character of the team.
                          ...Still "flying casual"
                          @roaminggnome74

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Here's how to turn things around -- demand better

                            Originally posted by LoneGranger33 View Post
                            I think all of our guys are good character guys though, even Stephen Jackson was to a large degree.
                            That's like saying most of the time, O.J. isn't violent.

                            Cussing out coaches, incidents at strip clubs, ball hogging, and continued griping and complaining to the refs = small degree of character, IMO.
                            "Look, it's up to me to put a team around ... Lance right now." —Kevin Pritchard press conference

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Here's how to turn things around -- demand better

                              Originally posted by Roaming Gnome View Post
                              Umm...The Blazers had good guys last season. Where were all these fans when they were losing?
                              .....
                              Also, when the "Jail Blazers" were in the WCF Game 7 against the Lakers in 2000, their fans were still showing up, selling the Rose Garden out!

                              The Blazers didn't become an embarrasment to their own fans until they started losing on the court....Then the fans started to get annoyed with the character of the team.
                              The "Jailblazers" stuff didn't happen until AFTER the 2000 playoff run. And yes, the Blazers had good guys last season. But they also still had Zach Randolph, one of the last Jailblazers still on the team (Darius Miles being the other one). And it was only Brandon Roy's rookie year. Other than him, the fans didn't really have anything to get excited about. They did have a bad enough season to win the #1 pick, after all.

                              I won't discount the fact that they're currently winning. That certainly helps. Good character guys on a losing team won't bring back fans. But I think the main attraction for fans is the fact that they now have hope. With Aldridge having a breakout season, Roy playing well, and Oden on deck for next year, Blazers fans have a lot to look forward to. With pretty much all of the "bad character" guys gone (Rasheed Wallace, Damon Stoudamire, Bonzi Wells, Zach Randolph, Ruben Patterson, Jeff McInnis, Qyntel Woods, and Sebastian Telfair), the promising young talent, and the Blazers' 25 Point Pledge, the Blazers have done a tremendous job of putting their bad past behind them and moving on to a better era. And I think the fans recognize that.

                              However, if the Pacers ever find the need to attempt something similar, I'm sure they will have a more difficult time bringing back fans. For starters, the Blazers are the only pro sports team in town. There's no NFL franchise to distract fans or eat up money that could go towards Blazers tickets. Second, Blazers had the benefit of some amazingly good luck with landing the #1 pick and some savvy moves by their GM. I'm not so sure that the Pacers could ever be that fortunate.

                              Comment

                              Working...
                              X