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The Rules of Pacers Digest

Hello everyone,

Whether your are a long standing forum member or whether you have just registered today, it's a good idea to read and review the rules below so that you have a very good idea of what to expect when you come to Pacers Digest.

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Why do we do this? So that it's more difficult for spammers (be they human or robot) to post, and so users who are banned cannot immediately re-register and start dousing people with verbal flames.

Below are the rules of Pacers Digest. After you have read them, you will have a very good sense of where we are coming from, what we expect, what we don't want to see, and how we react to things.

Rule #1

Pacers Digest is intended to be a place to discuss basketball without having to deal with the kinds of behaviors or attitudes that distract people from sticking with the discussion of the topics at hand. These unwanted distractions can come in many forms, and admittedly it can sometimes be tricky to pin down each and every kind that can rear its ugly head, but we feel that the following examples and explanations cover at least a good portion of that ground and should at least give people a pretty good idea of the kinds of things we actively discourage:

"Anyone who __________ is a liar / a fool / an idiot / a blind homer / has their head buried in the sand / a blind hater / doesn't know basketball / doesn't watch the games"

"People with intelligence will agree with me when I say that __________"

"Only stupid people think / believe / do ___________"

"I can't wait to hear something from PosterX when he/she sees that **insert a given incident or current event that will have probably upset or disappointed PosterX here**"

"He/she is just delusional"

"This thread is stupid / worthless / embarrassing"

"I'm going to take a moment to point and / laugh at PosterX / GroupOfPeopleY who thought / believed *insert though/belief here*"

"Remember when PosterX said OldCommentY that no longer looks good? "

In general, if a comment goes from purely on topic to something 'ad hominem' (personal jabs, personal shots, attacks, flames, however you want to call it, towards a person, or a group of people, or a given city/state/country of people), those are most likely going to be found intolerable.

We also dissuade passive aggressive behavior. This can be various things, but common examples include statements that are basically meant to imply someone is either stupid or otherwise incapable of holding a rational conversation. This can include (but is not limited to) laughing at someone's conclusions rather than offering an honest rebuttal, asking people what game they were watching, or another common problem is Poster X will say "that player isn't that bad" and then Poster Y will say something akin to "LOL you think that player is good". We're not going to tolerate those kinds of comments out of respect for the community at large and for the sake of trying to just have an honest conversation.

Now, does the above cover absolutely every single kind of distraction that is unwanted? Probably not, but you should by now have a good idea of the general types of things we will be discouraging. The above examples are meant to give you a good feel for / idea of what we're looking for. If something new or different than the above happens to come along and results in the same problem (that being, any other attitude or behavior that ultimately distracts from actually just discussing the topic at hand, or that is otherwise disrespectful to other posters), we can and we will take action to curb this as well, so please don't take this to mean that if you managed to technically avoid saying something exactly like one of the above examples that you are then somehow off the hook.

That all having been said, our goal is to do so in a generally kind and respectful way, and that doesn't mean the moment we see something we don't like that somebody is going to be suspended or banned, either. It just means that at the very least we will probably say something about it, quite possibly snipping out the distracting parts of the post in question while leaving alone the parts that are actually just discussing the topics, and in the event of a repeating or excessive problem, then we will start issuing infractions to try to further discourage further repeat problems, and if it just never seems to improve, then finally suspensions or bans will come into play. We would prefer it never went that far, and most of the time for most of our posters, it won't ever have to.

A slip up every once and a while is pretty normal, but, again, when it becomes repetitive or excessive, something will be done. Something occasional is probably going to be let go (within reason), but when it starts to become habitual or otherwise a pattern, odds are very good that we will step in.

There's always a small minority that like to push people's buttons and/or test their own boundaries with regards to the administrators, and in the case of someone acting like that, please be aware that this is not a court of law, but a private website run by people who are simply trying to do the right thing as they see it. If we feel that you are a special case that needs to be dealt with in an exceptional way because your behavior isn't explicitly mirroring one of our above examples of what we generally discourage, we can and we will take atypical action to prevent this from continuing if you are not cooperative with us.

Also please be aware that you will not be given a pass simply by claiming that you were 'only joking,' because quite honestly, when someone really is just joking, for one thing most people tend to pick up on the joke, including the person or group that is the target of the joke, and for another thing, in the event where an honest joke gets taken seriously and it upsets or angers someone, the person who is truly 'only joking' will quite commonly go out of his / her way to apologize and will try to mend fences. People who are dishonest about their statements being 'jokes' do not do so, and in turn that becomes a clear sign of what is really going on. It's nothing new.

In any case, quite frankly, the overall quality and health of the entire forum's community is more important than any one troublesome user will ever be, regardless of exactly how a problem is exhibiting itself, and if it comes down to us having to make a choice between you versus the greater health and happiness of the entire community, the community of this forum will win every time.

Lastly, there are also some posters, who are generally great contributors and do not otherwise cause any problems, who sometimes feel it's their place to provoke or to otherwise 'mess with' that small minority of people described in the last paragraph, and while we possibly might understand why you might feel you WANT to do something like that, the truth is we can't actually tolerate that kind of behavior from you any more than we can tolerate the behavior from them. So if we feel that you are trying to provoke those other posters into doing or saying something that will get themselves into trouble, then we will start to view you as a problem as well, because of the same reason as before: The overall health of the forum comes first, and trying to stir the pot with someone like that doesn't help, it just makes it worse. Some will simply disagree with this philosophy, but if so, then so be it because ultimately we have to do what we think is best so long as it's up to us.

If you see a problem that we haven't addressed, the best and most appropriate course for a forum member to take here is to look over to the left of the post in question. See underneath that poster's name, avatar, and other info, down where there's a little triangle with an exclamation point (!) in it? Click that. That allows you to report the post to the admins so we can definitely notice it and give it a look to see what we feel we should do about it. Beyond that, obviously it's human nature sometimes to want to speak up to the poster in question who has bothered you, but we would ask that you try to refrain from doing so because quite often what happens is two or more posters all start going back and forth about the original offending post, and suddenly the entire thread is off topic or otherwise derailed. So while the urge to police it yourself is understandable, it's best to just report it to us and let us handle it. Thank you!

All of the above is going to be subject to a case by case basis, but generally and broadly speaking, this should give everyone a pretty good idea of how things will typically / most often be handled.

Rule #2

If the actions of an administrator inspire you to make a comment, criticism, or express a concern about it, there is a wrong place and a couple of right places to do so.

The wrong place is to do so in the original thread in which the administrator took action. For example, if a post gets an infraction, or a post gets deleted, or a comment within a larger post gets clipped out, in a thread discussing Paul George, the wrong thing to do is to distract from the discussion of Paul George by adding your off topic thoughts on what the administrator did.

The right places to do so are:

A) Start a thread about the specific incident you want to talk about on the Feedback board. This way you are able to express yourself in an area that doesn't throw another thread off topic, and this way others can add their two cents as well if they wish, and additionally if there's something that needs to be said by the administrators, that is where they will respond to it.

B) Send a private message to the administrators, and they can respond to you that way.

If this is done the wrong way, those comments will be deleted, and if it's a repeating problem then it may also receive an infraction as well.

Rule #3

If a poster is bothering you, and an administrator has not or will not deal with that poster to the extent that you would prefer, you have a powerful tool at your disposal, one that has recently been upgraded and is now better than ever: The ability to ignore a user.

When you ignore a user, you will unfortunately still see some hints of their existence (nothing we can do about that), however, it does the following key things:

A) Any post they make will be completely invisible as you scroll through a thread.

B) The new addition to this feature: If someone QUOTES a user you are ignoring, you do not have to read who it was, or what that poster said, unless you go out of your way to click on a link to find out who it is and what they said.

To utilize this feature, from any page on Pacers Digest, scroll to the top of the page, look to the top right where it says 'Settings' and click that. From the settings page, look to the left side of the page where it says 'My Settings', and look down from there until you see 'Edit Ignore List' and click that. From here, it will say 'Add a Member to Your List...' Beneath that, click in the text box to the right of 'User Name', type in or copy & paste the username of the poster you are ignoring, and once their name is in the box, look over to the far right and click the 'Okay' button. All done!

Rule #4

Regarding infractions, currently they carry a value of one point each, and that point will expire in 31 days. If at any point a poster is carrying three points at the same time, that poster will be suspended until the oldest of the three points expires.

Rule #5

When you share or paste content or articles from another website, you must include the URL/link back to where you found it, who wrote it, and what website it's from. Said content will be removed if this doesn't happen.

An example:

If I copy and paste an article from the Indianapolis Star website, I would post something like this:

http://www.linktothearticlegoeshere.com/article
Title of the Article
Author's Name
Indianapolis Star

Rule #6

We cannot tolerate illegal videos on Pacers Digest. This means do not share any links to them, do not mention any websites that host them or link to them, do not describe how to find them in any way, and do not ask about them. Posts doing anything of the sort will be removed, the offenders will be contacted privately, and if the problem becomes habitual, you will be suspended, and if it still persists, you will probably be banned.

The legal means of watching or listening to NBA games are NBA League Pass Broadband (for US, or for International; both cost money) and NBA Audio League Pass (which is free). Look for them on NBA.com.

Rule #7

Provocative statements in a signature, or as an avatar, or as the 'tagline' beneath a poster's username (where it says 'Member' or 'Administrator' by default, if it is not altered) are an unwanted distraction that will more than likely be removed on sight. There can be shades of gray to this, but in general this could be something political or religious that is likely going to provoke or upset people, or otherwise something that is mean-spirited at the expense of a poster, a group of people, or a population.

It may or may not go without saying, but this goes for threads and posts as well, particularly when it's not made on the off-topic board (Market Square).

We do make exceptions if we feel the content is both innocuous and unlikely to cause social problems on the forum (such as wishing someone a Merry Christmas or a Happy Easter), and we also also make exceptions if such topics come up with regards to a sports figure (such as the Lance Stephenson situation bringing up discussions of domestic abuse and the law, or when Jason Collins came out as gay and how that lead to some discussion about gay rights).

However, once the discussion seems to be more/mostly about the political issues instead of the sports figure or his specific situation, the thread is usually closed.

Rule #8

We prefer self-restraint and/or modesty when making jokes or off topic comments in a sports discussion thread. They can be fun, but sometimes they derail or distract from a topic, and we don't want to see that happen. If we feel it is a problem, we will either delete or move those posts from the thread.

Rule #9

Generally speaking, we try to be a "PG-13" rated board, and we don't want to see sexual content or similarly suggestive content. Vulgarity is a more muddled issue, though again we prefer things to lean more towards "PG-13" than "R". If we feel things have gone too far, we will step in.

Rule #10

We like small signatures, not big signatures. The bigger the signature, the more likely it is an annoying or distracting signature.

Rule #11

Do not advertise anything without talking about it with the administrators first. This includes advertising with your signature, with your avatar, through private messaging, and/or by making a thread or post.
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Our point guard situation disturbs me

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  • #16
    Re: Our point guard situation disturbs me

    Originally posted by Peck View Post
    Diener was a no cost pickup that if he did good Bird would look like he struck gold. However if he failed (which so far is the case) then it's hard to fault anyone on this because of the cost.

    However we desperately need to get someone in here to help run the point for a few min. a game.

    God help us if Jamaal goes down with an injury of some kind.

    Keith McCloud was fine by me but I bet he wanted the lower level exemption at least.

    Jamaal has really and truely done a 180 this season and he keeps talking about how nice it is to have a coaching staff finally have faith in him.

    I have no real gripes about his play, sure he could be a better defender, but when you run an open style like we do you have to give the PG the power to miss some shots and make a bad pass. Just as long as they don't overdue it which Jamaal is not.

    However, I don't care about any history of this guy at all when I say this, but even the healthiest of pg's get injured and very very few can go for this many min. for the length of a season.
    I fully aggree with what Peck wrote here and what Anthem wrote in his opening post here, including the positive part about Jamaal and the fact that we do need a backup PG that can meaningfully fill in when called upon.

    Regards,

    Mourning
    2012 PD ABA Fantasy Keeper League Champion, sports.ws

    2011 PD ABA Fantasy Keeper League Champion, sports.ws

    2006 PD ABA Fantasy League runner up, sports.ws

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    • #17
      Re: Our point guard situation disturbs me

      just wanted to clarify travis diener's contract. he's not that cheap - he's guaranteed almost $5m over the next 3 years. that's first round pick money - about what danny and shawne are pulling in and roughly 2x the min.

      generally, you sign scrubs to min. 1 year deals only. why not? every year there are plenty of scrubs who are happy to take minimum deals. if they show anything then you can sign them to a longer deal next time.

      if you sign a guy for 3 years though, you're expecting him to be in the rotation - else why would he need to stick around that long?

      so diener to me has been a huge disappointment so far. can't help wondering whether keith mcleod would have been a better choice.
      would he have signed for that 3 year $5m contract that diener got?

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      • #18
        Re: Our point guard situation disturbs me

        Originally posted by skyfire View Post
        Orien Greene recently signed with the New Zealand Breakers in the NBL (Australia/NZ league). Should play his first game this weekend.
        heard about that but wondered why he didn't sign for the d-league instead. well, the nbl probably pays better. but in the d-league he could have improved his pg skills and his shooting. with that improvement together with his already nba-level defense, he's sure to get a call-up some time. in fact he started a few games for sacramento this season before they got udrih, so it's not like he's off the nba radar.

        not dissing the nbl, but orien will probably be the most athletic guy on the breakers. not a good incentive for improving one's skills.

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        • #19
          Re: Our point guard situation disturbs me

          This was a big topic of conversation at the forum party. If Tinsley goes down we are in trouble, if Tinsley goes down and Daniels is injured we are in deep, deep trouble.

          I made the point that I would like to see what Diener would do if he was forced to play 30 minutes a game for a two weeks worth of games. I believe he would at least start hitting some shots. The Pacers would suffer, but maybe he could re-gain some confidence.

          But the pacers need to acquire a better back-up because Tinsley cannot continue to play this many hard minutes and Daniels is too injury prone.

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          • #20
            Re: Our point guard situation disturbs me

            Originally posted by Unclebuck View Post
            This was a big topic of conversation at the forum party. If Tinsley goes down we are in trouble, if Tinsley goes down and Daniels is injured we are in deep, deep trouble.
            Okay, suppose that happens.

            Who can play point for us besides Deiner and Owens?

            Shawne? Granger? I can't see it.

            Maybe Dunleavey could do a point forward thing.
            "Look, it's up to me to put a team around ... Lance right now." —Kevin Pritchard press conference

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            • #21
              Re: Our point guard situation disturbs me

              That's the problem. Nobody else can really play the point. I suppose Granger & Dunleavy could be counted on to play a few sequences at the one but not an entire game. Defense would be a real experience too. Can you imagine Danny trying to guard some of the quicker points?
              I'm in these bands
              The Humans
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              The Bar Brawlers
              ME

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              • #22
                Re: Our point guard situation disturbs me

                Beno was my hope. I know I sound like a homer. But the dude would have complemented JT pretty well.

                Comment


                • #23
                  Re: Our point guard situation disturbs me

                  Originally posted by wintermute View Post
                  just wanted to clarify travis diener's contract. he's not that cheap - he's guaranteed almost $5m over the next 3 years. that's first round pick money - about what danny and shawne are pulling in and roughly 2x the min.
                  so diener was our first round pick this year -- and he had actually logged NBA minutes before... albeit not many. thats why i'm not torn up about the situation. the guy was basically a rookie given the limited opportunities he had stuck behind nelson and arroyo in orlando.

                  generally, you sign scrubs to min. 1 year deals only. why not? every year there are plenty of scrubs who are happy to take minimum deals. if they show anything then you can sign them to a longer deal next time.
                  yup we did this too with owens, graham and rush. we took a gamble on diener. like i said before he is essentially a draft pick.

                  if you sign a guy for 3 years though, you're expecting him to be in the rotation - else why would he need to stick around that long?
                  we obviously did expect him to be part of the rotation. so far he hasn't delivered. i'm not ready to give up on him yet -- like unclebuck mentioned it'd be interesting to see what diener would do when forced to play 25-30 minutes a game. maybe, like hicks has suggested, he rises to the occassion and produces beno-like numbers. unfortunately i don't see how we do that without risking losses and we're not a rebuilding project...

                  so diener to me has been a huge disappointment so far. can't help wondering whether keith mcleod would have been a better choice.
                  would he have signed for that 3 year $5m contract that diener got?
                  right now in theory yes. but you can hardly blame bird... as i mentioned above:

                  DIENER: 3pt shooter (at least in theory)
                  MCLEOD: not a 3pt shooter

                  what were we missing last season? shooting.

                  Originally posted by McKeyFan View Post
                  Okay, suppose that happens.

                  Who can play point for us besides Deiner and Owens?

                  Shawne? Granger? I can't see it.

                  Maybe Dunleavey could do a point forward thing.
                  that would be really the only option, outside of diener and owens.

                  and it might not be a terrible thing to have dunleavy do some of that before there is an injury. mainly because he is the "let the game come to me" -- maybe running the offense would force him to get more involved and more aggressive.
                  This is the darkest timeline.

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                  • #24
                    Re: Our point guard situation disturbs me

                    Originally posted by Peck View Post
                    However, I don't care about any history of this guy at all when I say this, but even the healthiest of pg's get injured and very very few can go for this many min. for the length of a season.
                    Agree completely.

                    Nice to be agreeing with you again, Peck.
                    This space for rent.

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                    • #25
                      Re: Our point guard situation disturbs me

                      I don't see how putting your two best players out there at point equals having a difficult point guard situation. We essentially have 4 PG's at this point. You want more of them?

                      Diener will be fine as a filler. If something happens as far as injury, we can deal with it then. I can't agree with making a move or trade for something that may never happen.

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                      • #26
                        Re: Our point guard situation disturbs me

                        John Lucas III is currently a free agent and looking for a job. He's about the same size as Diener but he's a good shooter and has played well when given minutes with Houston. He got squeezed out after they got Mike James and Francis in the off season.

                        I'd love to get Luther Head. He's not much of a PG but he is a good shooter and scrappy defender. He'd be perfect for this offense. The Rockets will want Ike Diogu though because it was rumored that they and the Pacers had a deal in place before the draft to swap Ike for Head and the 26th pick if Morris Almond was still available. Almond was selected by Utah before that pick and killed the deal.

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                        • #27
                          Re: Our point guard situation disturbs me

                          Originally posted by Phildog View Post
                          We essentially have 4 PG's at this point. You want more of them?
                          Nope. I'd be happy to trade Diener and Owens for somebody who could get on the floor.

                          And Quis isn't a point guard.
                          This space for rent.

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                          • #28
                            Re: Our point guard situation disturbs me

                            Originally posted by wintermute View Post
                            just wanted to clarify travis diener's contract. he's not that cheap - he's guaranteed almost $5m over the next 3 years. that's first round pick money - about what danny and shawne are pulling in and roughly 2x the min.
                            That's still extremely cheap.

                            Not even the Knicks could screw up a salary cap bad enough that $1.5 million could ever matter.
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                            • #29
                              Re: Our point guard situation disturbs me

                              I would think it should be easy to pull Ridnour away from the Sonics with him and watson always kind of miffed about playing time and who the starter is. We'd help them solve that situation and I bet Ridnour would be happy to at least to be getting 10-15 minutes a game at least.

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                              • #30
                                Re: Our point guard situation disturbs me

                                Owens and Diener are srubs. Scrubs always look good during the summer league. What exactly are you guys surprised about?

                                About Tinsley: I'm glad hes finally playing good but Im still not convinced. Heck, two weeks ago everyone was calling for his head. Im just saying that Tinsley has his ups and downs.

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