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Thread: wow does anyone go to pacers games anymore?

  1. #26

    Default Re: wow does anyone go to pacers games anymore?

    Quote Originally Posted by Indy
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    Thats not considering all the other sorts of things the average person spends their money on before they get to things like sports tickets.
    True, but the Halloween spending does attest to the fact there there is a lot of money spent on leisure and amusement. Leisure spending gets about 6-8 percent of Americans' income, so that would be $2.5 billion for just the city of Indy. That's not counting Hicks coming here from New Castle every game and other from outside the city.

    Another thing we need to factor into consideration of Pacers' attendance and how people spend their recreation dollars. The horse tracks in Anderson and Shelbyville and going to install slot machines. Beginning next year, there's yet another rat hole for money to swirl down.

    UncleBuck is a real fan, while I am only a casual fan. The problem, from the PS&E perspective is that most people are like me, and there are few like UncleBuck. Part of what makes this forum such a good place is that he is here every day and he cares enough to post really good, level headed insights. I know, on any given game night that I can stay home and go for number 9,785 and UncleBuck will be there next morning to tell me what I missed.
    Last edited by Putnam; 11-08-2007 at 03:48 PM.
    And I won't be here to see the day
    It all dries up and blows away
    I'd hang around just to see
    But they never had much use for me
    In Levelland. (James McMurtry)

  2. #27
    Administrator Unclebuck's Avatar
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    Default Re: wow does anyone go to pacers games anymore?

    One thing I would love to know is just how many people at any given Pacers game actually paid for their own ticket - same thing if an immediate family member paid for the tickets. My guess is less than half actually paid their own money for the ticket. They got the ticket free from a neighbor, or a co-worker or an extended family member, or through work, or they got the tickets for free somehow. (Im not suggesting the Pacers are giving away free tickets, but the people who are in the stands often did not pay for them.

    I think there is that notion that "I'll go if I get free tickets" otherwise no way.

    And I think this hurts attendance because the idea that "you can't give the tickets away" drives down demand. Afterall who would be so stupid to actually pay hard earned money for the darn things, - no one wants to feel like a fool.

    I also think that many real fans don't realize how inexpensive a lot of the tickets actually are. $10.00 isn't a bad price to get in the building and with the size of the crowds thus far you can certainly move down into some pretty good seats and in some cases really good seats, if you know what you are doing.

    Plus you can buy a full season ticket for $299.00 for all 45 games - that is $6.65 per game. And some of those seats are in the first row balcony - if that isn't a bargain I don't know what is. But I bet if you ask the average person who consideres themselves a pacers fan about $10.00 tickets or 299.00 for a full season, I would say that most have no idea. Plus why do that if you figure you might get free tickets to a few games every season.


    From 1990 - 1994 - I went to probably 25 games a year, but I would just walk up to the box office and buy a ticket right then. There was no need to buy season tickets, but in 1994 everything changed during the playoff run - each round it was getting more and more difficult to get tickets and in game 6 of the ECF against the Knicks, I had to pay $100.00 for one ticket up in the nosebleeds. So I decided right then I had to get season tickets so that I would always have playoff tickets. But today I don't need to get season tickets, I could get a ticket anytime I want and for less than face value on the secondary market. My point in bringing this up is to just show what drives up ticket demand.

    If people think it is difficult to get tickets, the demand skyrockets, if people think they can get tickets anytime they want - free tickets at that - that drives down demand
    Last edited by Unclebuck; 11-08-2007 at 05:06 PM.

  3. #28

    Default Re: wow does anyone go to pacers games anymore?

    Quote Originally Posted by UncleBuck
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    I also think that many real fans don't realize how inexpensive a lot of the tickets actually are.
    I agree. There is so much talk about how expensive it is if you get lower bowl seats and eat and drink a LOT. The expectation is that a game will cost you $100+.

    But when I go, I go by myself or with one friend or daughter, and sit in the $25 or $35 seats. I'm good for maybe one Coke apiece during the game (We'll eat at White Castle after the game).

    The cost isn't ever the reason I don't go. In my case, I can't see well enough to really learn anything much at a game I attend in person. I only go to get the feeling, and a few games a year is enough for that.
    And I won't be here to see the day
    It all dries up and blows away
    I'd hang around just to see
    But they never had much use for me
    In Levelland. (James McMurtry)

  4. #29
    Member IndyFan032589's Avatar
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    Default Re: wow does anyone go to pacers games anymore?

    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck View Post
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    I also think that many real fans don't realize how inexpensive a lot of the tickets actually are.
    Agreed as well. Basically anywhere in the lower two levels are great seats and some are $50 or less. Plus like you said it's a better atmosphere at the game and you see a lot of things you're unable to while watching it on TV.\

    And I think I'm one of few people who actually likes the non-basketball activities they do in between breaks. I'd rather watch Ashley Bidwell during a timeout than the same 4 commercials every break any day of the week and twice on Sunday.

    It's 10 times more fun being there than watching on TV, IMO.

  5. #30
    Yeah, I'm a Pacers fan. MyFavMartin's Avatar
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    Default Re: wow does anyone go to pacers games anymore?

    I would go but it's a two hour drive from IL and I lose an hour so on a weeknight I would have to get out of work early. Throw in the fact that I would take my wife and have to find a sitter and Saturday games are the only way.

    UB- You can think of it as $10/game or you can think of it as $600 (a season ticket for me and significant other). $600 is a lot of money... particularly for nosebleed seats.

    Also, for a lower level pair of seats it'll still run me $100. I like the Pacers, but to my wife, it's nothing special. She'd prefer college bball.

  6. #31
    Member Wu-Gambino's Avatar
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    Default Re: wow does anyone go to pacers games anymore?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Goldfoot View Post
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    I went last night. 10,000 hardly...5,000 maybe.

    I think I know why people don't go. It isn't fun. The building is dead. They pipe in fake crowd noises. You're constantly distracted by wannabe morning radio DJ's screaming at you from the big screen about getting up and dancing. Who the hell is in charge of selecting music? There were three of us last night and we all *****ed about the music choices (except when that guy with the breathing machine won the Tinsley autograph and they immediately played Billy Joel's "Only The Good Die Young". We thought that was poignant and hilarious.) Really though Ami Stewart's disco version of "Knock on Wood", "In Da Club" by 50 Cent, a couple of Coug's old standard's. Hopeless.

    Beer! $6.50 They were warm all night. It wasn't just us either. A guy in front of me in line got into it with the "bartender" over the beer temp. Her answer was "I'm just the bartender". He said "I'm just letting you know you're serving warm beer" then had a few choice words to yell at her as he walked away. They were serving 'em warm on all three levels.

    The fact that they lost just made it worse.
    Agreed with this 100%, this is what annoys the hell out of me at Pacers games (and almost every other NBA game I have attended). Is there any way we can go two or three possessions without playing sound effects (a whole game would be incredible). In fact, I would be willing to buy tickets to a mediocre game like a Clippers/Pacers games if they didn't play music nonstop. It annoys the hell out of me, and it really cheapens the game. That's one thing the NBA will NEVER have on college basketball, the overall atmosphere of play.
    [/rant]

    And the cost of an NBA game, I would say on average I would spend around 20-30 bucks each time I go to an NBA game:
    - usually buy cheap ten dollar tickets (often move to a different section, usually around 216/217 or 201).
    - park at the lot a few blocks south around Lily (2 bucks, you can't beat that) or park along East Washington or Market for free on the weekends
    - eat at Subway before the game (that's like eight bucks)

    Honestly, a night out going to a movie is about the same cost and the entertainment value is usually higher at a Pacers game. I've been to two games this year (Wizards and Miami), and I went to more games last year than I had ever gone to in previous years (I went to around eight).

    I wonder what the crowd will be Saturday.
    Last edited by Wu-Gambino; 11-08-2007 at 08:11 PM.

  7. #32
    Release Psycho T pwee31's Avatar
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    Default Re: wow does anyone go to pacers games anymore?

    They actually talked about our attendance on PTI today. Wilbon said that Conseco was the best basketball arena in the NBA in his eyes, and it's sad that only 10,000 or so showed up.
    Last edited by pwee31; 11-09-2007 at 05:41 PM.

  8. #33
    Member IndyFan032589's Avatar
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    Default Re: wow does anyone go to pacers games anymore?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mile Square View Post
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    I wonder what the crowd will be Saturday.
    Should be a decent crowd. One, it's a weekend. Two, people want to see AI and Carmelo. There are, obviously, always more people when superstars are in town.

  9. #34
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    Default Re: wow does anyone go to pacers games anymore?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mile Square View Post
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    Agreed with this 100%, this is what annoys the hell out of me at Pacers games (and almost every other NBA game I have attended). Is there any way we can go two or three possessions without playing sound effects (a whole game would be incredible). In fact, I would be willing to buy tickets to a mediocre game like a Clippers/Pacers games if they didn't play music nonstop. It annoys the hell out of me, and it really cheapens the game. That's one thing the NBA will NEVER have on college basketball, the overall atmosphere of play.
    [/rant]
    I'm not a huge fan of the sound effects either but they have to play something. I go to every George Washington University college basketball game and the whole student section is constantly standing up, chanting things, so there is no need for music except during halftime and sometimes during timeouts. So what I'm saying is in college basketball there is automatically something to fill that void. There aren't enough Pacer fans "getting up on their feet and making some noise" to warrant not playing some sound effects during the game. Otherwise it would feel more like a cemetary in Conceso that it already is.

  10. #35
    Member jeffg-body's Avatar
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    Default Re: wow does anyone go to pacers games anymore?

    I have to agree that it surprised me when I saw how little people were there. That was wild that PTI pointed it out. Maybe one reason could be everyone who used to get season tickets every year had to say no due to their increased property taxes.

  11. #36
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    Default Re: wow does anyone go to pacers games anymore?

    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck View Post
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    I also think that many real fans don't realize how inexpensive a lot of the tickets actually are. $10.00 isn't a bad price to get in the building and with the size of the crowds thus far you can certainly move down into some pretty good seats and in some cases really good seats, if you know what you are doing.

    I guess we don't know what we're doing.

    Besides we abide by the PAcers by-laws and fan code of ethics. I mean they specifically sent us a paper with the rules and one rule clearly states you have to set in your assigned seat (No Moving Down).
    You know how hippos are made out to be sweet and silly, like big cows, but are actually extremely dangerous and can kill you with stunning brutality? The Pacers are the NBA's hippos....Matt Moore CBS Sports....

  12. #37
    Fear my small avatar Gyron's Avatar
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    Default Re: wow does anyone go to pacers games anymore?

    I don't think UB means us upper level folk. They don't want us moving down into the lower bowl. Who knows what diseases and germs we might bring down with us.....

  13. #38
    NaptownSeth is all feel Naptown_Seth's Avatar
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    Default Re: wow does anyone go to pacers games anymore?

    Quote Originally Posted by AB1077 View Post
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    You have to be pretty close; the box score says attendance was 10,122, which I believe is paid attendance otherwise teams would very rarely (never) actually have a game which the attendance matched the capacity. Of course there were certainly quite a few who never arrived tonight so there may very well have been less than 9k there.
    - Well when half the lower bowl is empty and you know it's sold out and in the attendance figures, you know it can't be good. Maybe I caught more crap at Star than here, but I did catch a ton of it for saying that Jackson going wasn't the solution and that Indy fans are in the running for most fickle.

    I realize that Atlanta fans aren't so hot either and that Indy isn't the only city with this issue, but GD this is Hoosiers land and this is the city's first big time sports franchise and the one that grabbed the hearts of fans when the Colts stunk.

    I never bought into the "GS trade will solve attendance issues" and in fact it's gotten worse despite the early winning. Right now I'd say the Pacers better hope they win the GS deal in the long run because clearly the fans aren't going to be tolerant of losing.


    - You know if the Pacers are still fighting image problems rather than winning expectations then maybe they should have put guys like Dunleavy and Diener into those ads instead of JOB.


    - Also I know locals don't want to hear this, but it is a highly conservative state. That means slow to change; it's just the underlying mentality. That can also be a good thing, it can imply traditional and dependable. But in cases like this it takes a LONG time for people to get on the wagon. The Colts were running out 18/88/32/87 and still not avoiding some home blackouts.

    So it could take awhile before fans realize that the Pacers aren't still in the brawl. Again, my biggest issue is just where is this alleged love of the sport itself?



    - Just imagine how empty Lucas is going to get when Peyton is gone and the Colts are 5-11 a couple of times. The SB love will be long gone just like the 2000 Pacers love is. The excuses will sound similar - too expensive, not like they used to play when it was about effort, etc. Under it all will really be "well when they won a SB I realized that we had a professional football team and decided to look into that".

  14. #39
    Administrator Peck's Avatar
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    Default Re: wow does anyone go to pacers games anymore?

    Quote Originally Posted by Naptown_Seth View Post
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    - Well when half the lower bowl is empty and you know it's sold out and in the attendance figures, you know it can't be good. Maybe I caught more crap at Star than here, but I did catch a ton of it for saying that Jackson going wasn't the solution and that Indy fans are in the running for most fickle.

    I realize that Atlanta fans aren't so hot either and that Indy isn't the only city with this issue, but GD this is Hoosiers land and this is the city's first big time sports franchise and the one that grabbed the hearts of fans when the Colts stunk.

    I never bought into the "GS trade will solve attendance issues" and in fact it's gotten worse despite the early winning. Right now I'd say the Pacers better hope they win the GS deal in the long run because clearly the fans aren't going to be tolerant of losing.


    - You know if the Pacers are still fighting image problems rather than winning expectations then maybe they should have put guys like Dunleavy and Diener into those ads instead of JOB.


    - Also I know locals don't want to hear this, but it is a highly conservative state. That means slow to change; it's just the underlying mentality. That can also be a good thing, it can imply traditional and dependable. But in cases like this it takes a LONG time for people to get on the wagon. The Colts were running out 18/88/32/87 and still not avoiding some home blackouts.

    So it could take awhile before fans realize that the Pacers aren't still in the brawl. Again, my biggest issue is just where is this alleged love of the sport itself?



    - Just imagine how empty Lucas is going to get when Peyton is gone and the Colts are 5-11 a couple of times. The SB love will be long gone just like the 2000 Pacers love is. The excuses will sound similar - too expensive, not like they used to play when it was about effort, etc. Under it all will really be "well when they won a SB I realized that we had a professional football team and decided to look into that".

    All of these are great points, can't say I disagree with any of them. Well other than you insistance that there was a swell of people claiming that the G.S. trade would solve everything, but reasonable people can disagree.

    Now haveing said all of that and agreeing with almost all of your points, what seat where you in again?


    Basketball isn't played with computers, spreadsheets, and simulations. ChicagoJ 4/21/13

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    Member SycamoreKen's Avatar
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    Default Re: wow does anyone go to pacers games anymore?

    Quote Originally Posted by dcpacersfan View Post
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    I'm not a huge fan of the sound effects either but they have to play something. I go to every George Washington University college basketball game and the whole student section is constantly standing up, chanting things, so there is no need for music except during halftime and sometimes during timeouts. So what I'm saying is in college basketball there is automatically something to fill that void. There aren't enough Pacer fans "getting up on their feet and making some noise" to warrant not playing some sound effects during the game. Otherwise it would feel more like a cemetary in Conceso that it already is.
    I don't understand the need for extra sound during the game play. Is the game itself that boring that the extra noise is needed to keep people awake? Is the crowd so used to over the top sound in movies that the teams think they need the same thing during the game? During breeaks is fine, but at some of the Spurs games I have gone to you can't even talk to the person next to you because it is so loud.

    I much prefer the squeek of the shoes, the sound of the ball on the court, and hearing the players themselves to the piped in fluff.

  16. #41

    Default Re: wow does anyone go to pacers games anymore?

    After reading your comments Ive decided not to attend a Pacer game..
    I work hard for my money and Im not wasting it on a team that's mediocre.
    I dont see this team winning more than 30 games...
    Ill spend my money at college games.

  17. #42

    Default Re: wow does anyone go to pacers games anymore?

    Speaking as someone who went to hundreds (if not 1000) Pacer
    games at The Coliseum and then Market Square, I'll admit to
    having seen maybe 4-5 in Conseco. Why ?

    1. Conseco is a beautiful facility, but as a b-ball viewing venue,
    in my opinion, it sucks.

    2. All the games are on TV.

  18. #43
    Administrator Unclebuck's Avatar
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    Default Re: wow does anyone go to pacers games anymore?

    Quote Originally Posted by Rajah Brown View Post
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    1. Conseco is a beautiful facility, but as a b-ball viewing venue,
    in my opinion, it sucks.

    How so

  19. #44

    Default Re: wow does anyone go to pacers games anymore?

    Quote Originally Posted by Sycamore Ken
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    Is the crowd so used to over the top sound in movies that the teams think they need the same thing during the game? During breaks is fine, but at some of the Spurs games I have gone to you can't even talk to the person next to you because it is so loud.
    You know another place, besides sports venues and movie theaters that are too loud these days? Protestant church services. I've gone to about 25 different churches this summer and fall, and all but 2 of them were excessively loud and cluttered with junk noise.

    This doesn't explain why the sound engineers at Conseco choose to keep the place buzzing, but just confirms that noise pollution is widespread.
    And I won't be here to see the day
    It all dries up and blows away
    I'd hang around just to see
    But they never had much use for me
    In Levelland. (James McMurtry)

  20. #45

    Default Re: wow does anyone go to pacers games anymore?

    Uncle Buck-

    Well 'sucks' might have been a tad too strong a word. And since I
    haven't been down there in a couple yrs, me memory is a little hazy.

    But it's just too comfy and sterile an enviroment for my taste. There
    was more hoopla, rowdiness and fan frenzy in the average meaningless
    game in December in MSA than there is on the best night in Conseco.
    I love the game and enjoy observing and analyzing, etc. But I can do
    that from my couch.

    Just my take, accurate or not.

  21. #46
    Administrator Unclebuck's Avatar
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    Default Re: wow does anyone go to pacers games anymore?

    Quote Originally Posted by Rajah Brown View Post
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    Uncle Buck-

    Well 'sucks' might have been a tad too strong a word. And since I
    haven't been down there in a couple yrs, me memory is a little hazy.

    But it's just too comfy and sterile an enviroment for my taste. There
    was more hoopla, rowdiness and fan frenzy in the average meaningless
    game in December in MSA than there is on the best night in Conseco.
    I love the game and enjoy observing and analyzing, etc. But I can do
    that from my couch.

    Just my take, accurate or not.
    I wish the place was louder - and part of that is the fans and part is just the building. But other than that I think the place is perfect and is by far the best arena in the NBA.

  22. #47
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    Default Re: wow does anyone go to pacers games anymore?

    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck View Post
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    But other than that I think the place is perfect and is by far the best arena in the NBA.
    how many others have you been to?
    This is the darkest timeline.

  23. #48
    Jimmy did what Jimmy did Bball's Avatar
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    Default Re: wow does anyone go to pacers games anymore?

    Quote Originally Posted by Naptown_Seth View Post
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    Again, my biggest issue is just where is this alleged love of the sport itself?
    The Pacers haven't been the kind of team that Indiana basketball fans really embrace for any extended stretch of time for quite a while.

    IMO the 'starmaker' offense is not going to be a big winner with Indiana fans unless the 'star' is a Michael Jordan type and the other 4 players on the court totally buy into it and give 100% effort to making that system work.

    And even then, I don't know how far that would really get with fans as far as creating anything more than a bandwagon interest to fill the seats. That might be a winning system for a while, but it cannot be sustained long term. You'll have plenty of people who will be happy with the wins, but they won't be happy with the 'basketball' they are seeing.

    I think Indiana fans are savvy enough that they know when they are seeing a team game, effort, etc.. Sure there may be times when they confuse a lack of talent for effort, but more times than not it isn't the result of a play that they base that determination upon, instead it is the attempt in the first place.

    No matter what, until the team leaves everything on the floor, regardless of the system or who is the alleged 'star', and plays as a unit giving 100% then you're not going to see fans being built at the grassroots level.

    Some people argue winning is everything. I say that is wrong, people want to see a team play in such a way that they know winning is going to be the ultimate result.

    Selfish basketball isn't going to be winning basketball for long. You can't just market stars (as the NBA has done in the past) and expect that to click with Indiana fans who have grown up having a 'team' gamed drummed into them as the way basketball should be played. We like our stars to develop and rise thru the system, not have the role handed to them on a silver platter from the marketing dept.... and then hope they fill it.

    _Bball
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  24. #49
    Fear my small avatar Gyron's Avatar
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    Default Re: wow does anyone go to pacers games anymore?

    Quote Originally Posted by avoidingtheclowns View Post
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    how many others have you been to?
    I agree with Uncle Buck and I've been to at least 10 over the last 15 years, maybe more, I've lost count.

    Conseco is probably one of the best arenas in the NBA for basketball viewing.

    It was rated so highly, that Charlotte modeled their stadium after Conseco. While it isn't a duplicate, the inside of the arena is VERY similar.

  25. #50

    Default Re: wow does anyone go to pacers games anymore?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gyron View Post
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    I agree with Uncle Buck and I've been to at least 10 over the last 15 years, maybe more, I've lost count.

    Conseco is probably one of the best arenas in the NBA for basketball viewing.

    It was rated so highly, that Charlotte modeled their stadium after Conseco. While it isn't a duplicate, the inside of the arena is VERY similar.
    On the PTI where they mentioned the low attendance, Michael Willbon called it the best arena in basketball. I'm sure he's been to almost every NBA arena in North America.

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