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    Default Vick admits dog killing, conspiracy

    I'm posting this because until now I thought he only agreed to plead guilty to the gambling, but now it's to the killing of dogs as well. Wow. What a scumbag.

    http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/law/08/24...rss_topstories

    (CNN) -- NFL star Michael Vick has admitted that he and two of co-conspirators killed dogs that did not fight well in papers filed Friday with a federal court in Virginia.

    Vick said he would plead guilty to one count of "Conspiracy to Travel in Interstate Commerce in Aid of Unlawful Activities and to Sponsor a Dog in an Animal Fighting Venture" in a plea agreement filed at U.S. District Court in Richmond, Virginia.

    The charge is punishable by up to five years in prison, a $250,000 fine, "full restitution, a special assessment and 3 years of supervised release," the plea deal said.

    Federal prosecutors agreed to ask for the low end of the sentencing guidelines.

    "The defendant will plead guilty because the defendant is in fact guilty of the charged offense," the plea agreement said.

    In an additional summary of facts, signed by Vick and filed with the agreement, Vick admitted buying pit bulls and the property used for training and fighting the dogs but did not bet on the fights or receive any of the money won.

    "Most of the 'Bad Newz Kennels' operations and gambling monies were provided by Vick," the official summary of facts said. Gambling wins were generally split between co-conspirators Tony Taylor, Quanis Phillips and sometimes Purnell Peace, it continued.

    "Vick did not gamble by placing side bets on any of the fights. Vick did not receive any of the proceeds from the purses that were won by 'Bad Newz Kennels.' "

    Vick also agreed that "collective efforts" by him and two others caused the deaths of at least six dogs.

    Around April, Vick, Peace and Phillips tested some dogs in fighting sessions at Vick's property in Virginia, the statement said. "Peace, Phillips and Vick agreed to the killing of approximately 6-8 dogs that did not perform well in 'testing' sessions at 1915 Moonlight Road and all of those dogs were killed by various methods, including hanging and drowning.

    "Vick agrees and stipulates that these dogs all died as a result of the collective efforts of Peace, Phillips and Vick," the summary said.

    Peace, 35, of Virginia Beach, Virginia; Phillips, 28, of Atlanta; and Taylor, 34, of Hampton, Virginia, already have accepted agreements to plead guilty in exchange for reduced sentences.

    Vick, 27, is scheduled to appear Monday in court, where he is expected to plead guilty before a judge. See a timeline of the case against Vick »

    The judge in the case will have the final say over the plea agreement.

    The federal case against Vick focused on the interstate conspiracy, but Vick's admission that he was involved in the killing of dogs could lead to local charges, according to CNN legal analyst Jeffrey Toobin.

    "It sometimes happens -- not often -- that the state will follow a federal prosecution by charging its own crimes for exactly the same behavior," Toobin said Friday.

    "The risk for Vick is, if he makes admissions in his federal guilty plea, the state of Virginia could say, 'Hey, look, you admitted violating Virginia state law as well. We're going to introduce that against you and charge you in our court.' "

    In the plea deal, Vick agreed to cooperate with investigators and provide all information he may have on any criminal activity and to testify if necessary. Vick also agreed to turn over any documents he has and to submit to polygraph tests.

    Vick agreed to "make restitution for the full amount of the costs associated" with the dogs that are currently being held by the government.

    "Such costs may include, but are not limited to, all costs associated with the care of the dogs involved in that case, including if necessary, the long-term care and/or the humane euthanasia of some or all of those animals."

    Prosecutors, with the support of animal rights activists, have asked for permission to euthanize the dogs. But the dogs could serve as important evidence in the cases against Vick and his admitted co-conspirators.

    Judge Henry E. Hudson issued an order Thursday telling the U.S. Marshals Service to "arrest and seize the defendant property, and use discretion and whatever means appropriate to protect and maintain said defendant property."

    Both the judge's order and Vick's filing refer to "approximately" 53 pit bulldogs.

    After Vick's indictment last month, National Football League Commissioner Roger Goodell ordered the quarterback not to report to the Falcons training camp, and the league is reviewing the case.

    Atlanta Falcons owner Arthur Blank told the NFL Network on Monday he could not speculate on Vick's future as a Falcon, at least not until he has seen "a statement of facts" in the case.

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    White and Nerdy Anthem's Avatar
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    Default Re: Vick admits dog killing, conspiracy

    Hanging and drowning?

    Throw the book.
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    Default Re: Vick admits dog killing, conspiracy

    Quote Originally Posted by Mal View Post
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    I'm posting this because until now I thought he only agreed to plead guilty to the gambling, but now it's to the killing of dogs as well. Wow. What a scumbag.
    Eh, that's why ESPN is not the worldwide leader in sports...
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    Default Re: Vick admits dog killing, conspiracy

    The most disgusting thing for me? Knowing that there are GMs (not to mention the NFL as whole) who will essentially be saying in 1-2+ years: 'I want to pay a man, who admitted to brutally killing dogs, millions of dollars because he's really good at playing football.' A ridiculous little piece of civilization.

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    Default Re: Vick admits dog killing, conspiracy

    Quote Originally Posted by Mal View Post
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    The most disgusting thing for me? Knowing that there are GMs (not to mention the NFL as whole) who will essentially be saying in 1-2+ years: 'I want to pay a man, who admitted to brutally killing dogs, millions of dollars because he's really good at playing football.' A ridiculous little piece of civilization.
    I don't think Vick will be given a second chance. PETA would make that teams season a living hell.

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    Default Re: Vick admits dog killing, conspiracy

    Quote Originally Posted by Indy View Post
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    I don't think Vick will be given a second chance. PETA would make that teams season a living hell.
    I'm willing to bet they don't.

    He'll donate them millions of dollars for education and awareness and it will be like he was a member from the get-go. He and his PR people are going to be in full mode, and you can bet your *** PETA is #1 on their list.

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    Boom Baby'er ABADays's Avatar
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    Default Re: Vick admits dog killing, conspiracy

    Quote Originally Posted by Since86 View Post
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    I'm willing to bet they don't.

    He'll donate them millions of dollars for education and awareness and it will be like he was a member from the get-go. He and his PR people are going to be in full mode, and you can bet your *** PETA is #1 on their list.
    It would be financial suicide for a team to take on Vick - even in 2-3 years. He would not be worth the return. No team wants this kind of headache.

    He's not going to have millions to donate and if PR people want to take on PETA - uh, good luck to that.
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    Default Re: Vick admits dog killing, conspiracy

    I'll say this right now.

    I don't agree with what Vick did but people have to realize this is still going on . Vick was just a big name and they used it. Go down south and this dog fighting is big money stakes. It's funny how people act like this is something rare or new or try to act like it's a small thing.

    Like I said don't agree with what went on but people do make mistakes and when big money is involved the stakes are even higher.

    So its ok to play in the NFL if your a drunk or druggie , beat your wife or kids and the list could go on. Sorry it's a cop out. But what I see most of you saying it's okay to do much worse and still get to play football.

    Let's not single out just Vick , there are several in the NFL that probably deserve to be banned for life also. But I don't see many making waves about those people.

    Last I checked Micheal Vick isn't God , nor is he perfect.

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    Default Re: Vick admits dog killing, conspiracy

    Quote Originally Posted by ABADays View Post
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    He's not going to have millions to donate and if PR people want to take on PETA - uh, good luck to that.
    He doesn't have to give back any money from his endorsement deals, so he has whatever he has banked to fall back on.

    I'm only saying what a major sports agent was saying he would do if Vick was his client. Seeing how he is in the business and knows the interworkings a hell of a lot better than 99% of the population, I would take his word over most.

    He was actually breaking down the percentages of his contract and how much he would owe back to the Falcons and such. He was a very knowledgeable guest on what's left of the Dan Patrick Show.

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    Default Re: Vick admits dog killing, conspiracy

    Quote Originally Posted by Since86 View Post
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    I'm willing to bet they don't.

    He'll donate them millions of dollars for education and awareness and it will be like he was a member from the get-go. He and his PR people are going to be in full mode, and you can bet your *** PETA is #1 on their list.
    PETA stands to make a lot more money if they make Vick their poster boy for what not to do rather than allying with him. Especially if the NFL starts becoming buddy-buddy with PETA all of a sudden. Sorry Vick might have money, but PETA is as hard core as it comes. Vick is done.

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    Default Re: Vick admits dog killing, conspiracy

    The ESPN thing is saying he didn't personally kill any of the dogs nor gambled on any of the fights. The CNN article says the exact same thing, just in different wording. This is where the difference lies

    Quote Originally Posted by ESPN
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    The source said Vick maintains he never killed dogs and never gambled on a dog fight. He will admit he was present when dogs were killed, but that he did not personally kill any of the dogs.
    Quote Originally Posted by CNN
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    Vick admitted buying pit bulls and the property used for training and fighting the dogs but did not bet on the fights or receive any of the money won. . . ."Vick agrees and stipulates that these dogs all died as a result of the collective efforts of Peace, Phillips and Vick," the summary said.
    Him buying the dogs and funding the activities is what makes him guilty of killing them.

    It really doesn't matter, considering your just as guilty of murder if you hire someone to do it for you.

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    Default Re: Vick admits dog killing, conspiracy

    Quote Originally Posted by Since86 View Post
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    The CNN article says the exact same thing, just in different wording. This is where the difference lies.
    That's the point, from day one ESPN has been on this baseless Mike Vick apologist shtick where every story has been slanted...
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    Default Re: Vick admits dog killing, conspiracy

    Quote Originally Posted by naturallystoned View Post
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    That's the point, from day one ESPN has been on this baseless Mike Vick apologist shtick where every story has been slanted...
    What? They've crucified him on TV and especially their radio shows. Eric Kasillyius (no clue on the spelling) and Dan LeBartard were killing him and riping Wilbon at the fact that the "black community" (their words, not mine) were the ones defending him and his actions. (Wilbon was saying it was repulsive but he thought the media and other people wouldn't be so harsh if he were white, which I totally disagree with but whatever.)

    He's still denying gambling and he's still denying personally killing any of them. Both stories say the exact same thing, just different ways.

    Hell, ESPN's article even says the two other defendants claim that he (Vick) personally killed atleast 8 dogs, something that CNN's didn't do.

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    Default Re: Vick admits dog killing, conspiracy

    Even if teams are lining up to sign him after his jail time and suspension, I seriously doubt he'll make it back physically. The only thing that makes him a viable QB is his athleticism and that will go after not playing for two or three years (and that's not even considering he'll be almost 30 by then). So he'll have to play another position or even play as a return guy but he's played QB at every level...
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    Default Re: Vick admits dog killing, conspiracy

    good cartoon on the ideal Vick jury:


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    Default Re: Vick admits dog killing, conspiracy

    Vick should be banned from the NFL.

    ESPN the other day was already bringing up his comeback, "America loves great comeback stories, and in 2-3 years....".

    Forget that. This disgusting individual deserves to never be allowed to step foot on an NFL field again.
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    Default Re: Vick admits dog killing, conspiracy

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Helmet View Post
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    Vick should be banned from the NFL.

    ESPN the other day was already bringing up his comeback, "America loves great comeback stories, and in 2-3 years....".

    Forget that. This disgusting individual deserves to never be allowed to step foot on an NFL field again.

    On one of the ESPN discussions one of the commentators said they thought he could come back because "America loves an underdog".

    And he was serious... none of them seemed to catch the humor/irony in that statement. I caught it tho!

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    Default Re: Vick admits dog killing, conspiracy

    I do not like Vick, or what he was involved with. One would think someone
    in his position could find better ways to keep himself entertained. I'm barely
    a "thousandairre" let alone a "millionairre", and certainly can.

    And while he does deserve to catch hell and be punished, I think maybe
    there is a bit too much emphasis being put on his participation in killing
    these dogs.

    These are extremely vicious animals that would maim or kill a person just
    for being there, without any provocation. Most of us have seen all the
    stories that keep popping up about pit-bulls attacking and ripping the
    face off a child for no reason.

    While I feel little (if any) sympathy for Vick, I definately have none for
    these pit-bulls that were killed. These are not animals that could not
    have been adopted out, and would have been euthanized anyway.

    Killing them was right thing to do. Having them in the first place was
    the biggest mistake.
    Last edited by RamBo_Lamar; 08-24-2007 at 07:39 PM.

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    Boom Baby'er ABADays's Avatar
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    Default Re: Vick admits dog killing, conspiracy

    Quote Originally Posted by RamBo_Lamar View Post
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    I do not like Vick, or what he was involved with. One would think someone
    in his position could find better ways to keep himself entertained. I'm barely
    a "thousandairre" let alone a "millionairre", and certainly can.

    And while he does deserve to catch hell and be punished, I think maybe
    there is a bit too much emphasis being put on his participation in killing
    these dogs.

    These are extremely vicious animals that would maim or kill a person just
    for being there, without any provocation. Most of us have seen all the
    stories that keep popping up about pit-bulls attacking and ripping the
    face off a child for no reason.

    While I feel little (if any) sympathy for Vick, I definately have none for
    these pit-bulls that were killed. These are not animals that could not
    have been adopted out, and would have been euthanized anyway.

    Killing them was right thing to do. Having them in the first place was
    the biggest mistake.
    I would not have a pit bull but there are a lot of pit bull owners that would absolutely disagree with you.
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    Default Re: Vick admits dog killing, conspiracy

    Quote Originally Posted by ABADays View Post
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    I would not have a pit bull but there are a lot of pit bull owners that would absolutely disagree with you.
    I wouldn't have a problem with owning a pit bull, but I'd never adopt a pit bull after it had been a fighter. You could never trust it.

    Sure, people love their pit bulls, but they're not people who took bulls out of the ring. Like Rambo said, they'd have to be euthanized. Of course, there are better ways to do that than hanging.
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    Default Re: Vick admits dog killing, conspiracy

    Quote Originally Posted by ABADays View Post
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    I would not have a pit bull but there are a lot of pit bull owners that would absolutely disagree with you.
    When we were discussing making some zoning ordinance amendments re animal control I had a discussion with a very credible local dog owner/kennel operator who said that white Pit Bulls have some sort of genetic marker which makes them prone to violence for no reason - even against family members they've had contact with for years. She said other pit bulls aren't like that and for them (and all other dogs) you can predict their behavior based on training and environment but for white Pit Bulls you can't.
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    Default Re: Vick admits dog killing, conspiracy

    Quote Originally Posted by DisplacedKnick View Post
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    When we were discussing making some zoning ordinance amendments re animal control I had a discussion with a very credible local dog owner/kennel operator who said that white Pit Bulls have some sort of genetic marker which makes them prone to violence for no reason - even against family members they've had contact with for years. She said other pit bulls aren't like that and for them (and all other dogs) you can predict their behavior based on training and environment but for white Pit Bulls you can't.

    There are certain genetic anomalies that are linked to color of the haircoat
    such as white/deafness. This is not always true however. I have never heard
    of this particular anomaly and doubt it is true but plausable. It is much more
    likely that it is a general breed characteristic.
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    Default Re: Vick admits dog killing, conspiracy

    Well, remember too that we're not talking "hitting a person = hitting a dog", we're talking "KILLING a dog worse than hitting a person".

    Rape, however, should not compare.

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    Default Re: Vick admits dog killing, conspiracy

    Quote Originally Posted by Mal View Post
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    Well, remember too that we're not talking "hitting a person = hitting a dog", we're talking "KILLING a dog worse than hitting a person".

    Rape, however, should not compare.
    In the Vick case I consider the mere killing of the dogs far less offensive than the dogfighting itself - though the manner in which the dogs were killed leaves something to be desired.

    I consider a lack of respect for Human well-being to be of greater concern than a lack of respect for animal well-being.
    The poster formerly known as Rimfire

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    Default Re: Vick admits dog killing, conspiracy

    I would rank it: (Being extremely general; there are many exceptions to this simplistic rule/rank)

    Killing humans
    --
    Killing animals
    Hurting humans
    Hurting animals

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