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Interesting article NBA officiating - not about Donaghy

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  • Interesting article NBA officiating - not about Donaghy

    I come from the old school of NBA officiating. The Earl Strom school. When he was working a game, I had every confidence in the world that the game would be well officiated. That did not mean that every travel would be called or every 3 seconds would be called or that every call would be the "right call"

    But I knew that he knew how to work a game. And yes I mean that. He did not officiate every game the same. He did not make every call the same by the letter of the rule book. He used his good judgment to "work a game"

    I've gotten into many arguments over the years about the NBA officiating. Most of you want it to be more uniform, a travel is a travel and needs to be called everytime. A foul is a foul and needs to be called everytime. I disagree with that that notion. Every game is different every situation is different and I want refs who are good enough to use their judgment. That is the way it used to be in the 80's and part of the 90's.

    Some examples. If a player is going in for a fast break dunk, but takes an extra step - I say, don't call traveling. If there is a little contact between the ball handler and his defender - don't call a foul unless it either impeads the ball handler from making his move if it it enables the defender to steal the ball. On rebounds if a guy goes over-the-back, instead of calling a foul just give the ball to the other team - yes even if the ball went off the guy who had good rebound position.

    I don't believe in uniform calls across the board - but that is what the NBA wants and that is what the Donaghy situation will force the league into. Refs should be taught the art of officiating not the science of it.

    Edit: one other thing, do you know back in the 80's - refs rarely called charges - it just wasn't a call that was made very often - so players rarely tried to take a charge. Big men actually tried to block shots. Today there are so many charging calls I fell like I'm watching college ball.





    Interesting article below - rather long but is addresses this situation.
    http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/print...294&type=story

    NBA officials see themselves in no-win situations

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    By Ric Bucher
    ESPN The Magazine

    This article appears in the Aug. 13 edition of ESPN The Magazine.


    Chances are you've heard that an NBA referee recently resigned, sending a wave of uncertainty rippling through the league and leaving everyone to wonder what the commissioner will do to resuscitate faith in his officials.
    Chances are, you're thinking of the wrong ref.

    While allegations that Tim Donaghy conspired to fix the NBA games he was officiating rocked the league's foundation, it was the resignation of Bernie Fryer immediately after he worked Game 3 of the NBA Finals that was the summer's first bombshell.


    You won't have Bernie Fryer to kick around anymore.
    Fryer, a 28-year ref regarded as one of the league's best, is hanging up his whistle because he can no longer stomach the league's current system of managing its officials. And his disaffection is shared by as many as nine other topflight veterans -- about one-sixth of the corps -- who also have talked about stepping down in protest. "It's so bad," says one, "guys buy lottery tickets everywhere they go. If they win, they're just going to leave their shirt hanging in the locker."

    In short, the system is neither respected by veteran officials nor, it now appears, capable of weeding out miscreants such as Donaghy.

    If referees were losing their taste for the job before, when amateur Oliver Stones found grist for their conspiracy mills despite having not a whiff of hard evidence, imagine how much less palatable it will be if proof surfaces that one of their own was blowing his whistle to affect outcomes. Many of them now expect arenas to be filled with taunters waving dollar bills and shouting Tony Soprano references after each controversial call.

    Most refs actually agree that Donaghy was, as David Stern called him, "a rogue, isolated criminal." But unlike the commissioner -- who only recently submitted his referees to the kind of background checks NFL officials have gone through for years -- they aren't just hopeful that Donaghy acted alone. They say it's too difficult to change the outcome as part of a three-man crew. In fact, some have gone back and reviewed tapes of games they officiated with Donaghy and were unable to find any evidence that he attempted to manipulate a game. They're also convinced that Donaghy didn't do this as a way to get back at the league.

    Envisioning winning the lottery and abruptly leaving a game a whistle short right before tip-off, however, reflects how some refs would be willing to act out at the league's expense. The refs' dreams of doing something else seems odd, since from the outside, it looks as if they've already hit the jackpot. They're at the top of their profession, enjoying a solid six-figure income with all the perks that come with working on an international stage. What can compare with presiding over a roundball version of Cirque du Soleil, instilled with the power, with only a quick exhale, to bring the entire escapade to a screeching halt?

    For good measure, throw in the satisfaction that comes from knowing that you can confidently nail in a split second what the rest of the world often needs seven different camera angles and slow-motion replay to see. Sure, you have to be able to slough off the wisecracks from the cheap seats and the intimidating glares from men twice your size, but all in all, why would anyone quit this one-of-a-kind opportunity even one second earlier than necessary?


    Officials say that over the previous two seasons, their decisions have been second-guessed by the league more than ever before and, all too often, erroneously. They are convinced that public or team perception of a call will ultimately dictate whether the league finds it correct.

    Problem is, the job is not what it seems. Officials say that over the previous two seasons, their decisions have been second-guessed by the league more than ever before and, all too often, erroneously. They are convinced that public or team perception of a call will ultimately dictate whether the league finds it correct. Several refs say they've been given a thumbs-up on a performance only to be harangued, even reprimanded, by the same people several days later after they've had a chance to view the slo-mo replay. "With every whistle, guys think, Will the tape justify the call?" says one former ref. "Guys aren't being backed up. It's all about PR now."
    For the league, the most humiliating aspect of the Donaghy revelation is that its executive VP of operations, Stu Jackson, and director of officials, Ronnie Nunn (both of whom, along with Stern, refused repeated attempts seeking comment), have over the past few seasons taken extreme measures to discount the notion among coaches, players and fans that stars are treated differently or that maverick refs brandish their own brand of justice. An observer at every game files a play-by-play review after watching the action live and again on tape, and refs are then given a detailed critique of every call. Playoff crews actually aren't allowed to leave their locker room until a league office supervisor gives them the all clear.

    Jackson and Nunn, sources say, have complained to Stern that if their measures haven't improved the league's officiating, it's only because the league's old dogs won't learn new tricks. According to the refs themselves, maybe it's because they don't trust the teachers. While Nunn was considered a competent official during his 19 years, he certainly wasn't respected enough by his former colleagues to be viewed now as an authority or the ideal for how the job should be done.

    His weekly show on NBA TV, in which the rank and file see him pointing out missed calls and then correcting them for the viewing public, hasn't exactly improved his standing. Jackson's undistinguished record at every other position he's held -- Knicks coach, Grizzlies coach and GM -- has him forever fighting to win the respect of his charges, some of whom dealt with him in his previous capacities.



    See this story in the current edition of ESPN The Magazine.
    Jackson and Nunn have said that they are trying to develop a corps of interchangeable whistle-blowers, each one calling every minute of every game the exact same way. Three seconds in the lane is a violation, be it in the first minute of the second quarter or the last 30 seconds of overtime. Same with a hand check or a moving screen. The league strives for conformity by creating statistical averages and tracking its officials' adherence to them. Refs say they now receive calls from Jackson informing them that they haven't whistled a particular infraction for several games and need to pick up the slack. And that makes them feel like little more than traffic cops filling ticket quotas.

    There's no underestimating how much this whistle-by-checklist philosophy sticks in the craw of every accomplished referee, particularly in the context in which the calls are made. How, they ask, can every call be the same when no two teams, no two games, are the same? And then there is this: Officials say that if they actually adhered to the letter of the law, they'd be calling multiple infractions each trip down the court. Still, the league routinely points out inconsequential infractions and hammers its employees for not calling them.

    One unintended repercussion is the long-running success of Flopapalooza. Acting as if you've been mauled to get to the line has long been part of the game, but now players do it everywhere, anytime, because they realize that today's refs are more apt to blow the whistle. Blame a better-safe-than-sorry mind-set among officials who don't want to get blasted for not calling what could look, upon league replay, to be a legit foul. "NCI," says one ref. "It's short for 'no call incorrect.' That's what they hit you with the hardest. You're better off getting it wrong by blowing your whistle than by not blowing it."

    Strict adherence to the rules -- albeit not by game officials -- resulted in the Suns being punished more harshly than the Spurs for the altercation instigated by San Antonio's Robert Horry at the end of Game 4 of the Western Conference semifinals. The league, Jackson has admitted, chose "correctness" over "fairness." And that's what it always does. But that kind of thinking goes against a philosophy that has been hardwired through generations into every veteran ref: Let the players decide the game. "They've taken the common sense out of the officials' hands," says a former ref.



    The pursuit of uniformity, several refs contend, is creating mediocrity, even as isolated focus on every call is creating paralysis by analysis, especially among the younger officials.

    The pursuit of uniformity, several refs contend, is creating mediocrity, even as isolated focus on every call is creating paralysis by analysis, especially among the younger officials. And they see an irony in being asked to walk a straight line while they are being issued wildly careening directives from the league office. The 2005-06 season began with refs being told to exercise diplomacy and patience, to allow coaches and players to air their grievances as long as they weren't too demonstrative.
    Then they were told to do a 180 a year later, when a zero-tolerance policy was handed down. (Jackson objected to the idea that it was a zero-tolerance policy.) These days, no one is quite sure where the line is or, post-Donaghy, where it will fall. Will players and coaches be permitted to vent, or will the refs be filled to the brim with Donaghy smack and not take a drop more?

    For the officials, it would appear that correcting one of the ills of last season would be a good start. Remember Tim Duncan's sarcastic laughing fit following a foul call during a game back on April 15? Joey Crawford ejected the All-Star and followed it up with words that got the ref bounced for the remainder of the season. But multiple sources say that when Crawford asked, "Do you want to fight?" it wasn't a challenge, it was a question, as in, "Why do you keep staring at me? Are you trying to pick a fight with me?"


    Although the Duncan incident landed him in hot water, Crawford's toughness is credited with keeping a lid on disputes.
    While several refs concurred that Crawford would have been better served ignoring Duncan, his harsh punishment was taken as further evidence that they now toil in a no-win situation. On one hand, Stern doesn't want games marred by altercations or other distractions. On the other, he doesn't believe that in the heat of battle, being "fair" is the best way to ensure that. Crawford had long been known for his short fuse, but he's had a short fuse with everybody, star or scrub. Challenge his authority, and you're going to pay the price.

    And his colleagues point to the fact that altercations don't happen in games he works as proof that his approach quells disturbances rather than fomenting them. "What they did to Joey was wrong," said one player. "It's not that I like him, but you know what you're going to get with him. He's consistent. He's fair." Don't shed tears for Crawford. He's asked to return to his job next season, and Stern has indicated that he'll let him.

    But even with Crawford and 57-year-old Blane Reichelt, whose planned return after a two-year retirement has been thrown off course by the scandal, the NBA still faces a crisis-provoking exodus of its most experienced refs. The NBDL hasn't turned out to be the hoped-for proving ground for whistle-blowing wannabes, and the NBA has even had to resort to holding an open tryout for its new crop of officials.

    In fact, the league has found it so difficult to find suitable replacements that it has six men over 60 still humping it up and down the hardwood, including the respected Joe Forte, Jim Clark, Jack Nies and Jess Kersey. And then there are the fiftysomethings, the next wave of first-rate officials that includes Crawford, Bob Delaney and Bennett Salvatore. "Working a couple of extra years to improve your pension isn't worth it," says one official. Fryer, who is walking away in good health and standing, is clear evidence of that.

    The man has to be counting his blessings that he won't be around to witness the Donaghy Effect or be subjected to the suspicions that have crept into the minds of the faithful. But there is one respect in which Donaghy's indiscretions could serve as a benefit to the fraternity. Maybe a chastened Stern will now listen to -- and trust -- what his best referees have to say about how the job needs to be done.

    It's pretty clear that if he doesn't, traveling will be the hot new call in the NBA.

    Ric Bucher covers the NBA for ESPN The Magazine.




    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Last edited by Unclebuck; 08-04-2007, 07:07 AM.

  • #2
    Re: Interesting article NBA officiating - not about Donaghy

    problem is, everyone seems to think the NBA is too lenient on officials, and you won't win any friends by taking that kind of a stance.

    It wasn't about being the team everyone loved, it was about beating the teams everyone else loved.

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    • #3
      Re: Interesting article NBA officiating - not about Donaghy

      Originally posted by Kstat View Post
      problem is, everyone seems to think the NBA is too lenient on officials, and you won't win any friends by taking that kind of a stance.
      Well the system that is now in place doesn't seem to be working. The fans mistrust the refs more than ever, the league isn't grooming good young refs. I wish they went back to the system they used back in the 80's.

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      • #4
        Re: Interesting article NBA officiating - not about Donaghy

        Originally posted by Unclebuck View Post
        I've gotten into many arguments over the years about the NBA officiating. Most of you want it to be more uniform, a travel is a travel and needs to be called everytime. A foul is a foul and needs to be called everytime. I disagree with that that notion. Every game is different every situation is different and I want refs who are good enough to use their judgment. That is the way it used to be in the 80's and part of the 90's.

        I don't believe in uniform calls across the board - but that is what the NBA wants and that is what the Donaghy situation will force the league into. Refs should be taught the art of officiating not the science of it.
        Couldn't agree more...And thanks for posting the excellent article, UB.

        Trying to force an objective system into what is an inherently subjective task is flawed logic in my book.

        This is all leading towards a Quest Tec scenario where the refs no longer have any ability to make their own conclusions about what's going on in the game. We may as well put sensors on people's jersey to digitally record whether there's any contact on a drive to the hoop, and put those Wimbledon cameras on the sidelines. Maybe there's something we can put on players shoes for traveling or a compass we can put in the ball for palming.

        Basketball is waaaaay too complex for objective metrics that must be adhered to.



        "NCI," says one ref. "It's short for 'no call incorrect.' That's what they hit you with the hardest. You're better off getting it wrong by blowing your whistle than by not blowing it."
        This is troubling to me. I'd say a no-call is generally better than the wrong call. I'm really dissapointed to hear that no-calls are the things NBA honchos are getting most bent out of shape about.

        Easy to see why the League is getting so soft when that very concept is coming down from the top brass.
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        • #5
          Re: Interesting article NBA officiating - not about Donaghy

          I think the difference between good officiating and great officiating is that bit about asking yourself "did the player gain an advantage because of the violation?". If not, it should be a no-call. I don't agree with not calling fouls when a guy goes over the back but bounces off of him. That guy needs a foul because later in the game it could mean the difference between having to sit and getting to play due to foul trouble. But in general, if there was no advantage gained, it should be a "play on" mentality.

          The part I really, really don't like about NBA officiating is the occasional "make up" call, where a guy obviously blows a call to the point that even he realizes it, and within a couple possessions, you'll see him or a co-worker make another headscratcher to "neutralize" the original bad call. Drives me crazy.

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          • #6
            Re: Interesting article NBA officiating - not about Donaghy

            I have alway thought reputation was a valid reason to whistle a close call. You know the old "super star call". I have never been sure why the public has been against these type of calls. They seem to think that the "star" is getting special treatment from the refs. When in reality, refs are just giving a player "the benefit of the doubt". That is something a player has earned over his years in the league by developing a rep. The league looks like it is trying to change this. In reallity it is near impossible to change. This game is way to hard to officiate with just your eyes. IMO knowing a players strengths helps refs make good decisions. People have to realize that the call will not be right every time but that the refs made a fair decision.

            I'm not sure how it was in the eighties but in the nineties these call were given to Jordan left and right. IMO Jordan earned those calls with his rep. If a ref had a doubt about a call between Jordan and another player, ho should he give the benefit to? Who would you give the benefit of the doubt to?

            Does this make sense to any one else?

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            • #7
              Re: Interesting article NBA officiating - not about Donaghy

              I can't state strongly enough how much I disagree with almost everyone in this thread.

              I'm sorry but I lived through the era of Superstar calls and yes if you were a fan of Boston, Chicago, L.A. or Philly these "judgement calls" were great.

              Be a fan of a team that doesn't have a superstar.

              Benefit of the doubt? Nope, sorry I don't want a ref. blowing a whistle in anticipation of a foul.

              I hate to keep using this quote over and over but I can't help but remembering the complete and utter demoralization in Hersey Hawkins voice when he said "Michael Jordan touches you it's a steal, you touch him it's a foul."

              Yes I know it make take away some of the free flow of the game, but dammit fair is fair.

              I don't want fouls called on the opostion to the Pacers because one of our players has a rep. (ok that's a bad example because our entire team has a rep. and it ain't got nothing to do with hoops at this point in time).

              There was nothing more frustrating to me than watching the thugz, that's right I said thugz, of the Boston Celtics front line back in the 80's beat the crap out of opposing frontlines. Yet if someone breathed on precious Larry while he was in the act of shooting he was going to the line.

              A foul is a foul. If it is committed by Dwayne Wade or Reggie Evans it shouldn't matter.

              Now to be hones though I hate the charge call. I have always said that players that intentionally run to a spot with the sole purpose of drawing a charge without making any attempt at a defensive play should be called for a blocking foul even if they are planted on the ground. But that's just me.


              Basketball isn't played with computers, spreadsheets, and simulations. ChicagoJ 4/21/13

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              • #8
                Re: Interesting article NBA officiating - not about Donaghy

                Originally posted by Peck View Post
                I can't state strongly enough how much I disagree with almost everyone in this thread.

                I'm sorry but I lived through the era of Superstar calls and yes if you were a fan of Boston, Chicago, L.A. or Philly these "judgement calls" were great.

                Be a fan of a team that doesn't have a superstar.

                Benefit of the doubt? Nope, sorry I don't want a ref. blowing a whistle in anticipation of a foul.

                I hate to keep using this quote over and over but I can't help but remembering the complete and utter demoralization in Hersey Hawkins voice when he said "Michael Jordan touches you it's a steal, you touch him it's a foul."

                Yes I know it make take away some of the free flow of the game, but dammit fair is fair.

                I don't want fouls called on the opostion to the Pacers because one of our players has a rep. (ok that's a bad example because our entire team has a rep. and it ain't got nothing to do with hoops at this point in time).

                There was nothing more frustrating to me than watching the thugz, that's right I said thugz, of the Boston Celtics front line back in the 80's beat the crap out of opposing frontlines. Yet if someone breathed on precious Larry while he was in the act of shooting he was going to the line.

                A foul is a foul. If it is committed by Dwayne Wade or Reggie Evans it shouldn't matter.

                Now to be hones though I hate the charge call. I have always said that players that intentionally run to a spot with the sole purpose of drawing a charge without making any attempt at a defensive play should be called for a blocking foul even if they are planted on the ground. But that's just me.

                I never said I liked the superstar call, or the "superteam" call. But I do want a referee to be able to work a game and have a feel for when a call should be made and when it shouldn't - because the fact of the matter is a foul could be called on every play and I believe it is the refs job to know when to call it.

                Peck, do you remember Earl Strom - he was the best ref ever - he made the tough call against anybody and he made the tough call in Boston Garden

                That is what I want

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                • #9
                  Re: Interesting article NBA officiating - not about Donaghy

                  My point was that the game is too fast for refs to see what really happened. They have to make logical judgment call on the spot without the help of video. Every team including the Pacers gets these types of calls. Take a player such as Artest he has earned a rep (while playing for the Pacers) for being a defensive stopper. He is so hard to officiate because of how physical he is. Should he be whistled every time he touches someone? I don't think so. I haven't watched any Pacer games the last few seasons but I bet JO probably gets hammered alot without the calls he deserves.

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                  • #10
                    Re: Interesting article NBA officiating - not about Donaghy

                    Originally posted by Bynum Brigade View Post
                    My point was that the game is too fast for refs to see what really happened. They have to make logical judgment call on the spot without the help of video. Every team including the Pacers gets these types of calls. Take a player such as Artest he has earned a rep (while playing for the Pacers) for being a defensive stopper. He is so hard to officiate because of how physical he is. Should he be whistled every time he touches someone? I don't think so. I haven't watched any Pacer games the last few seasons but I bet JO probably gets hammered alot without the calls he deserves.
                    Those are excellent points. JO does get fouled a lot and they aren't called. But in a lot of ways it is his own fault - he get knocked off balance so easily - they just don't call the foul that often.

                    Artest did get away with a lot during the 2004 season (when he was defensive player of the year) - he was allowed to push, grab, hold, hand check. However, I think one reason why he isn't as good of a defender as he used to be are the new defensive rules - things he used to get away with are now called fouls

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                    • #11
                      Re: Interesting article NBA officiating - not about Donaghy

                      Originally posted by Peck View Post
                      A foul is a foul.
                      That's what I disagree with.

                      Every game has it's own physicality level and you can't call games over the past few years between Phoenix vs. Seattle the same way you call a Pistons vs. Spurs game.

                      One is a free flowing, jump-shooting game with out a lot of "battling in the trenches" and the other is a knock-down, drag-out affair where guys like Duncan and Big Ben are going toe-to-toe for every rebound and struggling for positioning on the block.

                      In the Phx-Sea game, if someone starts trying to push Amare around down low even when he doesn't have the ball, it's a foul. But, because of how the game is being played, Duncan may be receiving a good amount of contact even with the ball as he's beginning to make a move and it's just, as Jamaal would say, "good *** defense."

                      A foul is not a foul.

                      The beauty of basketball is that each and every game is different and each has its own nuances. What exactly constitutes a foul is relative. And properly officiating a game requires the judgement of the officials to call it fairly and make sure neither team is getting an advantage by exploiting the rules.

                      If you start trying to make everything objective, you take that power to their job properly away from the referees and you're essentially dictating how teams should play the game.
                      Read my Pacers blog:
                      8points9seconds.com

                      Follow my twitter:

                      @8pts9secs

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                      • #12
                        Re: Interesting article NBA officiating - not about Donaghy

                        Originally posted by JayRedd View Post
                        That's what I disagree with.

                        Every game has it's own physicality level and you can't call games over the past few years between Phoenix vs. Seattle the same way you call a Pistons vs. Spurs game.

                        One is a free flowing, jump-shooting game with out a lot of "battling in the trenches" and the other is a knock-down, drag-out affair where guys like Duncan and Big Ben are going toe-to-toe for every rebound and struggling for positioning on the block.

                        In the Phx-Sea game, if someone starts trying to push Amare around down low even when he doesn't have the ball, it's a foul. But, because of how the game is being played, Duncan may be receiving a good amount of contact even with the ball as he's beginning to make a move and it's just, as Jamaal would say, "good *** defense."

                        A foul is not a foul.

                        The beauty of basketball is that each and every game is different and each has its own nuances. What exactly constitutes a foul is relative. And properly officiating a game requires the judgement of the officials to call it fairly and make sure neither team is getting an advantage by exploiting the rules.

                        If you start trying to make everything objective, you take that power to their job properly away from the referees and you're essentially dictating how teams should play the game.
                        Your examples are fine, but you didn't take them far enough.

                        What happens when the Suns are playing the Pistons. Who's set of rules do we go by then?

                        Do we allow the Pistons to be physical or do we call all of the physcal fouls because the Suns don't play that way?

                        A foul is a foul.


                        Basketball isn't played with computers, spreadsheets, and simulations. ChicagoJ 4/21/13

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Interesting article NBA officiating - not about Donaghy

                          Originally posted by Peck View Post
                          I can't state strongly enough how much I disagree with almost everyone in this thread.

                          I'm sorry but I lived through the era of Superstar calls and yes if you were a fan of Boston, Chicago, L.A. or Philly these "judgement calls" were great.

                          Be a fan of a team that doesn't have a superstar.

                          Benefit of the doubt? Nope, sorry I don't want a ref. blowing a whistle in anticipation of a foul.

                          I hate to keep using this quote over and over but I can't help but remembering the complete and utter demoralization in Hersey Hawkins voice when he said "Michael Jordan touches you it's a steal, you touch him it's a foul."

                          Yes I know it make take away some of the free flow of the game, but dammit fair is fair.

                          I don't want fouls called on the opostion to the Pacers because one of our players has a rep. (ok that's a bad example because our entire team has a rep. and it ain't got nothing to do with hoops at this point in time).

                          .....

                          A foul is a foul. If it is committed by Dwayne Wade or Reggie Evans it shouldn't matter.
                          I agree with all of this. The rules are there. Follow them. Either players will adjust, or they can't earn their reputations as "stars". "The flow of the game" is great, but I don't want it when it's artificial; fake. Screw that. I can go watch WWE if I want fake entertainment. The players and teams should have to EARN those moments.

                          The counter-argument has a point, but you can't put anyone above the game, and putting a player, even for one play, above the rules puts them above the game. That is wrong. It's myopic and damaging in the long term.

                          .....

                          As a secondary question, how can anyone be OK with Stern and co. going by the letter of the law with the Phoenix suspensions, but be OK with breaking the rules for "the flow of the game" or what have you? It's a contradiction.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Interesting article NBA officiating - not about Donaghy

                            Originally posted by Peck View Post
                            Your examples are fine, but you didn't take them far enough.

                            What happens when the Suns are playing the Pistons. Who's set of rules do we go by then?

                            Do we allow the Pistons to be physical or do we call all of the physcal fouls because the Suns don't play that way?

                            A foul is a foul.
                            Peck, what is the definition of a foul. I'm not trying to be a jerk, but I think that is maybe where are are differing

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Interesting article NBA officiating - not about Donaghy

                              Originally posted by Mal View Post
                              I agree with all of this. The rules are there. Follow them. Either players will adjust, or they can't earn their reputations as "stars". "The flow of the game" is great, but I don't want it when it's artificial; fake. Screw that. I can go watch WWE if I want fake entertainment. The players and teams should have to EARN those moments.

                              The counter-argument has a point, but you can't put anyone above the game, and putting a player, even for one play, above the rules puts them above the game. That is wrong. It's myopic and damaging in the long term.

                              .....

                              As a secondary question, how can anyone be OK with Stern and co. going by the letter of the law with the Phoenix suspensions, but be OK with breaking the rules for "the flow of the game" or what have you? It's a contradiction.
                              That is not during the game and it is a clear rule with a lot of precedence.

                              I'm not suggesting refs allow players to step out of bounds and not call it, so I don't want players leaving the bench area during an altercation and by any definition the Suns players left the bench area.

                              When I say I want a ref to "work a game" I want a ref to have a "good feel on how to call a game" I'm talking about the many judgment calls during the game. If a player steps out of bounds with the ball - the other team gets the ball every time. So when a player leaves the bench during an altercation he is suspended every time. I really don't see any contradiction at all

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