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Thread: Hammering out KG deal

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    Member esabyrn333's Avatar
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    Default Hammering out KG deal

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    Talks between Minnesota and Golden State about a trade that would send Kevin Garnett to the Bay Area are real and advanced, according to a person involved in the discussions. But it's too early to say whether No. 8 pick Brandan Wright, reigning "most improved player" Monta Ellis and an assortment of fat and/or expiring contracts will be enough. Wright can't be traded for 30 days because he signed his rookie contract Friday ... Isiah Thomas so far is refusing to include David Lee in a Ron Artest trade. "No chance," a person with knowledge of the situation said ... Derek Fisher's interest in playing for the Knicks so he can be close to the best care for his infant daughter, who has a rare form of eye cancer, is not necessarily shared by the Knicks. The Lakers are a more realistic suitor.

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    flexible and robust SoupIsGood's Avatar
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    Default Re: Hammering out KG deal

    Wright and Ellis? They must be real high on Wright. I'd demand another asset, at least.
    You, Never? Did the Kenosha Kid?

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    How are you here? Kegboy's Avatar
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    Default Re: Hammering out KG deal

    One would think there'll be a draft pick. And they'll have to add some salary, obviously.

    Why couldn't they have done this **** draft night? The whole league is gonna be at a standstill for a month now.
    Come to the Dark Side -- There's cookies!

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    Default Re: Hammering out KG deal

    Phew KG makes a ton of money. Looking at his salary ratio on RealGM is insane.

    GS has a lot of pretty inexpensive contracts so this will be a hard deal for them to work out. Ellis and Wright isn't nearly enough.

    I think if you're GS you consider trading Baron Davis (one of those pretty good players who has mysteriously never gotten too far in the playoffs) and give Ellis the reigns at PG. For one thing Davis makes by far the most money on GS and is almost essential for this deal to work financially. For another, I think Ellis is ready.

    The undesirable contract of Adonal Foyle is also almost necessary for this deal to work. Look for him to be shipped out if it happens.

    Personally I think dealing with GS will make it tough for the Wolves to get good value for Garnett, but that being said they do need to start over.
    Last edited by idioteque; 07-08-2007 at 09:58 PM.

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    Go Colts! Shade's Avatar
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    Default Re: Hammering out KG deal

    That is highway robbery for KG.

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    Default Re: Hammering out KG deal

    Quote Originally Posted by Sh4d3 View Post
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    That is highway robbery for KG.
    I agree.

    If I'm Minnesota I'd rather start with Odom/Bynum than Wright/Ellis.

    If they are able to do a deal the Wolves would have:

    Randy Foye
    Ricky Davis
    Lamar Odom
    Andrew Bynum

    in their starting lineup. I don't know who the PG would be. Troy Hudson I guess but apparently he wants to be traded as well.

    Minnesota isn't going to win any championships with that lineup, but they're possibly darkhorse playoff team and I think it's at least a step in the right direction away from all this KG muck they're in.

  7. #7

    Default Re: Hammering out KG deal

    McHale was an idiot for not finding a way to get a deal done
    prior to the draft. His ineptitude almost makes me feel
    fortunate to have Bird at the Pacers' helm.

    Almost.

  8. #8

    Default Re: Hammering out KG deal

    Quote Originally Posted by dcpacersfan View Post
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    Phew KG makes a ton of money. Looking at his salary ratio on RealGM is insane.

    GS has a lot of pretty inexpensive contracts so this will be a hard deal for them to work out. Ellis and Wright isn't nearly enough.

    I think if you're GS you consider trading Baron Davis (one of those pretty good players who has mysteriously never gotten too far in the playoffs) and give Ellis the reigns at PG. For one thing Davis makes by far the most money on GS and is almost essential for this deal to work financially. For another, I think Ellis is ready.

    The undesirable contract of Adonal Foyle is also almost necessary for this deal to work. Look for him to be shipped out if it happens.

    Personally I think dealing with GS will make it tough for the Wolves to get good value for Garnett, but that being said they do need to start over.
    Wolves can indeed make a deal without including Davis. They still have their trade exception from the Jason Richardson trade. Their best bet is probably J-Dub from the Heat. I'd also expect them to throw in Patrick O' Bryant as well. J-Dub, Sarunas, O'Bryant, Wright, and Ellis works. It seems like they'd be giving up a lot of pieces but they do have a surprising amount of depth.

    Biedrins, Foyle
    KG, Harrington
    Barnes, Pietrus
    S-Jax, Marco
    Baron

    That's a pretty talented squad. All that's needed is depth at PG and they have the MLE for that.

    Minnesota gets 3 young and cheap pieces (2 with star potential) as well as cap relief:

    O' Bryant
    Wright
    Brewer
    Foye, McCants
    Ellis

    Great core to build around. Foye is the perfect guy to put next to Ellis because he can play the role of distributor allowing Ellis to focus on scoring and defending PGs instead to mask his lack of size. Brewer playing the rich-man's Bruce Bowen role - locking down the perimeter and nailing on kickouts. O'Bryant and Wright as your twin-towers on defense, both have solid inside and outside games to complement each other. McCants is the microwave off the bench.

    This trade works wonders for both teams, but the key remains getting that expiring K with their trade exception.
    Last edited by gng930; 07-08-2007 at 11:26 PM.

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    Long time fan diamonddave00's Avatar
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    Default Re: Hammering out KG deal

    A possible deal I could see with the Warriors would be in 2 parts.

    First part Warriors use 6.0 mil of their 10 mil.trade exception on Marko Jaric's contract from the T'wolves

    Then for Kevin Garnett they they Monte Ellis , Brendan Wright, Al Harrington , Patrick O'Bryant , Sarunas Jasikevicius, and a #1 in 2008 and 2010. Or a slightly different version would be Harrington, and O'Bryant removed and Andres Bierdrins and Adonal Foyle's horrible contract in their place and only the 2008 #1.

    Jasikevicius is in last year 4 mil of his deal. Ellis makes only $770,000 for this year will need a new contract, Wright signed recently 2.3 mil, Harrington 8.4 mil with 2more years after this on his contract but opt out the 3rd year, Patrick O'Bryant (Warriors #1 pick last season) 2.2 mil everything beyond this season is team option. Biedrens 2.6 Foyle 8.9 .

    T'wolves move Garnett's 22 mil contract and Jaric's 6 mil =28 mil from cap.

    Adding around 18 mil with either trade, an immediate 10+ mil off their cap. In addition after next season Sarunas, Ricky Davis, Jawaan Howard and Eddie Griffin 20 mil come off their salary cap. That would mean 30 mil total off their cap from now till next summer.

    So they acquire Harrington, Ellis , Wright, 2 #1's plus with trade and their own expiring contracts 30 mil in cap wiggle room. Their cap would be at 40 mil next summer.

    Their young base would be Foye, Ellis, Wright, Craig Smith , (perhaps Biedrens) the Warriors 2008 #1, their 2008 #1 belongs to the Celtics not sure if its lottery protected or not. They would have nearly 15-18 million to sign free agents.

    I think something along those lines is how the deal would work.
    Last edited by diamonddave00; 07-08-2007 at 11:39 PM.

  10. #10

    Default Re: Hammering out KG deal

    Why would they take Harrington's K when they wouldn't take Odom, who is better and whose contract runs shorter? A potential Lakers deal would have also involved relief from Jaric's contract and possibly Blount's as well.

    Take a look at my scenario right above yours.

  11. #11
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    Default Re: Hammering out KG deal

    odom's is less per year but al's is a year longer. odoms runs about $28mil over two years. harrington's runs about $27mil over three years. unless they'd balk at odom's relative lack of health (compared to Al) or see Al as a better trading chip after a year or two or they're willing to take it on because they really love the other pieces they're getting with Al compared to LO...
    This is the darkest timeline.

  12. #12

    Default Re: Hammering out KG deal

    ^^^ That's true, I also forgot to take into account that Ellis, Wright, O' Bryant >>> Bynum, Farmar. GS also has just enough in their trade X to also relieve Minnesota of either Hassell or Madsen's deals (both running for 3 more years). Either way, GS probably has the best shot at KG right now (assuming KG is willing). And that's bad news for a Lakers fan.
    Last edited by gng930; 07-09-2007 at 12:19 AM.

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    Default Re: Hammering out KG deal

    Because Harrington at 8.4 mil for 2007-08 and only 9.2 mil in 2008-09 with player option in 2009-10 is cheaper than Odom at 13.5 and 14.5 mil over the same period . Plus Al's contract could be easier to move.

    By dumping Jaric or Blount off for the trade exception the T'wolves could remove 6-6.7 mil off the cap immediately without taking on Kwame Brown's salary. Sarunas Jasikevicius would be included with a 1 year 4 mil deal , he is talking about wanting to return to Europe so he could forfeit the money (as Derek Fisher did with the Jazz) and go taking another immediate 4 mil salary away.

    So in essence the T'wolves could actually remove almost 30 mil in salary and only take back 14 mil. An immediate almost 16 mil savings , something the Lakers deal could not provide.

    Remember the trade exception can not to added to a trade it is used as a seperate entity, thats why it would be 2 seperate trades.

    Monte Ellis is already a quality nba guard 16.5 ppg this season , Wright is thought to be a very good prospect , Patrick O'Bryant is a 7' center with potential.

    While Andrew Bynum is a very good prospect and only 20 when the season begins he is not a proven nba yet , could be great or average , jury is out. Same goes for Javaris Crittenden or Jordan Farmar neither have proven to be quality nba players yet.

    As a result I could see why Ellis, Wright, O'Bryant , Harrington , Jasikevicius would top a Laker deal even if both teams added at least 1 #1 pick. Expecially with the Warriors also taking either Jaric or Blount's contract off their hands for only the trade exception in a 2nd deal.
    Last edited by diamonddave00; 07-09-2007 at 12:27 AM.

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    Pacer Junky Will Galen's Avatar
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    Default Re: Hammering out KG deal

    Quote Originally Posted by SoupIsGood View Post
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    Wright and Ellis? They must be real high on Wright. I'd demand another asset, at least.
    (Thinking) If that's all, we should get into the bidding ourselves with Ike, Granger, and Williams. Add Foster and Murphy and a #1 and that should do it.

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    Long time fan diamonddave00's Avatar
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    Default Re: Hammering out KG deal

    We have a 4 mil trade exception that would not take a costly salary like Blount or Jaric away.

    Murphy has a 4 year 42 mil salary they want no part of it.

    In all honesty the most attractive Pacer offer without JO we could make for Kevin Garnett would be;

    Indiana Pacers

    Incoming Players
    Kevin Garnett
    Salary: $21,000,000 Years Remaining: 3
    PTS: 22.4 REB: 12.8 AST: 4.1 PER: 24.20


    Outgoing Players: Stephen Graham, Marquis Daniels, Danny Granger, Jeff Foster, Ike Diogu, Shawne WilliamsMinnesota Timberwolves

    Incoming Players
    Stephen Graham
    Salary: $664,209 Years Remaining: 1
    PTS: 3.2 REB: 1.5 AST: 0.4 PER: 5.36

    Marquis Daniels
    Salary: $5,883,600 Years Remaining: 3
    PTS: 7.1 REB: 1.8 AST: 1.3 PER: 11.67

    Danny Granger
    Salary: $1,417,800 Years Remaining: 2
    PTS: 13.9 REB: 4.6 AST: 1.4 PER: 13.90

    Jeff Foster
    Salary: $5,500,000 Years Remaining: 3
    PTS: 4.3 REB: 8.1 AST: 0.8 PER: 13.07

    Ike Diogu
    Salary: $2,137,200 Years Remaining: 2
    PTS: 6.2 REB: 3.4 AST: 0.4 PER: 15.01

    Shawne Williams
    Salary: $1,367,760 Years Remaining: 2
    PTS: 3.9 REB: 1.8 AST: 0.5 PER: 9.75
    Salary info is based on last season's salaries.

    Granger, Diogu and Williams provide 3 young building blocks. Graham is merely filler. Foster and Daniels both have only 2 year guaranteed contracts. We'd probably have to throw in a #1 .

    No way the Pacers would do it , andquestionable if the T'wolves would. In addition Garnett is up for a new contract 4 years 100+ mil anyone????
    Last edited by diamonddave00; 07-09-2007 at 12:39 AM.

  16. #16

    Default Re: Hammering out KG deal

    The other catch with Odom vs Al Harrington is that didn't Odom require a contract extension with us? Wouldn't he feel the same for Minnesota as well?

    Just a thought.

    -- Steve --

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    Default Re: Hammering out KG deal

    Oh I'm sure Lamar Odom would need to feel "wanted" by having a 3 year extention added on to his deal , as he said he would need here.

    I'm in no way suggesting the Pacers trade for KG without dealing JO , just saying what best non-JO offer would be hypotheticly.
    Last edited by diamonddave00; 07-09-2007 at 01:30 AM.

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    Member Mr.ThunderMakeR's Avatar
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    Default Re: Hammering out KG deal

    Quote Originally Posted by Sh4d3 View Post
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    That is highway robbery for KG.
    Well it wouldnt be the first time in recent history that GS has gotten away with highway robbery, would it?

    Runs and hides

  19. #19

    Default Re: Hammering out KG deal

    Quote Originally Posted by Sh4d3 View Post
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    That is highway robbery for KG.

    Yes, on talent alone it is. But you gotta wonder about having almost 1/3 or half of your salary cap tied up in one player. Sure KG is great and all, but teams with players like that end up like... Minnesota. Not enough money to sign decent Veterans/borderline stars.

    I think there is a fundamental question to be asked. How much is a superstar worth? Is it better to have some really good players/borderline stars that make half of what you would pay Kobe or KG? I dare say... yeah.

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    Administrator Unclebuck's Avatar
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    Default Re: Hammering out KG deal

    This cannot help drive up the value of JO

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    Default Re: Hammering out KG deal

    So GS lets go of Ellis, Biedrins/Al, Sarunas, O'Bryant, Wright, a future #1 & their TE for KG 24mil & another bad contract in Jaric/Blount (in 2 seperate trades, yeah, I get it).

    I think that's overpaying. GS built a good momentum and fun style of play - why ruin it all? For 1 guy?

    I like KG, but he's not worth it, unless the move is to sell more tickets. He's just not that good. Only when he had Sam & Spree he got somewhere. He's no winner, and he's arguably past his prime.

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    Headband and Rec Specs rexnom's Avatar
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    Default Re: Hammering out KG deal

    Quote Originally Posted by NPFII View Post
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    So GS lets go of Ellis, Biedrins/Al, Sarunas, O'Bryant, Wright, a future #1 & their TE for KG 24mil & another bad contract in Jaric/Blount (in 2 seperate trades, yeah, I get it).

    I think that's overpaying. GS built a good momentum and fun style of play - why ruin it all? For 1 guy?

    I like KG, but he's not worth it, unless the move is to sell more tickets. He's just not that good. Only when he had Sam & Spree he got somewhere. He's no winner, and he's arguably past his prime.
    I think they are trying to get a deal done without Biedrins or Harrington which would mean trading only one rotation guy (two counting J-Rich)...both of which didn't do exactly splendidly in that Utah series. The same series where they were consistently out-rebounded and lacked a talented big guy. KG is one of the NBA's best rebounders and one of the most talented big guys of all time...and it's not like he can't run and move a lot.

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    Member BigDawg44's Avatar
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    Default Re: Hammering out KG deal

    they should just trade Stephen Jackson straight up for him. I mean, according to some people they are just about equal in talent level.

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    NaptownSeth is all feel Naptown_Seth's Avatar
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    Default Re: Hammering out KG deal

    Quote Originally Posted by BigDawg44 View Post
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    they should just trade Stephen Jackson straight up for him. I mean, according to some people they are just about equal in talent level.
    Die Straw Man, Die!
    Yeah, you killed him good.



    Anyway, I agree that GS might be giving up too much. Ellis and either Biedrens or Al, okay, giving up on O'Bryant so quickly to hit the Baron window now, okay. But man if they have to take another bad contract and give up a future 1st and this year's in Wright (or JRich if you want) also...

    I mean this will change their playing style a bit too. Can Barnes have the same impact with KG on the floor near the rim?

    To me it seems like they might be better off just letting Biedrens and Wright become the inside help they need with the bulk of the winning coming from the small ball aggressiveness still.


    It's probably a good trade since it features real risk and real reward. It's tough to get something good that feels totally safe.

  25. #25

    Default Re: Hammering out KG deal

    I wouldn't give up Biedrins and Ellis if I were GS. It would be one or the other with Belinelli or a future lst.

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