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Thread: Ray Allen Predicted Kobe's selfishness

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    Seize The Day carpediem024's Avatar
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    Default Ray Allen Predicted Kobe's selfishness

    Ray Allen Predicted Kobe’s Selfishness

    “He’s going to be very selfish,” Allen said of Bryant. “And he feels like he needs to show this league and the people in this country that he is better without Shaq. He can win championships without Shaq. So offensively, he’s going to jump out and say, ‘I can average 30 points. I can still carry the load on this team.’
    “I think the point production is not going to be so much what people are going to look at because (Tracy) McGrady did it in Orlando, Allen (Iverson) did it in Philly. Can you win a championship? I think that’s the question. Carrying guys on your back and making everybody better.”
    “If Kobe doesn’t see he needs two and a half good players to be a legitimate playoff contender or win a championship, in about a year or two he’ll be calling out to Jerry Buss that ‘We need some help in here,’ or ‘Trade me,’ ” Allen said. “And we’ll all be saying, ‘I told you so,’ when he says that.”
    Source: News Tribune




    Allen says Kobe will be very selfish and that Kobe wants to show people the league that he can do better without Shaq, and that's why he asked for a trade.




    Ummm Kobe didn't want Shaq to be gone. I'm guessing Allen still thinks Kobe ran Shaq off. Kobe is asking for a trade now because since the day Shaq was traded, Buss told Kobe that They're trading Shaq because of his age and that after this trade they will be builing a strong contender and they promised Kobe that. And 3 years later that promise hasn't been made. In those 3 years they made trades that didn't make sense and didnt make trades that did make sense.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YMltKsoDwe8&NR=1
    press pause on the second slow-mo replay around 0:12 mark

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    Default Re: Ray Allen Predicted Kobe's selfishness

    I find the criticism of Kobe not winning a championship by himself to be hilarious coming from Ray Allen.

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    Default Re: Ray Allen Predicted Kobe's selfishness

    Quote Originally Posted by indy0731 View Post
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    I find the criticism of Kobe not winning a championship by himself to be hilarious coming from Ray Allen.
    I don't think you have to have done it yourself to say it. Otherwise we all need to shut up (having, I would think, not led an NBA team to a title ourselves).

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    Default Re: Ray Allen Predicted Kobe's selfishness

    yeah ray has never been the same devisive figure kobe is. ray hasn't been winning but he hasn't made giant public demands for trades or players. he's quite a gifted scorer/shooter himself, kobe is better but ray's averages are nothing to scoff at. i think ray certainly is entitled to his opinion, and on top of that, he happened to be right.
    This is the darkest timeline.

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    Default Re: Ray Allen Predicted Kobe's selfishness

    Well, as far as Ray blaming Kobe for Shaq leaving, remember that this was said in 2004 and at that time that idea was the common public opinion.

    And Allen wasn't criticizing Kobe. He was mearly prediciting what would happen. And he was 95% correct.

    Its like someone saying back in 2002 that the Iraq war would ultimately be a mistake. People weren't criticizing America or being unpatriotic or anything like that. They were just calling it as they saw it based on the facts. The truth is the truth.

    If you can see what's comming, and it isn't good, and you tell everyone that it won't be good, you are not being pessimistic. You are being realistic.



    I think I just accidentally defended all of the PD darksiders. Crap.
    Last edited by FlavaDave; 06-06-2007 at 10:58 AM.

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    Default Re: Ray Allen Predicted Kobe's selfishness

    he also didn't say kobe forced shaq out. but even if events went down the way kobe has recently said about it being purely financial, don't you think that kobe re-signing with the same team that he'd won championships w/ shaq on was more about proving he could take this team to the same level without shaq? i didn't get the sense that ray was saying kobe forced shaq out but if the team does that and then you re-sign with that same team, that is a pretty obvious motivation.
    This is the darkest timeline.

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    Default Re: Ray Allen Predicted Kobe's selfishness

    Quote Originally Posted by Mal View Post
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    I don't think you have to have done it yourself to say it. Otherwise we all need to shut up (having, I would think, not led an NBA team to a title ourselves).
    However I don't make my career playing basketball. I am an objective fan. Ray Allen plays basketball and is criticizing Kobe for not doing something that he has not done as well.

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    Default Re: Ray Allen Predicted Kobe's selfishness

    for all it's worth... Ray told you so!

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    Default Re: Ray Allen Predicted Kobe's selfishness

    Quote Originally Posted by indy0731 View Post
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    However I don't make my career playing basketball. I am an objective fan. Ray Allen plays basketball and is criticizing Kobe for not doing something that he has not done as well.
    The difference between Ray and Kobe is that I'm pretty sure that Ray would be very quick to acknowledge that he is not as good as Kobe Bryant.
    "A man with no belly has no appetite for life."

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    Default Re: Ray Allen Predicted Kobe's selfishness

    Quote Originally Posted by indy0731 View Post
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    However I don't make my career playing basketball. I am an objective fan. Ray Allen plays basketball and is criticizing Kobe for not doing something that he has not done as well.
    He's NOT criticizing Kobe for not winning a title without Shaq, he's criticizing him for CRYING publicly about not being able to do it.

    That is NOT something Ray has done.

    -- Steve --

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    Default Re: Ray Allen Predicted Kobe's selfishness

    Quote Originally Posted by Pacersfan46 View Post
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    He's NOT criticizing Kobe for not winning a title without Shaq, he's criticizing him for CRYING publicly about not being able to do it.

    That is NOT something Ray has done.

    -- Steve --

    IMO he is in a way criticizing him for both. I obviously read it differently than you guys do.

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    Default Re: Ray Allen Predicted Kobe's selfishness

    Quote Originally Posted by indy0731 View Post
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    However I don't make my career playing basketball. I am an objective fan. Ray Allen plays basketball and is criticizing Kobe for not doing something that he has not done as well.
    But he was right, wasn't he?

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    Default Re: Ray Allen Predicted Kobe's selfishness

    Quote Originally Posted by indy0731 View Post
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    However I don't make my career playing basketball. I am an objective fan. Ray Allen plays basketball and is criticizing Kobe for not doing something that he has not done as well.
    Granted. Either way, he's entitled to his opinion and I don't believe in the "if you haven't done it better, STFU" argument (I think I used to, but not anymore).

    You're either correct or you aren't; regardless of your own achievements.

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    Default Re: Ray Allen Predicted Kobe's selfishness

    Quote Originally Posted by Mal View Post
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    I don't think you have to have done it yourself to say it. Otherwise we all need to shut up (having, I would think, not led an NBA team to a title ourselves).
    Wait, you haven't? How'd you get into the PD parties then, I thought it was a pre-req?


    Not only does Ray explain the reasoning, but also the exact nature and timing of Kobe's reaction. Pretty insightful I'd say.

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    Default Re: Ray Allen Predicted Kobe's selfishness

    Quote Originally Posted by Mal View Post
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    I don't think you have to have done it yourself to say it. Otherwise we all need to shut up (having, I would think, not led an NBA team to a title ourselves).
    This may be a good time to let you guys know that my real name is Bill Russell.

    And just like Jesus Shuttlesworth, I think Kobe should stay off the radio.

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    Default Re: Ray Allen Predicted Kobe's selfishness

    D-Wade won the championship by himself lol

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    Default Re: Ray Allen Predicted Kobe's selfishness

    I hate defending athletes but I feel for Kobe. Kobe doesn't get enough credit, Shaq and Kobe won those Championships. Shaq didn't win those Championships by him self. Shaq and WADE won that Championship not just Shaq. Shaq and Penny got to that championship not just Shaq. Kobe doesn't have anyone else. No, seriously NO ONE. Lamar is scarred to death to shoot, and when he forces himself to shoot, it's unnatural so he overshoots. Everyone on that lakers team is so mesmerized by Kobe's skill that when he starts going off, instead of them joining in, they give him the ball and fall into a Isolation Offense. Kobe tries to get the team involved but they just give it right back to him, or miss 100% wide open shots. Lebron, Ray, Vince Carter, Mcgrady, Carmello, Duncan all have people Shaq had literally an All-Star cast on his last Championship. Kobe has no one. I don't think he is selfish I think he needs people and knows the Lakers can get them, so he wants the front office to go out and get them. Shaq is a damn good player but it's not like Shaq went to the Bobcats and won a Championship. He went to Miami with a young top 3 SG, a veteran coach, 10 total all stars and a whole host of bench players. Noone wins championships alone, so to make it look like Kobe can't win without Shaq is unfair. He just needs someone, that can hit some buckets consistently.

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    Default Re: Ray Allen Predicted Kobe's selfishness

    Quote Originally Posted by indy0731 View Post
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    IMO he is in a way criticizing him for both. I obviously read it differently than you guys do.
    He's not criticizing Kobe at all. He's just saying that eventually Kobe is going to realize that he needs 2 and a half good players to be a legitimate contender for a championship. Ray is obviously speaking from experience having been in the league longer than Kobe. The best part is that he was right on the money.

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    Default Re: Ray Allen Predicted Kobe's selfishness

    Quote Originally Posted by Evan_The_Dude View Post
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    He's not criticizing Kobe at all. He's just saying that eventually Kobe is going to realize that he needs 2 and a half good players to be a legitimate contender for a championship. Ray is obviously speaking from experience having been in the league longer than Kobe. The best part is that he was right on the money.
    Ray Allen and Kobe Bryant were drafted in the exact same year. Kobe has three championships and Allen has zilch. I'd say Kobe has more experience playing winning basketball than Ray.

    I have no problem with Allen saying that KObe had no idea what he was getting into when it comes to leading a team by himself because Allen knows all about that.
    What I think Allen had no right to say is this...
    “I think the point production is not going to be so much what people are going to look at because (Tracy) McGrady did it in Orlando, Allen (Iverson) did it in Philly. Can you win a championship? I think that’s the question. Carrying guys on your back and making everybody better.”
    I'd throw this exact same quote back at Mr. Allen. Especially considering Kobe actually has three rings on his fingers.

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    Default Re: Ray Allen Predicted Kobe's selfishness

    Lol.

    Kobe is a great player, better than Ray Allen.

    But Kobe had a dominate Shaqiule O'Neal, playing for one of the greatest and winniest coaches ever, along with some great role players like Fisher, Fox, and Horry. Kobe had ALOT more help than Ray Allen has ever seen.

    I don't have any problem with the comments that Ray Allen made. He didn't say, Kobe needs to make others better like I do, Ray Allen was stating the facts though.

    All Ray was saying was that Kobe has to realize you need good players to win a championship. Obviously Ray knows this but it's not his job to put the team together. Just because Seattle can't put a winner together doesn't mean Ray Allen can't speak the truth about winning. You don't have to win a championship to know what it takes to win one. You need good players. To me, that's all Ray was saying.

    And I find it pretty funny that he was pretty much dead on with this 3 years later.

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    Seize The Day carpediem024's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ray Allen Predicted Kobe's selfishness

    Quote Originally Posted by rommie View Post
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    Lol.

    Kobe is a great player, better than Ray Allen.

    But Kobe had a dominate Shaqiule O'Neal, playing for one of the greatest and winniest coaches ever, along with some great role players like Fisher, Fox, and Horry. Kobe had ALOT more help than Ray Allen has ever seen.

    I don't have any problem with the comments that Ray Allen made. He didn't say, Kobe needs to make others better like I do, Ray Allen was stating the facts though.

    All Ray was saying was that Kobe has to realize you need good players to win a championship. Obviously Ray knows this but it's not his job to put the team together. Just because Seattle can't put a winner together doesn't mean Ray Allen can't speak the truth about winning. You don't have to win a championship to know what it takes to win one. You need good players. To me, that's all Ray was saying.

    And I find it pretty funny that he was pretty much dead on with this 3 years later.

    I'm pretty sure Kobe knows that you need Good players around you to win championships. HE DIDN'T want Shaq to leave and he didn't want to do it all on his own. And he was promised that they would build a contender around Kobe after the Shaq trade and Kobe still didn't want Shaq to go but Buss told him his decision was final. And Kobe is so ****ed because of the Laker Insider stating he was the reason that Shaq was traded, and the Lakers have done nothing good to make a contender.

    How would Ray feel if he was in the same situation, being blamed for 3 years and just letting it slip and then The Insider. I would hate to be criticized like that.
    Last edited by carpediem024; 06-07-2007 at 01:09 AM.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YMltKsoDwe8&NR=1
    press pause on the second slow-mo replay around 0:12 mark

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    Default Re: Ray Allen Predicted Kobe's selfishness

    Quote Originally Posted by indy0731 View Post
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    I find the criticism of Kobe not winning a championship by himself to be hilarious coming from Ray Allen.
    Actually, I find Allen's comments to be right on the mark concerning Kobe. YOU want to say, "that's the pot calling the kettle black" because Ray Allen hasn't won a championship himself, but I don't ever recall hearing/reading Ray Allen complain so badly about one of his teammates to the point where the franchise go rid of said player and then he plays so selfishly that he eventually begins to whine when his team isn't doing so well w/him as the #1 scoring option.

    Kobe asked for it; he got it! He became "the Man" on his team. And now he can't handle it. I don't feel sorry for him...not one bit.

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    Default Re: Ray Allen Predicted Kobe's selfishness

    Quote Originally Posted by carpediem024 View Post
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    I'm pretty sure Kobe knows that you need Good players around you to win championships. HE DIDN'T want Shaq to leave and he didn't want to do it all on his own. And he was promised that they would build a contender around Kobe after the Shaq trade and Kobe still didn't want Shaq to go but Buss told him his decision was final. And Kobe is so ****ed because of the Laker Insider stating he was the reason that Shaq was traded, and the Lakers have done nothing good to make a contender.

    How would Ray feel if he was in the same situation, being blamed for 3 years and just letting it slip and then The Insider. I would hate to be criticized like that.
    Yes I don't blame Kobe for Shaq leaving. Honestly I don't really care because he has being going downhill ever since their last title IMO. So really, I think the Lakers are better right now after that Shaq trade.

    But my main thing was I don't think Ray was out of line to make his comments. And I really don't blame Kobe for wanting changes. I would too if I were him.

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    Seize The Day carpediem024's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ray Allen Predicted Kobe's selfishness

    Quote Originally Posted by NuffSaid View Post
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    Kobe asked for it; he got it! He became "the Man" on his team. And now he can't handle it. I don't feel sorry for him...not one bit.
    For the what, 19083rd time Kobe never wanted Shaq to leave. He wanted him to stay.

    Edit: That's why Kobe's asking to be traded because he got back stabbed by Buss and he had everyone believing Kobe ran Shaq off. And they lied to him. Even Shaq was ****ed.

    "I believe Kobe 100 percent," said O'Neal, reached yesterday while in Los Angeles on business. "Absolutely. There's no doubt in my mind Kobe is telling the truth. I believe him a thousand percent. I would have respected Dr. Buss more as a man if he would have told me that himself, because I know he said it. But he didn't [tell me]. He never said a damn word to me."
    Last edited by carpediem024; 06-08-2007 at 10:45 AM.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YMltKsoDwe8&NR=1
    press pause on the second slow-mo replay around 0:12 mark

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