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Thread: This team is DUE some luck

  1. #26

    Default Re: This team is DUE some luck

    Quote Originally Posted by diamonddave00 View Post
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    rail thin Marcus Williams are questionable in my eyes.
    Because he's thin?

    I heard about some guy who played for the Pacers a few times, rail thin is how they described him coming out of college, too. Never got bigger. Maybe my memory is cloudy but I think he had a pretty OK career.

    Everybody isn't going to be a starter from this draft. Some guys will have injury issues, some guys will struggle on defense, some are just overrated (Noah, for example).

    But it's still by far the best group of players in the draft in a long, long time.

  2. #27

    Default Re: This team is DUE some luck

    What is the point of getting young talent if we have a coach who can't develop them. And have management that seems to have a love affair with that coach. It's time to stop changing our roster so much and change the people making the changes. Indiana is too loyal to their leaders/legends. Evan Byah and that KKK leader in the 20s is prove of that.
    Worse management in the history of sports

  3. #28
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    Default Re: This team is DUE some luck

    Quote Originally Posted by 3rdStrike View Post
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    Because he's thin?

    I heard about some guy who played for the Pacers a few times, rail thin is how they described him coming out of college, too. Never got bigger. Maybe my memory is cloudy but I think he had a pretty OK career.

    Everybody isn't going to be a starter from this draft. Some guys will have injury issues, some guys will struggle on defense, some are just overrated (Noah, for example).

    But it's still by far the best group of players in the draft in a long, long time.
    Reggie Miller was the #2 all-time leading scorer at legendary UCLA and was a sharpshooter. Marcus Williams is a worse shooter than Marquis Daniels and doesn't have half of Quis' overall talent. He's not much better than horrible Rawle Marshall, and is a far inferior defender to Rawle. If we want someone on Williams level, we could just trade Marshall and a future 2nd for Francisco Garcia.

  4. #29

    Default Re: This team is DUE some luck

    is this draft better than last year...
    Aldridge
    Worse management in the history of sports

  5. #30
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    Default Re: This team is DUE some luck

    Quote Originally Posted by youseeme09 View Post
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    is this draft better than last year...
    Aldridg
    Yes, on the strength of the top-5. Outside of that though, it's about the same.


  6. #31

    Default Re: This team is DUE some luck

    Quote Originally Posted by Y2J View Post
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    Yes, on the strength of the top-5. Outside of that though, it's about the same.

    I disagree thoroughly. Morrison would be a 2nd rounder in this draft possibly. If not him then Reddick. Look at last years draft and honestly tell me that most of them are not future NBA starters.

    I can see at least 33% of this draft being starters in 5 years.
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    Default Re: This team is DUE some luck

    Quote Originally Posted by youseeme09 View Post
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    I disagree thoroughly. Morrison would be a 2nd rounder in this draft possibly. If not him then Reddick. Look at last years draft and honestly tell me that most of them are not future NBA starters.

    I can see at least 33% of this draft being starters in 5 years.

    Man if I can get people to bet on these statements I can make some money. 10 people starting after the 2008 draft and so on? I will take that. Most of these prospects are big men, and with the shifting of Center/ big man league to fast pace mulitple postion guards there could be more busts than anything else. As long as these big men can play tranistion offense and defense and pass they might be able to cut it off the bench

  8. #33
    Administrator Unclebuck's Avatar
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    Default Re: This team is DUE some luck

    Is this years draft better than last years - I certainly hope so.
    But is it as good as many people think - no way.

    Someone determine the best draft ever. And tell me how many real stars are in the first round. 5 or 6 max - maybe in 1984

  9. #34
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    Default Re: This team is DUE some luck

    I'm trying to follow that logic, but I just can't. I'm looking at the top 20 guys available in this draft, and I don't see a single Devan George type in the bunch.
    No one ever does (cough, Darko). If it were obvious why would they get drafted.

    Fact, no matter how deep a draft is, there are going to be better and worse players in the group. Even if 30 Lebron's all came out together they would filter to every team and would have a null impact.

    In other words, even if all 30 1st round picks are contributors, good picks for their spot, the best 5 will be much better than the worst five, and the teams with those best 5 will be better off than the teams with the worst five.

    It's all relative in the end. Sure the #11 this year might be as good as a #6 in a different year, but it's still all over the place. People still want Duncan over Marion or Nash over Billups or whatever.

    Maybe it won't be Oden or Durant, but SOMEONE is going to be the best player in this draft and some of the guys are going to be "you could have drafted X instead" type of guys.

  10. #35
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    Default Re: This team is DUE some luck

    Quote Originally Posted by intridcold View Post
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    Man if I can get people to bet on these statements I can make some money. 10 people starting after the 2008 draft and so on? I will take that.
    Exactly. They haven't stopped producing young talented players have they? Guys like Wade, James and Melo didn't retire did they?

    My bet is that at least 1 of the top 10 picks isn't even in the NBA in 5 years. Even in a deep draft. 2008, 2009, 2010...at least 3-4 from each of those drafts will be starting as well. You have 150 starting slots. Good players last around 10 years at least. That's 1.5 starters per year.

  11. #36
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    Default Re: This team is DUE some luck

    Quote Originally Posted by Kstat View Post
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    ..other than the fact the NBA took the best of last year's draft class and made them stay a year to lump along with this year's?

    The list of prospects is a who's who of young talent. Not a single no-name project in the first round, wheras previous drafts were full of guys nobody had seen play before.

    This year's draft reminds me of the 1996 draft. A bunch of proven players instead of the usual underdeveloped projects.
    No they didn't. Did I miss the part where HS players are entering the draft this year?

    Whoops. LAST YEAR was a year that was hurt, but it didn't help this year. If guys like Mayo were getting into this draft, THEN you'd have a double dip.

    You had last year missing one class (the HS class). This year doesn't have an extra class in the draft.

    And the NBA didn't make the FLA guys stay, they were free to declare.

  12. #37
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    Default Re: This team is DUE some luck

    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck View Post
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    Is this years draft better than last years - I certainly hope so.
    But is it as good as many people think - no way.

    Someone determine the best draft ever. And tell me how many real stars are in the first round. 5 or 6 max - maybe in 1984
    I agree there's probably 5-6 max stars, though the 2003 draft is looking pretty good as one of the best.

    4 Stars: Lebron, Carmello, Bosh, Wade

    All-Star: Josh Howard

    Future all-stars (maybe): Hinrich, West (NOK)

    Starters/Contributors 1st round: Kaman, Ridnour, Ford, Diaw, Barbosa, Pietrus, Collison, Pavlovic,

    Starters/Contributors 2nd round: Kapono, Walton, Blake, Pachulia, Mo Williams, Korver

    Others that have seen decent time on the floor:
    Jarvis hayes
    Marcus Banks
    Travis Outlaw
    Brian Cook
    Carlos Defino
    Kendrick Perkins
    Darko Millicic
    James Jones
    Willie Green
    Matt Bonner


    I know the categories are a little out of whack, but there were a fair share of players in the 2003 draft that have contributed good minutes to a team at one time or another.

  13. #38
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    Default Re: This team is DUE some luck

    Quote Originally Posted by pwee31 View Post
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    I agree there's probably 5-6 max stars, though the 2003 draft is looking pretty good as one of the best.

    4 Stars: Lebron, Carmello, Bosh, Wade

    All-Star: Josh Howard

    Future all-stars (maybe): Hinrich, West (NOK)

    Starters/Contributors 1st round: Kaman, Ridnour, Ford, Diaw, Barbosa, Pietrus, Collison, Pavlovic,

    Starters/Contributors 2nd round: Kapono, Walton, Blake, Pachulia, Mo Williams, Korver

    Others that have seen decent time on the floor:
    Jarvis hayes
    Marcus Banks
    Travis Outlaw
    Brian Cook
    Carlos Defino
    Kendrick Perkins
    Darko Millicic
    James Jones
    Willie Green
    Matt Bonner


    I know the categories are a little out of whack, but there were a fair share of players in the 2003 draft that have contributed good minutes to a team at one time or another.

    OK here is my real point on all this. We have so much handwringing about the Pacers not getting the 10th pick. Well the 2003 draft was great - one of the best ever - maybe the 2007 draft will be as good or maybe better.

    But look at who was taken at the end of the lottery in 2003 and you tell me if any of these players are that good - good enough for all this handwringing - I think not.

    9) Sweetney
    10) Jarvis Hayes
    11) Pietrus
    12) Nick Collison
    13) Marcus Banks

    And that is the caliber of player we likely would get with the 12th pick - so why all the panic about the pacers not having the first round pick. Oh I know someone will argue, that this year will be different this year will be much better in picks 9 through 13. Well we'll see

  14. #39

    Default Re: This team is DUE some luck

    Why stop with 2003. Build a fantasy team with players from the top ten and players from the bottom 10 ( all first rounders). Go back 5,10,15 years. You will have Jordan, Duncan, Shaq, Carter, McGrady, Yao, etc. Of course there are the Dunleavys but in the other group we have Tinsley, Foster, Harrington, etc. Oh is that why the Pacers really are not competitive, no high picks. I hope we get lucky because that will go a long way to make this season justifiable. Then DW/LB can say that was the plan all along.

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    Default Re: This team is DUE some luck

    Quote Originally Posted by speakout4 View Post
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    Why stop with 2003. Build a fantasy team with players from the top ten and players from the bottom 10 ( all first rounders). Go back 5,10,15 years. You will have Jordan, Duncan, Shaq, Carter, McGrady, Yao, etc. Of course there are the Dunleavys but in the other group we have Tinsley, Foster, Harrington, etc. Oh is that why the Pacers really are not competitive, no high picks. I hope we get lucky because that will go a long way to make this season justifiable. Then DW/LB can say that was the plan all along.

    My cousin just got his MD and said that he will have to constantly study in order to stay up in his profession. Medical journals and seminars help in that process.

    Computer techs have to constantly be educated because their field changes frequently.

    Where am I going with this? The NBA changes, hell every sport changes. The Bird/Magic era was a scoring era. The Pistons came on the scene and actually played hard nosed knock you to the ground defense. The Bulls athleticism and defense (along with the triangle offense). With Garnett, Webber, Shaq, Wallace, and Duncan componet and the Kobe/Francis/McGrady/Carter/Marbury/AI/Pierce emphasis the NBA was not selling and producing an attractive product (the absence of Jordan, Bird, and Magic hurt too). I think now distributing players like Nash/Deron Williams/Paul/LeBron/Wade/Felton? are the future. Players who work in a system, instead of having the system revolve around them. You may think that the system revovles around Nash and Williams, but plug another distributing up tempo point and you might get similar results (although not as good). So what about Dallas? Do they not work in a system? I have not watched too many of their games.

    I ask what makes them successful? What system do they have? What componets make them tick that breeds a successful program?


    What I am getting at (i think i am there) is the league maybe moving past DW and Bird's knowledge of the game. The transactions of the past few years are out of despartion, but that is when you should work your best with DWs experience. And at times the deals were good (Peja for the excemption was the slickest move in awhile). They have a year to prove to me that they are able to assess and develop players to produce in a system that a coach is passionate and dedicated to.

    I know the Lakers aren't the best ( I think they are a JO or a PG away from contenders) but their players are developing in the system. They made the freakin playoffs in the west with Smush, Walton, Bynum (promising prospect), and Kwame. That is sick. Oh yeah and Kobe somebody???

    We need a coach and management with a vision for the future and knowledge of the game today to implement that system.

    And until that happens they don't deserve to pick a player that won't fit that future system. Let them spend next year tickering and get it right before they pick up that franchise player at the 12th pick


  16. #41
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    Default Re: This team is DUE some luck

    Quote Originally Posted by indy0731 View Post
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    We won't get a top 3 pick. God hates Pacer fans. We gave away a lotto pick in the most stocked draft in a decade for a guy that isn't even here anymore.
    What are you talking about? Ike, Troy,Mike and McLeod are all still here.

    ")

  17. #42
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    Default Re: This team is DUE some luck

    Quote Originally Posted by Bball View Post
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    Go ahead... pour some more salt on it...


    -Bball

    You noticed that too. He says the pacers are his 2nd favorite, but he sure likes to rub it in when available.
    PissOn Fan.

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