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Rule #1

Pacers Digest is intended to be a place to discuss basketball without having to deal with the kinds of behaviors or attitudes that distract people from sticking with the discussion of the topics at hand. These unwanted distractions can come in many forms, and admittedly it can sometimes be tricky to pin down each and every kind that can rear its ugly head, but we feel that the following examples and explanations cover at least a good portion of that ground and should at least give people a pretty good idea of the kinds of things we actively discourage:

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In general, if a comment goes from purely on topic to something 'ad hominem' (personal jabs, personal shots, attacks, flames, however you want to call it, towards a person, or a group of people, or a given city/state/country of people), those are most likely going to be found intolerable.

We also dissuade passive aggressive behavior. This can be various things, but common examples include statements that are basically meant to imply someone is either stupid or otherwise incapable of holding a rational conversation. This can include (but is not limited to) laughing at someone's conclusions rather than offering an honest rebuttal, asking people what game they were watching, or another common problem is Poster X will say "that player isn't that bad" and then Poster Y will say something akin to "LOL you think that player is good". We're not going to tolerate those kinds of comments out of respect for the community at large and for the sake of trying to just have an honest conversation.

Now, does the above cover absolutely every single kind of distraction that is unwanted? Probably not, but you should by now have a good idea of the general types of things we will be discouraging. The above examples are meant to give you a good feel for / idea of what we're looking for. If something new or different than the above happens to come along and results in the same problem (that being, any other attitude or behavior that ultimately distracts from actually just discussing the topic at hand, or that is otherwise disrespectful to other posters), we can and we will take action to curb this as well, so please don't take this to mean that if you managed to technically avoid saying something exactly like one of the above examples that you are then somehow off the hook.

That all having been said, our goal is to do so in a generally kind and respectful way, and that doesn't mean the moment we see something we don't like that somebody is going to be suspended or banned, either. It just means that at the very least we will probably say something about it, quite possibly snipping out the distracting parts of the post in question while leaving alone the parts that are actually just discussing the topics, and in the event of a repeating or excessive problem, then we will start issuing infractions to try to further discourage further repeat problems, and if it just never seems to improve, then finally suspensions or bans will come into play. We would prefer it never went that far, and most of the time for most of our posters, it won't ever have to.

A slip up every once and a while is pretty normal, but, again, when it becomes repetitive or excessive, something will be done. Something occasional is probably going to be let go (within reason), but when it starts to become habitual or otherwise a pattern, odds are very good that we will step in.

There's always a small minority that like to push people's buttons and/or test their own boundaries with regards to the administrators, and in the case of someone acting like that, please be aware that this is not a court of law, but a private website run by people who are simply trying to do the right thing as they see it. If we feel that you are a special case that needs to be dealt with in an exceptional way because your behavior isn't explicitly mirroring one of our above examples of what we generally discourage, we can and we will take atypical action to prevent this from continuing if you are not cooperative with us.

Also please be aware that you will not be given a pass simply by claiming that you were 'only joking,' because quite honestly, when someone really is just joking, for one thing most people tend to pick up on the joke, including the person or group that is the target of the joke, and for another thing, in the event where an honest joke gets taken seriously and it upsets or angers someone, the person who is truly 'only joking' will quite commonly go out of his / her way to apologize and will try to mend fences. People who are dishonest about their statements being 'jokes' do not do so, and in turn that becomes a clear sign of what is really going on. It's nothing new.

In any case, quite frankly, the overall quality and health of the entire forum's community is more important than any one troublesome user will ever be, regardless of exactly how a problem is exhibiting itself, and if it comes down to us having to make a choice between you versus the greater health and happiness of the entire community, the community of this forum will win every time.

Lastly, there are also some posters, who are generally great contributors and do not otherwise cause any problems, who sometimes feel it's their place to provoke or to otherwise 'mess with' that small minority of people described in the last paragraph, and while we possibly might understand why you might feel you WANT to do something like that, the truth is we can't actually tolerate that kind of behavior from you any more than we can tolerate the behavior from them. So if we feel that you are trying to provoke those other posters into doing or saying something that will get themselves into trouble, then we will start to view you as a problem as well, because of the same reason as before: The overall health of the forum comes first, and trying to stir the pot with someone like that doesn't help, it just makes it worse. Some will simply disagree with this philosophy, but if so, then so be it because ultimately we have to do what we think is best so long as it's up to us.

If you see a problem that we haven't addressed, the best and most appropriate course for a forum member to take here is to look over to the left of the post in question. See underneath that poster's name, avatar, and other info, down where there's a little triangle with an exclamation point (!) in it? Click that. That allows you to report the post to the admins so we can definitely notice it and give it a look to see what we feel we should do about it. Beyond that, obviously it's human nature sometimes to want to speak up to the poster in question who has bothered you, but we would ask that you try to refrain from doing so because quite often what happens is two or more posters all start going back and forth about the original offending post, and suddenly the entire thread is off topic or otherwise derailed. So while the urge to police it yourself is understandable, it's best to just report it to us and let us handle it. Thank you!

All of the above is going to be subject to a case by case basis, but generally and broadly speaking, this should give everyone a pretty good idea of how things will typically / most often be handled.

Rule #2

If the actions of an administrator inspire you to make a comment, criticism, or express a concern about it, there is a wrong place and a couple of right places to do so.

The wrong place is to do so in the original thread in which the administrator took action. For example, if a post gets an infraction, or a post gets deleted, or a comment within a larger post gets clipped out, in a thread discussing Paul George, the wrong thing to do is to distract from the discussion of Paul George by adding your off topic thoughts on what the administrator did.

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A) Start a thread about the specific incident you want to talk about on the Feedback board. This way you are able to express yourself in an area that doesn't throw another thread off topic, and this way others can add their two cents as well if they wish, and additionally if there's something that needs to be said by the administrators, that is where they will respond to it.

B) Send a private message to the administrators, and they can respond to you that way.

If this is done the wrong way, those comments will be deleted, and if it's a repeating problem then it may also receive an infraction as well.

Rule #3

If a poster is bothering you, and an administrator has not or will not deal with that poster to the extent that you would prefer, you have a powerful tool at your disposal, one that has recently been upgraded and is now better than ever: The ability to ignore a user.

When you ignore a user, you will unfortunately still see some hints of their existence (nothing we can do about that), however, it does the following key things:

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To utilize this feature, from any page on Pacers Digest, scroll to the top of the page, look to the top right where it says 'Settings' and click that. From the settings page, look to the left side of the page where it says 'My Settings', and look down from there until you see 'Edit Ignore List' and click that. From here, it will say 'Add a Member to Your List...' Beneath that, click in the text box to the right of 'User Name', type in or copy & paste the username of the poster you are ignoring, and once their name is in the box, look over to the far right and click the 'Okay' button. All done!

Rule #4

Regarding infractions, currently they carry a value of one point each, and that point will expire in 31 days. If at any point a poster is carrying three points at the same time, that poster will be suspended until the oldest of the three points expires.

Rule #5

When you share or paste content or articles from another website, you must include the URL/link back to where you found it, who wrote it, and what website it's from. Said content will be removed if this doesn't happen.

An example:

If I copy and paste an article from the Indianapolis Star website, I would post something like this:

http://www.linktothearticlegoeshere.com/article
Title of the Article
Author's Name
Indianapolis Star

Rule #6

We cannot tolerate illegal videos on Pacers Digest. This means do not share any links to them, do not mention any websites that host them or link to them, do not describe how to find them in any way, and do not ask about them. Posts doing anything of the sort will be removed, the offenders will be contacted privately, and if the problem becomes habitual, you will be suspended, and if it still persists, you will probably be banned.

The legal means of watching or listening to NBA games are NBA League Pass Broadband (for US, or for International; both cost money) and NBA Audio League Pass (which is free). Look for them on NBA.com.

Rule #7

Provocative statements in a signature, or as an avatar, or as the 'tagline' beneath a poster's username (where it says 'Member' or 'Administrator' by default, if it is not altered) are an unwanted distraction that will more than likely be removed on sight. There can be shades of gray to this, but in general this could be something political or religious that is likely going to provoke or upset people, or otherwise something that is mean-spirited at the expense of a poster, a group of people, or a population.

It may or may not go without saying, but this goes for threads and posts as well, particularly when it's not made on the off-topic board (Market Square).

We do make exceptions if we feel the content is both innocuous and unlikely to cause social problems on the forum (such as wishing someone a Merry Christmas or a Happy Easter), and we also also make exceptions if such topics come up with regards to a sports figure (such as the Lance Stephenson situation bringing up discussions of domestic abuse and the law, or when Jason Collins came out as gay and how that lead to some discussion about gay rights).

However, once the discussion seems to be more/mostly about the political issues instead of the sports figure or his specific situation, the thread is usually closed.

Rule #8

We prefer self-restraint and/or modesty when making jokes or off topic comments in a sports discussion thread. They can be fun, but sometimes they derail or distract from a topic, and we don't want to see that happen. If we feel it is a problem, we will either delete or move those posts from the thread.

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Generally speaking, we try to be a "PG-13" rated board, and we don't want to see sexual content or similarly suggestive content. Vulgarity is a more muddled issue, though again we prefer things to lean more towards "PG-13" than "R". If we feel things have gone too far, we will step in.

Rule #10

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Oden and Conley Both Enterting the Draft

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  • #61
    Re: Oden and Conley Both Enterting the Draft

    Originally posted by ChicagoPacer View Post
    It's a mistake for Conley to enter this year. He's a short point guard by NBA standards. He has long arms and is lightning quick, but he's still short. Short, quick point guards need perimeter shooting (18-20 foot range min) to create space for themselves. No one will respect his outside shooting, so they can play off him and he'll be ineffective.

    The guy is shooting 30% from the college 3-pt line.

    Looking down a list of young PG types without much height from the last 7 or 8 years:

    TJ Ford, Paul, Marbury, Bibby, Davis, Felton, Duhon, Tinsley, Hinrich, Francis, Jason Williams, Derron Williams, Jameer Nelson, Devin Harris, Andre Miller.

    All of these guys made pretty quick impacts for their ballclubs. The only two who were worse outside shooters than Conley? Andre Miller and TJ Ford. Ford gets banged up because he's forced to drive the lane to create things, and Miller's career has taken a downward turn early. The fact that Tinsley was a much better outside shooter coming into the league than Conley should tell you something.

    Conley needs a full year without Oden and Butler, where he has sole PG duty in a more open offense with Cook and Lighty. If he gets his 3-pt shooting up to the upper 30s/low 40s and adds another 4-5 ppg while making the same good decisions, he's top 5 next year. Right now, he's mid first round.

    Right now, what the Pacers need more than anything is a guy who can create his own shot. Dunleavy and Murphy will never be able to do this, and Granger seems hesitant at times to do so. Only O'Neal can. So he gets doubled. Conley could be that player if defenders respected his shooting ability, but they won't. Not yet anyway. Get a guy who can create opportunities, and get a vet PG for the exemption as a stop gap measure for Tinsley.
    I think we have that guy in Daniels if these health issues get resolved once and for all. Don't overlook the fact that we simply didn't win without him in the rotation. I'm not saying that he's the team savior, but his skill set is invaluable to this squad. Point-guard and pure shooting is what we need. I think pure shooting is the big thing. How many plays have you seen that resulted in a wide open shot that just simply didn't go down? Also, the one thing we could use is Conley's quickness. That's what makes Daniels so valuable is the havoc he creates getting into the paint. It is simply unguardable; and he can't shoot either.

    Comment


    • #62
      Re: Oden and Conley Both Enterting the Draft

      Originally posted by ChicagoPacer View Post
      It's a mistake for Conley to enter this year. He's a short point guard by NBA standards. He has long arms and is lightning quick, but he's still short. Short, quick point guards need perimeter shooting (18-20 foot range min) to create space for themselves. No one will respect his outside shooting, so they can play off him and he'll be ineffective.

      The guy is shooting 30% from the college 3-pt line.

      Looking down a list of young PG types without much height from the last 7 or 8 years:

      TJ Ford, Paul, Marbury, Bibby, Davis, Felton, Duhon, Tinsley, Hinrich, Francis, Jason Williams, Derron Williams, Jameer Nelson, Devin Harris, Andre Miller.

      All of these guys made pretty quick impacts for their ballclubs. The only two who were worse outside shooters than Conley? Andre Miller and TJ Ford. Ford gets banged up because he's forced to drive the lane to create things, and Miller's career has taken a downward turn early. The fact that Tinsley was a much better outside shooter coming into the league than Conley should tell you something.

      Conley needs a full year without Oden and Butler, where he has sole PG duty in a more open offense with Cook and Lighty. If he gets his 3-pt shooting up to the upper 30s/low 40s and adds another 4-5 ppg while making the same good decisions, he's top 5 next year. Right now, he's mid first round.

      Right now, what the Pacers need more than anything is a guy who can create his own shot. Dunleavy and Murphy will never be able to do this, and Granger seems hesitant at times to do so. Only O'Neal can. So he gets doubled. Conley could be that player if defenders respected his shooting ability, but they won't. Not yet anyway. Get a guy who can create opportunities, and get a vet PG for the exemption as a stop gap measure for Tinsley.
      He's over 50% from the floor as a true freshman.
      He can shoot plenty good enough.

      Comment


      • #63
        Re: Oden and Conley Both Enterting the Draft

        Originally posted by PacerMan View Post
        He's over 50% from the floor as a true freshman.
        He can shoot plenty good enough.
        Easy to shoot %50 when %75 of your baskets are layups. He got a lot of shots off at the rim at OSU that he won't be getting in the NBA.

        It wasn't about being the team everyone loved, it was about beating the teams everyone else loved.

        Division Champions 1955, 1956, 1988, 1989, 1990, 2002, 2003, 2005, 2006, 2007, 2008
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        • #64
          Re: Oden and Conley Both Enterting the Draft

          Originally posted by PacerMan View Post
          He's over 50% from the floor as a true freshman.
          He can shoot plenty good enough.
          He shoots about 58% from two-point range, 30% from 3-pt range, and 69% from the line. Ohio State is quicker than most teams they play and they spread the floor, allowing him to go one on one against college defenders. His field goal percentage relies upon a lot of layups and 12 footers he won't get in the NBA. What he will get a lot of in the NBA is 18-20 foot jump shots--which he hits worse than Jamaal Tinsley could at Iowa State.

          He shoots less than two shots from 20 feet per game. He only shoots them when he is wide open, which isn't necessarily a bad thing, but these shots will be contested in the NBA. He only hits 30% of these shots. Any way you cut it, that's not good enough.

          Comment


          • #65
            Re: Oden and Conley Both Enterting the Draft

            I dunno, Tony Parker only shoots layups and he is doing pretty well for himself.
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            • #66
              Re: Oden and Conley Both Enterting the Draft

              Actually, you're right. We just need to keep the other defenders busy guarding guys. We can trade O'Neal and Granger straight up for Duncan and Ginobili. That should do it. Then we can let Conley go to the hoop.

              Comment


              • #67
                Re: Oden and Conley Both Enterting the Draft

                Noah = Horford > Oden

                we'll see tonight.
                STARBURY

                08 and Beyond

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                • #68
                  Re: Oden and Conley Both Enterting the Draft

                  For right now, I unfortunately think you're right. I see Oden committing more cheap fouls tonight due to inexperience.

                  Oden is under a pretty big microscope and I think Packer was a little unfair to him the other night. A few other guys' first year in college. Or their second year if they didn't play HS ball in the US:

                  27 mpg, 14 pts, 11 reb, 61%fg (soph)
                  37 mpg, 17 pts, 13 reb, 59%fg (soph)
                  29 mpg, 13 pts, 8 reb, 63%fg
                  28 mpg, 14 pts, 12 reb, 57%fg
                  28 mpg, 13 pts, 7 reb, 60%fg
                  26 mpg, 11 pts, 11 reb, 71%fg (soph)


                  If you're wondering, these are the players in order: Olajuwon, Duncan, Ewing, O'Neal, Mourning, and Mutombo.

                  When you look at it that way, Oden's 15 pts, 10 reb, and 61% fg in 29 minutes doesn't look too bad.

                  Comment


                  • #69
                    Re: Oden and Conley Both Enterting the Draft

                    Well NBADraft.net finally added Conley and he is currently listed as the 12th overall pick. That could certainly go up in the next few months though.

                    Why Not Us ?

                    Comment


                    • #70
                      Re: Oden and Conley Both Enterting the Draft

                      Originally posted by Robertmto View Post
                      Noah = Horford > Oden

                      we'll see tonight.


                      Too funny. Doesn't this look silly now.

                      Florida > OSU

                      BUT Oden >> Horford > Noah

                      Oden is a freshman playing against the best frontline in college basketball. Horford, Speights, Noah and Richard could not stop him.

                      BTW, Noah is an overrated wussy. Certainly he goes after Oden and Horford in the draft.

                      Comment


                      • #71
                        Re: Oden and Conley Both Enterting the Draft

                        Originally posted by ChicagoPacer View Post
                        For right now, I unfortunately think you're right. I see Oden committing more cheap fouls tonight due to inexperience.

                        Oden is under a pretty big microscope and I think Packer was a little unfair to him the other night. A few other guys' first year in college. Or their second year if they didn't play HS ball in the US:

                        27 mpg, 14 pts, 11 reb, 61%fg (soph)
                        37 mpg, 17 pts, 13 reb, 59%fg (soph)
                        29 mpg, 13 pts, 8 reb, 63%fg
                        28 mpg, 14 pts, 12 reb, 57%fg
                        28 mpg, 13 pts, 7 reb, 60%fg
                        26 mpg, 11 pts, 11 reb, 71%fg (soph)


                        If you're wondering, these are the players in order: Olajuwon, Duncan, Ewing, O'Neal, Mourning, and Mutombo.

                        When you look at it that way, Oden's 15 pts, 10 reb, and 61% fg in 29 minutes doesn't look too bad.
                        Oden's played with one hand half the season as well...and didn't even start his freshman season until several games had been played. Oden goes #1.

                        Comment


                        • #72
                          Re: Oden and Conley Both Enterting the Draft

                          Originally posted by BlueNGold View Post


                          Too funny. Doesn't this look silly now.

                          Florida > OSU

                          BUT Oden >> Horford > Noah

                          Oden is a freshman playing against the best frontline in college basketball. Horford, Speights, Noah and Richard could not stop him.

                          BTW, Noah is an overrated wussy. Certainly he goes after Oden and Horford in the draft.
                          Agreed.

                          I can't believe anyone could possibly even compare Noah to Horford let alone Oden. Oden will be a great NBA player and Horford could easily develop into one. Noah, however, wont be anything more then a 10/7 guy on any given night. He may be scrappy and he may try, but he has no offensive game at all and has no shot outside of 10 feet of the basket. Jeff Foster with an even smaller body and quite possibly less offensive potency.

                          Comment


                          • #73
                            Re: Oden and Conley Both Enterting the Draft

                            I told you all Noah was extremely overrated, and Oden was going to be a monster. I feel bad for whatever team gets suckered into drafting Noah Top 5.

                            And I would trade ANYTHING and EVERYTHING possible for Oden.

                            Comment


                            • #74
                              Re: Oden and Conley Both Enterting the Draft

                              Originally posted by Moses View Post
                              Agreed.

                              I can't believe anyone could possibly even compare Noah to Horford let alone Oden. Oden will be a great NBA player and Horford could easily develop into one. Noah, however, wont be anything more then a 10/7 guy on any given night. He may be scrappy and he may try, but he has no offensive game at all and has no shot outside of 10 feet of the basket. Jeff Foster with an even smaller body and quite possibly less offensive potency.
                              Hey now, let's not insult Jeff. Noah isn't even the defender Foster is, nor the rebounder.

                              Comment


                              • #75
                                Re: Oden and Conley Both Enterting the Draft

                                Originally posted by Robertmto View Post
                                Noah = Horford > Oden

                                we'll see tonight.
                                Sorry, Rob. I warned you about Noah, and I know you hate Oden, but he really is that good. And I don't say that lightly.

                                It may take 3-4 years for Oden to adjust to the NBA, but he's going to be dominant when he does. In 3-4 years, Noah may not even be in the league.

                                Comment

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