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Thread: So...JO with back-to-back 30+ point games...

  1. #26
    Release Psycho T pwee31's Avatar
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    Default Re: So...JO with back-to-back 30+ point games...

    Won't be JO's fault tonight... he's sadly inactive

  2. #27
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    Default Re: So...JO with back-to-back 30+ point games...

    Quote Originally Posted by pwee31 View Post
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    Won't be JO's fault tonight... he's sadly inactive
    Well that is alot of the reason the team can't gel, for some insane reason JO is the sole centerpiece of our offense. And when that goes down every other week for a few games, its going to be hard for the team to gel. Because players roles and minutes keep changing.

  3. #28
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    Default Re: So...JO with back-to-back 30+ point games...

    ARE YOU KIDDING ME!? I JUST BOUGHT SWEET TICKETS TO THE GAME ON FRI AND HE'S NOT EVEN PLAYING! IT UCKEN FIGURES! I AM SO ANGRY... I'M JUST GOING TO GO THROW SOMETHING NOW!
    "GIMMIE DAT!"-DANGER

  4. #29
    The Doctor's In The House TheDon's Avatar
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    Default Re: So...JO with back-to-back 30+ point games...

    Quote Originally Posted by Los Angeles View Post
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    I don't know why, but it really pisses me off when someone brings up how much money he makes like it's supposed to mean he should be Ben Wallace on D and Kobe Bryant on O.
    Amen

  5. #30
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    Default Re: So...JO with back-to-back 30+ point games...

    After reading several posts I'll admit I need to remove how much Jermaine is making. Obviously I was wrong in my thought process that he was making too much money for his production and I should have faith that the amount he makes will have little or no impact on other players the Pacers can look at to upgrade the team.
    You know how hippos are made out to be sweet and silly, like big cows, but are actually extremely dangerous and can kill you with stunning brutality? The Pacers are the NBA's hippos....Matt Moore CBS Sports....

  6. #31
    Cheeseburger in Paradise Los Angeles's Avatar
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    Default Re: So...JO with back-to-back 30+ point games...

    Quote Originally Posted by RWB View Post
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    After reading several posts I'll admit I need to remove how much Jermaine is making. Obviously I was wrong in my thought process that he was making too much money for his production and I should have faith that the amount he makes will have little or no impact on other players the Pacers can look at to upgrade the team.
    I've been known to lay down the sarcasm and now I finally have worthy competition.

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  7. #32

    Default Re: So...JO with back-to-back 30+ point games...

    JO's worth more than Dunleavey and Murphy.

    But serious people throw around how much he makes as something that is hurting us. Can someone tell me how it is hurting us? What trade has it kept us from making, what free agent has it kept us from signing?
    "They could turn out to be only innocent mathematicians, I suppose," muttered Woevre's section officer, de Decker.

    "'Only.'" Woevre was amused. "Someday you'll explain to me how that's possible. Seeing that, on the face of it, all mathematics leads, doesn't it, sooner or later, to some kind of human suffering."

  8. #33
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    Default Re: So...JO with back-to-back 30+ point games...

    Quote Originally Posted by RWB View Post
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    After reading several posts I'll admit I need to remove how much Jermaine is making. Obviously I was wrong in my thought process that he was making too much money for his production and I should have faith that the amount he makes will have little or no impact on other players the Pacers can look at to upgrade the team.
    You can keep having faith that his contract doesn't affect that stuff. But like any Max contract it does. And when a player is worth the contract its much easier to stomach the inflexibility in the cap because well you have an elite player. And well like 60 games of the year we have a non elite player getting paid like one. Makes it kind of hard to stomach.

  9. #34
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    Default Re: So...JO with back-to-back 30+ point games...

    Quote Originally Posted by Arcadian View Post
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    JO's worth more than Dunleavey and Murphy.

    But serious people throw around how much he makes as something that is hurting us. Can someone tell me how it is hurting us? What trade has it kept us from making, what free agent has it kept us from signing?
    Brad Miller IIRC, although that turned out to be a blessing. But thats just an example.

  10. #35

    Default Re: So...JO with back-to-back 30+ point games...

    I thought it was Reggie we overpaid that kept us from getting Brad.

    But that didn't keep us from getting Brad--the brass didn't thgink Brad was worth what the market was offering.
    "They could turn out to be only innocent mathematicians, I suppose," muttered Woevre's section officer, de Decker.

    "'Only.'" Woevre was amused. "Someday you'll explain to me how that's possible. Seeing that, on the face of it, all mathematics leads, doesn't it, sooner or later, to some kind of human suffering."

  11. #36
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    Default Re: So...JO with back-to-back 30+ point games...

    Quote Originally Posted by Los Angeles View Post
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    I've been known to lay down the sarcasm and now I finally have worthy competition.

    Not at all my friend, I usually get hammered if the other guy/gal has their hand tied behind their back. Just frustrated like everybody else and what is strange for me was the final straw was the great game JO played against Chicago.

    Simply JO kept the Pacers in that game and simply we had no one including JO that was able to hit that winning shot. For me this is what it has come down to. Your best player has to do it some how.

    Obviously we were spoiled by Reggie, but we were also spoiled by other Pacers as well. Maybe my memory is cloudy, but it seems AJ or Stephen Jackson had hit more game winners than Jermaine. I know it's not his fault and the blame rests at Donnie Walsh's feet for paying out that amount. Once again the Pacers overpaid for their own talent.

    I think my biggest problem with JO is when push came to shove he was more
    Artest than team leader. He was worried about his own game then how he could help the team when he challenged the coach early in the season.
    You know how hippos are made out to be sweet and silly, like big cows, but are actually extremely dangerous and can kill you with stunning brutality? The Pacers are the NBA's hippos....Matt Moore CBS Sports....

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    Default Re: So...JO with back-to-back 30+ point games...

    Rou are right RWB, Stephen and AJ hit several game winners and game tying shots. I can't think of any JO has hit in the last couple of years. heck hasn't granger had a couple of game winning shots.

    Arcadian thats a pretty bold statement, as in you would need insider info to back up what the brass thought.

  13. #38

    Default Re: So...JO with back-to-back 30+ point games...

    Why wouldn't you need insider info to say that the brass would have resigned Brad at that price? After all the reality is that they didn't sign Brad and that contract looks horrible now.

    Wasn't that the summer when Reggie was signed for 7 mil? At least JO got market value.
    "They could turn out to be only innocent mathematicians, I suppose," muttered Woevre's section officer, de Decker.

    "'Only.'" Woevre was amused. "Someday you'll explain to me how that's possible. Seeing that, on the face of it, all mathematics leads, doesn't it, sooner or later, to some kind of human suffering."

  14. #39
    Jimmy did what Jimmy did Bball's Avatar
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    Default Re: So...JO with back-to-back 30+ point games...

    Quote Originally Posted by Arcadian View Post
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    Why wouldn't you need insider info to say that the brass would have resigned Brad at that price? After all the reality is that they didn't sign Brad and that contract looks horrible now.

    How much does Murphy make?

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  15. #40
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    Default Re: So...JO with back-to-back 30+ point games...

    Quote Originally Posted by Naptown_Seth View Post
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    JO's salary is the same as most superstar bigs - ie the MAX. The only reason their max isn't more than his max is because of YEARS OF SERVICE. That's it. That's why KG makes more than JO and why JO makes more than Lebron.
    Good point. That is why JO makes a tiny bit more than Duncan. People forget that JO has been in the league a year longer than Duncan, despite being 2 and a half years younger than TD.

  16. #41

    Default Re: So...JO with back-to-back 30+ point games...

    Quote Originally Posted by Bball View Post
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    How much does Murphy make?

    -Bball
    Well, there you go. Even with JO's franchise killing contract we can get overpriced big men that no other team wants.
    "They could turn out to be only innocent mathematicians, I suppose," muttered Woevre's section officer, de Decker.

    "'Only.'" Woevre was amused. "Someday you'll explain to me how that's possible. Seeing that, on the face of it, all mathematics leads, doesn't it, sooner or later, to some kind of human suffering."

  17. #42
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    Default Re: So...JO with back-to-back 30+ point games...

    Quote Originally Posted by Arcadian View Post
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    Why wouldn't you need insider info to say that the brass would have resigned Brad at that price? After all the reality is that they didn't sign Brad and that contract looks horrible now.

    Wasn't that the summer when Reggie was signed for 7 mil? At least JO got market value.
    As I recall they couldn't afford it. Not they didn't want too.

    And yeah JO's contract allows us the flexibility of trading quality players(Who for the most part improved after we traded them) for useless players, who doesn't love being put in that position

  18. #43

    Default Re: So...JO with back-to-back 30+ point games...

    What player has improved? Cro, Saras, Harrington, Jackson, Artest, J Jones, FJones, AJ? I guess Primo has but the rest are pretty much the same. And it's been argued here recently that a sign of Rick's coaching ablity is shown by how much better those players were here rather than their new teams.

    If you don't like the players brought in don't blame JO. He doesn't answer GM's calls. (Although what he gets paid I don't know why he isn't. ) I don't see how you can blame JO's contract for the players we bring in. The fact is we brought in two well paid players.
    "They could turn out to be only innocent mathematicians, I suppose," muttered Woevre's section officer, de Decker.

    "'Only.'" Woevre was amused. "Someday you'll explain to me how that's possible. Seeing that, on the face of it, all mathematics leads, doesn't it, sooner or later, to some kind of human suffering."

  19. #44
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    Default Re: So...JO with back-to-back 30+ point games...

    Its not the fact that it happened like that, its the fact that is the only way in which we can bring in players. Is through trades. I would like to sign somebody in the offseason that A) we don't trade 36 games later and B) we don't use a TE for.

    Jack and Harrington are who I was speaking of. My roommate last year was a GS fan, and he says their D is better, and their scoring is about the same but their all around game like Rebs, and Assists have improved. basically the stats that are indicators of Team functionallity(sp) and effort.

  20. #45

    Default Re: So...JO with back-to-back 30+ point games...

    How much do the stats reflect the two teams styles of play rather than the players suddenly becoming better?

    The Pacers have never been big players in the free agent market. Our biggest free agent signing was Saras -- in the JO era.
    "They could turn out to be only innocent mathematicians, I suppose," muttered Woevre's section officer, de Decker.

    "'Only.'" Woevre was amused. "Someday you'll explain to me how that's possible. Seeing that, on the face of it, all mathematics leads, doesn't it, sooner or later, to some kind of human suffering."

  21. #46
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    Default Re: So...JO with back-to-back 30+ point games...

    Quote Originally Posted by Arcadian View Post
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    I thought it was Reggie we overpaid that kept us from getting Brad.
    It hurts because it's true.
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  22. #47
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    Default Re: So...JO with back-to-back 30+ point games...

    Quote Originally Posted by Los Angeles View Post
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    At the time of his signing, there was a near universal agreement that JO belonged in the same elite club as Garnett, Duncan and Shaq.
    Interesting. I don't recall anywhere near such universal agreement but perhaps I'm mistaken. In any case, I've certainly never thought of JO being in that category of star players. I've always rated him in a tier below those guys.

    Jermaine certainly puts up the production in terms of stats where you could put in a higher tier or whatnot. All I know is I've watched a lot NBA ball over the years and Jermaine is pretty damn good but I've never once really felt like I was watching a true franchise player, next level superstar. That isn't really meant as a slight towards JO as I appreciate what he has done for the Pacers. He has matured a great deal during his time here from the days when he had the "head weasal" thing going on and got punked by Kenyon Martin about one big game in the 2002 series vs NJ.

    But top tier star? Nah.

  23. #48
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    Default Re: So...JO with back-to-back 30+ point games...

    How can you say that we overpaid for Reggie, we paid him role player money and obviously he was the leader that held us together for some extent. Plus look what he was capable of during the brawl year.

    We didn't overpay him, we under used him. because this pathetic delusion our team has that the offense had to revolve around 1 person and didn't have room for 2.

  24. #49
    Headband and Rec Specs rexnom's Avatar
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    Default Re: So...JO with back-to-back 30+ point games...

    Quote Originally Posted by IMissReggie View Post
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    How can you say that we overpaid for Reggie, we paid him role player money and obviously he was the leader that held us together for some extent. Plus look what he was capable of during the brawl year.

    We didn't overpay him, we under used him. because this pathetic delusion our team has that the offense had to revolve around 1 person and didn't have room for 2.
    Role player money? Your memory is fuzzy.

    Btw, any team in the league would have given JO the max back then. Young big? Good offense? Good defense? Sign me up.

    I wouldn't call JO overpaid at all, not considering the market value for bigs in this league. It's ridiculous. Have you ever heard of Troy Murphy?

  25. #50
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    Default Re: So...JO with back-to-back 30+ point games...

    Quote Originally Posted by rexnom View Post
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    Role player money? Your memory is fuzzy.
    Check the screen name. He's not going to be impartial.

    There was no doubt by anybody in the league that Jermaine was worth the max. San Antonio would have given him the max if he didn't get it here.

    Talk about no chance for a championship... San An would have it locked up for a decade.
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