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What has gotten into young people?

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  • What has gotten into young people?


    Consider the following song lyrics:

    Originally posted by Seether
    'Cause I'm broken when I'm open
    And I don't feel like I am strong enough
    'Cause I'm broken when I'm lonesome
    And I don't feel right when you're gone away


    Originally posted by Kelly Clarkson
    I hate myself for losing you
    I'm seeing it all so clear
    I hate myself for losing you
    What do you do when you look in the mirror
    And staring at you is why he's not here?

    I hate myself for losing you
    And oh, I don't know what to do
    Not sure that I'll pull through
    I wish you knew
    And oh, I don't know what to say
    And I don't know anyway
    Anymore
    No, no



    Originally posted by The Doors
    Wow, people, get up and dance
    The new day's comin', it's the end of the trance
    No need to worry, no need to hide
    Ev'rybody is on the same side



    Originally posted by Jefferson Airplane
    Look what’s happening out in the streets
    Got a revolution got to revolution
    Hey I’m dancing down the streets
    Got a revolution got to revolution
    Ain’t it amazing all the people I meet
    Got a revolution got to revolution
    One generation got old
    One generation got soul
    This generation got no destination to hold
    Pick up the cry
    Hey now its time for you and me
    Got a revolution got to revolution
    Come on now were marching to the sea
    Got a revolution got to revolution
    Who will take it from you
    We will and who are we
    We are volunteers of America

    Notice the difference between the first two (currently popular) artists, and the latter two from the '60s?

    The more I hear the stuff my teenaged daughter listens to, the more I'm astonished at the self-loathing that permeates most of today's teen music.

    A generation ago, teens were angry and their music pointed the finger straight at the man.

    In today's lyrics, teens are still angry, but they pretty consistently blame themselves and express no hope of any change for the better.

    What is going on?
    And I won't be here to see the day
    It all dries up and blows away
    I'd hang around just to see
    But they never had much use for me
    In Levelland. (James McMurtry)

  • #2
    Re: What has gotten into young people?

    October, 1975

    Originally Posted by Freddie Mercury
    Too late my time has come
    Sends shivers down my spine
    Body's aching all the time
    Goodbye everybody - I've got to go
    Gotta leave you all behind and face the truth
    Mama ooh (Anyway the wind blows...)
    I don't want to die
    I sometimes wish I'd never been born at all
    Originally Posted by Jimi Hendrix
    I don't live today

    Will I live tomorrow?
    Well, I just can't say
    Will I live tomorrow?
    Well, I just can't say
    But I know for sure
    I don't live today
    No sun comin' through my windows
    Feel like I'm livin' at the bottom of a grave
    No-ho sun comin' through my windows
    Feel like I'm livin' at the bottom of a grave
    I wish you'd hurry up and rescue me
    So I can be on my miserable way
    (Well), I don't
    Live today
    Maybe tomorrow, I just can't say, but, uh
    I don't
    Live today
    It's such a shame to waste your time away like this
    Existing
    Well, uh-I don't
    Live today

    Originally Posted by Kelly Clarkson

    When Miss Independent walked away
    No time for love that came her way
    She looked in the mirror and thought today
    What happened to miss no longer afraid?
    It took some time for her to see
    How beautiful love could truly be
    No more talk of why can't that be me
    I'm so glad I finally see...

    What is this feelin' takin' over?
    Thinkin' no one could open the door
    Surprise (surprise), it's time (yeah)
    To feel (to feel) what's real
    What happened to Miss Independent?
    No longer need to be defensive
    Goodbye (goodbye), old you
    When love, when love is true...

    Miss Independent
    [B
    Originally Posted by Kelly Clarkson[/B]

    I'll spread my wings and I'll learn how to fly
    I'll do what it takes til' I touch the sky
    I'll make a wish
    Take a chance
    Make a change
    And breakaway
    Out of the darkness and into the sun
    But I won't forget all the ones that I loved
    I'll take a risk
    Take a chance
    Make a change
    And breakaway


    Wanna feel the warm breeze
    Sleep under a palm tree
    Feel the rush of the ocean
    Get onboard a fast train
    Travel on a jet plane, far away (I will)
    And breakaway
    Originally Posted by John Mayer

    Me and all my friends
    We're all misunderstood
    They say we stand for nothing and
    There's no way we ever could
    Now we see everything is going wrong
    With the world and those who lead it
    We just feel like we don't have the means
    To rise above and beat it

    So we keep waiting (waiting)
    Waiting on the world to change
    We keep on waiting (waiting)
    Waiting on the world to change
    It?s hard to beat the system
    When we're standing at a distance
    So we keep waiting (waiting)
    Waiting on the world to change

    Now if we had the power
    To bring our neighbors home from war
    They would have never missed a Christmas
    No more ribbons on their door
    When you trust your television
    What you get is what you got
    ?Cuz? when they own the information ooohhh,
    They can bend it all they want
    Originally Posted by Green Day

    Don't want to be an American idiot.
    Don't want a nation under the new media.
    And can you hear the sound of hysteria?
    The subliminal mind******* America.

    Welcome to a new kind of tension.
    All across the alien nation.
    Everything isn't meant to be okay.
    Television dreams of tomorrow.
    We're not the ones who're meant to follow.
    Well that's enough to argue.

    Well maybe I'm the *********America.
    I'm not a part of a redneck agenda.
    Now everybody do the propaganda.
    And sing along in the age of paranoia.

    Why Not Us ?

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: What has gotten into young people?

      Frank, I think you are suggesting examples that contradict my point; songs of hopelessness from a generation ago and contemporary songs that have some ambition to them. I'm not sure what you intend, though, since you don't say anything, and also because some of your examples contradict my argument and one affirms it. The John Mayer song is another one I thought of using to make my point.

      Originally posted by John Mayer
      Now we see everything is going wrong
      With the world and those who lead it
      We just feel like we don't have the means
      To rise above and beat it

      Grace Slick's message was, "We can." John Mayer's message is, "We can't."

      Obviously there will always be all kinds of messages floating around in popular culture, and I'm not claiming that every song used to be an anthem of change and no song today is that.

      I'm saying that there is a strong thread of self-loathing in today's music that was almost totally lacking in the '60s and '70s. Or look at punk lyrics from the early '80s. Those are about anger and hate, but the anger is focused outward, not inward.

      I don't know the Green Day song. Is it just saying, "This sucks!" or is it saying, "We can make this better?" That is the distinction I'm asking about.
      And I won't be here to see the day
      It all dries up and blows away
      I'd hang around just to see
      But they never had much use for me
      In Levelland. (James McMurtry)

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: What has gotten into young people?

        Originally Posted by Bob Sinclair *2006*

        Why must our children play in the streets,
        broken hearts and faded dreams,
        listen um to everyone that you meet,
        don't you worry, it could be so sweet,
        just look to the rainbow, you will see,
        sun will shine 'till eternity,
        I've got for much love in my heart,
        no one can tear it apart,
        Yeah.

        Feel the love generation,
        Yeah, yeah, yeah,
        Feel the love generation,
        C'mon c'mon c'mon c'mon yeah

        I can definitely understand where Putnam is coming from as most of the songs that is "popular" is usually playing the emotional card - but instead of pointing the blame on anyone else...they're eating themselves alive.
        Of course this isn't the case in every scenario - as pointed out from the lyrics above...I guess TEENS these day feel like they relate to those songs more so than anything else.

        I'm 24 and I went through that period during my teenage years where I was listening to songs with similar messages *i.e. pushing people away; losing hope; broken dreams; etc* but it wasn't THAT 24/7....It was just depending on my mood...

        which makes me wonder - does music dictate our mood...or does our mood dictate the music?

        these days I'm listening to music whenever possible - and noticed how its usually more upbeat than anything else...there is enough drama in the rest of the world...I need something positive to charge up.

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: What has gotten into young people?

          "Well I know it wasnt you who held me down
          Heaven knows it wasnt you who set me free
          So often times it happens that we live our lives in chains
          And we never even know we have the key

          But me, Im already gone"
          - The Eagles


          "You dont know me but Im your brother
          I was raised here in this living hell
          You dont know my kind in your world
          Fairly soon the time will tell
          You, telling me the things youre gonna do for me
          I aint blind and I dont like what I think I see

          Takin it to the streets

          Take this message to my brother
          You will find him everywhere
          Wherever people live together
          Tied in poverty's despair
          You, telling me the things you're gonna do for me
          I aint blind and I dont like what I think I see

          Takin it to the streets"
          - The Doobie Brothers


          POWER TO THE PEOPLE!

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: What has gotten into young people?

            Thanks bellisimo and LoneGranger 33.

            To respond to bellisimo's question, I am pretty sure the influence goes in both directions. If you play music yourself, you can play yourself out of a bad mood, or you can indulge it and put the instrument away feeling worse than when you started.

            I'm not sure what to make of LG's additions, since they came from the '70s, which was a distinct time that was not as extreme as either period we're talking about. (The '70s was my era, and I'm not at all nostalgic.)

            My daughter and I have a theory. The baby boomers were the children of the people who had just won world war 2 and made the world safe. Their parents gave them confidence that they could do anything. Then a lot of bad stuff (Vietnam, Watergate, energy crisis, Iran hostage crisis, Reagan, Challenger disaster, etc.) happened, and the new conclusion was that we sometimes lose. Now the Baby Boomers are passing a lot of pessimism to Gen X and Gen Y. So, allowing for a lot of differences, the general tone today is less confident and less hopeful today than it was. Does this make sense?

            Take the most extreme example. At Woodstock, Country Joe got the crowd to spell out, "F, U, C, K," and then he admonished them to get louder with, "How do you expect to stop the war if you don't yell any louder than that?"

            Well, it is utterly ridiculous to suppose spelling out a cuss word, however loudly, could stop a war. But I believe there was an underlying confidence among those kids that they were going to stop the war, and that whatever they did at any time could contribute to the effort.

            Today we've got John Mayer, saying, "Now if we had the power to bring our neighbors home from war." I know the song is ironic, but the reason it is a good song is that kids really think that way. (You can't parody something that doesn't exist.)

            I think the values of teens then and now are a lot the same, but the attitude is a lot difference.
            And I won't be here to see the day
            It all dries up and blows away
            I'd hang around just to see
            But they never had much use for me
            In Levelland. (James McMurtry)

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: What has gotten into young people?

              it also has a lot to do with the mentality of the song writer...
              just another example:

              Originally Posted by EMINEM

              Come along follow me as I lead through the darkness
              As I provide just enough spark that we need to proceed
              Carry on, give me hope, give me strength
              Come with me and I won't steer you wrong
              Put your faith and your trust as I guide us through the fog
              To the light at the end of the tunnel
              We gonna fight, we gonna charge, we gonna stomp, we gonna march
              Through the swamp, we gonna mosh through the marsh
              Take us right through the doors (c'mon)

              All the people up top on the side and the middle
              Come together lets all bomb and swamp just a little
              Just let it gradually build from the front to the back
              All you can see is a sea of people some white and some black
              Don't matter what color, all that matters we gathered together
              To celebrate for the same cause don't matter the weather
              If it rains let it rain, yea the wetter the better
              They ain't gonna stop us they can't, we stronger now more than ever
              They tell us no we say yea, they tell us stop we say go
              Rebel with a rebel yell, raise hell we gonna let em know
              Stomp, push, shove, mush, Bush, until they bring our troops home (c'mon)

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: What has gotten into young people?

                Originally posted by Putnam View Post
                Frank, I think you are suggesting examples that contradict my point; songs of hopelessness from a generation ago and contemporary songs that have some ambition to them. I'm not sure what you intend, though, since you don't say anything, and also because some of your examples contradict my argument and one affirms it. The John Mayer song is another one I thought of using to make my point.




                Grace Slick's message was, "We can." John Mayer's message is, "We can't."

                Obviously there will always be all kinds of messages floating around in popular culture, and I'm not claiming that every song used to be an anthem of change and no song today is that.

                I'm saying that there is a strong thread of self-loathing in today's music that was almost totally lacking in the '60s and '70s. Or look at punk lyrics from the early '80s. Those are about anger and hate, but the anger is focused outward, not inward.

                I don't know the Green Day song. Is it just saying, "This sucks!" or is it saying, "We can make this better?" That is the distinction I'm asking about.
                i really think you're missing the point with the john mayer song. i don't think mayer is saying "we can't" i think its more of a call-to-arms by saying "we aren't" ... in fact, first time i heard mayer's song, i wondered if it was kind of this generation's "Whats Going On"

                and those are real generalizations about the tone of current music. theres is self-loathing, sure. its part of a movement of music (emo, scremo, etc.) just like the folk movement of the 60s and early 70s. just like the late 60s was about a psychedelic movement. and the 80s had new wave and punk. frankly, you want to talk about self-loathing, listen to a few depeche mode albums, they've been specializing in self-loathing and depression to music since the mid 80s (long after "Just Can't Get Enough") and they've also mastered outward loathing too. tears for fears debut album "The Hurting" was all about their experiences in primal scream therapy. it was pretty dark and self-loathing. both were part of the new wave movement along with Duran Duran and hundreds of other bands that never lasted. but they it didn't mean they all sounded the same or were all self-loathing or overwhelmingly positive. tears for fears went on to write "Shout" (another primal scream song but also protest song) "Everybody Wants to Rule the World" (cold war protest song), "Sowing the Seeds of Love" (political pop song), etc... so they grew as artists and their entire repotoire isn't self-loathing or depressing (as a sidenote, TFF's 2004 album "Everybody Loves a Happy Ending" is fantastic. sort of McCartney-ish pop... 1989's "Seeds of Love" is more Lennon-esque for what its worth)

                "Personal Jesus" (Depeche Mode -1990)

                Your own personal Jesus
                Someone to hear your prayers, someone who cares
                Your own personal Jesus
                Someone to hear your prayers, someone who's there

                Feeling unknown and you're all alone
                Flesh and bone, by the telephone
                Lift up the receiver I'll make you a believer
                Take second best, put me to the test
                Things on your chest you need to confess
                I will deliver you know I'm a forgiver
                Reach out and touch faith


                "Mad World" (Tears For Fears -1983)

                All around me are familiar faces
                Worn out places, worn out faces
                Bright and early for their daily races
                Going nowhere, going nowhere

                And their tears are filling up their glasses
                No expression, no expression
                Hide my head I want to drown my sorrow
                No tommorow, no tommorow

                And I find it kind of funny, I find it kind of sad
                The dreams in which I'm dying are the best I've ever had
                I find it hard to tell you 'cos I find it hard to take
                When people run in circles it's a very, very mad world
                but theres plenty that is outward anger in recent music too like "american idiot" or take the song "megalomaniac" by incubus...

                I hear you on the radio
                You permeate my screen
                It's unkind but
                If I met you in a scissor fight
                I'd cut off both your wings
                On principle alone, on principle alone

                Hey megalomaniac, You're no Jesus
                Yeah, you're no *******ing Elvis
                Wash your hands clean of yourself baby
                Step down, step down

                If I were your appendages
                I'd hold open your eyes
                So you would see
                That all of us are heaven sent
                There was never meant to be only one
                To be only one

                Hey megalomaniac, You're no Jesus
                Yeah, you're no *******ing Elvis
                Wash your hands clean of yourself baby
                Step down, step down
                Abandoned Pools has both self-loathing and outward-loathing down pretty well

                "Fluorescein" (2001)

                Wipe away the summer air
                You don't wanna see
                That's you in that Photograph from 1973
                And you don't even know me

                God only Knows I wanna be
                The other side of misery
                Gimme a plate of Fluorescein
                I'm gonna paint an ugly scene
                All of the things I wanna say
                Can't get a word out anyway
                Falling away after today
                Nothing to lose so come what may
                Don't wake me

                You got away from me somehow
                And all we tried to be
                Everything is different now
                The mind's eye fails to see
                And all we know is TV


                "Armed to the Teeth" (2005)

                I am armed to the teeth, you can't hold me down
                I've turned seething into a hobby
                Why is god out to get us? Can't we just be friends?
                I feel a twinge of righteousness, like a corporate hedonist

                Armed to the teeth, I'm ready
                Go out and spend your money
                Giants of industry come on and try to eat me
                Armed to the teeth, I'm ready

                What century are you living in
                An ancient puzzle piece that won't fit in
                You want artists that are more positive? Try India Arie. Collective Soul. Dave Matthews. Ben Folds isn't self-loathing, he isn't really angry either. somewhere in between.

                "Better Now" (Collective Soul - 2004)

                Oh I'm newly calibrated
                All shiny and clean
                I'm your recent adaptation
                Time to redefine me

                Let the word out I've got to get out
                Oh I'm feeling better now
                Break the news out I've got to get out
                Oh I'm feeling better now

                The world's done shaking
                The world's done shaking
                The world's done shaking me down
                i just think its a movement of music, but its not an accurate generalization. its like saying that theres so much more rap than there used to be in the 60s. or how music is so much louder now (but then you point to people like damien rice, norah jones, corrine bailey rae who are basking in minimalism or you look back at Led Zeppelin and the Who as really loud bands from the 70s). lyric writing has changed as an artform over the decades. songwriting has evolved and its not overwhelmingly colored by one mood or another.

                besides self-loathing isn't new in music (see genre: blues). even the beatles (see songs: Yer Blues, I'm a Loser). it has now taken a new form

                i guess the point is, just because artists don't always say "Go out there and give 'em hell" like people in the 60s and 70s, im not sure if they need to. the information is out there, it is much more available than it once was. there are messageboards for fans from all over the world that like the pacers to discuss changing trends in music. things change so do artistic movements. it doesn't mean there is anything wrong with 'young people' (i guess i should mention i turn 23 in a few weeks for full disclosure). in the 60s, there had never been a giant movement to challenge that type of authority (government, social institutions, etc) and artists led the war cry. but we've already had that movement, do artists really need to be doing the same things? does john mayer need to repeat the same ideas that grace slick did (i have yet to hear mayer use alice in wonderland metaphors for drug usage but i'll keep my ears open)?

                also, and this is just my own personal opinion, i don't believe that seether is going to be placed in some time capsule and cherished 20 years from now.
                This is the darkest timeline.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: What has gotten into young people?

                  Originally posted by Putnam View Post
                  I'm not sure what to make of LG's additions, since they came from the '70s, which was a distinct time that was not as extreme as either period we're talking about. (The '70s was my era, and I'm not at all nostalgic.)
                  I'm a young person (21 as of last Saturday) and just goes to show that the music that speaks to me most is from a different era. So, I think I'm in agreement with you Putnam. I also have problems with today's music not because it doesn't inspire us for good, but quite the opposite - teaches poor values (chauvinism, materialism, foul language, **** like that...) Let me add on the following, because I like these songs too:

                  "And the men who hold high places
                  Must be the ones to start
                  To mould a new reality
                  Closer to the heart"
                  - Rush



                  "When I was young, it seemed that life was so wonderful,
                  a miracle, oh it was beautiful, magical.
                  And all the birds in the trees, well they'd be singing so happily,
                  joyfully, playfully watching me.
                  But then they send me away to teach me how to be sensible,
                  logical, responsible, practical.
                  And they showed me a world where I could be so dependable,
                  clinical, intellectual, cynical.

                  There are times when all the world's asleep,
                  The questions run too deep for such a simple man
                  Won't you please, please tell me what we've learned
                  I know it sounds absurd but please tell me who I am...

                  Now watch what you say or they'll be calling you a radical,
                  liberal, fanatical, criminal.
                  Won't you sign up your name, we'd like to feel you're
                  acceptable, respectable, presentable, a vegetable!
                  At night, when all the world's asleep,
                  The questions run so deep for such a simple man
                  Won't you please, please tell me what we've learned
                  I know it sounds absurd but please tell me who I am"
                  - Supertramp


                  Let us not be just another brick in the wall!

                  IMO - the '60s generation of young people transformed the world, mostly for the better, but that work is far from complete. I'm not sure if any artist today (save for possibly U2, one of my favorite bands) inspires us the way a Bob Dylan or John Lennon could.

                  Also, the Who is the loudest band ever. And they were pretty damn good to boot. Baba O'Riley has to be the best song ever. Just my opinion.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: What has gotten into young people?

                    Well, it seems like other don't see the issue as clearly as it appears to me. It isn't always easy to see a general trend among diverse instandces. And you are telling mne that I may be connecting dots the wrong way and gettin a picture that isn't really there. OK. Thanks to everyone for their thoughts and the examples they posted.

                    There was another high school suicide in the North Putnam school district this week. (Just thought I'd mention that. It may not be important.)

                    Originally posted by avoidingtheclowns
                    besides self-loathing isn't new in music (see genre: blues).
                    Now you're on my grounds. I'm an absolute blues freak. Hardly any blues expresses self-loathing. There is a lot of celebratory "Sat'idy night fish fry" kind of blues, but even the remorseful blues tends to put the blame on those "evil-hearted women." Or else it expresses more of a determination to cope with quiet dignity rather than to despise oneself. In the following example, there is a long list of hardship, but the singer knows its not his fault, and he knows he'll get through it all. It is the opposite of self-loathing.


                    Originally posted by B.B. King
                    Everybody wants to know
                    Why I sing the blues
                    Yes, I say everybody wanna know
                    Why I sing the blues
                    Well, I've been around a long time
                    I really have paid my dues

                    When I first got the blues
                    They brought me over on a ship
                    Men were standing over me
                    And a lot more with a whip
                    And everybody wanna know
                    Why I sing the blues
                    Well, I've been around a long time
                    Mm, I've really paid my dues

                    I've laid in a ghetto flat
                    Cold and numb
                    I heard the rats tell the bedbugs
                    To give the roaches some
                    Everybody wanna know
                    Why I'm singing the blues
                    Yes, I've been around a long time
                    People, I've paid my dues

                    I stood in line
                    Down at the County Hall
                    I heard a man say, "We're gonna build
                    Some new apartments for y'all"
                    And everybody wanna know
                    Yes, they wanna know
                    Why I'm singing the blues
                    Yes, I've been around a long, long time
                    Yes, I've really, really paid my dues

                    Now I'm gonna play Lucille.

                    My kid's gonna grow up
                    Gonna grow up to be a fool
                    'Cause they ain't got no more room
                    No more room for him in school
                    And everybody wanna know
                    Everybody wanna know
                    Why I'm singing the blues
                    I say I've been around a long time
                    Yes, I've really paid some dues

                    Yeah, you know the company told me
                    Guess you're born to lose
                    Everybody around me, people
                    It seems like everybody got the blues
                    But I had 'em a long time
                    I've really, really paid my dues
                    You know I ain't ashamed of it, people
                    I just love to sing my blues

                    I walk through the cities, people
                    On my bare feet
                    I had a fill of catfish and chitterlings
                    Up and down Beal Street
                    You know I'm singing the blues
                    Yes, I really
                    I just have to sing my blues
                    I've been around a long time
                    People, I've really, really paid my dues

                    Now Father Time is catching up with me
                    Gone is my youth
                    I look in the mirror everyday
                    And let it tell me the truth
                    I'm singing the blues
                    Mm, I just have to sing the blues
                    I've been around a long time
                    Yes, yes, I've really paid some dues

                    Yeah, they told me everything
                    Would be better out in the country
                    Everything was fine
                    I caught me a bus uptown, baby
                    And every people, all the people
                    Got the same trouble as mine
                    I got the blues, huh huh
                    I say I've been around a long time
                    I've really paid some dues

                    One more time, fellows!

                    Blind man on the corner
                    Begging for a dime
                    The rollers come and caught him
                    And throw him in the jail for a crime
                    I got the blues
                    Mm, I'm singing my blues
                    I've been around a long time
                    Mm, I've really paid some dues

                    Can we do just one more?

                    Oh I thought I'd go down to the welfare
                    To get myself some grits and stuff
                    But a lady stand up and she said
                    "You haven't been around long enough"
                    That's why I got the blues
                    Mm, the blues
                    I say, I've been around a long time
                    I've really, really paid my dues

                    Fellows, tell them one more time.

                    Ha, ha, ha. That's all right, fellows.
                    Yeah!
                    And I won't be here to see the day
                    It all dries up and blows away
                    I'd hang around just to see
                    But they never had much use for me
                    In Levelland. (James McMurtry)

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: What has gotten into young people?

                      I think I've got the missing link for you guys. The current mood for artists is often referred to as "emo", which stands for emotional. Obviously, some performers/groups exhibit this trait more than others, but it's a common theme, and as that's what sells records, that's what gets made. The genre is typically self-loathing, and more importantly, focuses on negative emotions such as anger and loathing, which can be expressed either internally or externally. Keep in mind, the pioneer of this genre of music was The Cure, and they've been around for a while

                      The question is: Is this life imitating Art, or Art imitating Life? I think in this case, it's Art imitating Life. I have a strong feeling that the current fad of self-loathing has a strong connection to September 11, 2001. The kids who are the primary demographic for music are roughly 12-22, which would have made that age group 7-17 when the terrorism happened. Notice that they were all kids? I think the attacks had a far more profound effect on the younger kids who weren't old enough to cope with their feelings, and are now faced with something similar to PTSD.

                      Sound like a good explanation to you guys? Cause that's all I got.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: What has gotten into young people?

                        I don't know how seriously I take it, but I think it is watered down existentialist art that has caught up with pop culture. For instance The Cure had a song "Killing an Arab" inspired by The Stranger and Nine Inch Nails' Downward Spiral draws from Nausea. Today, I think bands are more inspired by the afore mentioned bands than the existentialist.

                        So, yeah, I blame Europe.
                        "They could turn out to be only innocent mathematicians, I suppose," muttered Woevre's section officer, de Decker.

                        "'Only.'" Woevre was amused. "Someday you'll explain to me how that's possible. Seeing that, on the face of it, all mathematics leads, doesn't it, sooner or later, to some kind of human suffering."

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: What has gotten into young people?

                          Originally posted by Eindar View Post
                          I think I've got the missing link for you guys. The current mood for artists is often referred to as "emo", which stands for emotional. Obviously, some performers/groups exhibit this trait more than others, but it's a common theme, and as that's what sells records, that's what gets made. The genre is typically self-loathing, and more importantly, focuses on negative emotions such as anger and loathing, which can be expressed either internally or externally. Keep in mind, the pioneer of this genre of music was The Cure, and they've been around for a while

                          The question is: Is this life imitating Art, or Art imitating Life? I think in this case, it's Art imitating Life. I have a strong feeling that the current fad of self-loathing has a strong connection to September 11, 2001. The kids who are the primary demographic for music are roughly 12-22, which would have made that age group 7-17 when the terrorism happened. Notice that they were all kids? I think the attacks had a far more profound effect on the younger kids who weren't old enough to cope with their feelings, and are now faced with something similar to PTSD.

                          Sound like a good explanation to you guys? Cause that's all I got.
                          Props, eindar. I think you are right, even with the link to The Cure!

                          My daughter listens to a lot of Evanscence, which is just what you describe. There is some debate over whether Amy Lee is a Goth emo, or an Emo goth, but she sure is honked off about something!
                          And I won't be here to see the day
                          It all dries up and blows away
                          I'd hang around just to see
                          But they never had much use for me
                          In Levelland. (James McMurtry)

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: What has gotten into young people?

                            I must agree with Putnam here that the blues is certainly not self-loathing, in fact it is what is early on used as protest song, in which later the folk became instrumental (mix of).

                            I also agree that there was definitely more "message" in the music of the 60/70 period (I would even add 50's to that) then today, after the "empty" 80's and the "ego-driven" 90's I have a feeling that this era is mostly characterized by money driven ideas then anything else.

                            Every tv-show becomes a contest, with big bucks for the winner and a lot of shouting and coming down hard on the losers: "sign of the times".

                            So close to "black awareness month" (I think it's called that, sorry; ignorant Euro here) it is almost funny to quote this song, written in '49 and finally recorded in France in '51 (no one in the USA dared touching it):

                            Big Bill Broonzy:

                            This little song that I'm singin' about,
                            People, you all know that it's true,
                            If you're black and gotta work for livin',
                            Now, this is what they will say to you,
                            They says: "If you was white,
                            You's alright,
                            If you was brown,
                            Stick around,
                            But if you's black, oh, brother,
                            Get back, get back, get back."

                            I was in a place one night,
                            They was all havin' fun,
                            They was all buyin' beer and wine,
                            But they would not sell me none.
                            They said: "If you was white,
                            You's alright,
                            If you was brown,
                            You could stick around,
                            But as you's black, hmm, hmm, brother,
                            Get back, get back, get back."

                            I went to an employment office,
                            I got a number and I got in line,
                            They called everybody's number,
                            But they never did call mine.
                            They said: "If you was white,
                            You's alright,
                            If you was brown,
                            You could stick around,
                            But as you's black, hmm, hmm, brother,
                            Get back, get back, get back."

                            Me and a man was workin' side by side,
                            Now, this is what it meant:
                            They was payin' him a dollar an hour,
                            And they was payin' me fifty cent.
                            They said: "If you was white,
                            You'd be alright,
                            If you was brown,
                            You could stick around,
                            But as you's black, oh, brother,
                            Get back, get back, get back."

                            I helped build this country
                            and i fought for it too
                            Now I guess that you can see
                            What a black man have to do
                            They said: "If you was white,
                            You'd be alright,
                            If you was brown,
                            You could stick around,
                            But as you's black, oh, brother,
                            Get back, get back, get back.

                            I helped win sweet victories,
                            With my plow and hoe,
                            Now, I want you to tell me, brother,
                            What you gonna do 'bout the old Jim Crow?
                            Now, if you is white,
                            You's alright,
                            If you's brown,
                            Stick around,
                            But if you's black, oh, brother,
                            Get back, get back, get back.
                            So Long And Thanks For All The Fish.

                            If you've done 6 impossible things today?
                            Then why not have Breakfast at Milliways!

                            Comment

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