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Thread: Its Time To Move Jeff Foster

  1. #1
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    Default Its Time To Move Jeff Foster

    I know that I will take much abuse from this post but when you step back and look at really how valuable Foster is you can see why they need to trade him.

    First I like Jeffs work ethic, he hustles, rebounds and for the most part runs the floor fairly well. On the other hand he can't hit open shots from 5 feet out. Is a terrible free throw shooter, and commits way to many stupid fouls.

    On a team that is now being shaped very slowly Jeff Foster is now a luxury, not an asset. When Jeff is in the game the Pacers are forced to play 5 on 4 on the offensive end. That being said zone defenses are now the norm as more teams are just challanging the Pacers to shoot it. The PAcers as a team, especially with the new players, are not shooting the mid range jumper with ANY consistancy.

    Now I know many of you will say...but Jeff doesn't get in any trouble or hurt you on the defensive end... Jeff on the defensive end does hurt us, I could be wrong, but Jeff may lead the Pacers in fouls as a player is shooting...basket good, free throw good...three point play the hard way for the Pacers opponets. Honestly I've seen O'Neal and Tinsley make the same MISTAKES with that pretty consistantly...O'Neal at Detroit on Sheed and Tinsley against the Warriors the other night.

    Jeff Foster is what he is. He is NEVER going to develop a consistant jumper or he would have. His offensive boards are only a plus if we convert on the offensive end after he gets one. Honestly the PAcers are one of the poorest executing teams in the NBA....the only saving grace is that there are a ton of poor executing teams in the NBA....some just have better shooters.

    I am all for moving Foster in any trade that will get this team a better then average point guard...Mike Bibby comes to mind, or a better shooter...Mike Miller comes to mind.

    The art of the mid range jumper is all but dead, save Rip Hamilton, None of the Pacers shoot the ball with any consistancy from mid range. The Pacers need that more then anything to be a better mid range shooting team.

    I do feel that Jeff will be traded only becasue we have to include him to get rid of someone that we don't want to keep.

    Lets Blow this Sucker UP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  2. #2
    Rebound King Kstat's Avatar
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    Default Re: Its Time To Move Jeff Foster

    The term "luxury" implies that he's somehow redundant or irrelevant.

    Care to explain to me how it's his fault that Oneal and Tinsley can't make shots?

    So, the Pacers don't need 2nd chances because they can't convert them anyway?

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  3. #3
    Administrator Unclebuck's Avatar
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    Default Re: Its Time To Move Jeff Foster

    No, it isn't time to move Jeff. He's the type of player that once he is traded almost everyone will within a few weeks will be begging to get him back.

    One of the Pacers biggest problems is their lack of energy players and as much as I like Dun, Murph and Ike - those players are not energy players at all.

    I worry about Ike's defense I saw somethings last night that was almost David Harrison like - very concerning to me. So I hope we aren't too eager trade Jeff

  4. #4

    Default Re: Its Time To Move Jeff Foster

    I, like many, love the way Foster gives everything he has, but he's blocking the future bigs of this team. Ike and Harrison need a chance to show what they can do. Foster can help get us some backcourt depth and also be packaged with JT, if Tinsley is moved.

    UB: How would you feel if Foster was included in a deal that netted us Earl Watson?

  5. #5

    Default Re: Its Time To Move Jeff Foster

    I agree with this, if there is no plan to move O'neil then they should move Jeff. Tins/Jeff for another PG. In the off-season aquire a better backup pg and someone than can actually shoot the darn ball at either the starting or backup 2. Our guard play must be revamped. It is simply amazing to me
    how bad our guard play is. Danny is a nice player, but would be much better off at the 3. Dunleavy is Ok but should be someone off the bench not a starter. 3 players, 2PG's and a 2 and I would really like this team.

  6. #6

    Default Re: Its Time To Move Jeff Foster

    Foster stays!

    Tinsley is the one who needs to go, and maybe JO in the summer too!
    Maceo Baston's #1 fan on Pacers Digest!

  7. #7

    Default Re: Its Time To Move Jeff Foster

    No it's not time to trade Jeff. We need him more than ever now.

    We need his energy like UB said. Really, Jeff and DA are the only energy players on this team. Jeff is a veteran at a fair price who knows his role and does it well. We need his defense. He can guard Duncan and Dirk as good as anyone in the league, IMO.

    If we could get rid of Tinsley, you might move Jeff but it would be very tough. He would be hard to deal.

    If you want to blow this sucker up, well it's already been blown up. But if you really want to start over than trade Jermaine. That would be about the only thing left to do in order to blow this thing up. I'm not to eager to trade Jermaine, although re building seemed tempting before.

  8. #8

    Default Re: Its Time To Move Jeff Foster

    Obviously, we shouldn't be looking to dump Foster. But with O'Neal, Baston, Murphy, Diogu, Foster, and Harrison all playing the same two positions, we should be looking to move one or two of them to reinforce the backcourt. Because of his age, contract, and lack of offensice game, Foster is a prime candidate.

    I would love it if a team bit on Harrison or Baston, but that's unlikely. If O'Neal could next us a future star, a #1 pick, and cap space, you have to consider it, but not even AI could net that. So Foster seems like the logical guy.

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    Member Isaac's Avatar
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    Default Re: Its Time To Move Jeff Foster

    Smash, how does Jeff hurt us on defense? Jeff is a very good defender.

  10. #10
    Tyrant maragin's Avatar
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    Default Re: Its Time To Move Jeff Foster

    Foster's FG% has greatly improved over what he was shooting earlier this year. In Jan/ Feb he's shooting just under 60% from the field, and well over his career for FT%. For the year he trails only Baston and Harrison in field goal percentage.

    Tangent: Baston has the second highest dunking percentage in the NBA-
    The top five (minimum: 10 dunks): Tyrus Thomas, 30 of 51 (59%); Maceo Baston, 17 of 32 (53%); Dwight Howard, 138 of 294 (47%); Erick Dampier, 67 of 144 (47%); Solomon Jones, 13 of 29 (45%).

    Criticism of Foster's shooting might be that he only takes high percentage shots, but that's what we'd want out of him. I've seen several complaints about his inability to put the ball in the bucket, but stats and the games I've watched tell a different story.

    He's stayed healthy, cleaned the glass like windex, and been a model team player. We have a logjam at the 4-5 position, but Foster isn't the problem.

  11. #11

    Default Re: Its Time To Move Jeff Foster

    Here's a deal that I think would really interest both teams:

    We trade Tinsley, Foster, and S. Williams to SAC for Bibby. (Giving up on Williams this early would be the tough one. However, Granger will be ahead of him for a long time. Also we have Dunleavy and Daniels to fill out the 2/3 rotation.)

    Bibby is only 29 and he'd give us a PG that can shoot deliver in the clutch. A change of scenery would really help get his career back on track. I think playing with Ron-Ron has drained him. I know I have defended Tinsley, but I do agree that if can upgrade the PG postion and free up more minutes for Ike then we should do it. This meets both of those requirements.

  12. #12

    Default Re: Its Time To Move Jeff Foster

    Quote Originally Posted by maragin View Post
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    Foster isn't the problem.


    I think most people aren't saying that he is. But his value plus the fact that we can absorb his loss to me means that trading him might help the team in the long run.

    I see it being similar to the Dale Davis situation in 2000. He was valuable, but in the long run Jermaine O'Neal was more valuable to us. I hope we can trade Foster for a young PG/SG who would be of similar value to us.

    The fact that Pacer fans have a very hard time even thinking of letting him go indicates that he would be valuable in trade talks.

  13. #13

    Default Re: Its Time To Move Jeff Foster

    Hey guys, stop considering Harrison an option or even a future talent. This is his 3rd year in NBA and he did not improved AT ALL since he started. Same knuklehead, wild, foul prone, terrible FT shooter.
    But I do agree that Murphy does everything Foster does, only better (except maybe offensive rebounds).
    And DaSMASH, have you watched Bulls? They are in my opinion the best jump shooting team in the NBA. They stop on fast break at 15 feet to take the jump shot!

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    Default Re: Its Time To Move Jeff Foster

    Quote Originally Posted by Kstat View Post
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    The term "luxury" implies that he's somehow redundant or irrelevant.

    Care to explain to me how it's his fault that Oneal and Tinsley can't make shots?

    So, the Pacers don't need 2nd chances because they can't convert them anyway?
    Very well stated.

    On a team that has a few players with poor character and poor work habits, why on earth would you want to get rid of a player that is just the opposite. And, at this point with this team, I'd probably say that even if Jeff had no talent.

    But, even though we may not like Jeff's shooting range or free throw percentages, what I think we get from Jeff is remarkable consistency.

    He will always rebound, he will always defend, he will always give you everything he has. Well, and if he somehow gives us more than just a few points or has a 4-6 FG game, then I just consider that icing on the cake.

    I've never considered Jeff to be a fantastic starter in this league, but I've always considered him to be an ideal player coming in off the bench. It is not Jeff's fault that we've not been able to acquire a better starter so that Jeff would be placed in that role.

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    Default Re: Its Time To Move Jeff Foster

    Ergh, not Mike Bibby. All he bring over Tins is shooting, something we need but we also need leadership and defense from the PG position, neither of which Bibby can deliver. That and his contract is horrible, he can opt out at the end of the season aswell.

  16. #16

    Default Re: Its Time To Move Jeff Foster

    "All he brings over Tinsley is shooting"

    That seems like an awful lot to me considering the way this team is built. First, a PG capable of spotting up and hitting consistently would be huge when the ball goes into JO in the post. Secondly, do you realize how much more effective the high pick & roll is when you have a Mike Bibby. Jamaal creates pretty well off the pick, but he's never a threat to come off it and hit the 18 footer. Obviously Bibby isn't as good at getting into the lane and creating his own shot, but this team desperately needs a perimeter scorer with ability to catch fire at anytime.

  17. #17
    Member Roferr's Avatar
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    Default Re: Its Time To Move Jeff Foster

    Be careful for what you wish. There would be probably 20 some teams scrambling to get at Foster. No way should he be considered a luxury. How many teams have a hustler like him who only wants to rebound, defend and keep the ball live for another brick to be hoisted up and set a ton of picks while doing it?

    It's true, he hurts us offensively but he more than makes up for it in other aspects of the game. He should be playing when we have two strong go to guys so that he isn't a liability.

    The only way I would want him traded is if the other team demanded him included in a trade to swing the deal for a good PG. JO and Granger probably are the only two players with more trade value.
    .

  18. #18
    The Last Great Pacer BlueNGold's Avatar
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    Default Re: Its Time To Move Jeff Foster

    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck View Post
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    No, it isn't time to move Jeff. He's the type of player that once he is traded almost everyone will within a few weeks will be begging to get him back.

    One of the Pacers biggest problems is their lack of energy players and as much as I like Dun, Murph and Ike - those players are not energy players at all.

    I worry about Ike's defense I saw somethings last night that was almost David Harrison like - very concerning to me. So I hope we aren't too eager trade Jeff
    I am slowly moving into agreement with UB. I have always liked Jeff, but always wanted more. Right now, we are lucky to have what we've got in Jeff. He's one of the few we can be sure will not be in the next bar fight. He's one who never complains. He brings solid effort and energy every night. He will not turn off the fans. ..and he's really not even that old yet.

    Let's just say there are other players we should be looking to move.

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    Default Re: Its Time To Move Jeff Foster

    Quote Originally Posted by bnd45 View Post
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    UB: How would you feel if Foster was included in a deal that netted us Earl Watson?
    Although I am not UB....I figure I would give my

    I agree that Foster would likely be the only player that we could use to somehow move Tinsley. But I...like some of the PD members...think that Foster's value is too much to give up...just to make a lateral move from Tinsley to Earl Watson. If Foster were to be moved with Tinsley....we better be getting a clear cut improvement at the PG spot.

    I like Watson....but not at the cost of Foster.

    As DaSmash suggested....despite his matador defense.....I could possibly be convinced to do a Bibby+Filler ( either Ronnie Price or Justin Williams ) for Tinsley+Foster just to get a better scoring PG.
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    This is David West, he is the Honey Badger, West just doesn't give a *****....he's pretty bad *ss cuz he has no regard for any other Player or Team whatsoever.

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    Default Re: Its Time To Move Jeff Foster

    Absolutely mystifies me that the third most mentioned "must be moved" after Jackson and Tinsley seems to be Foster. Why!?! Foster stays. He does more with what he has than anyone on this team - maybe ever.
    The best exercise of the human heart is reaching down and picking someone else up.

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    Default Re: Its Time To Move Jeff Foster

    I know that Foster is an offensive liability....but match him up with a scoring Big Man like JONeal, Murphy and ( most notably ) Ike....and any shots that he ( as a 5th player ) would usually take....could all go to our Big Men.

    I really want to see Ike play more with Foster when JONeal and Murphy are off the floor. I think the rebounding/defense that Foster provides complements Ike's interior tenacity and "blackhole" offensive game.

    The way I look at it...the less shots Foster takes....the more shots will be available to JONeal/Murphy/Ike to take.
    Ash from Army of Darkness: Good...Bad...I'm the guy with the gun.

    This is David West, he is the Honey Badger, West just doesn't give a *****....he's pretty bad *ss cuz he has no regard for any other Player or Team whatsoever.

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    Default Re: Its Time To Move Jeff Foster

    Quote Originally Posted by CableKC View Post
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    I know that Foster is an offensive liability....but match him up with a scoring Big Man like JONeal, Murphy and ( most notably ) Ike....and any shots that he ( as a 5th player ) would usually take....could all go to our Big Men.

    I really want to see Ike play more with Foster when JONeal and Murphy are off the floor. I think the rebounding/defense that Foster provides complements Ike's interior tenacity and "blackhole" offensive game.

    The way I look at it...the less shots Foster takes....the more shots will be available to JONeal/Murphy/Ike to take.
    But you have to factor in that JO/Murphy/Ike are getting double teamed when Foster is out there.

    Im uncertain on trading Foster. I love his rebounding and defense but he limits us a lot on offense. Not only by not being and offense threat at all but also allowing another big man to go after JO.

    If we would get a PG who could play defense and hit a shot occasionally i would be okay with trading him. When i say occasionally i just mean i want a pass first PG that will take the shot a few times or when he is open instead of forcing things.

  23. #23
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    Default Re: Its Time To Move Jeff Foster

    Quote Originally Posted by maragin View Post
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    Foster isn't the problem.

    This is'nt about Foster being the problem. It is about making this team better. If you can make the team better by offloading Foster, or Tinsley, or Harrison or anyone then you need to do it.

    We do have a log jam in the PF/C positions and Foster is probably one of the more desirable players at the moment. It definately needs to be explored.
    I would not like to see him go but if we could make the team better in the process then it needs to be done.
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  24. #24
    The Doctor's In The House TheDon's Avatar
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    Default Re: Its Time To Move Jeff Foster

    Ok I don't know how the whole restrictions and what not play out but lets say we traded boston and they definately had the number 1 pick.

    Trade them Jermaine O'Neal + Jamaal Tinsley for Paul Pierce + Delonte West + 1st Round Pick

    that would clear up a considerable amount of cap space wouldn't it? Then try and get Chauncey Billups in the free agent market this upcoming year? I don't know if this is possible but that would give our team a look of somethin like this

    PG - Billups
    SG - Pierce
    SF - Granger
    PG - Ike
    C - Odin

    PG - West
    SG - Quis
    SF - Williams
    PF - Murphy
    C - Jeff

    ....a guy can dream lmao

  25. #25
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    Default Re: Its Time To Move Jeff Foster

    Quote Originally Posted by JO4MVP2006 View Post
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    But you have to factor in that JO/Murphy/Ike are getting double teamed when Foster is out there.

    Im uncertain on trading Foster. I love his rebounding and defense but he limits us a lot on offense. Not only by not being and offense threat at all but also allowing another big man to go after JO.

    If we would get a PG who could play defense and hit a shot occasionally i would be okay with trading him. When i say occasionally i just mean i want a pass first PG that will take the shot a few times or when he is open instead of forcing things.
    JONeal and Ike ( from now on ) are going to get double-teamed everytime they get the ball regardless of whether Foster is in there or not. Although my hope is that they will be able to get the ball to Foster to make a simple basket, I would prefer that Tinsley, Dunleavy, Marquis, Granger or whoever is smart enough to recognize the double team and get into a spot on the floor where JONeal or Ike can pass to. I know its inefficient...but I would much rather give the ball to a player that can shoot ( cuz that's what he's paid for and is best at doing ) as opposed to one who simply isn't good at it while keeping a player like Foster.

    Don't get me wrong...I agree with you that Foster should be used as trade bait to move Tinsley for another PG...but only if we get one that is worth it. I don't want to trade Tinsley...and include Foster...just to move him for any PG.

    Unless we get a quality starting PG that is worth it....which is probably unlikely...the only other type of trade that I could accept where Foster was moved with Tinsley to get a "lateral move" starting PG would be if could get a quality starting SG that can shoot.
    Ash from Army of Darkness: Good...Bad...I'm the guy with the gun.

    This is David West, he is the Honey Badger, West just doesn't give a *****....he's pretty bad *ss cuz he has no regard for any other Player or Team whatsoever.

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