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Thread: the best guard in the state of Indiana is named

  1. #26
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    Default Re: the best guard in the state of Indiana is named

    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck View Post
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    My attitude about the kid is the same with all H.S. players. (And I even graduated from North Central) Wake me up when they get to the NBA - because until then I really don't care.
    And the reason I agree with Buck is because of the TYPES of moves that work in HS. Those 2 hand layups from the waist - destroyed by most wings/guards at the rim in the NBA. Straight down the lane for the 2 foot jump step layup? Um, that's your nose on the floor, pick it up and shoot 2.

    Yes his catch and shoot is deep and quick, so was Fred Hoiberg's. He is very talented, but he doesn't look as ready to go as Rip or AI did in college IMO. He's simply ready to move to the next level before most other guys are (and most won't even make that step anyway).

    If he can continue to refine his game, adapt moves and develop new ones for better competition, then yes, he will become a very strong NBA talent. Right now it's still just potential.

    But for where he's at now he's a lot of fun to watch and shows more promise than just about any other HS players out there.

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    Default Re: the best guard in the state of Indiana is named

    No way, this one is the best.......... checkout his highlights, he can dunk from freethrow line with ease and he can do thunder jams (literally).

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GkJLBRz0o9c

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    Default Re: the best guard in the state of Indiana is named

    Quote Originally Posted by Anthem View Post
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    If you want him to be Allen Iverson or Ben Gordon, maybe. But he's going to be consistently overmatched by taller players. Fred Jones had an impressive vertical and a 7'1" wingspan, and the same thing happened to him.


    .
    Fred Jones was not arguably the best player in the country coming out of HS was he?
    I guess we will agree to disagree, but the kids better than Oden when it comes to pure talent. I've been saying it since the beginning of his junior year. Ray Allen is 6'5" tops and is nowhere near the athlete Gordon his and has had a fine career. EJ will be a big time scorer in the NBA his whole career.

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    Default Re: the best guard in the state of Indiana is named

    Quote Originally Posted by indy0731 View Post
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    I guess we will agree to disagree, but the kids better than Oden when it comes to pure talent. I've been saying it since the beginning of his junior year. Ray Allen is 6'5" tops and is nowhere near the athlete Gordon his and has had a fine career. EJ will be a big time scorer in the NBA his whole career.
    I'm not saying he won't. But I am saying I didn't see anything in the highlight reel that I couldn't see Ben Gordon doing.

    Look, I'm not saying he won't become a first-class NBA player with a long career. But his best chance of having a great NBA career involves playing point guard, IMO. And he's not the best guard in the state of Indiana. Right now, that's Jamaal Tinsley.
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    Default Re: the best guard in the state of Indiana is named

    Quote Originally Posted by Anthem View Post
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    I'm not saying he won't. But I am saying I didn't see anything in the highlight reel that I couldn't see Ben Gordon doing.

    Look, I'm not saying he won't become a first-class NBA player with a long career. But his best chance of having a great NBA career involves playing point guard, IMO. And he's not the best guard in the state of Indiana. Right now, that's Jamaal Tinsley.
    I don't think Ben Gordon could come anywhere near doing that reverse dunk he had against Loyola.

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    Default Re: the best guard in the state of Indiana is named

    Quote Originally Posted by indy0731 View Post
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    I don't think Ben Gordon could come anywhere near doing that reverse dunk he had against Loyola.
    don't think ben gordon could do this either...

    http://youtube.com/watch?v=gDmOPnz_Pic

    or this...

    http://youtube.com/watch?v=B-Z7-W1JCn4

    and setting the scoring record at arguably the biggest aau tournament of the year...

    http://youtube.com/watch?v=6MOhc8M90...elated&search=

  7. #32
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    Default Re: the best guard in the state of Indiana is named

    Quote Originally Posted by indy0731 View Post
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    I don't think Ben Gordon could come anywhere near doing that reverse dunk he had against Loyola.
    Well, that's a good point. Plus, in the NBA, dunks are worth double points if they're flashy. So that's something.

    I get your point, but I'm sticking with mine. His best chance of a long NBA career is at point guard, not shooting guard.

    I don't watch him, so I don't know. But can he pass the ball?
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    Default Re: the best guard in the state of Indiana is named

    Quote Originally Posted by Anthem View Post
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    Well, that's a good point. Plus, in the NBA, dunks are worth double points if they're flashy. So that's something.

    I get your point, but I'm sticking with mine. His best chance of a long NBA career is at point guard, not shooting guard.

    I don't watch him, so I don't know. But can he pass the ball?
    I'd argue his biggest weakness is passing.

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    Default Re: the best guard in the state of Indiana is named

    his biggest drawback is his height. if he were 2-3 inches taller, people would view him as a better all around player than lebron at the same age. the only thing lebron had on ej is height and passing ability. and even there, ej is a very good passer, he's just asked to be a scorer on his team. ej is superior to lebron in every other aspect as a high school senior. i continue to question people acting like they have an opinion on the matter when they've never seen ej play. there's a reason many feel he's the best guard at this age to ever come out of the state of indiana.

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    Default Re: the best guard in the state of Indiana is named

    Quote Originally Posted by indy0731 View Post
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    I'd argue his biggest weakness is passing.
    Well, he's just a kid, so he's got time to fix that.

    But his best chance at a long NBA career is if he can run a team in addition to scoring on his man.
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    Default Re: the best guard in the state of Indiana is named

    Quote Originally Posted by croz24 View Post
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    his biggest drawback is his height. if he were 2-3 inches taller, people would view him as a better all around player than lebron at the same age. the only thing lebron had on ej is height and passing ability. and even there, ej is a very good passer, he's just asked to be a scorer on his team. ej is superior to lebron in every other aspect as a high school senior. i continue to question people acting like they have an opinion on the matter when they've never seen ej play. there's a reason many feel he's the best guard at this age to ever come out of the state of indiana.
    I wouldn't know EJ if I met him on the street. But you're right about the height thing... it's just hard for a 6'3" shooting guard to translate his game to the NBA. I'm not saying it can't be done (look at Allen Iverson), I'm just saying it's hard.

    It's easier to make it into the NBA if you're tall. That's just the way it is. Like somebody said in another thread, if Ike Diogu was 2-3 inches taller he'd be absolutely untouchable. He's got more skill than most big men in the league, but because he's smaller he's consistently in danger of being outmatched (on defense if nothing else).
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    Default Re: the best guard in the state of Indiana is named

    Quote Originally Posted by croz24 View Post
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    don't think ben gordon could do this either...

    http://youtube.com/watch?v=gDmOPnz_Pic

    or this...

    http://youtube.com/watch?v=B-Z7-W1JCn4

    and setting the scoring record at arguably the biggest aau tournament of the year...

    http://youtube.com/watch?v=6MOhc8M90...elated&search=
    He looks like DWade. The only difference is that DWade makes those dunks against NBA level competition. Some of us appear to placing a different weight on this factor.

  13. #38

    Default Re: the best guard in the state of Indiana is named

    Quote Originally Posted by croz24 View Post
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    his biggest drawback is his height. if he were 2-3 inches taller, people would view him as a better all around player than lebron at the same age.
    Are you joking? I hope so.

    I'm not usually very critical of people on here, but this is just getting ridiculous. Eric Gordon isn't even the consensus best player in his class. I've seen him listed in the top 5 regularly, but not #1 every time. A couple inches isn't going to change that much.

    In his junior year Lebron was considered the best player in all of high school basketball, regardless of class, and everyone knew he was the #1 player in his class without any question or doubt.

    Calm down, you guys hyping Gordon are getting really in over your head with some of these comments. Seriously.

    When I was in school with Jason Gardner, I thought much the same of him. He schooled me daily, and I didn't see how he couldn't be good in the NBA. If Lebron was around then, I never would have had the audacity to say he would be better than James. Which is part of my frustration with this topic. I've seen high school all americans, college, and nba players up close and personal on the court. Yet, when I watched Lebron I could absolutely see he was different, special, and not like the others. Eric Gordon doesn't show me anything close to that.

    -- Steve --

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    Default Re: the best guard in the state of Indiana is named

    Quote Originally Posted by Pacersfan46 View Post
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    Are you joking? I hope so.

    I'm not usually very critical of people on here, but this is just getting ridiculous. Eric Gordon isn't even the consensus best player in his class. I've seen him listed in the top 5 regularly, but not #1 every time. A couple inches isn't going to change that much.

    In his junior year Lebron was considered the best player in all of high school basketball, regardless of class, and everyone knew he was the #1 player in his class without any question or doubt.

    Calm down, you guys hyping Gordon are getting really in over your head with some of these comments. Seriously.

    When I was in school with Jason Gardner, I thought much the same of him. He schooled me daily, and I didn't see how he couldn't be good in the NBA. If Lebron was around then, I never would have had the audacity to say he would be better than James. Which is part of my frustration with this topic. I've seen high school all americans, college, and nba players up close and personal on the court. Yet, when I watched Lebron I could absolutely see he was different, special, and not like the others. Eric Gordon doesn't show me anything close to that.

    -- Steve --
    You thought a 5'10" PG with mediocre athletic ability was going to make it in the NBA?

    Also someone in power must think highly enough of Gordon to put his games on national TV. Hes now had what three national TV games in his career (one was shared with Oden, you know the game where Gordon comes flying in from out of nowhere and stuffs the guy on the fastbreak.) You don't get put it on TV just for the heck of it, you have to be a specail, dare I say surefire NBA talent. I know we can't always listen to what ESPN commentators say, but I think it is a pretty large statement when the phrase "never seen anyone else like him" is used during your games. I have never heard that about guys like Jason Gardner, Fred Jones, Ben Gordon or anyone else mentioned in this thread other than the guy you brought up, Lebron. Now I am not saying Eric Gordon is Lebron, I am however saying that the people on here who are saying he is a special talent are not just talking out their rears. The national media and college coaches obviously agree with us. Why do you think Illinois was so furious about losing him? The kid is special.

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    Default Re: the best guard in the state of Indiana is named

    Quote Originally Posted by indy0731 View Post
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    You thought a 5'10" PG with mediocre athletic ability was going to make it in the NBA?
    Yes, that Jameer Nelson (near same height, same athletically) guy isn't very good, and Earl Boykins (MUCH shorter) is even worse. Right? Since when does height = success? I don't get this idea. You're looking at it in hindsight. Jason Gardner was ranked by all those same people in the same area as Eric Gordon.

    And I don't care what they said during the game. "Never seen anything quite like him", it's called getting caught up in the moment. Exaggerating. That's all it is. If you ask those same people if they thought he was better than Lebron in high school they'd obviously say no. Which would be the same as admitting they've seen something like it before. Not to mention the team North Central was playing was nationally RANKED, and had two of Michael Jordans kids on the team. They didn't televise the game just for Gordon. Get that right.

    Gordon is good, but calm down. He's not a sure fire NBA All-Star or anything like it yet. He hasn't played one NBA game. This is just the same as all the people clammoring over the 2007 NBA draft, and they haven't proven anything yet. It's overboard.

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    Default Re: the best guard in the state of Indiana is named

    Quote Originally Posted by Pacersfan46 View Post
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    Yes, that Jameer Nelson (near same height, same athletically) guy isn't very good, and Earl Boykins (MUCH shorter) is even worse. Right? Since when does height = success? I don't get this idea. You're looking at it in hindsight. Jason Gardner was ranked by all those same people in the same area as Eric Gordon.

    And I don't care what they said during the game. "Never seen anything quite like him", it's called getting caught up in the moment. Exaggerating. That's all it is. If you ask those same people if they thought he was better than Lebron in high school they'd obviously say no. Which would be the same as admitting they've seen something like it before. Not to mention the team North Central was playing was nationally RANKED, and had two of Michael Jordans kids on the team. They didn't televise the game just for Gordon. Get that right.

    Gordon is good, but calm down. He's not a sure fire NBA All-Star or anything like it yet. He hasn't played one NBA game. This is just the same as all the people clammoring over the 2007 NBA draft, and they haven't proven anything yet. It's overboard.

    -- Steve --
    Then it was even more of a statement to Gordon's ability because the number 7 ranked team in the state of Indiana stomped the number 22 ranked team in the whole country by 41 points.

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    Default Re: the best guard in the state of Indiana is named

    Kelvin Sampson will help him alot with his bball IQ and passing.
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    Default Re: the best guard in the state of Indiana is named

    Being a SG under 6'5 is not a death sentence. Dwyane Wade is 6'4, Barbosa is 6'3, Monta Ellis is 6'3, Ben Gordon is listed at 6'3 though I doubt if he's that tall, and Luther Head is 6'3.

    All of those players see major minutes and are effective scorers for their teams. Athletic ability >>> height. Always.

    Edit: The height stuff doesn't even fly when we have a 6'8 center proving my point!

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    Default Re: the best guard in the state of Indiana is named

    Quote Originally Posted by 3rdStrike View Post
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    Being a SG under 6'5 is not a death sentence. Dwyane Wade is 6'4, Barbosa is 6'3, Monta Ellis is 6'3, Ben Gordon is listed at 6'3 though I doubt if he's that tall, and Luther Head is 6'3.
    All of those guys play at least a little point. We're not talking, though, about whether he could get minutes this season. We're talking about what makes a successful long-term career.

    He might be the next D.Wade, but he also might be the next Flip Murray. Heck, until he's scored 100 points in a HS game, he's not even the next Travis Best.

    It's not sheer athletic ability that keeps you in the NBA over the course of time. It's talent, persistence, and the continued drive to improve yourself. He's got talent, I agree. Does he have the other two? Maybe he does, but it's too soon to say.

    If he could develop some PG skills, he'd be a sure thing. Nobody would pass up drafting the next Chris Paul.
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    Default Re: the best guard in the state of Indiana is named

    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck View Post
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    I thought he was 6'3" and at that height unless he's a freakish athlete he's going to have to play point guard in the NBA.
    Earl the Pearl, Allen Iverson, Dwayne Wade, Joe Dumars, Dave Bing, Jason Terry, Danny Ainge, Leandro Barbosa and Ben Gordan would all like to say hello.

    (BTW...I have never seen Gordon play, just saying.)

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    Default Re: the best guard in the state of Indiana is named

    Quote Originally Posted by #31 View Post
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    No way, this one is the best.......... checkout his highlights, he can dunk from freethrow line with ease and he can do thunder jams (literally).

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GkJLBRz0o9c
    So could James White

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    Default Re: the best guard in the state of Indiana is named

    Quote Originally Posted by JayRedd View Post
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    Earl the Pearl, Allen Iverson, Dwayne Wade, Joe Dumars, Dave Bing, Jason Terry, Danny Ainge, Leandro Barbosa and Ben Gordan would all like to say hello.

    (BTW...I have never seen Gordon play, just saying.)
    Dave Bing?? Going back 30 years for players isn't helping your point.

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    Default Re: the best guard in the state of Indiana is named

    Quote Originally Posted by Anthem View Post
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    I wouldn't know EJ if I met him on the street. But you're right about the height thing... it's just hard for a 6'3" shooting guard to translate his game to the NBA. I'm not saying it can't be done (look at Allen Iverson), I'm just saying it's hard.

    It's easier to make it into the NBA if you're tall. That's just the way it is. Like somebody said in another thread, if Ike Diogu was 2-3 inches taller he'd be absolutely untouchable. He's got more skill than most big men in the league, but because he's smaller he's consistently in danger of being outmatched (on defense if nothing else).
    Most of the shorter guards that are exceptional are quicker than average as well. He's quick enough, but it looks to me like his greatest advantage at this point is his strength advantage. The differences in physical development at 18 y/o can be huge. That will lessen in college and disappear in the NBA. Does look like a dead eye pure shooter with great hops. That gives him a pretty dang good shot.

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    Default Re: the best guard in the state of Indiana is named

    the real question, can the guy play D?

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    Default Re: the best guard in the state of Indiana is named

    Quote Originally Posted by PacerMan View Post
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    Dave Bing?? Going back 30 years for players isn't helping your point.
    You're right...Hall of Famers from the 70s are clearly irrelevant to the discussion of basketball.

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