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Thread: Andre Miller

  1. #1
    Long time fan diamonddave00's Avatar
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    Default Andre Miller

    After once again watching Jamaal Tinsley again force too many shots down the stretch (4of 14 mage field goals for game) 1of5 in 4th not counting being fouled on 3 other attempts , its becoming obvious he's not the answer at the point.

    I know Andre Miller is not the flashiest point guard but he knows him limitations and forces few bad shots. Once again this season he's among the nba assist leaders , his man on man defense is no worse than Tinsley's.

    With Granger and Dunleavy here , it appears the small forward position is filled Diogu , and Murphy added at pf/c seem to have answered depth questions there.

    So I suggest the Pacers offer Tinsley , Shawne Williams and David Harrison for Andre Miller. Williams and Harrison it would appear have little playing time rotation spots here but have skills.

    Miller is a durable player in his career he's missed less than 10 games total and plays 35+ minutes a night. Just seems to me he fits the Pacers needs at the point a steady ,durable point guard . Williams and Harrison add potentially 2 solid player to the Sixers, and Tinsley -in my opinion is more suited to a team that wants to get up and down the court.

    Just my thought after watching Tinsley fire at will and hit barely 30% of his field goal attempts over the last 15 games or so.

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    One man show ajbry's Avatar
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    Default Re: Andre Miller

    I'd love to acquire Miller somehow, especially if we can ship out both Tinsley and Harrison in the process. Shawne, on the other hand, has all the tools to be a very good player in this league, and if we give him up just to get a 2nd-tier PG, I'll be disappointed. I'm not exactly sure what other players the 76ers may be interested in, but who knows, maybe an offer of Tinsley + Harrison could work.

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    Member Evan_The_Dude's Avatar
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    Default Re: Andre Miller

    That trade works for us, but I don't see it making any sense for Philly.

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    The Future Is Bright JB's Breakout Year's Avatar
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    Default Re: Andre Miller

    Even if Miller would be a significant upgrade at the point, I don't think we give up Shawne Williams in return.

    The fact that we don't have a draft pick this year makes him more valuable. He's young and talented enough to make up for us sitting this draft out.

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    Default Re: Andre Miller

    The Sixers gain a point guard who is 2 years younger in Tinsley , plus a servicable and perhaps better young center in Harrison , plus a young raw sf Shawne Williams .

    Williams is the key , while he has potential with Granger and the length of Dunleavy's contract 5years -I don't see Shawne getting any real minutes in the next couple years at least.

    Williams is a lot to give up and would be attractive in any deal to a rebuilding team, as might Harrison who has shown flashes(though few and far between).

    Its probably over paying in actuality for Miller (in most Pacer fans eyes) but its a move I feel needs to be made. Miller averages 13 ppg and 9 assist while turning the ball over less than 3 times a game.

    To me its a fair offer to the Sixers.

  6. #6

    Default Re: Andre Miller

    I would trade Tinsley, Harrison, and a pick, or maybe Tinsley and Foster. I would not trade Shawne.
    The eyes of the Granger are upon you.

  7. #7

    Default Re: Andre Miller

    If their salaries were close enough to match, I bet Donnie Walsh could convince his buddy Billy King to do a straight up swap of Tinsley for Miller. I can hear the conversation now...

    "Billy we know you guys really want to tank the season and have a shot at Greg Oden, but that pesky Andre Miller is good enough to win just a few too many games for you. Buddy do I have a deal for you..."

  8. #8

    Default Re: Andre Miller

    Quote Originally Posted by dgranger View Post
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    I would trade Tinsley, Harrison, and a pick, or maybe Tinsley and Foster. I would not trade Shawne.
    2007- no pick
    2006-Williams
    2005-Granger
    2004-Harrison
    2003-Jones

    If we trade Williams, Harrison, and Tinsley for Miller after letting Freddie go our record of retaining and developing 1st rounders is pathetic. If we do this then Granger and Foster will be the only 1st rounders that we have retained on our 15 man roster.

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    Member odeez's Avatar
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    Default Re: Andre Miller

    Oh man yes, if we could get Miller that would be great. We need a smart Vet. in here no doubt. Armstrong is great, but way past his prime.

  10. #10

    Default Re: Andre Miller

    you have to make hard deals to get better. Miller would be a big upgrade on decesion making on the floor. maybe see if they would take Marshal instead of Williams. Pacers need to get a deal done NOW to save this season!!!!

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    Default Re: Andre Miller

    I will always believe that the Pacers would be better off with a PG that is able to make better decisions that Tinsley. And one that doesn't press his own agenda nearly as much, or go into a 1-v-1 game against his defender after being shown up on the other end of the court.

    However, with Dunleavy on the team able to handle a "point-forward" role, I think that a PG that is a top notch distributor is not as important to us now as it was a week ago.

    For that reason, I think the stress on getting a new PG should be placed more on his defensive abilities, his ability to handle and take care of the ball, and on his ability to simply hit a wide-open shot.

    For a true distributor of the ball, I believe we can draft one and develop him or eventually acquire one with our MLE.

    But for right now, considering that Dunleavy might even play some backcourt minutes, we need to acquire some defensive players capable of playing PG. Heck, if we have to, give up someone and get AJ back. I don't care how few minutes he's getting at Dallas, if he were a Pacer, especially without Tinsley on the roster, he's more than capable of providing exactly what we need here in Indy.

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    Default Re: Andre Miller

    I'm a little different than some I now look at Ike Diogu as our 2nd 2005 #1 pick. He was basicly dealt for Sarunas and Powell 2 undrafted players.

    Dunleavy's contract as it kicks in will make him virtually untradable for 3 more years and with Granger here I don't see Shawne getting real minutes anytime soon(though I really like him).

    Getting Diogu softens dealing Harrison and Williams in my opinion if he's the player Bird thinks he is.

    Like Bird and Walsh said you have to give to get, the fact Miller is so durable to me is a key. We all know Jamaal is a chest cold or hissy fit away from missing games.

  13. #13
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    Default Re: Andre Miller

    Quote Originally Posted by diamonddave00 View Post
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    I'm a little different than some I now look at Ike Diogu as our 2nd 2005 #1 pick. He was basicly dealt for Sarunas and Powell 2 undrafted players.

    Dunleavy's contract as it kicks in will make him virtually untradable for 3 more years and with Granger here I don't see Shawne getting real minutes anytime soon(though I really like him).

    Getting Diogu softens dealing Harrison and Williams in my opinion if he's the player Bird thinks he is.

    Like Bird and Walsh said you have to give to get, the fact Miller is so durable to me is a key. We all know Jamaal is a chest cold or hissy fit away from missing games.
    Good point on Diogu, but I think there are plenty of opportunities for Shawne as Danny moves into the starting line-up. Maybe Shawne takes Danny's old minutes, eventually picks up where Danny left off as a 6th man.

    We moved Al and Jackson-2 players who were getting the bulk of minutes at the 2 and 3. If Dunleavey, Jr. continues to play 2, then there are minutes at the 3 for Shawne to play.

  14. #14
    White and Nerdy Anthem's Avatar
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    Default Re: Andre Miller

    Quote Originally Posted by diamonddave00 View Post
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    Like Bird and Walsh said you have to give to get, the fact Miller is so durable to me is a key. We all know Jamaal is a chest cold or hissy fit away from missing games.
    Speak for yourself. I don't know that.

    I'd be fine with trading for Miller, but I'm not going to bash Tinsley for being frail right now.
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    Default Re: Andre Miller

    Quote Originally Posted by Anthem View Post
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    Speak for yourself. I don't know that.

    I'd be fine with trading for Miller, but I'm not going to bash Tinsley for being frail right now.
    So to you, the last 3 months have completely erased the past history of 4 years?

  16. #16
    White and Nerdy Anthem's Avatar
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    Default Re: Andre Miller

    Quote Originally Posted by Pacersfan46 View Post
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    So to you, the last 3 months have completely erased the past history of 4 years?
    I'm down on Tinsley because of his decision-making, but how can you fault him for his durability this year? He's committed to 82 games, and there's nothing so far that makes me think he won't get there.
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    Default Re: Andre Miller

    I hope you are right Anthem because trading AJ and Runi and acquiring 38 year old Armstrong , no shot Orien Greene and currently out for at least 2 weeks Keith McLeod doesn't bode well if JT has his 3 times a year sinus infections.

    Winter hasn't really set in yet and JT has chronic respitory and sinus troubles. Seeing will be believing -just mark me down as a lil pessimistic JT makes it through the season without at least 1 spell of injury or illness.

  18. #18

    Default Re: Andre Miller

    Quote Originally Posted by Anthem View Post
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    I'm down on Tinsley because of his decision-making, but how can you fault him for his durability this year? He's committed to 82 games, and there's nothing so far that makes me think he won't get there.

    I personally would not fault him for his durability this year. But I blame him for it. If he was injured or sick we wouldn't be losing these close games.


    PS: I wouldn't trade Williams. He is our real 2007 number 1 pick.
    But an hour or so later, Hibbert wrote on his Twitter account: "Love this coach [and] I love this team. We can go far this year if we play like that. 2night we played our hearts out. Just didn't get the win."

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    Default Re: Andre Miller

    I like what Shawne has to offer...but if we could get rid of Tinsley and get back Dre.....without giving up Foster...who ( despite having some ups and downs ) I think is critical for balencing Ike and Murphy's defensive deficiencies...then I would do it.

    However, I seriously doubt that the Sixers do it.....I mean....seriously.....when I look at that offer...I even question if its enough.
    Ash from Army of Darkness: Good...Bad...I'm the guy with the gun.

    This is David West, he is the Honey Badger, West just doesn't give a *****....he's pretty bad *ss cuz he has no regard for any other Player or Team whatsoever.

  20. #20

    Default Re: Andre Miller

    I like Tinsley as a backup SG. He isn't good enough to be a starting SG. Also he is not a good PG because of the afor mentioned "decision making". I feel he is weighing down the team. He's like a cement block attached to our leg as we sink to the bottom of the Central Division Ocean. I honestly beleive all we need now is a true PG. That PG could be Miller.
    The eyes of the Granger are upon you.

  21. #21
    Headband and Rec Specs rexnom's Avatar
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    Default Re: Andre Miller

    Miller is not a poor choice. Also, he is probably available because the Sixers are trying to tank and rebuild at the same time. However, if we want him then I don't think there's anyway to swing it without giving up Shawne.

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    Default Re: Andre Miller

    Wow... with Jackson gone its pretty clear who the new scapegoat will be.

  23. #23
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    Default Re: Andre Miller

    Check JT's shooting over last 15 games -- 64 fgm 196 fga .326 fg% but still shooting 13 times a game. Free throw shooting 42 of 65 nly 64.6% , so yes he's averaged 12.1ppg but at a very high cost shot wise. Over same period 12of 47 3ps 26%.

    There is no reason he should be shooting more than around 8-10 times a game he's not a good enough shooter to warrent 13 shots in addition to 2 or3 other times he's fouled attempting a shot.

    If JT would shoot less and move feet on defense I'd have no problem but he's hoisting too many shots and playing matador defense.

  24. #24
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    Default Re: Andre Miller

    Quote Originally Posted by Cobol Sam View Post
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    Wow... with Jackson gone its pretty clear who the new scapegoat will be.
    Yeah, that is very evident!

    To be fair to Tinsley...I didn't see Rick objecting or saying much of anything when Tinsley was trying to take it over down the strech. Personally, I hate when Tinsley goes into Rucker Park mode, but it seems like there is more to it then just Tinsley calling his own number. We've seen it in the last 3 games and there has been more then enough oppertunities for Carlisle to bring this to a halt if this is truely not wanted.
    ...Still "flying casual"
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  25. #25
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    Default Re: Andre Miller

    Quote Originally Posted by Roaming Gnome View Post
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    Yeah, that is very evident!

    To be fair to Tinsley...I didn't see Rick objecting or saying much of anything when Tinsley was trying to take it over down the strech. Personally, I hate when Tinsley goes into Rucker Park mode, but it seems like there is more to it then just Tinsley calling his own number. We've seen it in the last 3 games and there has been more then enough oppertunities for Carlisle to bring this to a halt if this is truely not wanted.
    If Carlisle was to do anything about it my guess is that Tinsley would quickly come down with a sinus problem.

    I have a feeling that TPTB decided to "let Tinsley be Tinsley" this season and evaluate where his head and game are really at. There'd be a secondary benefit of showcasing him and at least pretending the coach and Tinsley are on the same page (for PR reasons). At least that's what I hope is going on.

    Tinsley has been problem 1A in my book for quite a while. There may be other problems but until he's gone everything else is just going to be magnified.



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