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Thread: Vecsey says Pacers offering everyone except JO and Grange for AI

  1. #101
    NaptownSeth is all feel Naptown_Seth's Avatar
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    Default Re: Vecsey says Pacers offering everyone except JO and Grange for AI

    I just wanted to bring this back to Vescey.

    Remember how the tread started, his "everyone but JO and Danny".

    Now he follows with this comment in his most recent column.
    The Pacers talks never went anywhere worthwhile.
    Excuse me if I don't see how this matches his initial intentionally provocative statement.

    How can he say they never went anywhere worthwhile if he himself KNEW FOR A FACT that the Pacers were offering just about the entire team? That sounds pretty worthwhile to me. To me this change of tune within a few days says it all about PV.
    I just saw on NBA TV, Peter talked 10 mins about which teams are today IN the "AI hunt"
    Notice that he didn't mention the Nuggets...or the Pacers of course.

    Here's Deadspins claim about PV
    Here are two recent Vecsey scoops: The Pacers' Ron Artest to Seattle for Brent Barry ... and Steve Francis "going to the Denver Nuggets in the next 48 hours" ...
    Link
    Of course they note that his old Post articles must be paid to view, helpful to avoid net searches that review your old predictions.

  2. #102

    Default Re: Vecsey says Pacers offering everyone except JO and Grange for AI

    Quote Originally Posted by Naptown_Seth View Post
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    I just wanted to bring this back to Vescey.

    Remember how the tread started, his "everyone but JO and Danny".

    Now he follows with this comment in his most recent column.

    Excuse me if I don't see how this matches his initial intentionally provocative statement.

    How can he say they never went anywhere worthwhile if he himself KNEW FOR A FACT that the Pacers were offering just about the entire team? That sounds pretty worthwhile to me. To me this change of tune within a few days says it all about PV.
    But for the talks to be worthwhile, the Nuggets have to be interested in what the Pacers have to offer. Most of what I've read have the Nuggets wanting young players, draft picks, and expiring contracts. With Granger off the table and Shawne Williams unproven, that makes the Pacers 0-3 on what the Nuggets want. So Vescey hasn't really changed his tune. The Pacers very well could've offered everyone except Granger and JO. But it doesn't mean the offer was worthwhile to the Nuggets.

  3. #103
    NaptownSeth is all feel Naptown_Seth's Avatar
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    Default Re: Vecsey says Pacers offering everyone except JO and Grange for AI

    either get to the hole or get to the line or dish to a big man on the block or kick to a jump shooter is something that the Indiana Pacers franchise has never had to the degree in which he is able to do so.
    Really. All that shooting at the rim and he's 42%, all that drawing attention and dishing and he never got to 8 assists per game either.

    Results. He drives and what happens? The 42% isn't made up, he only did better than that a couple of times. So what are those misses? Blown layups from his great penetration?

    And what is happening on all those passes, guys just miss for him all the time. Korver's 40-45% from 3 isn't enough to make his passes turn into assists, the dumps to bigs inside are constantly being blown at the rim?


    Look, I agree that AI has speed and drives a lot. I disagree that it's nearly as effective as you think it is. If it was then there would be results (stats). You guys argue against the stats, but keep in mind that the most fundamental stat is WINS.

    When you say "he drives to the rim for shots or passes" and then dismiss the numbers as misleading, that's the same as me saying" ignore the 35 wins, the Knicks played great ball all year. At some point you want to see the results start to add up and match what is being claimed to happen.

    If someone says "hundreds of people showed up for the PD party" but the attendence count says "23", then it's not the stat that's misleading someone.

    He's getting shots he can make then he'll make them and his FG% will be strong. He's forcing shots that he can't make and his FG% will be low. He's driving and dishing like nobody else then his assists would be closer to what Knight or Nash or Kidd do, rather than what Tinsley does.

    I could care less if he finishes every first half of the season going 5-13 for 14 points.
    As long as you feel the same way about Jackson. I happen to think all parts of a game matter. Score early and get the big lead and you can taken teams out of it. Shoot poorly and fall behind and you might spend all your energy pressing and trying to catch up.


    IMA - I didn't check but I believe your about the O-REB thing, but my question is "how's that make the AI case?"

  4. #104
    ENABEABLER MagicRat's Avatar
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    Default Re: Vecsey says Pacers offering everyone except JO and Grange for AI

    Quote Originally Posted by Naptown_Seth View Post
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    I will agree that the Pacers have needed a tie game, time to take over player. JO is good late, but not really at the very end of games. But is that part of AI's history, getting and making good shots at the ends of games for the win? Honestly I don't recall one way or the other.
    I was wondering about AI late in games, too. Seems like I remember him making his first ever game-winning buzzer beater against the Pacers not that long ago.

    Anyway, it led me to this page from 82games.com. Only one Pacer made the list and it's not pretty.......

    http://www.82games.com/random12.htm
    PSN: MRat731 XBL: MRat0731

  5. #105
    The Last Great Pacer BlueNGold's Avatar
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    Default Re: Vecsey says Pacers offering everyone except JO and Grange for AI

    Quote Originally Posted by JayRedd View Post
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    If AI's career year of 2005-06 puts him at 25th best in the League in your eyes, I'm really not going to try to debate AI's overall offensive effectiveness with you anymore. Our difference of opinion is obviously just too far apart to really have any meaningful discussion. All due respect.
    I agree. AI has been at times during his career one of the very best players in the NBA. Very best. Not top 10. Like top 3. You cannot even say that about our god Reggie. Whether you like AI's personality is one thing, his talent is just undeniable. People are simply underestimating his value.

    There have been very few years in his career where he had a solid team around him. For example, right now his team is horrible. When he did, he was still young and stupid yet went to the finals. The man gets ALL of the attention from the opposing defense and is still able to score over 30ppg and shoot almost 45% as, basically a SG. He is still lightening quick, something else we lack to the point we don't even know what we are missing.

    Now, if you are concerned about the negatives he brings, you can be sure AI will fit in perfectly with the culture of this team. AI is not the idiot he was several years ago. He may not be a model citizen, but neither are many of our players. We might even have a felon on our roster next year. We were made for him.

    JO is going to be moving out of his prime in a few years. AI is as well. It is time to make this kind of move as a franchise.

  6. #106

    Default Re: Vecsey says Pacers offering everyone except JO and Grange for AI

    Quote Originally Posted by MagicRat View Post
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    I was wondering about AI late in games, too. Seems like I remember him making his first ever game-winning buzzer beater against the Pacers not that long ago.

    Anyway, it led me to this page from 82games.com. Only one Pacer made the list and it's not pretty.......

    http://www.82games.com/random12.htm
    2-14, .143


    ouch!


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