Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 34

Thread: As Sarunas goes, so do the Pacers?

  1. #1

    Default As Sarunas goes, so do the Pacers?

    With the latest stat of the game from www.pacers.com "The Pacers are now 5-0 when Sarunas Jasikevicius scores in double figures and 5-1 when he plays at least 20 minutes." I was wondering if it actually is Sarunas who is more important to our success (or failure) than Tinsley.

    What do you guys think?

    And please, no bashing in this thread!
    Maceo Baston's #1 fan on Pacers Digest!

  2. #2
    DIET COKE! Trader Joe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Troll Hunting
    Age
    26
    Posts
    32,501

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: As Sarunas goes, so do the Pacers?

    I think Sarunas is an important player to this team and thats what has always frustrated me about his inconsistency. The stat maybe slightly misleading but for the most part what I think it shows is that bench play, particularly in the backcourt will be key to this team winning.

    “WE NEVER SURRENDER, WE NEVER GIVE UP, WE KEEP ATTACKING”- Frank Vogel
    momentarygodsblog.com https://twitter.com/momentarygods

  3. #3
    White and Nerdy Anthem's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    23,748

    Default Re: As Sarunas goes, so do the Pacers?

    Sarunas had a nice game, albeit with some poor play that didn't show up in the box score.

    But his best play came when he was the off-guard, playing with Armstrong. He didn't look great when he was playing the point.
    Welcome to Pacers Digest! New around here? Here are three tips for making the forum a great place to talk about Pacers basketball.

    • Log in. Even if you want to read instead of post, it's helpful because it lets you:
    • Change your signature options. You can hide all signatures by choosing "Settings" (top right) then "General Settings" (middle left) and unchecking the box "Show Signatures" (in the "Thread Display Options" area).
    • Create an ignore list. I know it may seem unneighborly. But you're here to talk about the Pacers, not argue with someone who's just looking for an argument. Most of the regular users on here make use (at least occasionally) of the "Ignore" feature. Just go to "Settings" -> "Edit Ignore List" and add the names.

    Enjoy your time at PD!

  4. #4
    DIET COKE! Trader Joe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Troll Hunting
    Age
    26
    Posts
    32,501

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: As Sarunas goes, so do the Pacers?

    Oh as far as the Tins and Runi comparisons as to who is more important I think they both are. When they both have big games we are damn near unstoppable, when one has a good game we are still a good team, but when both struggle we stink.

    “WE NEVER SURRENDER, WE NEVER GIVE UP, WE KEEP ATTACKING”- Frank Vogel
    momentarygodsblog.com https://twitter.com/momentarygods

  5. #5

    Default Re: As Sarunas goes, so do the Pacers?

    Try to take out JO .

    The team is strong when one or two players have off night, other players step in and cover them and the team wins.

    Saras played good 4 or 5 games, but some games he really played **** (for example game against Toronto - his stats and +/- were awful). He's inconsistent.

    We have other players who had carried us to victories, but they are inconsistent too. Tinsley let's say.

    We don't have superstars as Wade, LeBron or Nowitzki, who have off nights very rarely. Otherwise we have JO, who plays very good imo at the moment and is 18 most eff player in NBA (was much lower a week or so ago) and he plays like franchise player now.

    I just want to say, that's very good that Pacers have bench players who can step up and I hope it will last.

    Every player means.
    "Things should be made as simple as possible, but not any simpler."

    - Albert Einstein

  6. #6

    Default Re: As Sarunas goes, so do the Pacers?

    I think overall he's just shown this season that he can have a huge impact on games and dispelled any notions that he doesn't belong in this league. Being paired with DA or Daniels(if he actually made an effort) is a great situation for him. While he struggles to bring the ball up sometimes, there's no denying that in the half-court, the offense should be run through Saras, especially late in games

  7. #7
    STRAIGHT UP pizza guy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Location
    Indiana
    Age
    26
    Posts
    4,011
    Mood

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: As Sarunas goes, so do the Pacers?

    It's simple. When Sarunas plays well, the entire second unit plays well. When he doesn't, it throws the second unit to heck. JO brings it every night, and he's about the only one. When Tinsley plays as well as he can, our first unit is great. And, when Sarunas plays well, our second unit is great.

    All else can change every night, but if the guards bring it like they can, paired with JO bringing it every night, we win. This team is based on a front-court player in JO, so, you have to have good guard play to compliment that if you're going to win. Without it, JO can drop 50, and we'll lose 99-55.

    The importance of Sarunas is the balance we get between first and second units. When he plays well, our second unit isn't much of a drop-off (if any) from our first. But if "bad Sarunas" shows up, it's a long night.
    BLUE COLLAR GOLD SWAGGER

    @The_Real_CJake

  8. #8
    White and Nerdy Anthem's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    23,748

    Default Re: As Sarunas goes, so do the Pacers?

    All I know is, I'd give blood to have the 30-year-old version of D. Armstrong on this team.
    Welcome to Pacers Digest! New around here? Here are three tips for making the forum a great place to talk about Pacers basketball.

    • Log in. Even if you want to read instead of post, it's helpful because it lets you:
    • Change your signature options. You can hide all signatures by choosing "Settings" (top right) then "General Settings" (middle left) and unchecking the box "Show Signatures" (in the "Thread Display Options" area).
    • Create an ignore list. I know it may seem unneighborly. But you're here to talk about the Pacers, not argue with someone who's just looking for an argument. Most of the regular users on here make use (at least occasionally) of the "Ignore" feature. Just go to "Settings" -> "Edit Ignore List" and add the names.

    Enjoy your time at PD!

  9. #9
    Member Israfan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Haifa, Israel
    Posts
    125

    Default Re: As Sarunas goes, so do the Pacers?

    Quote Originally Posted by Anthem View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    All I know is, I'd give blood to have the 30-year-old version of D. Armstrong on this team.
    Death!!!

    Regarding Sarunas importance to win:
    http://www.pacersdigest.com/forums/s...highlight=S-DA
    Yours truly,
    Israfan, former Lithfan

  10. #10
    Pacer Junky Will Galen's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    10,051

    Default Re: As Sarunas goes, so do the Pacers?

    Quote Originally Posted by Alpolloloco View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    "The Pacers are now 5-0 when Sarunas Jasikevicius scores in double figures and 5-1 when he plays at least 20 minutes." I was wondering if it actually is Sarunas who is more important to our success (or failure) than Tinsley.
    I noticed that stat developing a while back but thought it inconclusive and needed more games before deciding it was true or not. Why? It could be that when anyone is hitting from the outside it opens the floor. And two, as for being 5-1 when he plays 20 minutes or more that's self explanatory, because he only plays big minutes when he's playing well.

  11. #11
    Intuition over Integers McKeyFan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Free Lance!
    Posts
    8,220

    Default Re: As Sarunas goes, so do the Pacers?

    Quote Originally Posted by Will Galen View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    I noticed that stat developing a while back but thought it inconclusive and needed more games before deciding it was true or not. Why? It could be that when anyone is hitting from the outside it opens the floor. And two, as for being 5-1 when he plays 20 minutes or more that's self explanatory, because he only plays big minutes when he's playing well.
    Quite frackingly true,

    However . . . since Runi can be inconsistent--and since he can also flip a switch and turn from bad to great--this is the one stat I want to see before all my questions go away and I accept that he is either bad/mediocre or really good:

    What is the Ps record when he plays 20+ minutes for ten games in a row, regardless of whether he plays good or bad?

    In other words, give him the confidence that he won't get yanked, let him be in the game when its on the line, and let's see what the team's record is for those ten games.

    It's the stat that we just never seem to get.
    .

    .

    .

    .


    “People talk about how quiet he [McKey] is, but he’s really been helpful. He gives a lot of insight to players in how to guard certain teams and what their weaknesses are. The whole team listens to him, and it makes my job a lot easier. Having players like him is what pro basketball is all about for me.” —Larry Brown

  12. #12
    STRAIGHT UP pizza guy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Location
    Indiana
    Age
    26
    Posts
    4,011
    Mood

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: As Sarunas goes, so do the Pacers?

    Quote Originally Posted by McKeyFan View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Quite frackingly true,

    However . . . since Runi can be inconsistent--and since he can also flip a switch and turn from bad to great--this is the one stat I want to see before all my questions go away and I accept that he is either bad/mediocre or really good:

    What is the Ps record when he plays 20+ minutes for ten games in a row, regardless of whether he plays good or bad?

    In other words, give him the confidence that he won't get yanked, let him be in the game when its on the line, and let's see what the team's record is for those ten games.

    It's the stat that we just never seem to get.
    I would love to see that. It would be the final determining factor.
    BLUE COLLAR GOLD SWAGGER

    @The_Real_CJake

  13. #13

    Default Re: As Sarunas goes, so do the Pacers?

    I think Sarunas now needs to show he can be consistent for several games in a row (I mean the good Sarunas should ).

    I just wonder, is it possible for all our guys to show up to a single game together .
    I just once would like to see Tins, Al, Fiesty, Runi, S-Jax, DG, Quis, JO all playing to their abilities at a single game. I don't care if we lose 3 in a row after that. I don't care about the whole season after that

  14. #14
    Banned Fool's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Posts
    2,408

    Default Re: As Sarunas goes, so do the Pacers?

    Quote Originally Posted by McKeyFan View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Quite frackingly true,

    However . . . since Runi can be inconsistent--and since he can also flip a switch and turn from bad to great--this is the one stat I want to see before all my questions go away and I accept that he is either bad/mediocre or really good:

    What is the Ps record when he plays 20+ minutes for ten games in a row, regardless of whether he plays good or bad?

    In other words, give him the confidence that he won't get yanked, let him be in the game when its on the line, and let's see what the team's record is for those ten games.

    It's the stat that we just never seem to get.
    I realize you are talking about this year, but he had stretches of such time last year. http://www.basketball-reference.com/...sa01_2006.html

    The 2 stretches I saw (20+ minutes for 10+ games) the Pacers were 7-6 in 13 games and 6-5 in 11 games

  15. #15

    Default Re: As Sarunas goes, so do the Pacers?

    Quote Originally Posted by Seed View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    I just once would like to see Tins, Al, Fiesty, Runi, S-Jax, DG, Quis, JO all playing to their abilities at a single game. I don't care if we lose 3 in a row after that. I don't care about the whole season after that
    They would give Pacers and everybody would be free after that one game
    "Things should be made as simple as possible, but not any simpler."

    - Albert Einstein

  16. #16
    Intuition over Integers McKeyFan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Free Lance!
    Posts
    8,220

    Default Re: As Sarunas goes, so do the Pacers?

    Quote Originally Posted by Fool View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    I realize you are talking about this year, but he had stretches of such time last year. http://www.basketball-reference.com/...sa01_2006.html

    The 2 stretches I saw (20+ minutes for 10+ games) the Pacers were 7-6 in 13 games and 6-5 in 11 games
    I would count that, as well. But the question is, did he really play 20+ minutes for ten games in a row? I'm doubting that.
    .

    .

    .

    .


    “People talk about how quiet he [McKey] is, but he’s really been helpful. He gives a lot of insight to players in how to guard certain teams and what their weaknesses are. The whole team listens to him, and it makes my job a lot easier. Having players like him is what pro basketball is all about for me.” —Larry Brown

  17. #17
    Intuition over Integers McKeyFan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Free Lance!
    Posts
    8,220

    Default Re: As Sarunas goes, so do the Pacers?

    Quote Originally Posted by Seed View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    I think Sarunas now needs to show he can be consistent for several games in a row
    Cart before the horse. He can't be consistent for several games in a row if he can't have an off game or two. That would mess with anyone's head.

    How often do JO, Al, Tins or Granger have a bad game. Oh, about every fourth or fifth.
    .

    .

    .

    .


    “People talk about how quiet he [McKey] is, but he’s really been helpful. He gives a lot of insight to players in how to guard certain teams and what their weaknesses are. The whole team listens to him, and it makes my job a lot easier. Having players like him is what pro basketball is all about for me.” —Larry Brown

  18. #18
    Intuition over Integers McKeyFan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Free Lance!
    Posts
    8,220

    Default Re: As Sarunas goes, so do the Pacers?

    Quote Originally Posted by McKeyFan View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    I would count that, as well. But the question is, did he really play 20+ minutes for ten games in a row? I'm doubting that.
    Not doubting it anymore.

    Just went to the link that you provided

    Interesting summary:

    During the first stretch of 13 games he shot 52% from the field, and 38% from 3point. His Assist/Turnover was 4/1.8.

    During the second stretch of 11 games he shot 42% from the field and 42% from 3point. His assist/turnover ratio was 3.6/2.1.

    He seemed to decline a bit on the second stretch, although 42 percent from 3-point land is pretty good.

    If you buy the idea that Sarunas brings floor intangibles--enthusiasm, good in the clutch, and leadership (spare me the Korver story, please)--then this stat is revealing:

    When Runi played 20+ minutes (consistently) we won 54 percent of our games.

    When he didn't, we won 47 percent of our games.
    .

    .

    .

    .


    “People talk about how quiet he [McKey] is, but he’s really been helpful. He gives a lot of insight to players in how to guard certain teams and what their weaknesses are. The whole team listens to him, and it makes my job a lot easier. Having players like him is what pro basketball is all about for me.” —Larry Brown

  19. #19

    Default Re: As Sarunas goes, so do the Pacers?

    Quote Originally Posted by Alpolloloco View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    With the latest stat of the game from www.pacers.com "The Pacers are now 5-0 when Sarunas Jasikevicius scores in double figures and 5-1 when he plays at least 20 minutes." I was wondering if it actually is Sarunas who is more important to our success (or failure) than Tinsley.

    What do you guys think?

    And please, no bashing in this thread!


    I think the stat says a lot more about Tinsley's play than Saras'. 5-1 when Saras plays 20+minutes means that we're 3-6 when Tinsley is getting more minutes. I think he's played consistently mediocre, and that allows for a good record when Sarunas can come in, play well, and take some of Tins' minutes.

  20. #20

    Default Re: As Sarunas goes, so do the Pacers?

    http://www.nba.com/pacers/news/question_061129.html

    QOD with Bruno
    Why Has Jasikevicius’ Playing Time Fluctuated?

    Q. What is up with Sarunas Jasikevicius' playing time? I know another fan asked a similar question at the end of last season but I don't understand why he can score 20 points one night and get 1:36 of playing time the next. There are the knocks on his defense and the presence of (Jamaal) Tinsley as well as well as (Darrell) Armstrong at point. I still think Sarunas should get 10 to 12 minutes per game, ideally splitting time just about down the middle with Tinsley and leaving Armstrong on the bench save serious foul trouble or injury. If he continues to play less than four minutes most nights, I'd hate to see him end up starting for someone else and averaging 20 points per game while Tinsley battles injuries and provides little offensive firepower. (From Will in northern California)

    A. Among the many players with unsettled roles to this point, Jasikevicius stands out. He has played both backcourt positions and has occasionally produced impressive numbers and inspirational play. But consistency has been a major issue. He'll play terrific one night, then be a non-entity the next. Is his playing time fluctuating because his play has been up and down? Or has his play been fluctuating because his minutes have been up and down? It's the old chicken-or-egg argument and I'm not sure there's a right answer.
    The last few games have offered a crystallization of his season. He was very good in Portland with 17 points, seven assists and four rebounds in nearly 31 minutes. Sunday in Toronto, however, he missed all six of his shots and managed one point and three assists in 24 minutes. The night before against Cleveland he scored 15 points with three assists in 29 minutes. In the previous game, three points in 13 minutes. In the Pacers' last three victories, he averaged 14.0 points and shot .517 from the floor. In the last three losses, he totaled four points on 1-of-11 shooting.
    It seems pretty clear his production is important to the team. The Pacers are 5-0 when he scores in double figures. For the time being, it appears Tinsley and Armstrong will get most of the minutes at point guard with Jasikevicius coming off the bench at shooting guard. He and Armstrong have generally played very well together as both bring energy and an unselfish nature to the floor. Having Armstrong and Danny Granger flanking him, defensively, also helps. If playing time is an indicator, Jasikevicius is getting the chance to cement a consistent role in the rotation. He has played at least 24 minutes in each of the last three games after doing so just thrice in his first 11 appearances. As Coach Rick Carlisle gains confidence in his decision-making, Jasikevicius appears to be finding a nice rhythm. He's a valuable piece of the puzzle, not just because of his shooting but also for his creativity and passion. All he needs now is to string together some consistent performances to further entrench himself as a vital role-player.

  21. #21

    Default Re: As Sarunas goes, so do the Pacers?

    Given that the PACERS are the worst shooting team in the league (41.9% entering the Portland game) no wonder we seem to always gravitate back to
    someone who, at least on occasion, can shoot competently (not like he can do anything else well).

    It's a love fest. It's LAUGHABLE but a lovefest nonetheless.

    Sadly indicative, as well, of the quality of players on this team.

  22. #22

    Default Re: As Sarunas goes, so do the Pacers?

    Quote Originally Posted by v_d_g View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Given that the PACERS are the worst shooting team in the league (41.9% entering the Portland game) no wonder we seem to always gravitate back to
    someone who, at least on occasion, can shoot competently (not like he can do anything else well).

    It's a love fest. It's LAUGHABLE but a lovefest nonetheless.

    Sadly indicative, as well, of the quality of players on this team.
    You can shoot 60 % every night and still lose. There are more aspects of the game also. You won't win a game making 3 FG from 4 with 75 %.

    This team of bad shooters has 4th record in the East. Not a tragedy.

    Why don't you search for positive things? For example assists - 6th in the league (Pacers make +3.60 assists more than opponents - 4th place), 2nd in blocks, 8th in steals, 10th in FT%???
    "Things should be made as simple as possible, but not any simpler."

    - Albert Einstein

  23. #23
    Member Dr. Goldfoot's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Indianapolis
    Age
    38
    Posts
    1,428

    Default Re: As Sarunas goes, so do the Pacers?

    Quote Originally Posted by imawhat View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    I think the stat says a lot more about Tinsley's play than Saras'. 5-1 when Saras plays 20+minutes means that we're 3-6 when Tinsley is getting more minutes. I think he's played consistently mediocre, and that allows for a good record when Sarunas can come in, play well, and take some of Tins' minutes.

    Runi doesn't seem to be taking any time away from Tinsley. In the six games he played 20 minutes or more Mel Mel is still getting 28.7 MPG compared to 29.3 on the year. Those numbers include his season low 23 minutes vs the Blazers. Runi is playing the majority of his minutes at the two guard.

    In fact in those 6 games one could argue Tinsley had just as much top do with the wins statistically speaking. They both are hitting their threes in those games. Jamaal 6/15 .400 Runi 9/18 .500. They both are getting to the line..Jamaal 21/28 .750 Runi 21/24 .875. Tins is getting 4.7 rebs and 6.5 ast Runi is at 2.0 reb and 3.8 ast. Tins is getting over 1 spg and 12.8 PPG Runi is at 12.7 ppg.

  24. #24

    Default Re: As Sarunas goes, so do the Pacers?

    Quote Originally Posted by indy0731 View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Oh as far as the Tins and Runi comparisons as to who is more important I think they both are. When they both have big games we are damn near unstoppable, when one has a good game we are still a good team, but when both struggle we stink.
    So true, so true.

    You can't discount either's effectiveness. One is a great passer and setup guy, the other a good "show-time" passer and shooter. Both bring something different to the table, and when their at the top of their game collectively or individually, the team does very well. So, here's hoping both can establish some consistency in what they bring to the hardwood and both can stay healthy throughout the season.

  25. #25

    Default Re: As Sarunas goes, so do the Pacers?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Goldfoot View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Runi doesn't seem to be taking any time away from Tinsley. In the six games he played 20 minutes or more Mel Mel is still getting 28.7 MPG compared to 29.3 on the year. Those numbers include his season low 23 minutes vs the Blazers. Runi is playing the majority of his minutes at the two guard.


    Maybe I should fact check before posting. Interesting.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •