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Thread: The booing needs to stop

  1. #26
    Member bulldog's Avatar
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    Default Re: The booing needs to stop

    It's only gonna get worse. People are gonna jump on the booing bandwagon, they don't like to boo alone, seeing everyone else do it will give'em courage.

    Booing is like democracy: it's the worst form of expressing your displeasure with the team, except for all of the others. What else do you want fans to do? They want a change, let'em boo.

  2. #27
    Member Speed's Avatar
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    Default Re: The booing needs to stop

    Dude, they booed the Colts two weeks ago in the first half, I don't think Jax is gonna get a break.

  3. #28
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    Default Re: The booing needs to stop

    If it means anything... I really dislike the booing too and would like it to stop... I really don't think its productive and feel that it is classless...
    Here, everyone have a : on me

  4. #29
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    Default Re: The booing needs to stop

    Quote Originally Posted by imawhat View Post
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    They're smart enough to figure it out, but I'm thinking less of them every day.
    I agree, but I would not use the word "they". Bird has yet to earn any respect as a GM. He is the one that starred on the magazine cover with Ron Ron and Sarunas was his brain child. Not real bright moves IMO.

  5. #30
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    Default Re: The booing needs to stop

    A.) I think the boo'ing should continue until he's either exonerated by the courts or traded. He's made his choices, now he has to deal with the consequences. I do feel bad for the rest of the players that they're stuck with fans that are fed-up with the antics of our team. But the fans made it really clear late last season that Stephen Jackson wasn't living up to their expectations, and its only gotten worse since then. What choice do they have other than to boo him and management? If there were no-shows, you'd be complaining about that, too. This team doesn't deserve "unquestioned" support.

    B.) Its a shame TPTB continues to underestimate the fans' dissatisfaction with the team.

    Here's the result of my email:

    Hi Jay,

    I hope you're doing well! Unfortunately, at this point, there are no refunds. If you are wanting to cancel, we can go forward with that, but the money on your account would just show as a credit to be used for other games, etc.

    We do not have a reinstatement policy. Chances are if you give up your package where you're located, it will be gone pretty quickly. Should you decide to come back, I will do my best to get you your seats, or comparable seats.

    I apologize for the inconvenience and I also can understand your frustrations. We are disappointed as well, but I also know that there are the other players and employees of the Pacers, that have worked hard all summer to make things better. I am trusting them and giving them a chance. I hope you're willing to do the same for me, Jay.

    Please let me know what I can do for you.
    My original email was,

    Krista,

    I’m sure you’re getting these questions a lot.

    Is there a refund policy for fans that don’t want to watch a certain player in legal trouble on the court representing the Pacers?

    Is there a reinstatement policy for fans that cancel but wish to resume their tickets if/ when that same player is either (1) no longer with the Pacers, or (2) exonerated by the courts?

    We’re not sure what we want to do – and obviously these things take time and right now we’re willing to wait until the dust settles or closer to the start of the regular season. I was just wondering what the option were.

    Regards, Jay
    Ultimately, I'm still swayed by the fact that there are a bunch of frontcourt players on this team that I like. But we could really use a new backcourt if TPTB wants the boo'ing to stop.
    Why do the things that we treasure most, slip away in time
    Till to the music we grow deaf, to God's beauty blind
    Why do the things that connect us slowly pull us apart?
    Till we fall away in our own darkness, a stranger to our own hearts
    And life itself, rushing over me
    Life itself, the wind in black elms,
    Life itself in your heart and in your eyes, I can't make it without you


  6. #31

    Default Re: The booing needs to stop

    Quote Originally Posted by krista
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    I hope you're willing to do the same for me, Jay.

    Please let me know what I can do for you.
    Jay, Krista is after you! Ask her to send pictures...



    The poster "pacertom" since this forum began (and before!). I changed my name here to "Slick Pinkham" in honor of the imaginary player That Bobby "Slick" Leonard picked late in the 1971 ABA draft (true story!)

  7. #32

    Default Re: The booing needs to stop

    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck View Post
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    So do you think TPTB are too stupid to figure out that the fans aren't happy with Jax, and the only way they will figure it out is if the fans boo him. Do many of you really think that little of DW and Bird.
    I'm sure that they know it.

    But if the booing totally stopped, they would think that the fans have gotten over it. The continued booing is a constant reminder that they have work to do.
    The poster "pacertom" since this forum began (and before!). I changed my name here to "Slick Pinkham" in honor of the imaginary player That Bobby "Slick" Leonard picked late in the 1971 ABA draft (true story!)

  8. #33
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    Default Re: The booing needs to stop

    Quote Originally Posted by Jay@Section19 View Post
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    A.) I think the boo'ing should continue until he's either exonerated by the courts or traded. He's made his choices, now he has to deal with the consequences. I do feel bad for the rest of the players that they're stuck with fans that are fed-up with the antics of our team. But the fans made it really clear late last season that Stephen Jackson wasn't living up to their expectations, and its only gotten worse since then. What choice do they have other than to boo him and management? If there were no-shows, you'd be complaining about that, too. This team doesn't deserve "unquestioned" support.

    B.) Its a shame TPTB continues to underestimate the fans' dissatisfaction with the team.

    Here's the result of my email:



    My original email was,



    Ultimately, I'm still swayed by the fact that there are a bunch of frontcourt players on this team that I like. But we could really use a new backcourt if TPTB wants the boo'ing to stop.
    *VA sits back and waits for the "your not a real fan" and "your a hater" threads.*

    I still have no clue why Jackson is on this team. I think that purely from a business POV that was the stupidest thing TPTB could do, and I have no clue why the Simons signed off on it.

    Oh well, if the non stop booing does not get the message across, maybe having empty seats will get the job done.

  9. #34
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    Default Re: The booing needs to stop

    I have been a season ticket holder since the ABA days. The one thing this franchise always had, was quality players. I'm not talking about their game performance, but what kind of people they are. Look at what this team has now. We have a bunch of "thugs". I don't like watching street ball. I can go over to the park and watch Pacer basketball. The team has gone to the dogs. This team is not going to win. We need to clean house, starting with our "team leaders". There is an obvious lack of leadership.

    Am I a fair weather fan? No. I remember how bad we were after our ABA championships. I kept my season tickets through all of that. The players worked hard, and cared. Remember the game against the Magic after the brawl? No one plays that way on this team anymore. It is obvious that the players do not care. They don't care about this quality organization, themselves, the game, or the fans.

    That is why we boo.

  10. #35
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    Default Re: The booing needs to stop

    Quote Originally Posted by Bridge View Post
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    I have been a season ticket holder since the ABA days.

    That is why we boo.
    WOW

    The man has been a member of PD since 05 and this was only his third post. Another sign the natives are restless.
    You know how hippos are made out to be sweet and silly, like big cows, but are actually extremely dangerous and can kill you with stunning brutality? The Pacers are the NBA's hippos....Matt Moore CBS Sports....

  11. #36
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    Default Re: The booing needs to stop

    From a purely selfish standpoint, I endorse bringing Stephen Jackson back, because there's no way in hell he's going to go a full 82-game season without completely losing his mind at least once, especially if he gets booed by his own fans.

    Like Artest, I'm just glad I'm out of his blast radius.

    I have no idea why Bird insists on torpedoing his own franchise, but I'm not going to complain.

    It wasn't about being the team everyone loved, it was about beating the teams everyone else loved.

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  12. #37
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    Default Re: The booing needs to stop

    Quote Originally Posted by vapacersfan View Post
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    *VA sits back and waits for the "your not a real fan" and "your a hater" threads.*

    I still have no clue why Jackson is on this team. I think that purely from a business POV that was the stupidest thing TPTB could do, and I have no clue why the Simons signed off on it.

    Oh well, if the non stop booing does not get the message across, maybe having empty seats will get the job done.
    TPTB already compounded the problem by putting Jack on the floor. They should have never put him out there. This is perhaps more troubling to me than Jack's actions themselves.

    The only reasons you would conceivably put Jack out there at this point would be to 1) raise his trade value or 2) win more games. I don't think either of those reasons are enough to further tick off the fans considering the fact Jack is just not that good compared to other players that will be available. There is just not a large drop off from Jack to Quis or Granger considering everything they bring to the game. Let Harrington play SF and put Foster, Powell, Baston and Harrison on the floor more minutes. We have enough front court bodies to allow Granger to split time with Quis at the 2.

  13. #38
    Administrator Unclebuck's Avatar
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    Default Re: The booing needs to stop

    OK, what do you want TPTB to do with Jackson right now. Don't talk about past mistakes, talk about what you want the pacers to do now. Keep in mind there are legal issues involved and the players union involved here.

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    Default Re: The booing needs to stop

    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck View Post
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    OK, what do you want TPTB to do with Jackson right now. Domn't talk about past mistakes, talk about what you want the pacers to do now. Keep in mind there are legal issues involved and the players union involved here.
    Put him on the inactive list.

    You are right. There are issues with the NBAPA. That is why you put him on the "suspended with pay" list.

  15. #40

    Default Re: The booing needs to stop

    Suspend him indefinitely. If Doc Rivers can suspend Orien Greene for driving 90 in a 35 (or whatever it was), then TPTB can suspend Jax indefinitely.

  16. #41
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    Default Re: The booing needs to stop

    Quote Originally Posted by BlueNGold View Post
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    There is just not a large drop off from Jack to Quis or Granger considering everything they bring to the game. Let Harrington play SF and put Foster, Powell, Baston and Harrison on the floor more minutes. We have enough front court bodies to allow Granger to split time with Quis at the 2.
    Where have you observed this? I don't recall seeing any notable games in which we could all be assured that Marquis and Danny will fill in for Jack, without losing any productivity. Let's wait until the regular season and then you can make your points. Until then, it's unfair to assume Jack can be replaced by Marquis Daniels...

  17. #42

    Default Re: The booing needs to stop

    The booing will eventually stop once people realize how dumb they look when they do it.

  18. #43
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    Default Re: The booing needs to stop

    Quote Originally Posted by Black Sox View Post
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    The booing will eventually stop once people realize how dumb they look when they do it.
    I fail to see how booing can make anybody look dumb.

    Looking dumb is booing when a injured player gets carted off the field (or is that just classless? You decide.) but booing because you are not happy with the product you are receiving is from from "dumb".

    When I order a item and I am unhappy with it, I return it and get a refund. I let the company know I was not happy with the product/service I received. This is what fans do when they boo, and I am still amazed any person can still have the you should be "100 % loyal and never boo, no matter what" attitude. There is a place between being a "hater" and being a "supporter". It is called reality. Sadly, reality is many of us saw some incident coming long, long, ago. TPTB choose to roll the dice, and [once again] they have been burned.

  19. #44
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    Default Re: The booing needs to stop

    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck View Post
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    OK, what do you want TPTB to do with Jackson right now. Domn't talk about past mistakes, talk about what you want the pacers to do now. Keep in mind there are legal issues involved and the players union involved here.
    First, bench him or tell him to stay home. Let the legal system do its work. If he is exonerated, the people should accept him. If convicted, void his contract that day and advertise it in the papers.

    In the meantime, work on a trade. Take a loss if necessary. He will never be a great player at this point...and although he is currently our most talented SG, let the others develop. Let Granger or Quis start at SG. Either can handle the position. Move Al to SF, JO to PF and Harrison or Foster to C.

    If he is exonerated and not tradeable, take a poll from the fans and determine whether we should eat his contract or play him. Let the people decide!....or at least listen to them.

  20. #45
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    Default Re: The booing needs to stop

    Quote Originally Posted by ajbry View Post
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    Where have you observed this? I don't recall seeing any notable games in which we could all be assured that Marquis and Danny will fill in for Jack, without losing any productivity. Let's wait until the regular season and then you can make your points. Until then, it's unfair to assume Jack can be replaced by Marquis Daniels...
    I'm a streaky shooter, and I'm turnover prone.

    If I can learn to hold on to the ball too long, *I* can replace SJax.

    Stephen Jackson offends me more as a dumb/ bad/ overerated basketball player than his off-court nonsense (although it adds evidence that he just don't make good decisions anywhere, anytime.)
    Why do the things that we treasure most, slip away in time
    Till to the music we grow deaf, to God's beauty blind
    Why do the things that connect us slowly pull us apart?
    Till we fall away in our own darkness, a stranger to our own hearts
    And life itself, rushing over me
    Life itself, the wind in black elms,
    Life itself in your heart and in your eyes, I can't make it without you


  21. #46
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    Default Re: The booing needs to stop

    Quote Originally Posted by ajbry View Post
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    Where have you observed this? I don't recall seeing any notable games in which we could all be assured that Marquis and Danny will fill in for Jack, without losing any productivity. Let's wait until the regular season and then you can make your points. Until then, it's unfair to assume Jack can be replaced by Marquis Daniels...
    Marquis averaged double figures for a better team and shot a much better FG% than Jack. Jack averaged more points but he played more minutes and took many more shots. In any event, points per minute played were comparable. So, talent-wise I think Quis can handle it. ...and if you look at the value of their contracts, Quis is valued in the same neighborhood as Jack. Granger will be more valuable.

    Not saying there won't be a small drop-off. Jack is a talented player....but Quis and Granger are not far behind at all.

  22. #47
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    Default Re: The booing needs to stop

    Quote Originally Posted by Jay@Section19 View Post
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    I'm a streaky shooter, and I'm turnover prone.

    If I can learn to hold on to the ball too long, *I* can replace SJax.
    You just described most perimeter players in the league. Jack has his faults, but it certainly doesn't merit any discredit in regards to his play. He's a good player - like it or not.

  23. #48

    Default Re: The booing needs to stop

    Quote Originally Posted by ajbry View Post
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    You just described most perimeter players in the league. Jack has his faults, but it certainly doesn't merit any discredit in regards to his play. He's a good player ... not.
    fixed

  24. #49

    Default Re: The booing needs to stop

    Quote Originally Posted by ajbry
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    Where have you observed this?



    Quote Originally Posted by BlueNGold
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    There is just not a large drop off from Jack to Quis or Granger considering everything they bring to the game.
    It is there, ajbry. BNG emphasizes the whole game, not just scoring. Jackson had a higher rate of scoring last year, but he took too many shots to make those points. Quis and Granger both had higher scoring percentages.

    FG percentage

    Jackson .41
    Granger .46
    Daniels .48

    Or look at rebounds

    Jackson 5.1 rebounds per 48 minutes
    Daniels 6.1
    Granger 10.5

    Cover up the names, and then tell you you'd rather have the guy with the lowest FG percentage and the fewest rebounds.
    And I won't be here to see the day
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  25. #50
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    Default Re: The booing needs to stop

    Quote Originally Posted by ajbry View Post
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    You just described most perimeter players in the league. Jack has his faults, but it certainly doesn't merit any discredit in regards to his play. He's a good player - like it or not.
    A. No, there are many, many perimeter players better than SJax.

    B. He's generally near the bottom of all SGs/ SFs in terms of FG% and turnovers. He's also near the top on he FG% and scoring standard deviations, which is not really a good thing. Statistically, he's much more up-and-down (IOW, much less consistent) than the typical NBA SG or SF.

    C. Even if his stats were closer to the average (not even the top players) for his position, his basketballIQ is so much lower than any player not named Darius Miles that its a (bad) joke.

    D. The only reason his "scoring" stat is as good as it seems is because he dominates the ball too much, shoots too much, etc. His scoring is an output of shooting volume, and his shot selection is often atrocious (but every once in a while he hits every bad shot he throws up at the basket, encouraging a few more games of the same bad behavior until the cycle repeats.)
    Why do the things that we treasure most, slip away in time
    Till to the music we grow deaf, to God's beauty blind
    Why do the things that connect us slowly pull us apart?
    Till we fall away in our own darkness, a stranger to our own hearts
    And life itself, rushing over me
    Life itself, the wind in black elms,
    Life itself in your heart and in your eyes, I can't make it without you


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