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Thread: Why Hasnít Foster Developed Offensive Game? Q.O.D 8-14-06

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    Default Why Hasnít Foster Developed Offensive Game? Q.O.D 8-14-06

    Why Hasnít Foster Developed Offensive Game?

    Monday, Aug. 14, 2006

    QUESTION
    OF THE DAY
    Conrad Brunner


    Q
    . We all know that Jeff Foster is one of the league's best per-minute rebounders. I am wondering if the Pacers ever tried to develop his offensive game, I.E. develop a jump hook or other inside moves. It just seems to me that he gives the Pacers so much on the boards, it's a shame he's never been able to provide just a little more scoring to give J.O. the alternate inside offensive threat that is needed. (From Mark in Bloomington, Ind.)

    A. In order to find a picture to illustrate this article, I logged into the NBA's photo server and began searching for images of our favorite feisty center. When I typed in the keywords "Jeff Foster," fully 932 images appeared. When I typed in the keywords "Jeff Foster scores" there were, well, eight. That pretty well sums up Foster's game. It's not hard to find him doing just about everything else. But if you want to see him score, you're probably going to be disappointed.

    I'm sure there were Pistons fans who believed Ben Wallace should've either been given more opportunity to score, or could've developed something of an offensive game. I'm sure there will soon be Bulls fans who feel the same. This is not to say Foster is on Wallace's level as an overall force but he fits the same basic profile. He does the dirty work: loose balls, deflections, floor burns, etc. He is one of the game's most productive rebounders, particularly on the offensive glass, and plays with a relentless energy.

    He's one of those guys that can make a starting lineup work because he doesn't demand the ball. If he wants it, he'll go get it. That leaves more shots for the scorers, and that generally is good for chemistry. It's nearly impossible to construct a successful lineup that features five scorers. In fact, I can't remember any. Most great teams have three; Detroit won it all with four and that was a rarity.

    That said, would it help if Foster was able to develop one reliable offensive weapon? Absolutely, although I don't think he needs to be able to score from the post. If Foster had a consistent mid-range jumper, either from the baseline or high post, it would really help the offense because of the space it would create inside. But he's 29 now and has been in the league seven seasons, so it's safe to assume he is basically a finished product, and that's not a criticism. He can't do it all, but it's certainly does a lot.

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    Default Re: Why Hasnít Foster Developed Offensive Game? Q.O.D 8-14-06

    How many times has this topic been brought up? When will people learn that there are players who don't score, but do other things well.


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    Member Doug's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why Hasnít Foster Developed Offensive Game? Q.O.D 8-14-06

    Bah!

    I just see a lot of excuses and rationalizations.

    There is NO excuse for Jeff not having some sort of offensive weapon by now. I too appreciate what he does bring to the floor, but that does not make up for the fact that other teams DO NOT HAVE TO GUARD HIM! And that hurts the team. Mid-range jumper? Heck, he's had seven years to develop one. And he hasn't. He's capable of it. This, IMO, is almost as bad as McKey's "I am what I am" attitude. And to suggest that 29 he's over the hill and we should just give up waiting for him to improve is rediculous. I expect every single player on the roster to work on improving their game. Did Reggie ever say "I'm a good enough shooter, I don't have to work at any more."? Or, more to the point, did he ever say "I'm a great shooter so I don't have to play defense." No - his defense improved pretty much every year. It was never great, but it did improve.

    Heck, I'm 40 and I expect to improve every year.

    No excuses for Jeff. Develop a #!$#!$ jump shot already!
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    NaptownSeth is all feel Naptown_Seth's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why Hasnít Foster Developed Offensive Game? Q.O.D 8-14-06

    Whoa, how is this for timing. Here's the photo I took about an hour ago and posted in the Sekou Blog/Harrington thread...




    So it's not for lack of trying. From what I saw he was working on 10' catch and shoots.

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    Default Re: Why Hasnít Foster Developed Offensive Game? Q.O.D 8-14-06

    Quote Originally Posted by Mac_Daddy View Post
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    How many times has this topic been brought up?
    Exactly 455,536 times. (grin)

    You have to remember some people are just becoming fans so the same questions get asked.

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    Default Re: Why Hasnít Foster Developed Offensive Game? Q.O.D 8-14-06

    Seems to me Bruno was stumped on the topic for the day, did not want to comment on the Al situation. Bruno conveniently spots Foster working on his shot today and ...

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    Default Re: Why Hasnít Foster Developed Offensive Game? Q.O.D 8-14-06

    Foster has to be both a coach's dream and nightmare. You can probably figure out the dream part of it.

    But why the heck can't he hit a 15-foot jumper? His form's good. In warmups he swishes them. But come gametime he short-arms them and CLANG!

    I believe he hits layups in warmups too.
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    Default Re: Why Hasnít Foster Developed Offensive Game? Q.O.D 8-14-06

    "He's one of those guys that can make a starting lineup work because he doesn't demand the ball. "

    He's one of those guys that just shouldn't be in a starting lineup.
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    Default Re: Why Hasnít Foster Developed Offensive Game? Q.O.D 8-14-06

    Quote Originally Posted by Naptown_Seth View Post
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    Whoa, how is this for timing. Here's the photo I took about an hour ago and posted in the Sekou Blog/Harrington thread...




    So it's not for lack of trying. From what I saw he was working on 10' catch and shoots.
    I would hope that Foster works more on his low-post to mid-range jumpshots. As one of our better rebounders...I really don't want him that far away from the paint.
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    Default Re: Why Hasnít Foster Developed Offensive Game? Q.O.D 8-14-06

    Quote Originally Posted by Frank Slade View Post
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    Seems to me Bruno was stumped on the topic for the day, did not want to comment on the Al situation. Bruno conveniently spots Foster working on his shot today and ...
    Naptown Seth = Bruno?

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    Default Re: Why Hasnít Foster Developed Offensive Game? Q.O.D 8-14-06

    Quote Originally Posted by CableKC View Post
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    I would hope that Foster works more on his low-post to mid-range jumpshots. As one of our better rebounders...I really don't want him that far away from the paint.
    I sure do. If he's in the paint along with JO, then Jermaine gets guarded by two guys. If he can pull back to 10' or so, then Jermaine gets more room to work.

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    NaptownSeth is all feel Naptown_Seth's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why Hasnít Foster Developed Offensive Game? Q.O.D 8-14-06

    Quote Originally Posted by Anthem View Post
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    Naptown Seth = Bruno?
    Sadly no. I get paid a healthy zip/hour for writing about the Pacers. I hope Bruno is doing better than that.


    Just odd timing, and his article was up before I took that photo and probably long before Jeff hit the court. If anything you'd think Jeff read it and said "F that man."

    Actually I'm sure this is just part of the routine for Jeff, just as we've heard about the other Pacers working out this summer. Here's the coolest thing to me, Jeff was working out with the curtains up, even on Delaware, instead of going snob/secret and having them lowered so passers-by couldn't see. I love that "just part of the community" feel the open view practice gym has.

    I might have to swing by the arena more often during my free time to catch some other guys hitting the gym.


    BTW, in the photo posted Jeff had already faded back off his shot, he wasn't that far out. In fact he was just going around the rim in that drill, generally closer than that. Just far enough back to make team's play honest.

    I hope this is a sign that he's staying with the Pacers after all the trade rumors. He's not a perfect answer, but I still like rooting for him due to his attitude and type of game.

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    Boom Baby'er ABADays's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why Hasnít Foster Developed Offensive Game? Q.O.D 8-14-06

    It is interesting though that a former guard has no offensive game. How did that happen?
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    Default Re: Why Hasnít Foster Developed Offensive Game? Q.O.D 8-14-06

    Can't believe someone hasn't said the most obvious answer.

    Answer: Because he took down his outside goal at home. DUH! He has no where to actually practice.

    Nice photoshop job though Seth.

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    Default Re: Why Hasnít Foster Developed Offensive Game? Q.O.D 8-14-06

    Becuase he surrounds himself with people like UB.

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    Default Re: Why Hasnít Foster Developed Offensive Game? Q.O.D 8-14-06

    Quote Originally Posted by Gamble View Post
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    Becuase he surrounds himself with people like UB.
    I still love Jeff Foster

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    Default Re: Why Hasnít Foster Developed Offensive Game? Q.O.D 8-14-06

    Quote Originally Posted by Since86 View Post
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    Can't believe someone hasn't said the most obvious answer.

    Answer: Because he took down his outside goal at home. DUH! He has no where to actually practice.

    Nice photoshop job though Seth.
    Damnit! I was just coming in to say this.

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    Default Re: Why Hasnít Foster Developed Offensive Game? Q.O.D 8-14-06

    Quote Originally Posted by Fool View Post
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    Damnit! I was just coming in to say this.
    I didn't even open this thread for the longest time, because I figured it wouldn't have anything but jokes in it.

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    Default Re: Why Hasnít Foster Developed Offensive Game? Q.O.D 8-14-06

    Quote Originally Posted by Frank Slade View Post
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    He's one of those guys that can make a starting lineup work because he doesn't demand the ball. If he wants it, he'll go get it. That leaves more shots for the scorers, and that generally is good for chemistry. It's nearly impossible to construct a successful lineup that features five scorers. In fact, I can't remember any. Most great teams have three; Detroit won it all with four and that was a rarity.
    Uh..... wrong.

    Its not that he "doesn't demand the ball." Its that he is inept, doesn't need to be guarded, and allows opponents to double-team JO without recourse. He "isn't allowed to have the ball." There's a big difference between the two.

    If he were a competent offensive player and then voluntarily deferred an didn't demand the ball - that would be great. (Derrick McKey, Jr.) But that's not what's going on here. He can barely catch the damn ball cleanly without a turnover, let alone hit an open shot well enough to keep his man honest.

    Miami put a team on the court with five "good" offensive players that understood their roles. Yes, Wade got the most shots because he was the #1 option. But JayWill, Shaq, Walker and even Posey are at least "competent/ capable" on the offensive end of the court.

    Is there a single thing (other than rebounding) that Jeff is "competent/ capable" of on the offensive end of the court? He doesn't set great screens. He doesn't handle the ball well (especially considering he was a guard). I don't care if he ever turns into an offensive juggernaut. But make the opponents pay for double-team.
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    White and Nerdy Anthem's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why Hasnít Foster Developed Offensive Game? Q.O.D 8-14-06

    Quote Originally Posted by Jay@Section204 View Post
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    Is there a single thing (other than rebounding) that Jeff is "competent/ capable" of on the offensive end of the court? He doesn't set great screens.
    He certainly used to be terrible at screens, but I think he's pretty good these days.

    That doesn't negate the rest of your point, though.

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    NaptownSeth is all feel Naptown_Seth's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why Hasnít Foster Developed Offensive Game? Q.O.D 8-14-06

    Quote Originally Posted by Since86 View Post
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    Can't believe someone hasn't said the most obvious answer.

    Answer: Because he took down his outside goal at home. DUH! He has no where to actually practice.

    Nice photoshop job though Seth.
    I've got a couple more and can put them up at 3kx2k if you'd like to check em. I forgot to get Jeff to hold a copy of today's paper in them.

    Besides, I use PSPro.
    If I had skills enough to fake as good as that one I'd be getting paid enough for lower level seasons..and I would have put Harrington in there instead.

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    Jay - Foster is also the team's quickest dunker. Seriously. Put the ball in his hands near the rim, even on a full run, and its getting thrown down. I know it doesn't make him an offensive threat, but it is a nice skill. Also Jeff does move pretty well without the ball and at times gets open for nice interior passes (like from Pollard for example).

    Screens, jump shots, ball handling of any sort - agreed, big problem areas. But then it's not like Dale was much better, other than screens. 40 pump fakes and a serviceable turnaround jumper didn't make him an offensive threat either.

    I do with Jeff could set screens like Dale.

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    Default Re: Why Hasnít Foster Developed Offensive Game? Q.O.D 8-14-06

    Okay, I wasn't totally honest earlier. I did bump into Al as he was leaving his physical and was trying to hail a cab off of Pennsylvania. Didn't want to share till we knew for sure he was coming here.




    Hopefully that clears things up regarding my PSP skills vs that Foster pix.

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    Grumpy Old Man (PD host) able's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why Hasnít Foster Developed Offensive Game? Q.O.D 8-14-06

    Nappie, would love to see the other pics, this way I can get an image of the practise court without a certain pimped player on it
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    Default Re: Why Hasnít Foster Developed Offensive Game? Q.O.D 8-14-06

    I'll send them up to photobucket at full, but won't post the pix here and kill b'width.

    edit - hold on. P'bucket resizes them. I'll have to do a Yahoo upload later. Gotta go cook dinner.

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    Default Re: Why Hasnít Foster Developed Offensive Game? Q.O.D 8-14-06

    Quote Originally Posted by Naptown_Seth View Post
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    Screens, jump shots, ball handling of any sort - agreed, big problem areas. But then it's not like Dale was much better, other than screens. 40 pump fakes and a serviceable turnaround jumper didn't make him an offensive threat either.
    Don't ever confuse me with being a Dale Davis fan...

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