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Thread: Andre Miller trade kicker?

  1. #1
    How are you here? Kegboy's Avatar
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    Default Andre Miller trade kicker?

    Might as well break my cherry on this board.

    So, after last night's game, I was on RealGM playing around with trading for Andre, and I saw TK next to his name. Does anybody know what this entails, and how it might affect us trading for him?
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  2. #2
    sweabs
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    Default Re: Andre Miller trade kicker?

    I'm not sure about the answer to your question regarding the Trade Kicker.

    However, the more I watch the Nuggets play, the more it seems likely that they'd make a trade with us involving Jackson and Tinsley for Andre Miller. They desperately need someone who can hit the outside shot, and while I don't think Jackson is the best shooter by any means, he is far better than anything the Nuggets currently have. Tinsley to fill the space of Andre for them, and I think we're looking at a realistic possibility here.

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    Member tdubb03's Avatar
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    Default Re: Andre Miller trade kicker?

    Trade kicker gives players the ability to veto a trade. Garnett has one I know.

    At least I think that's right.

  4. #4
    Well lubricated Skaut_Ech's Avatar
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    Default Re: Andre Miller trade kicker?

    Quote Originally Posted by rcarey
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    I'm not sure about the answer to your question regarding the Trade Kicker.

    However, the more I watch the Nuggets play, the more it seems likely that they'd make a trade with us involving Jackson and Tinsley for Andre Miller. They desperately need someone who can hit the outside shot, and while I don't think Jackson is the best shooter by any means, he is far better than anything the Nuggets currently have. Tinsley to fill the space of Andre for them, and I think we're looking at a realistic possibility here.
    I was watching the game the other night and I was thinking the very same thing. I was thinking along those lines a few days ago.

    The Nugs have been wanted a solid Sg for so long, I think a solid playoff trashing would make them very receptive to an offer from the Ps. Thing is, I can't see any trade that really works financially, short of the sign and trade I proposed with Nene.

    Jamaal and Stephen make about the same, but combined, they take a nice little chunk of salary. I don't think we could trade both of them to the Nugs. Straight up, the only thing I could come up with was Saras and Stephen Jackson for Andre Miller.

    I think this would be a trade word worth making IF we could quickly swing a second deal for a solid SG.

    There's just not a lot of SGs out there. Some guys who may be had due to their respective situations are Luke Jackson, JR Smith, Devin Brown (Hmm...) and I'd have to think we may be able to land Cheaney or Pietrus.

    I know we shouldn't go to the well again, but the Kings look to have a player whom I think would be a GREAT fit in Kevin Martin. I just can't see any possible trade scenarios short of some type of sign and trade.




    Reference a Trade kicker, I refer you to this:

    http://members.cox.net/lmcoon/salarycap99.htm



    Teams are permitted to write a bonus called an "assignment bonus," or more conventionally a "trade kicker," into contracts. This bonus is paid to the player when he is traded (within 30 days following the trade), but only upon his first trade and not upon subsequent trades. The trade kicker is for a specific dollar amount, but this amount is limited to 15% of the remaining value of the contract. For example, assume a player has a seven-year contract that pays $1 million per year. This player also has a $500,000 trade kicker. Since the trade kicker is limited to 15% of the remaining value of the contract, the actual value of the kicker varies from year to year, as follows:

    Year Remaining value
    of the contract 15% of the remaining
    value of the contract Actual value of
    $500,000 trade kicker
    1 $7,000,000 $1,050,000 $500,000
    2 $6,000,000 $900,000 $500,000
    3 $5,000,000 $750,000 $500,000
    4 $4,000,000 $600,000 $500,000
    5 $3,000,000 $450,000 $450,000
    6 $2,000,000 $300,000 $300,000
    7 $1,000,000 $150,000 $150,000

    However, a trade kicker may never cause a player's salary to exceed the maximum salary, based on his years of service.

    The value of a trade kicker is calculated only once each season, at the beginning of the season. It does not decrease during the season as salary is earned.

    83. How do trade kickers affect the salary cap and trades?


    For the salary cap, the value of an assignment bonus (trade kicker) is applied evenly to team salary among the remaining years of the contract, excluding non-guaranteed years (see question number 90 ) and years following an Early Termination Option (see question number 48 ). For example, suppose the player from question number 82 is traded during the fifth season of his contract. Per the chart in that question, the actual value of his trade kicker that season is $450,000. If every season of the contract is guaranteed, and there is no Early Termination Option, then the $450,000 is spread evenly among the final three seasons of the player's contract, for $150,000 per season. Since the player earns $1 million per season, $1,150,000 is included in the team salary in each of those seasons.

    Now suppose the player has an Early Termination Option following the fifth season of his contract. In this event, the entire trade kicker will be allocated to the fifth season of the contract. The player will therefore count $1,450,000 as team salary during that season. If the Early Termination Option is not exercised, $1,000,000 will be included in the team salary during the sixth and seventh seasons.


    For trades, these kickers can be a nuisance. When a team trades for a player with a trade kicker, it must count the portion of the kicker that applies to that season as incoming salary. Let's say a team wants to trade their $900,000 player for the player used in the example above. Using the first case above, where there is not an Early Termination Option or non-guaranteed season, the kicker counts $150,000 in the current season, so the trade cannot be made. The team trading the $900,000 player can accept $1,135,000 in return (see question number 67 ), but the player with the trade kicker counts as $1,150,000 in incoming salary.

    Fortunately, the CBA allows the player to waive part of his trade kicker, if necessary, in order to complete a trade. To make the above trade work, the player would need to waive $45,000 of his $450,000 trade kicker. The kicker would then be worth $405,000, and one-third of that, or $135,000 would be allocated to the current season. The player would therefore count $1,135,000 as incoming salary, which exactly matches the maximum the other team can accept in return for their $900,000 player. The player is not allowed to waive more than the amount necessary to make the trade work.

    Another potential difficulty is that a team trading a player with a trade kicker uses the player's original salary, before the kicker, when comparing salaries for trade. Here is another example, using the same player as before. This time, let's assume our player has an Early Termination Option following the fifth season of his contract, so if he is traded during the fifth season, the entire kicker is allocated to that season. This means that following a trade, $1,450,000 is included in his new team's team salary. Suppose a team wants to trade their $1,300,000 player for this player. The other team can accept $1,595,000 for their player, and our player counts $1,450,000 as incoming salary. So it works from their end. But our player counts $1 million as outgoing salary, so the most we can accept in return is $1,250,000. This means the trade doesn't work from our end. And in this case, waiving a portion of the trade kicker will not expedite matters.
    Hey! What're you kicking me for? You want me to ask? All right, I'll ask! Ma'am, where do the high school girls hang out in this town?

  5. #5
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    Default Re: Andre Miller trade kicker?

    Quote Originally Posted by Skaut_Ech
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Teams are permitted to write a bonus called an "assignment bonus," or more conventionally a "trade kicker," into contracts. This bonus is paid to the player when he is traded (within 30 days following the trade), but only upon his first trade and not upon subsequent trades. The trade kicker is for a specific dollar amount, but this amount is limited to 15% of the remaining value of the contract. For example, assume a player has a seven-year contract that pays $1 million per year. This player also has a $500,000 trade kicker. Since the trade kicker is limited to 15% of the remaining value of the contract, the actual value of the kicker varies from year to year, as follows:

    Year Remaining value
    of the contract 15% of the remaining
    value of the contract Actual value of
    $500,000 trade kicker
    1 $7,000,000 $1,050,000 $500,000
    2 $6,000,000 $900,000 $500,000
    3 $5,000,000 $750,000 $500,000
    4 $4,000,000 $600,000 $500,000
    5 $3,000,000 $450,000 $450,000
    6 $2,000,000 $300,000 $300,000
    7 $1,000,000 $150,000 $150,000

    However, a trade kicker may never cause a player's salary to exceed the maximum salary, based on his years of service.

    The value of a trade kicker is calculated only once each season, at the beginning of the season. It does not decrease during the season as salary is earned.

    83. How do trade kickers affect the salary cap and trades?


    For the salary cap, the value of an assignment bonus (trade kicker) is applied evenly to team salary among the remaining years of the contract, excluding non-guaranteed years (see question number 90 ) and years following an Early Termination Option (see question number 48 ). For example, suppose the player from question number 82 is traded during the fifth season of his contract. Per the chart in that question, the actual value of his trade kicker that season is $450,000. If every season of the contract is guaranteed, and there is no Early Termination Option, then the $450,000 is spread evenly among the final three seasons of the player's contract, for $150,000 per season. Since the player earns $1 million per season, $1,150,000 is included in the team salary in each of those seasons.

    Now suppose the player has an Early Termination Option following the fifth season of his contract. In this event, the entire trade kicker will be allocated to the fifth season of the contract. The player will therefore count $1,450,000 as team salary during that season. If the Early Termination Option is not exercised, $1,000,000 will be included in the team salary during the sixth and seventh seasons.


    For trades, these kickers can be a nuisance. When a team trades for a player with a trade kicker, it must count the portion of the kicker that applies to that season as incoming salary. Let's say a team wants to trade their $900,000 player for the player used in the example above. Using the first case above, where there is not an Early Termination Option or non-guaranteed season, the kicker counts $150,000 in the current season, so the trade cannot be made. The team trading the $900,000 player can accept $1,135,000 in return (see question number 67 ), but the player with the trade kicker counts as $1,150,000 in incoming salary.

    Fortunately, the CBA allows the player to waive part of his trade kicker, if necessary, in order to complete a trade. To make the above trade work, the player would need to waive $45,000 of his $450,000 trade kicker. The kicker would then be worth $405,000, and one-third of that, or $135,000 would be allocated to the current season. The player would therefore count $1,135,000 as incoming salary, which exactly matches the maximum the other team can accept in return for their $900,000 player. The player is not allowed to waive more than the amount necessary to make the trade work.

    Another potential difficulty is that a team trading a player with a trade kicker uses the player's original salary, before the kicker, when comparing salaries for trade. Here is another example, using the same player as before. This time, let's assume our player has an Early Termination Option following the fifth season of his contract, so if he is traded during the fifth season, the entire kicker is allocated to that season. This means that following a trade, $1,450,000 is included in his new team's team salary. Suppose a team wants to trade their $1,300,000 player for this player. The other team can accept $1,595,000 for their player, and our player counts $1,450,000 as incoming salary. So it works from their end. But our player counts $1 million as outgoing salary, so the most we can accept in return is $1,250,000. This means the trade doesn't work from our end. And in this case, waiving a portion of the trade kicker will not expedite matters.

  6. #6
    Well lubricated Skaut_Ech's Avatar
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    Default Re: Andre Miller trade kicker?

    Quote Originally Posted by microwave_oven
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    Basically, you're paying a player an additional salary, on top of his contract money, if you pick him up for your team. Think of it as a signing bonus.

    Ya know how player's get a signing bonus in the NFL? Now imagine a bouns for signing with another team. I guess it's a way to make being traded not hurt so bad.

    Jermaine, we traded you to the Grizzlies and you'll be making 15 mill a year from them, PLUS they'ree going to pay you a trade kicker, per your contract, as a way of showing "hey, no harm, no foul", based upon which year of your contract this is, which is year 3, so you get an additional 3 million.

    It's way to insure you don't get traded, I think. That way, if a team is going to pick you up, they have to pay your salary PLUS a bonus chunk of money, which counts against their cap.
    Hey! What're you kicking me for? You want me to ask? All right, I'll ask! Ma'am, where do the high school girls hang out in this town?

  7. #7
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    Default Re: Andre Miller trade kicker?

    Thanks for clearing that up!

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