Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 62

Thread: Official "Is the team better with or without JO?" Thread

  1. #1
    Cheeseburger in Paradise Los Angeles's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Location
    Venice, CA
    Posts
    9,690

    Default Official "Is the team better with or without JO?" Thread

    Me? I wouldn't go that far, but I'm ready to hear both sides of the argument after tonight's game.

    I think if I were to re-watch all of the games from the last month (not just the losing games) You'll find something interesting. When JO comes onto the court, we seem to lose more than we gain. When he goes out, and at least 2 of Foster, Cro or Pollard are on the court, we seem to play better.

    Agree?

    Disagree?

    Let's hear your reasons.

  2. #2
    Member Moses's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Athens, GA
    Posts
    3,565

    Default Re: Official "We're a better team without JO" Thread

    Disagree.

    How does adding a perenial all-star and the only post scoring threat on our team cause trouble? If anything, it's because Rick is taking out the hot hand when he puts JO in. I don't think JO has found a role yet in this offense. He's had a stretch of rough games..but if you honestly think a front court of Foster and Croshere is better, you need to get off of it. Both of those guys are great hustle players but JO adds another dimension to this team. I'm not going to let a stretch of bad games he's had since coming back change my mind. I want to see him in a few more games before I make that decision.

  3. #3
    Banned Jermaniac's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Your baby moms house
    Age
    26
    Posts
    11,717

    Default Re: Official "We're a better team without JO" Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Los Angeles
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Me? I wouldn't go that far, but I'm ready to hear both sides of the argument after tonight's game.

    I think if I were to re-watch all of the games from the last month (not just the losing games) You'll find something interesting. When JO comes onto the court, we seem to lose more than we gain. When he goes out, and at least 2 of Foster, Cro or Pollard are on the court, we seem to play better.

    Agree?

    Disagree?

    Let's hear your reasons.
    Apparently you havent been watching the games.

    Bulls game big lead, JO goes to the bench lead disapears. Knicks game few days ago 8 point lead, JO comes back in down 2.

    Way to pick on him when he has his worst game. Get the hate out of your heart playboy.

  4. #4
    Member Ragnar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Fort Wayne, IN
    Age
    43
    Posts
    5,917

    Sports Logo

    Default Re: Official "We're a better team without JO" Thread

    Before Rick got here J.O. averaged 18 rebounds per game in the playoffs. When Rick got here we all knew our defensive rebouning would go down because that is not in his game plan. Jermaine is not the problem here Rick is.

    I will add the disclaimer that Rick is a good coach but he is not the right coach for THIS TEAM.

    P.S. does anyone think Rick was told to leave Jamaal in even if he does something that Rick did not like (like two fouls in a row) and thats why Jamaal was playing tonight amd of course why we won. Just a thought.

  5. #5
    Member #31's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Croatia
    Posts
    1,811

    Default Re: Official "We're a better team without JO" Thread

    I disagree, but it starts to look to me like everytime he is playing and dont take more than 10 FG attempts, the Pacers win? Works really strange... Maybe the P´s need to make him a Dale Davis/Ben Wallace kinda player? More Defense/Rebounds and on offense not to force shots, but let the offense come to him. But HE MUST BE THERE!!

  6. #6
    Member J_2_Da_IzzO's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Age
    26
    Posts
    843

    Default Re: Official "We're a better team without JO" Thread

    This is one of the worst threads ever. How stupid can you be?
    My Dream Team

    PG - A.Iverson
    SG - K.Bryant
    SF - R.Artest
    PF - J.O'Neal
    C - D.Howard

  7. #7
    Cheeseburger in Paradise Los Angeles's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Location
    Venice, CA
    Posts
    9,690

    Default Re: Official "We're a better team without JO" Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Jermaniac
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Apparently you havent been watching the games.

    Bulls game big lead, JO goes to the bench lead disapears. Knicks game few days ago 8 point lead, JO comes back in down 2.

    Way to pick on him when he has his worst game. Get the hate out of your heart playboy.


    I was AT the bulls game.

  8. #8
    Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Age
    26
    Posts
    653

    Default Re: Official "We're a better team without JO" Thread

    Scot, Cro, and Jeff seem to be more willing to do the "little" things.
    Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.
    -- Albert Einstein

  9. #9
    Member Moses's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Athens, GA
    Posts
    3,565

    Default Re: Official "We're a better team without JO" Thread

    I don't mean to be a jerk but you really can't expect this argument to hold any water...Like seriously.

    JO may be over-rated and overpaid according to some here, but when he is out on the court, it is a huge positive in alot of different aspects of our game. Nobody on this team can block besides him. Nobody else has any post moves with the exception of Harrison who is still learning. I would love a front court of JO and Harrison because it actually leaves us with a center who can score near JO. I love Foster but it seems as though he and JO don't really compliment eachother at all. It was very apparent in the PIstons game. Pollard and Foster, on the other hand, compliment eachother extremely well. Not sure if that means we need to move JO to center for a while and start Croshere at PF, but I really like Pollard and Foster together with JO and Austin being together on the court. It just seems to work out better that way.

  10. #10
    sweabs
    Guest

    Default Re: Official "We're a better team without JO" Thread

    I'd really like to hear some outsider's opinions on this as well (fans from other teams).

    I think I've stated on numerous occassions where I fall on this topic.

  11. #11
    Member J_2_Da_IzzO's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Age
    26
    Posts
    843

    Default Re: Official "We're a better team without JO" Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Pacersfan.
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Scot, Cro, and Jeff seem to be more willing to do the "little" things.
    But they are also willing to let players stroll through for layups.
    My Dream Team

    PG - A.Iverson
    SG - K.Bryant
    SF - R.Artest
    PF - J.O'Neal
    C - D.Howard

  12. #12
    Banned Jermaniac's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Your baby moms house
    Age
    26
    Posts
    11,717

    Default Re: Official "We're a better team without JO" Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Los Angeles
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote


    I was AT the bulls game.
    Maybe you went to the bathroom when the Bulls started cutting our lead when JO wasnt playing. I dont know.

  13. #13
    Cheeseburger in Paradise Los Angeles's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Location
    Venice, CA
    Posts
    9,690

    Default Re: Official "We're a better team without JO" Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Jermaniac
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Maybe you went to the bathroom when the Bulls started cutting our lead when JO wasnt playing. I dont know.
    Maybe you'd rather talk about the Pacers W/L with JO in the lineup vs when he is out?

  14. #14
    Member Moses's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Athens, GA
    Posts
    3,565

    Default Re: Official "We're a better team without JO" Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Los Angeles
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Maybe you'd rather talk about the Pacers W/L with JO in the lineup vs when he is out?
    Are you really trying to say that JO is to blame for this crappy *** team we have?

  15. #15
    Banned Jermaniac's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Your baby moms house
    Age
    26
    Posts
    11,717

    Default Re: Official "We're a better team without JO" Thread

    Whatever floats your boat. I can argue for days.

  16. #16
    Cheeseburger in Paradise Los Angeles's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Location
    Venice, CA
    Posts
    9,690

    Default Re: Official "We're a better team without JO" Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Moses
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Are you really trying to say that JO is to blame for this crappy *** team we have?
    No, I'm trying to have a discussion. Unfortunately, I seem to have chosen the wrong thread title for that.

  17. #17
    Member J_2_Da_IzzO's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Age
    26
    Posts
    843

    Default Re: Official "Is the team better with or without JO?" Thread

    How can you fairly assess if this team is better with or without JO by the win loss record. 2 very big factors effect that and thats:

    (1) Him returning from a lengthy injury.
    (2) Him also having to adjust to a different system.

    Oh yeah and a third is adjusting with a new teammate.
    My Dream Team

    PG - A.Iverson
    SG - K.Bryant
    SF - R.Artest
    PF - J.O'Neal
    C - D.Howard

  18. #18
    Fat, Drunk and Stupid Lord Helmet's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Richmond, IN
    Age
    24
    Posts
    15,664

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: Official "Is the team better with or without JO?" Thread

    Jermaniac, I don't think LA is necessarily saying he thinks that the team is better without JO, in fact I don't even think he's made a statement of his opinion in this thread.

    Anyway, I don't think the team is better without him, I just think they play harder with him out, knowing they need to pick it up. We just need to play more scrappy with him in.
    Super Bowl XLI Champions
    2000 Eastern Conference Champions





  19. #19
    Member #31's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Croatia
    Posts
    1,811

    Default Re: Official "Is the team better with or without JO?" Thread

    It would be more interesting if you/someone started an "Official "Is this team better with changed JO or regular JO" thread" instead..

  20. #20
    You are my Lucifer D-BONE's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Nirvana
    Posts
    7,192

    Default Re: Official "We're a better team without JO" Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by #31
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    I disagree, but it starts to look to me like everytime he is playing and dont take more than 10 FG attempts, the Pacers win? Works really strange... Maybe the Pīs need to make him a Dale Davis/Ben Wallace kinda player? More Defense/Rebounds and on offense not to force shots, but let the offense come to him. But HE MUST BE THERE!!
    I won't go so far as to say he absolutely must be here. If the decision is that he remains, I like your idea though. He'd have to amp up his rebounding intensity and box outs a tad, but I think he would be good at it.

  21. #21

    Default Re: Official "Is the team better with or without JO?" Thread

    Bad thing is that JO got only 5 rebounds again (Crosher and Foster outrebounded him twice). Good thing is - the oponents still doubling him even if he can't hit. As for bad shooting, imo oponents are fouling him to prevent him getting into the rythm (and they succeeded today).
    As for better play without JO. Imo it looks better, because with JO the game isn't that free-flowing. Imho JO is more effective playing iso sets else team just loses some seconds when he dribbles and passes out. His low rebounding doesn't help either.
    Still JO is the threat and yet another option if other offensive options fail.
    I'm really sorry because of my english (which is my 3-4 language) and I really appreciate Your patience. I hope this board will make me better

  22. #22
    Cheeseburger in Paradise Los Angeles's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Location
    Venice, CA
    Posts
    9,690

    Default Re: Official "Is the team better with or without JO?" Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by J_2_Da_IzzO
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    How can you fairly assess if this team is better with or without JO by the win loss record. 2 very big factors effect that and thats:

    (1) Him returning from a lengthy injury.
    (2) Him also having to adjust to a different system.

    Oh yeah and a third is adjusting with a new teammate.
    It doesnt' make sense. We were losing before Peja came in. JO was healthy, and the only player we lost was Artest. And we were losing a lot of games. JO went out at the same time that Peja came in.

    The remaining players had no problem picking up a new system AND adjusting to Peja's presence.

    There's WAY too many factors here, which is why I thought it would be a good idea to start a thread that layed out all of the facts, stats and intangibles.

    And for those of you who think this is crazy, I have to bring this up:

    When O'Neal went down, it was reported that he himself wondered why the team played better without him. Why can't I question what Jermaine himself has already questioned? Why can't we at least talk about it?

  23. #23
    Administrator Unclebuck's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    32,986

    Default Re: Official "We're a better team without JO" Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Ragnar
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    When Rick got here we all knew our defensive rebouning would go down because that is not in his game plan.
    That is simply not true at all. Rick is very big on defensive rebounding. It is offensive rebounding that he sacrifices in favor of transitiopn defense.


    We are a better team with J.O.

  24. #24
    Ain't Happening BlueNGold's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Location
    Indianapolis
    Posts
    16,060

    Default Re: Official "Is the team better with or without JO?" Thread

    The team is only worse with JO, if he is misused. JO should only play PF and should be stroking it from the outside and driving to the bucket more often to get fouls and 3pt plays.

    Now, his great post up moves are enticing and should be used at times...but primarily as a decoy. Over-using his post up game does at least two things detrimental to the team's success:

    1) it does not make best use of the other players skills on the floor, and does not create the type of ball movement the team needs for higher percentage shots.

    2) it results in JO taking a pounding, getting triple teamed, him getting ticked and getting technicals, the other team preparing for a fast break where there is no shot blocker on the other end, etc.

  25. #25
    Member #31's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Croatia
    Posts
    1,811

    Default Re: Official "Is the team better with or without JO?" Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by BlueNGold
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    The team is only worse with JO, if he is misused. JO should only play PF and should be stroking it from the outside and driving to the bucket more often to get fouls and 3pt plays.

    Now, his great post up moves are enticing and should be used at times...but primarily as a decoy. Over-using his post up game does at least two things detrimental to the team's success:

    1) it does not make best use of the other players skills on the floor, and does not create the type of ball movement the team needs for higher percentage shots.

    2) it results in JO taking a pounding, getting triple teamed, him getting ticked and getting technicals, the other team preparing for a fast break where there is no shot blocker on the other end, etc.
    Yup! Agree.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •