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Rule #1

Pacers Digest is intended to be a place to discuss basketball without having to deal with the kinds of behaviors or attitudes that distract people from sticking with the discussion of the topics at hand. These unwanted distractions can come in many forms, and admittedly it can sometimes be tricky to pin down each and every kind that can rear its ugly head, but we feel that the following examples and explanations cover at least a good portion of that ground and should at least give people a pretty good idea of the kinds of things we actively discourage:

"Anyone who __________ is a liar / a fool / an idiot / a blind homer / has their head buried in the sand / a blind hater / doesn't know basketball / doesn't watch the games"

"People with intelligence will agree with me when I say that __________"

"Only stupid people think / believe / do ___________"

"I can't wait to hear something from PosterX when he/she sees that **insert a given incident or current event that will have probably upset or disappointed PosterX here**"

"He/she is just delusional"

"This thread is stupid / worthless / embarrassing"

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"Remember when PosterX said OldCommentY that no longer looks good? "

In general, if a comment goes from purely on topic to something 'ad hominem' (personal jabs, personal shots, attacks, flames, however you want to call it, towards a person, or a group of people, or a given city/state/country of people), those are most likely going to be found intolerable.

We also dissuade passive aggressive behavior. This can be various things, but common examples include statements that are basically meant to imply someone is either stupid or otherwise incapable of holding a rational conversation. This can include (but is not limited to) laughing at someone's conclusions rather than offering an honest rebuttal, asking people what game they were watching, or another common problem is Poster X will say "that player isn't that bad" and then Poster Y will say something akin to "LOL you think that player is good". We're not going to tolerate those kinds of comments out of respect for the community at large and for the sake of trying to just have an honest conversation.

Now, does the above cover absolutely every single kind of distraction that is unwanted? Probably not, but you should by now have a good idea of the general types of things we will be discouraging. The above examples are meant to give you a good feel for / idea of what we're looking for. If something new or different than the above happens to come along and results in the same problem (that being, any other attitude or behavior that ultimately distracts from actually just discussing the topic at hand, or that is otherwise disrespectful to other posters), we can and we will take action to curb this as well, so please don't take this to mean that if you managed to technically avoid saying something exactly like one of the above examples that you are then somehow off the hook.

That all having been said, our goal is to do so in a generally kind and respectful way, and that doesn't mean the moment we see something we don't like that somebody is going to be suspended or banned, either. It just means that at the very least we will probably say something about it, quite possibly snipping out the distracting parts of the post in question while leaving alone the parts that are actually just discussing the topics, and in the event of a repeating or excessive problem, then we will start issuing infractions to try to further discourage further repeat problems, and if it just never seems to improve, then finally suspensions or bans will come into play. We would prefer it never went that far, and most of the time for most of our posters, it won't ever have to.

A slip up every once and a while is pretty normal, but, again, when it becomes repetitive or excessive, something will be done. Something occasional is probably going to be let go (within reason), but when it starts to become habitual or otherwise a pattern, odds are very good that we will step in.

There's always a small minority that like to push people's buttons and/or test their own boundaries with regards to the administrators, and in the case of someone acting like that, please be aware that this is not a court of law, but a private website run by people who are simply trying to do the right thing as they see it. If we feel that you are a special case that needs to be dealt with in an exceptional way because your behavior isn't explicitly mirroring one of our above examples of what we generally discourage, we can and we will take atypical action to prevent this from continuing if you are not cooperative with us.

Also please be aware that you will not be given a pass simply by claiming that you were 'only joking,' because quite honestly, when someone really is just joking, for one thing most people tend to pick up on the joke, including the person or group that is the target of the joke, and for another thing, in the event where an honest joke gets taken seriously and it upsets or angers someone, the person who is truly 'only joking' will quite commonly go out of his / her way to apologize and will try to mend fences. People who are dishonest about their statements being 'jokes' do not do so, and in turn that becomes a clear sign of what is really going on. It's nothing new.

In any case, quite frankly, the overall quality and health of the entire forum's community is more important than any one troublesome user will ever be, regardless of exactly how a problem is exhibiting itself, and if it comes down to us having to make a choice between you versus the greater health and happiness of the entire community, the community of this forum will win every time.

Lastly, there are also some posters, who are generally great contributors and do not otherwise cause any problems, who sometimes feel it's their place to provoke or to otherwise 'mess with' that small minority of people described in the last paragraph, and while we possibly might understand why you might feel you WANT to do something like that, the truth is we can't actually tolerate that kind of behavior from you any more than we can tolerate the behavior from them. So if we feel that you are trying to provoke those other posters into doing or saying something that will get themselves into trouble, then we will start to view you as a problem as well, because of the same reason as before: The overall health of the forum comes first, and trying to stir the pot with someone like that doesn't help, it just makes it worse. Some will simply disagree with this philosophy, but if so, then so be it because ultimately we have to do what we think is best so long as it's up to us.

If you see a problem that we haven't addressed, the best and most appropriate course for a forum member to take here is to look over to the left of the post in question. See underneath that poster's name, avatar, and other info, down where there's a little triangle with an exclamation point (!) in it? Click that. That allows you to report the post to the admins so we can definitely notice it and give it a look to see what we feel we should do about it. Beyond that, obviously it's human nature sometimes to want to speak up to the poster in question who has bothered you, but we would ask that you try to refrain from doing so because quite often what happens is two or more posters all start going back and forth about the original offending post, and suddenly the entire thread is off topic or otherwise derailed. So while the urge to police it yourself is understandable, it's best to just report it to us and let us handle it. Thank you!

All of the above is going to be subject to a case by case basis, but generally and broadly speaking, this should give everyone a pretty good idea of how things will typically / most often be handled.

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If this is done the wrong way, those comments will be deleted, and if it's a repeating problem then it may also receive an infraction as well.

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When you ignore a user, you will unfortunately still see some hints of their existence (nothing we can do about that), however, it does the following key things:

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Regarding infractions, currently they carry a value of one point each, and that point will expire in 31 days. If at any point a poster is carrying three points at the same time, that poster will be suspended until the oldest of the three points expires.

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Provocative statements in a signature, or as an avatar, or as the 'tagline' beneath a poster's username (where it says 'Member' or 'Administrator' by default, if it is not altered) are an unwanted distraction that will more than likely be removed on sight. There can be shades of gray to this, but in general this could be something political or religious that is likely going to provoke or upset people, or otherwise something that is mean-spirited at the expense of a poster, a group of people, or a population.

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However, once the discussion seems to be more/mostly about the political issues instead of the sports figure or his specific situation, the thread is usually closed.

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Okay, how bout Saras 38?

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  • #61
    Re: Okay, how bout Saras 38?

    Originally posted by Lithfan
    you what?
    concur

    Originally posted by Webster's
    con·cur ( P ) Pronunciation Key (kn-kûr)
    intr.v. con·curred, con·cur·ring, con·curs
    1. To be of the same opinion; agree: concurred on the issue of preventing crime. See Synonyms at assent.
    2. To act together; cooperate.
    3. To occur at the same time; coincide: icy sleet that concurred with a forceful wind.
    http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=concur

    He agrees.
    Why do the things that we treasure most, slip away in time
    Till to the music we grow deaf, to God's beauty blind
    Why do the things that connect us slowly pull us apart?
    Till we fall away in our own darkness, a stranger to our own hearts
    And life itself, rushing over me
    Life itself, the wind in black elms,
    Life itself in your heart and in your eyes, I can't make it without you

    Comment


    • #62
      Re: Okay, how bout Saras 38?

      Originally posted by Kstat


      First of all, Parker was HOW old when he played against sarunas? 16? 17? Sarunaus was what, 24? 25?

      To say Sarunas is better than Tony Parker is an absoluke joke. Sorry, but it is. Parker is an all-star. Sarunas wouldnt even start on msot NBA teams.
      Now please dont teach europeans about european players.
      Tony Parker is playing for France NT and meeting Saras annualy in championships, friendly games, I guess at least once per year. So with all the respect to Tony, Saras outplayed him many many times and he was not 16,17.
      By the way Parker totally sucked during Euro championship this summer. He averaged much less then 10 ppg with extremely low percentage. Thats what happens to shootingless slashers that meet zone defence.
      Just to get the perspective of our little comparison of Saras with Tony "allstar" Parker, look at Parker stat line in his rookie year:

      YEARTEAMGGSMPGFG%3P%FT%OFFDEFRPGAPGSPGBPGTOPFPPG
      01-02 SAS 777229.4.419.323.675.42.12.64.31.16.091.962.209.2


      Saras rookie year till now:

      TeamGGSMPGFGM-AFG%3PM-A3P%FTM-AFT%OFFDEFTOTAPGSPGBPGTOPFPPG
      IND 361323.997-229 .42453-130 .40883-93 .892.32.22.53.2.83.111.831.509.2


      So wait and see

      Comment


      • #63
        Re: Okay, how bout Saras 38?

        Originally posted by Jay@Section204
        concur


        He agrees.
        Thanks man,

        The hype around Saras is justified.
        He is special, don't you see that?

        Comment


        • #64
          Re: Okay, how bout Saras 38?

          Saras has outplayed Parker every time they faced each other in the international competition.
          Playing on the mighty powerhouse that is France, in addition to coming off a grueling NBA finals with little rest.

          Originally posted by Lithfan
          YEARTEAMGGSMPGFG%3P%FT%OFFDEFRPGAPGSPGBPGTOPFPPG
          01-02 SAS 777229.4.419.323.675.42.12.64.31.16.091.962.209.2


          Saras rookie year till now:

          TeamGGSMPGFGM-AFG%3PM-A3P%FTM-AFT%OFFDEFTOTAPGSPGBPGTOPFPPG
          IND 361323.997-229 .42453-130 .40883-93 .892.32.22.53.2.83.111.831.509.2


          So wait and see
          Wait and see?

          Parker was 19 as a rookie.

          Sarunas is 29 as a rookie.

          It wasn't about being the team everyone loved, it was about beating the teams everyone else loved.

          Division Champions 1955, 1956, 1988, 1989, 1990, 2002, 2003, 2005, 2006, 2007, 2008
          Conference Champions 1955, 1956, 1988, 2005
          NBA Champions 1989, 1990, 2004

          Comment


          • #65
            Re: Okay, how bout Saras 38?

            Originally posted by Lithfan
            you what?
            I agree with you totally.

            Comment


            • #66
              Re: Okay, how bout Saras 38?

              Originally posted by Kstat


              First of all, Parker was HOW old when he played against sarunas? 16? 17? Sarunaus was what, 24? 25?

              Sarunas wouldnt even start on msot NBA teams.
              well, your incompetence amuses me! (that's regarding the first remark)
              compared to you, guys, average 10 year old in Lithuania knows more (edit: much more) about international basketball. no offense..

              and mind you Saras was starting for your beloved championship contender just a month or so into his first season in NBA. that's regarding the second remark.

              Comment


              • #67
                Re: Okay, how bout Saras 38?

                Originally posted by Kestas
                and mind you Saras was starting for your beloved championship contender just a month or so into his first season in NBA. that's regarding the second remark.
                well, your incompetence amuses me!

                compared to you, guys, average 10 year old in Lithuania knows more (edit: much more) about international basketball. no offense..
                compared to you, the average 5-year old American knows more about NBA basketball, no offense.

                edit:much more

                It wasn't about being the team everyone loved, it was about beating the teams everyone else loved.

                Division Champions 1955, 1956, 1988, 1989, 1990, 2002, 2003, 2005, 2006, 2007, 2008
                Conference Champions 1955, 1956, 1988, 2005
                NBA Champions 1989, 1990, 2004

                Comment


                • #68
                  Re: Okay, how bout Saras 38?

                  Originally posted by Kstat
                  Wait and see?

                  Parker was 19 as a rookie.

                  Sarunas is 29 as a rookie.
                  Havent you heard that its heart and mind and not the age matters the most? (From you grandfather)

                  29 is not too bad, especially for the point guard. He shows signs of quick adaptation. Most of people on this board write that his defence improved drastically. I saw his games this and last season. I think he lost 5-10 pounds and defending and running like he never did. He is learning and 29 is not old enough. He has another 5 years untill his body weakens.

                  Comment


                  • #69
                    Re: Okay, how bout Saras 38?

                    Originally posted by Lithfan
                    Havent you heard that its heart and mind and not the age matters the most? (From you grandfather)

                    29 is not too bad, especially for the point guard. He shows signs of quick adaptation. Most of people on this board write that his defence improved drastically. I saw his games this and last season. I think he lost 5-10 pounds and defending and running like he never did. He is learning and 29 is not old enough. He has another 5 years untill his body weakens.

                    The point is, you're comparing a 19-year old rookie to a 29-year old rookie. That's not even remotely fair.

                    Sarunas at 19 wouldnt have been in the NBA, period. He wouldnt even have gotten an invitation to traning camp until at least 25.

                    You want to say he's god's gift to basketball, fine. But don't go comparing him to all-stars.

                    Sarunas is a nice backup in the NBA. On a team with no stellar PGs, he might even be a full-time starter. TO expect anythign ebyond that from him is ridiculous. He is steady, but not dominant in any phase of the game.

                    It wasn't about being the team everyone loved, it was about beating the teams everyone else loved.

                    Division Champions 1955, 1956, 1988, 1989, 1990, 2002, 2003, 2005, 2006, 2007, 2008
                    Conference Champions 1955, 1956, 1988, 2005
                    NBA Champions 1989, 1990, 2004

                    Comment


                    • #70
                      Re: Okay, how bout Saras 38?

                      Originally posted by hoopsforlife
                      I agree with you totally.

                      Comment


                      • #71
                        Re: Okay, how bout Saras 38?

                        Originally posted by Kstat
                        well, your incompetence amuses me!



                        compared to you, the average 5-year old American knows more about NBA basketball, no offense.

                        edit:much more

                        Yeah, Kestas you should know that Kstat (nick similarities are never casual) is notorious for being PISTONS fan.

                        Comment


                        • #72
                          Re: Okay, how bout Saras 38?

                          Originally posted by Kstat
                          The point is, you're comparing a 19-year old rookie to a 29-year old rookie. That's not even remotely fair.

                          Sarunas at 19 wouldnt have been in the NBA, period. He wouldnt even have gotten an invitation to traning camp until at least 25.

                          You want to say he's god's gift to basketball, fine. But don't go comparing him to all-stars.

                          Sarunas is a nice backup in the NBA. On a team with no stellar PGs, he might even be a full-time starter. TO expect anythign ebyond that from him is ridiculous. He is steady, but not dominant in any phase of the game.

                          Please, almost NO european AT ANY age NEVER excelled his first year in NBA. I know it can be ridiculos to you, but he is dominant in one phase - the winning one. And the thing is you don't expect it from him as he is not athletic, his dribbling sucks etc, even for Euro level. But in spite of those things he plays great! Well average for you in NBA at the moment.
                          His desire to win and determination are unbelievable. i'm wondered that there are no stories yet about player shooting 3's and FT's in Indianapolis after lights turn off.
                          The only analogy I know is Larry Bird.

                          Comment


                          • #73
                            Re: Okay, how bout Saras 38?

                            Everybody needs to just calm down. This has stopped being a discussion about a basketball player and has devolved into a nationalist slug-fest, never a good thing. First of all, Saras will start in Indiana by next year after Jack and Tins are gone and will become the team leader that he should be. Secondly, my saying that he is not ready now and does some stupid things now and then is not an insult to the entire nation of Lithuania. I love those little runners he hits with consistancy, but I hate it when he forgets the limitations of his teammates and attempts a pass that they cannot handle. Finally, if Saras is as good as I think that he is, he will make the necessary adjustments to his game to thrive in the NBA.
                            Slug 'em Sabres!!!!!
                            http://youtube.com/watch?v=cj1SUF4wzu0

                            Comment


                            • #74
                              Re: Okay, how bout Saras 38?

                              Originally posted by Lithfan
                              Thanks man,

                              The hype around Saras is justified.
                              He is special, don't you see that?
                              No.

                              He looks like a rookie to me. And I'm certainly not going to use the special word until I've seen him in a couple of playoff series.

                              And I believe Tinsley is the better player, both overall and for the Pacers. But he's never healthy in the playoffs, and that's a huge problem.
                              Why do the things that we treasure most, slip away in time
                              Till to the music we grow deaf, to God's beauty blind
                              Why do the things that connect us slowly pull us apart?
                              Till we fall away in our own darkness, a stranger to our own hearts
                              And life itself, rushing over me
                              Life itself, the wind in black elms,
                              Life itself in your heart and in your eyes, I can't make it without you

                              Comment


                              • #75
                                Re: Okay, how bout Saras 38?

                                Originally posted by Kstat
                                Playing on the mighty powerhouse that is France, in addition to coming off a grueling NBA finals with little rest.



                                Wait and see?

                                Parker was 19 as a rookie.

                                Sarunas is 29 as a rookie.
                                these thing happen from time to time. not all good players go to NBA. some go too late. like Sabonis did when he was 30 or 31 and could barely run..
                                anyways, it is hard to say who's better, but if we look at the facts we can see who gets more recognition. take EUROSCAR awards, that are among the most prestigeous basketball awards in Europe (I'd say they are the best known ones). the award is given to the best players over the year according to the survey of basketball specialists and journalists from around the continent. the award is influenced by players performance in the international competition and in the club competitions.
                                this year award for the best European player went to Nowitzki (191 points), who was pehenomenal in Germany's success in Eurobasket and also made his mark (as usual) in NBA. second was Saras (97), third - Parker (57). all observers agree that Saras' result was hurt by his absence in Eurobasket, but he still finished second. last year Saras was second as well.
                                if we look at this years FIBA nominations for the best European player of the year, we will see that the most probable candidates are Parker, Saras, Kirilenko and Nowitzki:
                                http://www.fibaeurope.com/cid_-M4,Jp...TnA8adZx2.html
                                there is an internet poll there, but it means nothing for the end result.
                                anyways, their basketball life took different shapes but it would ont be fair to put Parker above Saras just because he went to NBA at a young age. Parker had more succes in NBA, but Saras had more succes everywhere else a n d is now given a chance to do the same in NBA.

                                Comment

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