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Thread: Artest distastefully responds to Magic Johnson

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    Default Re: Artest distastefully responds to Magic Johnson

    Fool, if your boss fires you, it is almost always after you have had multiple discussions with him/her regarding a shortcoming in your performance or the quality of your work.

    During those earlier discussions you will amost always be given the opportunity to be heard. And there is ample opportunity to discuss the shortcomings of your boss and how an improvement in his shortcomings will help you to improve yourself in your own problem areas.

    As one who has both fired others, and has been fired himself, you could say I've been on both ends of the stick. Being fired very rarely has anything whatsoever to do with a knock on one's character. Firing (as opposed to being a victim of a cutback) almost always is about a problem with production or quality of work.

    So stating that I simply don't have enough knowledge or prior training to "get the job done" is in no way equivalent to a character attack.

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    Default Re: Artest distastefully responds to Magic Johnson

    Quote Originally Posted by beast23
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    I think that most of you guys are totally missing the point. Everyone seems to think that in one instance we are talking about a man's career and in the other instance, we are talking about a man's personal life.

    Bull*****!!!

    If you tell me that you will not take a chance on me, you aren't saying a word about my career.

    You are talking about my character, clear and simple.
    Agreed. Magic has chosen a job that has him speaking his opinion. If he can't handle tough responses to his opinion, that's on him. I have no problem with Ron saying this.

    p.s. I went to a couple Lakers message boards and the opinion seems pretty split -those who feel Ron insulted the whole organization and those who think Magic deserved it.
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    Default Re: Artest distastefully responds to Magic Johnson

    Pretty low by Ron. Magic makes a legit comment in his role as a commentator and Ron decides to drag his personal life into this?

    Oldest trick in the book - instead of actually dealing with your own problems, deflect the criticism by talking about something totally unrelated - and if it somehow involves sex, drug addiction, or any other serious character defect, all the better.

    Carl Rove would be proud.
    The poster formerly known as Rimfire

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    Default Re: Artest distastefully responds to Magic Johnson

    Quote Originally Posted by DisplacedKnick
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    Pretty low by Ron. Magic makes a legit comment in his role as a commentator and Ron decides to drag his personal life into this?

    Oldest trick in the book - instead of actually dealing with your own problems, deflect the criticism by talking about something totally unrelated - and if it somehow involves sex, drug addiction, or any other serious character defect, all the better.

    Carl Rove would be proud.
    Well said.

    Also, Kstat mentioned this, but Artest is now persona non grata in LA. The Pacers just lost some leverage with the rest of the league. Not to mention the domino effect..just take a look around the league at how many of Magic's close friends are in positions of power with different teams.

    When it comes down to it, this is just another case of Ron screwing over the Pacers. Couldn't they somehow get a retraining order to prevent him from making public comment?

  5. #55
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    Default Re: Artest distastefully responds to Magic Johnson

    Quote Originally Posted by Jasikevicius fan3
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    "It's like saying, 'Magic, should your wife give you another chance?'" Artest said "He's saying Ron Artest should have no more second chances. What's worse -- me saying I want to be traded or you cheating on your wife?"
    redneck. you can hardly come up with a dumber comparison. I mean, wasn't Magic cheating before he got infected? and it's none of Artest's business anyways.

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    Default Re: Artest distastefully responds to Magic Johnson

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr._Basketball
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    When it comes down to it, this is just another case of Ron screwing over the Pacers. Couldn't they somehow get a retraining order to prevent him from making public comment?

    Even if they could, he wouldn't obey it.

    From the Pacers and Artest's own good, the best thing Ron could do would be to check in the hospital for elective surgery so they could cut out his tongue.

    For everyone else though, that would really detract from the entertainment value.
    The poster formerly known as Rimfire

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    Default Re: Artest distastefully responds to Magic Johnson

    Quote Originally Posted by Harmonica
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    I guess if you don't consider passing HIV onto your partner and unborn child a threat, okay.
    I'm not saying what Magic did was alright. He had a pretty major character flaw, and I'd say he paid for it dearly.

    That said, don't you think Cookie knew he was a cad? Even if you want to believe she didn't, she still chose to stay with him. If you think she shouldn't have, that's fine, that's your opinion. Should she be criticized for it? I don't know, it's not like he was beating her or anything.

    If you want to say Magic was criminally negligent for sleeping around, that's your opinion. Pretty damning statement, considering how many people in society sleep around, let alone pro athletes. Whether they actually contracted an STD is immaterial, because they all take the chance.

    Even if you take as hardline a position as possible with Magic's HIV and his getting Westhead fired, I don't see how it can be compared with all the **** Ron's done.
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    Default Re: Artest distastefully responds to Magic Johnson

    Quote Originally Posted by Kegboy
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    That said, don't you think Cookie knew he was a cad? Even if you want to believe she didn't, she still chose to stay with him. If you think she shouldn't have, that's fine, that's your opinion. Should she be criticized for it? I don't know, it's not like he was beating her or anything.
    Yes, like Hilary Clinton, I believe she knew her husband was a dog. However, I would imagine that the last person Magic slept with wasn't the one who transmitted the virus to him. So you can probably safely conclude that he passed it along to others, who passed it along to others, and so on and so forth. Because of his celebrity and lack of self-control, he had the opportunity to hurt a great number of innocent (and not-so-innocent) people.

    That said, no one is criticizing Cookie. Where did that come from? Now, I don't know what your beliefs are, or how you were raised, but a lot of people consider cheating on their partner a form of abuse. Certainly Chelsea suffered and her family suffered because of Clinton's philandering. I'm sure Magic's philandering has left some emotional scars on his family as well.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kegboy
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    If you want to say Magic was criminally negligent for sleeping around, that's your opinion. Pretty damning statement, considering how many people in society sleep around, let alone pro athletes. Whether they actually contracted an STD is immaterial, because they all take the chance.

    Even if you take as hardline a position as possible with Magic's HIV and his getting Westhead fired, I don't see how it can be compared with all the **** Ron's done.
    I'm not suggesting Magic was criminally negligent. Again, where did that come from? Secondly, you're gathering opinions of mostly men here. Ask any woman whose deeds were worse: Ron's basketball antics or Magic's grotesque promiscuity? You'll get an entirely different picture altogether.

    Let me be clear on one thing: Ron should have kept his mouth shut; that would have been the mature and wise thing to do. But the remark itself, whether you want to admit it or not, is pretty truthful. And as Vicious Tyrant said, "Magic has chosen a job that has him speaking his opinion. If he can't handle tough responses to his opinion, that's on him."

    The problem I have with Ron's remarks are that they continue to hurt the organization.

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    Default Re: Artest distastefully responds to Magic Johnson

    Quote Originally Posted by Fool
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    So if your boss ever fires you then a perfectly valid reply would be to say that his wife should divorce him because he's cheated on her? After all, your boss has just said that you are unfit to work for him, and you have to defend your reputation.

    Maybe Ron should challenge MJ to a duel, you know to protect his honor.
    I agree with you. We're talking about the character of both, but with Ron it's about what he's done as a basketball player, with Magic Ron is hitting his home life, not what he did in the NBA.

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    Default Re: Artest distastefully responds to Magic Johnson

    Quote Originally Posted by beast23
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    I think that most of you guys are totally missing the point. Everyone seems to think that in one instance we are talking about a man's career and in the other instance, we are talking about a man's personal life.

    Bull*****!!!

    If you tell me that you will not take a chance on me, you aren't saying a word about my career.

    You are talking about my character, clear and simple.

    Magic Johnson makes a statement about a man's character, the back, the man (Artest) responds back, and you somehow think the two are not the same? I suppose the only thing Artest would be guilty of is not putting himself above it all and simply "turning the other cheek".

    Now I don't know about you guys, but the most important things to me are the health/safety of my family and our reputations.

    In the workplace, the only thing of importance that I take to work and come home with every day is my reputation. If you attack that, then it forces me to defend it.

    In Ron's case, the mistake he made really couldn't be defended. And he said as much in his interview. So, human nature being what it is, he did what he thought was the next best thing. He reduced the power of the attack on his character by pointing out the hypocrisy of the one who made the statement.

    Bottom line is that when you attack the character of someone else, then by default your own character becomes fair game to the one you attacked.

    In this regard, I don't think Artest is any different than any of us.
    Did you listen to Magic's statement? He said if Ron did ONE more crazy thing after he gets traded then he's out. He actually said that this was Ron's last chance to act properly. But then again you can't teach an old dog new tricks. If youre fine with how Ron responded to Magic's statement then so be it, but how can you say Magic is a hypocrite? Because he obtained AIDS he can't call out a player for acting unprofessionally? This is the NBA ang not the ghetto. Act accordingly or be bashed by the media and fined. And with how Ron reacted I just think he just doesn't and will never know any better. Some people just don't understand the concept of diplomacy, professionalism, respect and taking responsibility for you actions. He said he knew he dug himself a hole and after everything he's done, is it really SHOCKING for people to say that when he gets traded that he should be in his best behaviour? If Ron was offended with that and did not get the essence of what Magic said that he really has to straighten up, then he's really just an immature stupid kid who doesn't even know how to respect rules and has too much pride too really look within himself to correct his crap and rather dig crap from another than to just reform.

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    Default Re: Artest distastefully responds to Magic Johnson

    Sometimes you gotta know when to lean on the shovel!

    If you're out there Ron, somewhere in internet land, reading these words, stop and check yourself, you are dangerously close to wrecking yourself. It'd be like humpty dumpty bro. They ain't gonna put ya back together when you fall. Let it go and concentrate on what you can and don't worry about the damage behind you. Mistakes happen. Three years from now, and nobody will remember this crap (well some will but so what). Move on and pick up the pieces and don't dig deeper.

    Just my two cents worth. I really don't want to see Ron throw the talent he has away, and if he screws with Magic and Sir Charles, he's fooling with the NBA's golden children and he'll pay the price in some way shape or form.

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    Default Re: Artest distastefully responds to Magic Johnson

    The biggest question to me isn't that Ron said something about Magic. It is why is he still talking? Is "no comment" really that hard to say? Does opinion mean that much to Ron that he feels he has to respond? Just more signs of a mentally weak and emotionally immature person to me.
    "They could turn out to be only innocent mathematicians, I suppose," muttered Woevre's section officer, de Decker.

    "'Only.'" Woevre was amused. "Someday you'll explain to me how that's possible. Seeing that, on the face of it, all mathematics leads, doesn't it, sooner or later, to some kind of human suffering."

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    Default Re: Artest distastefully responds to Magic Johnson

    Quote Originally Posted by Kegboy
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    Oh, I'm most definitely with you there. And I think you're right, that they'd been together for a while, but had not been married long.

    Here's an article: http://www.aegis.com/news/lt/2001/LT011102.html
    Lets see, a millionare gives you aids....what do you do leave him and go to who?? She had ever right to slap him.

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    Default Re: Artest distastefully responds to Magic Johnson

    There's nothing wrong with what Ron said. Magic attacked his chracter, so he defended himself by making a solid point - people deserve second chances. What Magic did was far worse than anything Ron ever did. He violated someone very close to him, yet he was forgiven. Ron too should be forgiven. Yet there's plenty of fans out there who never will forgive him no matter what he says or does, and thats one of the main reasons he wants to leave Indiana.

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    Default Re: Artest distastefully responds to Magic Johnson

    Quote Originally Posted by Romsey31
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    Lets see, a millionare gives you aids....what do you do leave him and go to who?? She had ever right to slap him.
    Cookie doesn't have AIDS, Einstien. Neither does Magic, for that matter.

    HIV isn't AIDS. It can lead to AIDS, but it is not AIDS.

    Cookie also never got infected.

    It wasn't about being the team everyone loved, it was about beating the teams everyone else loved.

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    Default Re: Artest distastefully responds to Magic Johnson

    Quote Originally Posted by Romsey31
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    Lets see, a millionare gives you aids....what do you do leave him and go to who?? She had ever right to slap him.
    Magic never had full blown AIDS, only the HIV virus. If he had full blown AIDS he would've been dead long ago.

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    Default Re: Artest distastefully responds to Magic Johnson

    Quote Originally Posted by Kstat
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    Cookie doesn't have AIDS, Einstien. Neither does Magic, for that matter.

    HIV isn't AIDS. It can lead to AIDS, but it is not AIDS.

    Cookie also never got infected.
    #1, no need for the trolling "Einstein" remark.
    #2, no she doesnt have AIDS nor the HIV virus, but thats not the point. The point is, she could've easily caught it. Magic endangered not only his own life, but his fiances life, and most importantly, his unborn childs life. And he did it while violating is future wife's trust, and their relationship as a whole.
    That makes him a lowlife ******* in my mind. But nah, noway Magic could be a bad guy. He was a great basketball player, a tv celebrity. And did i mention he smiles a lot? Yeah, no way someone who smiles that much could be a bad person...

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    Default Re: Artest distastefully responds to Magic Johnson

    Quote Originally Posted by Naptown Seth
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    There's nothing wrong with what Ron said. Magic attacked his chracter, so he defended himself by making a solid point - people deserve second chances. What Magic did was far worse than anything Ron ever did. He violated someone very close to him, yet he was forgiven. Ron too should be forgiven. Yet there's plenty of fans out there who never will forgive him no matter what he says or does, and thats one of the main reasons he wants to leave Indiana.

    Ron was a dick and took the conversation personal, when it was about basketball and actions by Ron that affected basketball. He was wrong, YET AGAIN.

    Magic is no angel, I have no problem saying that. I never really liked him all that well, but I respect what he did on the basketball court and some of the decisions he has made in the business world.

    Ron HAS been forgiven. Countless times. He will not and should not be forgiven now. Sooner or later, you have to say enough is enough. How many more chances are you willing to give him? What does he have to do to NOT get another chance with you, burn down Conseco and run over Boomer on the flight from the crime scene?

    And lastly, from what I'm hearing, Ron doesn't want to leave Indy now. If you can chalk up all the talk the last week about wanting out as 'he didn't really mean it, or he was upset' how can you trust what he is saying now? Shouldn't it even be considered that he could be figuring out what a dumbass he has been this last week? Maybe he is figuring out that it really IS a lot better here than virtually anywhere else in the NBA for him? With Ron it is always speak first (or ACT first) and figure out what he should have done later, after everyone is scratching their heads......



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    Default Re: Artest distastefully responds to Magic Johnson

    For the record, Magic has been one of the biggest developers of urban ghettos in US history. He's built countless movie theatres in areas people said was too crime-ridden and poor to support them.

    As a buisnessman, Magic's done an incredible amount for poor people in America.

    Magic obviously wasn't a saint, but he's done a lot more good than bad.

    It wasn't about being the team everyone loved, it was about beating the teams everyone else loved.

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    Default Re: Artest distastefully responds to Magic Johnson

    Ok, I came across too harsh in that last post.

    I don't know Magic personally, obviously. I don't know how he is behind the scenes. I don't know what he thinks, what he feels etc. But the point is, neither do any of you. Yet many of you act like Magic is a great guy simply because he was a great basketball player and he seems nice on TV, which is foolish.
    Magic made a big mistake, a mistake that could've cost many people their lives - his own, his wifes, his unborn childs, and who knows how many other groupies he slept with before discovering he was HIV positive. Yet through all of that, he was forgiven by his wife, and his fans. Yet Ron Artest throws a camera, flips off crowd, and punches out a fan who throws a full cup of beer in his face, and he's vilified for it.

    Do you all honestly not see the extreme hypocrisy in that?

    And yeah, it's Magic Johnson's right as an analysist to speak his opinion, however it's also Ron's right as a human being to defend himself.

    Stop being overly P.C. hypocrits.

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    Default Re: Artest distastefully responds to Magic Johnson

    Now to put things in a basketball perspective (and ONLY a basketball perspective), there is no comparison at all. Magic was the consummate teamate, and Ron has been the consummate BAD teamate.

    It wasn't about being the team everyone loved, it was about beating the teams everyone else loved.

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    Default Re: Artest distastefully responds to Magic Johnson

    Quote Originally Posted by Naptown Seth
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    Yet Ron Artest throws a camera, flips off crowd, and punches out a fan who throws a full cup of beer in his face, and he's vilified for it.
    He has done a whole lot more than that. Don't trivialize the consequences of those and many other mistakes.

    Quote Originally Posted by Naptown Seth
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    Do you all honestly not see the extreme hypocrisy in that?
    No, I don't.


    Quote Originally Posted by Naptown Seth
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    Stop being overly P.C. hypocrits.
    Now who is name-calling? Keep it civilized or stop posting. People don't agree with you, and I for one, never will on this issue.

    It escapes me how someone can continually defend someone as detrimental to himself, his family, his team, and the NBA as Ron has been for the last few years.



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    Default Re: Artest distastefully responds to Magic Johnson

    I can't say I don't entirely disagree with what Ron said about Magic.

    It's the truth and he was defending himself. Not that Ron cares anymore. Anyone who thinks he wont get a contract with any team is a moron because Ron has the potential to be the best all around player in the NBA if he ever grew up..and I know a ton of lowly teams that would be willing to gamble on that potential.

    I see him going to Portland or the likes so he can join Patterson and they can make the highlights together for saying stupid things. Then Portland would also sign Spree.

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    Default Re: Artest distastefully responds to Magic Johnson

    Quote Originally Posted by Moses
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    I can't say I don't entirely disagree with what Ron said about Magic.

    It's the truth and he was defending himself. Not that Ron cares anymore. Anyone who thinks he wont get a contract with any team is a moron because Ron has the potential to be the best all around player in the NBA if he ever grew up..and I know a ton of lowly teams that would be willing to gamble on that potential.

    I see him going to Portland or the likes so he can join Patterson and they can make the highlights together for saying stupid things. Then Portland would also sign Spree.
    And if Ron Burgundy says it...

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    Default Re: Artest distastefully responds to Magic Johnson

    Quote Originally Posted by rcarey
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    And if Ron Burgundy says it...
    It's the truth!!

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