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The Rules of Pacers Digest

Hello everyone,

Whether your are a long standing forum member or whether you have just registered today, it's a good idea to read and review the rules below so that you have a very good idea of what to expect when you come to Pacers Digest.

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Why do we do this? So that it's more difficult for spammers (be they human or robot) to post, and so users who are banned cannot immediately re-register and start dousing people with verbal flames.

Below are the rules of Pacers Digest. After you have read them, you will have a very good sense of where we are coming from, what we expect, what we don't want to see, and how we react to things.

Rule #1

Pacers Digest is intended to be a place to discuss basketball without having to deal with the kinds of behaviors or attitudes that distract people from sticking with the discussion of the topics at hand. These unwanted distractions can come in many forms, and admittedly it can sometimes be tricky to pin down each and every kind that can rear its ugly head, but we feel that the following examples and explanations cover at least a good portion of that ground and should at least give people a pretty good idea of the kinds of things we actively discourage:

"Anyone who __________ is a liar / a fool / an idiot / a blind homer / has their head buried in the sand / a blind hater / doesn't know basketball / doesn't watch the games"

"People with intelligence will agree with me when I say that __________"

"Only stupid people think / believe / do ___________"

"I can't wait to hear something from PosterX when he/she sees that **insert a given incident or current event that will have probably upset or disappointed PosterX here**"

"He/she is just delusional"

"This thread is stupid / worthless / embarrassing"

"I'm going to take a moment to point and / laugh at PosterX / GroupOfPeopleY who thought / believed *insert though/belief here*"

"Remember when PosterX said OldCommentY that no longer looks good? "

In general, if a comment goes from purely on topic to something 'ad hominem' (personal jabs, personal shots, attacks, flames, however you want to call it, towards a person, or a group of people, or a given city/state/country of people), those are most likely going to be found intolerable.

We also dissuade passive aggressive behavior. This can be various things, but common examples include statements that are basically meant to imply someone is either stupid or otherwise incapable of holding a rational conversation. This can include (but is not limited to) laughing at someone's conclusions rather than offering an honest rebuttal, asking people what game they were watching, or another common problem is Poster X will say "that player isn't that bad" and then Poster Y will say something akin to "LOL you think that player is good". We're not going to tolerate those kinds of comments out of respect for the community at large and for the sake of trying to just have an honest conversation.

Now, does the above cover absolutely every single kind of distraction that is unwanted? Probably not, but you should by now have a good idea of the general types of things we will be discouraging. The above examples are meant to give you a good feel for / idea of what we're looking for. If something new or different than the above happens to come along and results in the same problem (that being, any other attitude or behavior that ultimately distracts from actually just discussing the topic at hand, or that is otherwise disrespectful to other posters), we can and we will take action to curb this as well, so please don't take this to mean that if you managed to technically avoid saying something exactly like one of the above examples that you are then somehow off the hook.

That all having been said, our goal is to do so in a generally kind and respectful way, and that doesn't mean the moment we see something we don't like that somebody is going to be suspended or banned, either. It just means that at the very least we will probably say something about it, quite possibly snipping out the distracting parts of the post in question while leaving alone the parts that are actually just discussing the topics, and in the event of a repeating or excessive problem, then we will start issuing infractions to try to further discourage further repeat problems, and if it just never seems to improve, then finally suspensions or bans will come into play. We would prefer it never went that far, and most of the time for most of our posters, it won't ever have to.

A slip up every once and a while is pretty normal, but, again, when it becomes repetitive or excessive, something will be done. Something occasional is probably going to be let go (within reason), but when it starts to become habitual or otherwise a pattern, odds are very good that we will step in.

There's always a small minority that like to push people's buttons and/or test their own boundaries with regards to the administrators, and in the case of someone acting like that, please be aware that this is not a court of law, but a private website run by people who are simply trying to do the right thing as they see it. If we feel that you are a special case that needs to be dealt with in an exceptional way because your behavior isn't explicitly mirroring one of our above examples of what we generally discourage, we can and we will take atypical action to prevent this from continuing if you are not cooperative with us.

Also please be aware that you will not be given a pass simply by claiming that you were 'only joking,' because quite honestly, when someone really is just joking, for one thing most people tend to pick up on the joke, including the person or group that is the target of the joke, and for another thing, in the event where an honest joke gets taken seriously and it upsets or angers someone, the person who is truly 'only joking' will quite commonly go out of his / her way to apologize and will try to mend fences. People who are dishonest about their statements being 'jokes' do not do so, and in turn that becomes a clear sign of what is really going on. It's nothing new.

In any case, quite frankly, the overall quality and health of the entire forum's community is more important than any one troublesome user will ever be, regardless of exactly how a problem is exhibiting itself, and if it comes down to us having to make a choice between you versus the greater health and happiness of the entire community, the community of this forum will win every time.

Lastly, there are also some posters, who are generally great contributors and do not otherwise cause any problems, who sometimes feel it's their place to provoke or to otherwise 'mess with' that small minority of people described in the last paragraph, and while we possibly might understand why you might feel you WANT to do something like that, the truth is we can't actually tolerate that kind of behavior from you any more than we can tolerate the behavior from them. So if we feel that you are trying to provoke those other posters into doing or saying something that will get themselves into trouble, then we will start to view you as a problem as well, because of the same reason as before: The overall health of the forum comes first, and trying to stir the pot with someone like that doesn't help, it just makes it worse. Some will simply disagree with this philosophy, but if so, then so be it because ultimately we have to do what we think is best so long as it's up to us.

If you see a problem that we haven't addressed, the best and most appropriate course for a forum member to take here is to look over to the left of the post in question. See underneath that poster's name, avatar, and other info, down where there's a little triangle with an exclamation point (!) in it? Click that. That allows you to report the post to the admins so we can definitely notice it and give it a look to see what we feel we should do about it. Beyond that, obviously it's human nature sometimes to want to speak up to the poster in question who has bothered you, but we would ask that you try to refrain from doing so because quite often what happens is two or more posters all start going back and forth about the original offending post, and suddenly the entire thread is off topic or otherwise derailed. So while the urge to police it yourself is understandable, it's best to just report it to us and let us handle it. Thank you!

All of the above is going to be subject to a case by case basis, but generally and broadly speaking, this should give everyone a pretty good idea of how things will typically / most often be handled.

Rule #2

If the actions of an administrator inspire you to make a comment, criticism, or express a concern about it, there is a wrong place and a couple of right places to do so.

The wrong place is to do so in the original thread in which the administrator took action. For example, if a post gets an infraction, or a post gets deleted, or a comment within a larger post gets clipped out, in a thread discussing Paul George, the wrong thing to do is to distract from the discussion of Paul George by adding your off topic thoughts on what the administrator did.

The right places to do so are:

A) Start a thread about the specific incident you want to talk about on the Feedback board. This way you are able to express yourself in an area that doesn't throw another thread off topic, and this way others can add their two cents as well if they wish, and additionally if there's something that needs to be said by the administrators, that is where they will respond to it.

B) Send a private message to the administrators, and they can respond to you that way.

If this is done the wrong way, those comments will be deleted, and if it's a repeating problem then it may also receive an infraction as well.

Rule #3

If a poster is bothering you, and an administrator has not or will not deal with that poster to the extent that you would prefer, you have a powerful tool at your disposal, one that has recently been upgraded and is now better than ever: The ability to ignore a user.

When you ignore a user, you will unfortunately still see some hints of their existence (nothing we can do about that), however, it does the following key things:

A) Any post they make will be completely invisible as you scroll through a thread.

B) The new addition to this feature: If someone QUOTES a user you are ignoring, you do not have to read who it was, or what that poster said, unless you go out of your way to click on a link to find out who it is and what they said.

To utilize this feature, from any page on Pacers Digest, scroll to the top of the page, look to the top right where it says 'Settings' and click that. From the settings page, look to the left side of the page where it says 'My Settings', and look down from there until you see 'Edit Ignore List' and click that. From here, it will say 'Add a Member to Your List...' Beneath that, click in the text box to the right of 'User Name', type in or copy & paste the username of the poster you are ignoring, and once their name is in the box, look over to the far right and click the 'Okay' button. All done!

Rule #4

Regarding infractions, currently they carry a value of one point each, and that point will expire in 31 days. If at any point a poster is carrying three points at the same time, that poster will be suspended until the oldest of the three points expires.

Rule #5

When you share or paste content or articles from another website, you must include the URL/link back to where you found it, who wrote it, and what website it's from. Said content will be removed if this doesn't happen.

An example:

If I copy and paste an article from the Indianapolis Star website, I would post something like this:

http://www.linktothearticlegoeshere.com/article
Title of the Article
Author's Name
Indianapolis Star

Rule #6

We cannot tolerate illegal videos on Pacers Digest. This means do not share any links to them, do not mention any websites that host them or link to them, do not describe how to find them in any way, and do not ask about them. Posts doing anything of the sort will be removed, the offenders will be contacted privately, and if the problem becomes habitual, you will be suspended, and if it still persists, you will probably be banned.

The legal means of watching or listening to NBA games are NBA League Pass Broadband (for US, or for International; both cost money) and NBA Audio League Pass (which is free). Look for them on NBA.com.

Rule #7

Provocative statements in a signature, or as an avatar, or as the 'tagline' beneath a poster's username (where it says 'Member' or 'Administrator' by default, if it is not altered) are an unwanted distraction that will more than likely be removed on sight. There can be shades of gray to this, but in general this could be something political or religious that is likely going to provoke or upset people, or otherwise something that is mean-spirited at the expense of a poster, a group of people, or a population.

It may or may not go without saying, but this goes for threads and posts as well, particularly when it's not made on the off-topic board (Market Square).

We do make exceptions if we feel the content is both innocuous and unlikely to cause social problems on the forum (such as wishing someone a Merry Christmas or a Happy Easter), and we also also make exceptions if such topics come up with regards to a sports figure (such as the Lance Stephenson situation bringing up discussions of domestic abuse and the law, or when Jason Collins came out as gay and how that lead to some discussion about gay rights).

However, once the discussion seems to be more/mostly about the political issues instead of the sports figure or his specific situation, the thread is usually closed.

Rule #8

We prefer self-restraint and/or modesty when making jokes or off topic comments in a sports discussion thread. They can be fun, but sometimes they derail or distract from a topic, and we don't want to see that happen. If we feel it is a problem, we will either delete or move those posts from the thread.

Rule #9

Generally speaking, we try to be a "PG-13" rated board, and we don't want to see sexual content or similarly suggestive content. Vulgarity is a more muddled issue, though again we prefer things to lean more towards "PG-13" than "R". If we feel things have gone too far, we will step in.

Rule #10

We like small signatures, not big signatures. The bigger the signature, the more likely it is an annoying or distracting signature.

Rule #11

Do not advertise anything without talking about it with the administrators first. This includes advertising with your signature, with your avatar, through private messaging, and/or by making a thread or post.
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"Pacers are asking for the World"

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  • #1

    "Pacers are asking for the World"

    So says a Mavs official

    http://www.dfw.com/mld/dfw/sports/ba...printstory.jsp




    At right price, Artest might be Mavs' championship key

    By JIM REEVES
    Star-Telegram Staff Writer

    DALLAS -- This one is a character tester.

    This one will make you check your hole card.

    This one could have you mumbling to yourself all season.

    Ron Artest: Should the Mavs take the gamble or play the hand they've been dealt?

    Gut instinct says leave him alone. He's T.O. in baggy shorts. He's Randy Moss on hardwood. He's very bad news. Let someone else borrow that trouble.

    But in the back of my mind, I wonder: Is this the elite player who could put the Mavs over the top, the missing piece that could make them as good as the San Antonio Spurs? Or even better?

    And the whisper that comes back is, yeah, that's exactly what he could be.

    If the Mavs want to win an NBA championship this season, it's a risk they have to take.

    But only if the price is right.

    "They [the Indiana Pacers] are asking the world," one Mavs official said after Wednesday night's 102-96 victory over Phoenix. "We're not going to mortgage our future for him."

    The official company line has become almost a mantra when Artest's name comes up.

    "We like our team," coach Avery Johnson said before the game.

    "We like our team," echoed owner Mark Cuban during his pregame ritual on the Stairmaster. "You can talk about any player in the league and speculate.

    "What I will tell you is, just because a player demands something doesn't mean it's going to happen."

    But the Pacers have said they intend to try to accommodate Artest by the end of the week.

    "What better way to defuse the situation?" Cuban said. "I don't know Ron at all, and there's no reason to do our homework and find out."

    Whoa. Avery had just told the media in his pregame briefing that homework is exactly what the Mavs do in situations like this, and Cuban is no dummy.

    So why was Cuban being so coy?

    Of course they've done their homework. If the Mavs' brain trust hasn't collectively discussed the pros and cons of bringing Artest to Dallas, then I'll happily volunteer to wear Mark's silliest Mavs T-shirt to a home game sometime this season.

    This subject is so sensitive around the AAC, even Big Nellie backed away when it came up.

    "Anything I say could be misconstrued," Don Nelson said. "Ask Mark or Donnie."

    I already know what they'd say: "We like our team."

    Nellie knows that Artest could be to the Mavs what Brett Hull once was to the Stars or Charles Haley was to the Cowboys.

    Artest is arguably a top-10 talent with exactly the skills the Mavs need. He's a good offensive player, a strong rebounder and a great defensive player. He would bring an element of toughness that the Mavs lack.

    "It's something you'd have to be interested in," former Mavs guard Derek Harper said. "There are some things you put up with if you have a chance to win a championship."

    Artest is Bruce Bowen with an offensive game. He could be the second option behind Dirk Nowitzki that the Mavs have so desperately needed.

    "Like a lot of other teams, we always do our homework," Avery said. "If we thought there was something out there that could put us over the top or put us on the next level, we would make those calls.

    "We just haven't made that call yet. All we're saying is that for our basketball team, [Artest] is not the right fit."

    It's the fit that Avery seems most concerned about, not the baggage that Artest brings.

    Forget about getting him for Jerry Stackhouse or Keith Van Horn. The Pacers, the Mavs official said, want to start with Josh Howard or Devin Harris, and work from there.

    And what about that baggage? What about the mood swings and the violent behavior? What about the CDs and the acting and the other distractions? Do the Mavs really want to expose their young players to this guy?

    Yet, one of Artest's most vocal critics, The Indianapolis Star columnist Bob Kravitz, agrees that he could be a difference-maker for a good team.

    "I've been calling for him to be traded here for three years, but if I was a team hanging around near the top, he'd be worth the risk," Kravitz said. "The thing is, nobody thinks he's a bad guy. There's no looting or pillaging here, no beating up the wife, or drugs or anything like that. He's just scattered."

    Hmmm. I suspect Kravitz has used harsher terms than "scattered" to describe Artest's behavior over the years.

    Hull was crazy. Haley was crazy. But Artest is crazy in a you-never-know-what-you're-gonna-get kind of way. He's constantly at the center of some melodrama.

    "It's never destructive to other people, but it's destructive to the team," Kravitz said. "Still, you always have the feeling that the light's going to come on at any moment.

    "He gives you just enough to make you think he's going to get it some day."

    And, of course, every coach believes he's the guy who can flip the switch.

    "I've played with players like that before," Avery said. "I wouldn't have a problem coaching that type of player.

    "When Nick Van Exel came here, he was supposed to be such a headache. What a headache he was ... He was a headache to the opponents. It's all about the environment, the relationship that particular player has with the coach, with his teammates."

    One problem: In Indianapolis, Artest had no relationship with his coach or his teammates. The consensus locker room response to the Pacers agreeing to trade him? Good riddance.

    "I guess a leopard never changes his spots," former teammate Reggie Miller told Kravitz earlier this week.

    Maybe not. Maybe gut instinct is right. Maybe you don't touch this guy at all. After all, the Mavs are 16-6, the third-best record in the league, without Artest. The risk is enormous.

    On the other hand, the reward just might be the same.
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  • #2
    Re: "Pacers are asking for the World"

    Oh, I suppose I could settle for Josh Howard.
    Ever notice how friendly folks are at a shootin' range??.

    Comment

    • #3
      Re: "Pacers are asking for the World"

      Unless we asked for Dirk, he should stop whining.

      Comment

      • #4
        Re: "Pacers are asking for the World"

        Maybe we should have asked for Dirk, then they would have said, "No, no, no, anyone but Dirk." Then we could have asked for Howard.

        Comment

        • #5
          Re: "Pacers are asking for the World"

          Some of this is posturing, just like Donnie getting 30 calls a day,, Teams are saying they will not give up x player or they are asking too much in an attempt and drive down the market, and then be able to turn around give up more than other teams.

          Why Not Us ?

          Comment

          • #6
            Re: "Pacers are asking for the World"

            You're supposed to haggle...
            Originally posted by Natston;n3510291
            I want the people to know that they still have 2 out of the 3 T.J.s working for them, and that ain't bad...

            Comment

            • #7
              Re: "Pacers are asking for the World"

              The Pacers want Josh Howard and Marquis Daniels from the Mavericks .Chance it could be Howard and Harris, but you know its Howard and one of the 2 young guards.

              Comment

              • #8
                Re: "Pacers are asking for the World"

                Originally posted by naturallystoned
                You're supposed to haggle...
                Yes you are.
                “Success is not final, failure is not fatal: it is the courage to continue that counts.” - Winston Churchill

                “If you can't be a good example, then you'll just have to serve as a horrible warning.” - Catherine Aird

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                • #9
                  Re: "Pacers are asking for the World"

                  Don't be deluding yourselves into believing that we should expect someone like Josh Howard back from a team like the Mavs. I am inclined to believe that we are not in as great a bargaining position as Walsh would lead us to be in.

                  I really hope that Walsh isn't deluding himself into believing that we can getting decent starting quality 1st/2nd options from opposing GMs.

                  I just want to get solid decent players that can fill our needs for this season so that we can move on. The more losses that we pile on....1 so far....the more obvious that it will be that we need to get back something for Artest and therefore put us in a weaker position to bargain.

                  If there are players that Walsh wants and it costs us some capspace ( that isn't outrageous ) and maybe not getting back a draft pick...then do it.

                  No matter what....this Artest thing is a huge dark cloud hanging over the head of the players....we have to get it out of the way so that the players can focus on playing.

                  Most of all....I do not want to be put in a position where we have to deal Artest to the Knicks for QRich or JCrawford!!!!!
                  Ash from Army of Darkness: Good...Bad...I'm the guy with the gun.

                  Comment

                  • #10
                    Re: "Pacers are asking for the World"

                    Originally posted by diamonddave00
                    The Pacers want Josh Howard and Marquis Daniels from the Mavericks .Chance it could be Howard and Harris, but you know its Howard and one of the 2 young guards.
                    And for the opportunity to tip the balance of power in the West (at least in the regular season), it's more than worth it. Ron would turn Dallas into a powerhouse and give them a shot at getting farther in the playoffs than they've ever been. I wouldn't do it though, if I were Donnie.

                    Comment

                    • #11
                      Re: "Pacers are asking for the World"

                      Originally posted by diamonddave00
                      The Pacers want Josh Howard and Marquis Daniels from the Mavericks .Chance it could be Howard and Harris, but you know its Howard and one of the 2 young guards.

                      Is asking for Josh Howard and Harris asking for the world?? Now I would be happy getting those two back or Daniels in a trade with the Mavs but none of those guys are going to be superstars. Now if we asked for Dirk and Josh Howard or just Dirk thats reaching but I highly doubt we did that.

                      Everbody wants Artest but no one wants to give up anything half way decent. Almost all the deals being rumored have us getting guys back that A) washed up or B) taking back bad contracts.I got a kick out of the Post this morning where Isiah basically said all of his young players are off limits( lee, Robinson, Ariza) as if any of those players have a chance to be stars in this league. Hell Lee isn't even activated and at best Ariza is a 9th man on most teams.Talk about overating your own players.

                      I would rather see Artest sit out the next two years and not play then give Artest up to a team like Dallas, Golden State and watch them win a title and wind up getting anything out of the deal. I still think Walsh is going to get a good deal for Artest but I think its going to take alot longer to trade him then was first reported.

                      Comment

                      • #12
                        Re: "Pacers are asking for the World"

                        Originally posted by naturallystoned
                        You're supposed to haggle...
                        Not if your name is Brian and you're about to be captured by Roman guards....
                        Don't ask Marvin Harrison what he did during the bye week. "Batman never told where the Bat Cave is," he explained.

                        Comment

                        • #13
                          Re: "Pacers are asking for the World"

                          Every team overrates it's own players and underrates others, just like the fans do. Artest for Howard and Harris/Daniels would be a steal for Dallas, who is on the cusp of something great now. And for us, it allows us to rebuild on the run. We won't be a title contender this year, but maybe in a couple years we could move back up with the right moves.

                          Comment

                          • #14
                            Re: "Pacers are asking for the World"

                            Originally posted by Suaveness
                            Not if your name is Brian and you're about to be captured by Roman guards....
                            There's one born every minute...
                            “Seventy percent of me talking on the court is personally for me to get me
                            motivated and going. Thirty percent is to see if I can get into the opponent’s head.”
                            Reggie Miller

                            Comment

                            • #15
                              Re: "Pacers are asking for the World"

                              "They [the Indiana Pacers] are asking the world," one Mavs official said after Wednesday night's 102-96 victory over Phoenix. "We're not going to mortgage our future for him."

                              Mortgage the future (maybe) for a REAL shot at winning it all RIGHT NOW? Bet you WAY more than 1/2 the team owners in pro sports say GO FOR IT NOW !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! You strike when the iron is hot and you are CLOSE.
                              Negotiating..............................

                              Comment

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