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Rule #1

Pacers Digest is intended to be a place to discuss basketball without having to deal with the kinds of behaviors or attitudes that distract people from sticking with the discussion of the topics at hand. These unwanted distractions can come in many forms, and admittedly it can sometimes be tricky to pin down each and every kind that can rear its ugly head, but we feel that the following examples and explanations cover at least a good portion of that ground and should at least give people a pretty good idea of the kinds of things we actively discourage:

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"Remember when PosterX said OldCommentY that no longer looks good? "

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We also dissuade passive aggressive behavior. This can be various things, but common examples include statements that are basically meant to imply someone is either stupid or otherwise incapable of holding a rational conversation. This can include (but is not limited to) laughing at someone's conclusions rather than offering an honest rebuttal, asking people what game they were watching, or another common problem is Poster X will say "that player isn't that bad" and then Poster Y will say something akin to "LOL you think that player is good". We're not going to tolerate those kinds of comments out of respect for the community at large and for the sake of trying to just have an honest conversation.

Now, does the above cover absolutely every single kind of distraction that is unwanted? Probably not, but you should by now have a good idea of the general types of things we will be discouraging. The above examples are meant to give you a good feel for / idea of what we're looking for. If something new or different than the above happens to come along and results in the same problem (that being, any other attitude or behavior that ultimately distracts from actually just discussing the topic at hand, or that is otherwise disrespectful to other posters), we can and we will take action to curb this as well, so please don't take this to mean that if you managed to technically avoid saying something exactly like one of the above examples that you are then somehow off the hook.

That all having been said, our goal is to do so in a generally kind and respectful way, and that doesn't mean the moment we see something we don't like that somebody is going to be suspended or banned, either. It just means that at the very least we will probably say something about it, quite possibly snipping out the distracting parts of the post in question while leaving alone the parts that are actually just discussing the topics, and in the event of a repeating or excessive problem, then we will start issuing infractions to try to further discourage further repeat problems, and if it just never seems to improve, then finally suspensions or bans will come into play. We would prefer it never went that far, and most of the time for most of our posters, it won't ever have to.

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Also please be aware that you will not be given a pass simply by claiming that you were 'only joking,' because quite honestly, when someone really is just joking, for one thing most people tend to pick up on the joke, including the person or group that is the target of the joke, and for another thing, in the event where an honest joke gets taken seriously and it upsets or angers someone, the person who is truly 'only joking' will quite commonly go out of his / her way to apologize and will try to mend fences. People who are dishonest about their statements being 'jokes' do not do so, and in turn that becomes a clear sign of what is really going on. It's nothing new.

In any case, quite frankly, the overall quality and health of the entire forum's community is more important than any one troublesome user will ever be, regardless of exactly how a problem is exhibiting itself, and if it comes down to us having to make a choice between you versus the greater health and happiness of the entire community, the community of this forum will win every time.

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If you see a problem that we haven't addressed, the best and most appropriate course for a forum member to take here is to look over to the left of the post in question. See underneath that poster's name, avatar, and other info, down where there's a little triangle with an exclamation point (!) in it? Click that. That allows you to report the post to the admins so we can definitely notice it and give it a look to see what we feel we should do about it. Beyond that, obviously it's human nature sometimes to want to speak up to the poster in question who has bothered you, but we would ask that you try to refrain from doing so because quite often what happens is two or more posters all start going back and forth about the original offending post, and suddenly the entire thread is off topic or otherwise derailed. So while the urge to police it yourself is understandable, it's best to just report it to us and let us handle it. Thank you!

All of the above is going to be subject to a case by case basis, but generally and broadly speaking, this should give everyone a pretty good idea of how things will typically / most often be handled.

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If this is done the wrong way, those comments will be deleted, and if it's a repeating problem then it may also receive an infraction as well.

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When you ignore a user, you will unfortunately still see some hints of their existence (nothing we can do about that), however, it does the following key things:

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Rule #4

Regarding infractions, currently they carry a value of one point each, and that point will expire in 31 days. If at any point a poster is carrying three points at the same time, that poster will be suspended until the oldest of the three points expires.

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If I copy and paste an article from the Indianapolis Star website, I would post something like this:

http://www.linktothearticlegoeshere.com/article
Title of the Article
Author's Name
Indianapolis Star

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The legal means of watching or listening to NBA games are NBA League Pass Broadband (for US, or for International; both cost money) and NBA Audio League Pass (which is free). Look for them on NBA.com.

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Provocative statements in a signature, or as an avatar, or as the 'tagline' beneath a poster's username (where it says 'Member' or 'Administrator' by default, if it is not altered) are an unwanted distraction that will more than likely be removed on sight. There can be shades of gray to this, but in general this could be something political or religious that is likely going to provoke or upset people, or otherwise something that is mean-spirited at the expense of a poster, a group of people, or a population.

It may or may not go without saying, but this goes for threads and posts as well, particularly when it's not made on the off-topic board (Market Square).

We do make exceptions if we feel the content is both innocuous and unlikely to cause social problems on the forum (such as wishing someone a Merry Christmas or a Happy Easter), and we also also make exceptions if such topics come up with regards to a sports figure (such as the Lance Stephenson situation bringing up discussions of domestic abuse and the law, or when Jason Collins came out as gay and how that lead to some discussion about gay rights).

However, once the discussion seems to be more/mostly about the political issues instead of the sports figure or his specific situation, the thread is usually closed.

Rule #8

We prefer self-restraint and/or modesty when making jokes or off topic comments in a sports discussion thread. They can be fun, but sometimes they derail or distract from a topic, and we don't want to see that happen. If we feel it is a problem, we will either delete or move those posts from the thread.

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Rule #10

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Rule #11

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Ranking the games best shooting guards

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  • #1

    Ranking the games best shooting guards

    http://msn.foxsports.com/nba/story/4806088

    Wade's already top shooting guard in game
    Story Tools: Print Email XML

    Mike Kahn / Special to FOXSports.com
    Posted: 35 minutes ago

    The glamour position of the NBA remains just that.


    Filled with spectacular athletes capable of taking over games in any number of ways, they can grab the ball off the rim, take the ball the length of the floor, and burn defenders from the perimeter or off the dribble on a whim.

    The bigger question is how do you differentiate between the elite shooting guards who play the game today?

    Seriously now ... do you really think Dwyane Wade is a better basketball player than Kobe Bryant?

    Then again, is Kobe Bryant more talented than Tracy McGrady?

    And while we're at it, is any one of the aforementioned trio even close to being the same kind of consistent leader that Ray Allen was for the Seattle SuperSonics last season?

    Not to be forgotten is the biggest winner of the entire group — Manu Ginobili, who in the last four seasons has won two NBA titles, an Olympic gold medal and a European title.

    Dwyane Wade needed just two seasons to reach the top of the shooting guard heap. (Victor Baldizon / Getty Images)


    The key to ranking extraordinarily talented players such as these is the criteria used for the ranking. If we went on pure talent, Vince Carter would be considered for first. So would Steve Francis. And there is always the sleeper of the bunch who everybody fell in love with over the past six months — Joe Johnson.

    Actually, Johnson is loaded with tangible skills, but we won't find out what kind of leadership qualities he has until we see how he performs with his new team in Atlanta.

    Bryant's leadership qualities have been in question since the team completely unraveled at the end of the 2004 NBA Finals against the Pistons and there was unrest last season.

    And that's not to mention that both McGrady and Carter admittedly quit on their previous teams, setting the stage for trades last season.

    That leaves us with the wonderfully talented and focused qualities that both Wade and Allen bring to the floor to help their teammates succeed. Not only did that last throughout the regular season, but well into the postseason. Wade led the Miami Heat to Game 7 of the Eastern Conference finals, and Allen carried the underdog and injured Sonics to Game 6 of the West semifinals against the San Antonio Spurs.

    So how do we differentiate between the two? Well, Wade just does more. He isn't the special perimeter shooter that Allen is, but Wade does everything else better ... from ballhandling, to taking players off the dribble, to setting up his teammates, and defending.

    Consequently, we believe not only is Wade the best shooting guard in the league entering this season, but along with a healthy Shaquille O'Neal and other additions to the team, will lead the Heat to their first NBA title in 2006.

    And without further adieu, here are our top 10 shooting guards for the 2005-06 season, and a few more:

    1. Dwyane Wade, Miami Heat



    Ht./Wt. 6-4, 210
    Numbers: 24.1 pts., 5.2 reb., 6.8 ast.
    Wade became the "It Player" during last year's playoffs. Strong, smooth and extraordinarily gifted, his best quality might just be his humility. And when you consider that he is just entering his third season ... it just puts everything in perspective. The fifth player taken in the special 2003 draft — after LeBron James, Darko Milicic, Carmelo Anthony and Chris Bosh — may indeed end up being the best of all.

    2. Ray Allen, Seattle SuperSonics



    Ht./Wt. 6-5, 205
    Numbers: 23.9 pts., 4.4 reb., 3.7 ast.
    Just when everybody thought the Sonics were headed to the cellar for good and Allen along with them, he gathered the troops and not only explained, but showed them how to win. He became an upper-crust superstar for good during the playoffs with a slew of extra-terrestrial performances against the Kings and Spurs that exceeded expectations even for Allen.

    3. Kobe Bryant, LA Lakers



    Kobe Bryant is the most complete talent at the SG position. But his attitude knocks him down to No. 3 on our list. (Rocky Widner / Getty Images)


    Ht./Wt. 6-6, 220
    Numbers: 27.6 pts., 5.9 reb., 6.0 ast.
    He's still the best package of talent, with the size, strength, quickness, defense and offensive skills. But there is so much resentment and disdain for his selfishness that he has to overcome that it tends to supersede his wondrous gifts. And it is amazingly ironic that Phil Jackson would return to coach after a one-year hiatus to help him prove otherwise.

    4. Tracy McGrady, Houston Rockets



    Ht./Wt. 6-8, 210
    Numbers: 25.7 pts., 6.2 reb., 5.7 ast.
    T-Mac appeared to do everything humanly possible in the first round of last year's playoffs against Dallas, and still couldn't prevent the Rockets from blowing a 2-0 lead coming home. It's too easy to point the finger at the irrefutable fact that he has never gotten out of the first round, but it's also why he's ranked no better than fourth.

    5. Vince Carter, New Jersey Nets



    Ht./Wt. 6-6, 220
    Numbers: 24.5 pts., 5.2 reb., 4.2 ast.
    There is still Vinsanity to reckon with, but the difference is in the definition. No longer is his talent what keeps fans in awe, but the contradiction of his great play to his frequent disappearing acts. He was outstanding down the stretch last season to get the Nets into the playoffs. Now in Year Two we'll find out how deep his commitment is. Plenty of people still need to be convinced.

    6. Manu Ginobili, San Antonio Spurs



    Ht./Wt. 6-6, 210
    Numbers: 16.0 pts., 4.4 reb., 3.9 ast.
    Many insiders watching the seven-game win over the Pistons believed it was Ginobili, not Tim Duncan, who should have been the MVP of the finals, and that it was backlash to commissioner David Stern's globalization theme that skewed voting from the writers. Whatever the case, Ginobili now is a legitimate All-Star in every phase of the game and getting better, regardless of whether he was raised in Argentina or Brooklyn.

    7. Steve Francis, Orlando Magic



    Ht./Wt. 6-3, 205
    Numbers: 21.3 pts., 5.8 reb., 7.0 ast.
    Stevie Franchise had hoped for bigger and better things with the Magic last season, only to suffer another disappointing trip into the lottery. He is not a point guard, nor a shooting guard. He is a guard, with exceptional talent, who just dribbles way, way, too much. Somebody else will play point, so he is a two, and we'll see if new coach Brian Hill can help him gain some consistency.

    8. Michael Redd, Milwaukee Bucks



    Ht./Wt. 6-6, 215
    Numbers: 23.0 pts., 4.2 reb., 2.3 ast.
    He has moved into the "elite player" category contract-wise and without question shooting-wise. But can he rise to the level of a player who helps his team win? The Bucks were a major disappointment last season and have added two key players in Andrew Bogut and Bobby Simmons, and new coach Terry Stotts. Now Redd has to prove he deserves the money and plaudits by leading them to the playoffs.

    9. Richard Hamilton, Detroit Pistons



    Ht./Wt. 6-7, 195
    Numbers: 18.7 pts., 3.9 reb., 4.9 ast.
    Rip's all-around improvement defensively and passing the ball have been vastly overlooked in the wake of the Pistons' back-to-back Eastern Conference titles. He remains one of the top two or three mid-range shooters in the game and is getting better all the time at setting up his teammates as well. Just because he's skinny, doesn't mean he can't play. He's potentially Reggie Miller with less range.

    10. Joe Johnson, Atlanta Hawks



    Ht./Wt. 6-7, 230
    Numbers: 17.1 pts., 5.1 reb., 3.5 ast.
    It's hard to figure what will happen to this marvelously talented 24-year-old now that he's going to the Hawks. A natural shooting guard, maybe he becomes a point guard, maybe a small forward. Whatever the case, he's the only other player who has the complete game on both ends of the floor and shooting touch to rival Bryant. The difference is, he may be too nice of a guy. Also under consideration: Larry Hughes, Cleveland Cavaliers; Michael Finley, free agent; Jason Richardson, Golden State Warriors; Jalen Rose, Toronto Raptors; Cuttino Mobley, Los Angeles Clippers; Stephen Jackson, Indiana Pacers.

    Tags: None
  • #2
    Re: Ranking the games best shooting guards

    WADE AT TOP?!Oh come on Kobe Bryant still holds the title as best Sg Wade has the best center in the game by side him.Kobe is a better shooter then Wade a better pentrater then Wade and is defintley more talented then Wade.

    Comment

    • #3
      Re: Ranking the games best shooting guards

      Ehh.... Ray Allen is very good, but the second best SG? I don't think so.

      Regards,

      Mourning
      2012 PD ABA Fantasy Keeper League Champion, sports.ws

      2011 PD ABA Fantasy Keeper League Champion, sports.ws

      2006 PD ABA Fantasy League runner up, sports.ws

      Comment

      • #4
        Re: Ranking the games best shooting guards

        RIP is ranked way low whcih is not right at all. He should be above

        Vince, Gnobli, Francis, Redd and maybe Ray Allen.
        ANDY: I guess it comes down to a simple choice, really. Get busy winning or get busy losing.

        Comment

        • #5
          Re: Ranking the games best shooting guards

          You ask me who I want on my team, Kobe or Wade, and I'll take Wade every time.

          I think Wade is a much better team player, and I would also say the Wade is the better penetrator, not Kobe. I will give Kobe the nod on shooting, but I do think Wade will improve.

          And bang for the buck, Wade wins hands down.

          Comment

          • #6
            Re: Ranking the games best shooting guards

            How dose Wade win Hands down.Kobe was a better scorer,shooter,passer,pentrator and rebounder last year and Kobes a better defender.Kobes better then Wade at both ends of the floor and has 3 rings on his hand.Kobes better then Wade hands down.

            Comment

            • #7
              Re: Ranking the games best shooting guards

              I'd take Wade because he has shown the willingness to play with another great player without crying about it. Remember, he won his 3 rings playing with the best center in the league as well.

              Comment

              • #8
                Re: Ranking the games best shooting guards

                Yes he know that.But Kobe is still more talented and is statistcly the better player.

                Comment

                • #9
                  Re: Ranking the games best shooting guards

                  Originally posted by Pimping31
                  Yes he know that.But Kobe is still more talented and is statistcly the better player.

                  The better player? No! The more talented player yes. You're stuck on stats and ability. Why did the author cut Kobe?

                  QUOTE: Bryant's leadership qualities have been in question since the team completely unraveled at the end of the 2004 NBA Finals against the Pistons and there was unrest last season.

                  In other words Kobe is a detriment to his team whereas Wade is a plus. Everything considered I would take Wade over Kobe as my shooting guard.

                  Comment

                  • #10
                    Re: Ranking the games best shooting guards

                    I'd take Artest as my SG anyday....

                    Wade's to small for my Liking...

                    I don't really need my SG to score.. I'd prefer a Defensive Presence..

                    but hey thats just how I play Live

                    Tinsley, Artest, Bender, O'neal, Harrison

                    Bench Jackson, Jones, Korver & Foster

                    Dreammm Teammmm ahhhh drooling....
                    Ya Think Ya Used Enough Dynamite there Butch...

                    Comment

                    • #11
                      Re: Ranking the games best shooting guards

                      I'd always take TMac over Kobe.
                      This space for rent.

                      Comment

                      • #12
                        Re: Ranking the games best shooting guards

                        LBJ, KB8, TMac, DWade, Ginobili, Jesus, RIP
                        http://Twitter.com/dRealSource

                        Comment

                        • #13
                          Re: Ranking the games best shooting guards

                          I dont know why everybody underrates Ray Allen so much, this guy is like a combination between Reggie Miller and Michael Jordan....

                          Comment

                          • #14
                            Re: Ranking the games best shooting guards

                            Originally posted by Will Galen
                            In other words Kobe is a detriment to his team whereas Wade is a plus. Everything considered I would take Wade over Kobe as my shooting guard.
                            So you're saying that if the Lakers cut Kobe they would IMPROVE?

                            I'm starting to think that the best shooting guard in the league is just whoever plays with Shaq. It's much easier to hit the 3 when nobody is within 10 feet of you.

                            Comment

                            • #15
                              Re: Ranking the games best shooting guards

                              Tell that to Dwyane
                              2004 3p% = .302
                              2005 3p% = .289

                              Comment

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