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Thread: Rick Carisle's Respect

  1. #1
    Naptown Seth
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    Default Rick Carisle's Respect

    Rick Carlisle is the best coach in the NBA, period. And I'm gonna back that statement up with facts so good, noone will be able to dispute them.

    From 2001-2002 (Ricks 1st season) untill this past season, Rick Carlisle is #3 in total Coach of the Year points. However these points can be a little misleading, as someone like Mike D'Antonio or Eric Musselman can have 1 great coaching season and be skyrocketed to near the top of the list.

    In those 4 years, 4 coaches have been voted top-5 in multiple seasons.
    Jerry Sloan, Nate McMillan, and Rick Adelman have each been named in the top-5 twice. Rick Carlisle has been named in the top-5 all 4 seasons.

    Only 1 coach has been named in the top-2 multiple seasons - Rick Carlisle, who did it twice, finishing #2 in 2004-2005 and winning the award in 2001-2002.

    Rick Carlisle got his lowest finish ever - 5th - the season before last. The season in which he lead the Pacers to a record of 61-21, the best record in the NBA. This same feat was good enough to win Mike D'Antoni the award this past season, so why it was only good enough for Carlisle to finish 5th, I don't know.

    Only 1 coach recieved points all 4 seasons - Rick Carlisle. As a matter of fact, only 2 other coaches recieved points in atleast 3 seasons - Rick Adelman and Gregg Popovich.


    Here's total points rankings and number of top-5 finishes:
    Jerry Sloan 567, 2
    Hubie Brown 513, 1
    Rick Calisle 472, 4
    Mike D'Antoni 326, 1
    Nate McMillan 241, 2
    Eric Musselman 231, 1
    Gregg Popovich 224, 1
    Scott Skiles 199, 1
    George Karl 97, 1
    Rick Adelman 95, 2
    Flip Saunders 76, 0
    Stan Van Gundy 62, 1
    Terry Porter 54, 1
    Don Nelson 33, 0
    Larry Brown 30, 0
    Maurice Cheeks 27, 1
    Jeff Bzdelik 25, 0
    Byron Scott 23, 1
    Frank Johnson 22, 0
    Paul Silas 18, 0
    Eddie Jordan 14, 0
    Phil Jackson 12, 0
    Isiah Thomas 4, 0
    Rudy Tomjanovich 3, 0
    Jim O'Brien 2, 0
    Mike Fratello 2, 0
    Alvin Gentry 1, 0
    Doug Collins 1, 0

  2. #2
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    Default Re: Rick Carisle's Respect

    Rick Carlisle this past year removed any doubt I had about his ability to lead men that will listen to him. Back in '96 (the last season we didn't make the play-offs) we had a season that was in no way as bad as this last one, but "God's gift the coaching community" Larry Brown essentially gave up on the team and let the team tune him out. Rick Carlisle from day one of our mess last season said NO EXCUSES and coached his way thru it and didn't give up....Like Larry Brown did here nearly a decade ago!!!

    Rick Carlisle is my coach!

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    Default Re: Rick Carisle's Respect

    Quote Originally Posted by Roaming Gnome
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    Rick Carlisle this past year removed any doubt I had about his ability to lead men that will listen to him. Back in '96 (the last season we didn't make the play-offs) we had a season that was in no way as bad as this last one, but "God's gift the coaching community" Larry Brown essentially gave up on the team and let the team tune him out. Rick Carlisle from day one of our mess last season said NO EXCUSES and coached his way thru it and didn't give up....Like Larry Brown did here nearly a decade ago!!!

    Rick Carlisle is my coach!
    Good observation!

    Carlise obviously doesn't have the experience that Larry Brown does, but I would take him first in a draft of NBA coaches.

  4. #4
    foretaz
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    Default Re: Rick Carisle's Respect

    it would be very hard to argue with the fact that no coach has accomplished more with less under the most difficult circumstances than carlisle did last year....

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    Default Re: Rick Carisle's Respect

    He was also great as an assistant to Larry Bird back in the late 90's.

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    Default Re: Rick Carisle's Respect

    Quote Originally Posted by Naptown Seth
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    Rick Carlisle is the best coach in the NBA, period. And I'm gonna back that statement up with facts so good, noone will be able to dispute them.
    Phil Jackson - 9 NBA Titles
    Greg Popovich - 3 NBA Titles
    Larry Brown - 1 NBA Title
    Rick Carlisle - 0 NBA Titles

    When they vote for the NBA Championship maybe you'd have some sort of a point.

    I hate Jackson but the 3 names there are easily IMO the best 3 in the game - at least if you go by the assumption that winning the title is the ultimate goal of an NBA franchise. Carlisle and JVG are roughly equivalent. Scott Skiles may find himself in that 2nd group fairly soon. If one of those 3 wins a title they vault into the elite group.
    The poster formerly known as Rimfire

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    Default Re: Rick Carisle's Respect

    Quote Originally Posted by foretaz
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    it would be very hard to argue with the fact that no coach has accomplished more with less under the most difficult circumstances than carlisle did last year....
    I thought he was COY myself - I didn't really have any internal debate about that. But I also thought Shaq was MVP so I guess I missed the mainstream all the way around.
    The poster formerly known as Rimfire

  8. #8
    foretaz
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    Default Re: Rick Carisle's Respect

    Quote Originally Posted by DisplacedKnick
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    Phil Jackson - 9 NBA Titles
    Greg Popovich - 3 NBA Titles
    Larry Brown - 1 NBA Title
    Rick Carlisle - 0 NBA Titles

    When they vote for the NBA Championship maybe you'd have some sort of a point.

    I hate Jackson but the 3 names there are easily IMO the best 3 in the game - at least if you go by the assumption that winning the title is the ultimate goal of an NBA franchise. Carlisle and JVG are roughly equivalent. Scott Skiles may find himself in that 2nd group fairly soon. If one of those 3 wins a title they vault into the elite group.
    kinda ironic that in twenty-some years brown could never win a title in the nba....not until carlisle set the table for him, was he able to do so....

  9. #9
    Naptown Seth
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    Default Re: Rick Carisle's Respect

    See, here's a lot of peoples biggest mistake when judging talent - they only look on the surface. I would compare it to people who enjoy circus acts or magc acts. They see an elephant disappear, and they're automatically turned to believers. However people like myself look a little deeper, we discover the hidden mirrors, or the secret compartments, or whatever phoney baloney there may be.

    All the open-minded people see when they look at Phil Jackson is his 9 championships, and therefor he's God's gift to coaching. the more open-minded outside-the-box thinkers like myself see someone who's never proven himself outside of riding the coattails of megastars. Phil had the chance to prove himself when the Bulls dynasty broke up. Instead what does he do? He goes and crawls under a rock untill he finds the perfect oppurtunity to win, . I actually commend Phil for taking the Lakers job. Maybe he's finally grown some balls. But unfortunately for him, his legacy will be severely tarnished when he can't lead the Lakers into the playoffs.

    And for Gregg Popovich - his 96-97 season is all I needed to see to relieze he was no where near Rick Carlisle's level. 17-47, .266 winning percentage. Give me a break people. I don't care that David Robinson was out. A great coach like Rick Carisle would overcome adversity to atleast post a .400 record.

  10. #10
    Huge Member heywoode's Avatar
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    Default Re: Rick Carisle's Respect

    Quote Originally Posted by DisplacedKnick
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    Phil Jackson - 9 NBA Titles
    Greg Popovich - 3 NBA Titles
    Larry Brown - 1 NBA Title
    Rick Carlisle - 0 NBA Titles

    When they vote for the NBA Championship maybe you'd have some sort of a point.

    I hate Jackson but the 3 names there are easily IMO the best 3 in the game - at least if you go by the assumption that winning the title is the ultimate goal of an NBA franchise. Carlisle and JVG are roughly equivalent. Scott Skiles may find himself in that 2nd group fairly soon. If one of those 3 wins a title they vault into the elite group.
    Jackson would never have won ANYTHING if he didn't get to coach the greatest player ever, and then the superstar Lakers. Let me see him take a team of nobody's to the title and then we can talk. Can't wait to see what he does with the "new" Lakers! I was praying he would take that job so we can see how lame he is. A monkey with a suit on could've coached the Bulls to titles....What did Phil do the two years that Jordan was retired? NOTHING. Jordan comes back, and hmmmm...magically they win three more titles.....

    I respect Pop, but he also has and has had one of most dominant players in the league. The Spurs are a complete team and they are true champions, so I can live with him being ahead of Carlisle, albeit with an asterisk for having Robinson and Duncan.

    The Pistons at least fall into the category of a team with no superstars that went all the way. Not sure how much LB had to do with that. I think Carlisle would've done the same thing if he had been kept around....I have my own issues with Larry Brown, so I will recognize that I may be biased with him. I think it is 'just rewards' that he gets to move to the train wreck that is the Knicks (no offense, DK...just feel it's the truth). I hope he crashes and burns there...

    In my era of watching the NBA I've never seen a coach do more with less than Carlisle, and I'm not just talking about last year. Here's to hoping he can continue the trend this next year and break into the elite group of coaches with a ring in the last twenty years...Aren't there only 6?



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  11. #11
    Naptown Seth
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    Default Re: Rick Carisle's Respect

    7
    Gregg Popovich (99,03,05)
    Larry Brown (04)
    Phil Jackson (91,92,93,96,97,98,00,01,02)
    Rudy Tomjanovich (94,95)
    Chuck Daly (89,90)
    Pat Riley (85,87,88)
    KC Jones.(86)

    It doesnt take great coaching to win the championship, just great players.

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    Default Re: Rick Carisle's Respect

    Quote Originally Posted by foretaz
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    kinda ironic that in twenty-some years brown could never win a title in the nba....not until carlisle set the table for him, was he able to do so....
    So true.

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    Default Re: Rick Carisle's Respect

    Quote Originally Posted by heywoode
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    Jackson would never have won ANYTHING if he didn't get to coach the greatest player ever, and then the superstar Lakers. Let me see him take a team of nobody's to the title and then we can talk. Can't wait to see what he does with the "new" Lakers! I was praying he would take that job so we can see how lame he is. A monkey with a suit on could've coached the Bulls to titles....What did Phil do the two years that Jordan was retired? NOTHING. Jordan comes back, and hmmmm...magically they win three more titles.....

    I respect Pop, but he also has and has had one of most dominant players in the league. The Spurs are a complete team and they are true champions, so I can live with him being ahead of Carlisle, albeit with an asterisk for having Robinson and Duncan.

    The Pistons at least fall into the category of a team with no superstars that went all the way. Not sure how much LB had to do with that. I think Carlisle would've done the same thing if he had been kept around....I have my own issues with Larry Brown, so I will recognize that I may be biased with him. I think it is 'just rewards' that he gets to move to the train wreck that is the Knicks (no offense, DK...just feel it's the truth). I hope he crashes and burns there...

    In my era of watching the NBA I've never seen a coach do more with less than Carlisle, and I'm not just talking about last year. Here's to hoping he can continue the trend this next year and break into the elite group of coaches with a ring in the last twenty years...Aren't there only 6?
    I think people are too quick to discount what Phil Jackson did with the Bull's and Lakers. I was living in Chicago from Jordan's second season through the early 90's and got to see the transition from Collins to Jackson up close. While Collins was a very determined and intelligent coach, he never got Michael to buy into reliance on his teammates like Phil did. Before Phil came, the Pistons owned the Bulls mentally and physically. After Phil, it was the other way around. With the Lakers, anyone who thinks it was easy to get Kobe and Shaq to coexist for the betterment of the team isn't paying attention. To see Jackson mutate into the arrogant, egocentric jerk that he is today is baffling too me. In extensive pre and post game interviews while in Chicago, he always seemed like the most grounded person, with a perspective that would never let the superficial trappings of NBA success overwhelm his humility, which it unfortunately has.

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    Huge Member heywoode's Avatar
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    Default Re: Rick Carisle's Respect

    Quote Originally Posted by McClintic Sphere
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    I think people are too quick to discount what Phil Jackson did with the Bull's and Lakers. I was living in Chicago from Jordan's second season through the early 90's and got to see the transition from Collins to Jackson up close. While Collins was a very determined and intelligent coach, he never got Michael to buy into reliance on his teammates like Phil did. Before Phil came, the Pistons owned the Bulls mentally and physically. After Phil, it was the other way around. With the Lakers, anyone who thinks it was easy to get Kobe and Shaq to coexist for the betterment of the team isn't paying attention. To see Jackson mutate into the arrogant, egocentric jerk that he is today is baffling too me. In extensive pre and post game interviews while in Chicago, he always seemed like the most grounded person, with a perspective that would never let the superficial trappings of NBA success overwhelm his humility, which it unfortunately has.
    That post was so eloquent, I have a hard time not believing every word of it. It seems as though you have some insight into Jackson's Chicago days that would lend a different perspective on the subject. I can respect that.

    I think he has good basketball knowledge and he must be able to motivate players. I still think the results of the next few years in L.A. will be indicative of his coaching mettle; 9 rings or none. Maybe he'll talk Jordan into suiting up again!



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    Huge Member heywoode's Avatar
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    Default Re: Rick Carisle's Respect

    Quote Originally Posted by Naptown Seth
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    It doesnt take great coaching to win the championship, just great players.
    Well said.



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    Default Re: Rick Carisle's Respect

    I really like Rick, I'd like for him to be here a long time, and have a Sloan/Poppovich type career.
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    Default Re: Rick Carisle's Respect

    You still need to win at LEAST one championship for anybody to consider you the best coach in the NBA.

    He doesn't have to win 9 titles, but he is going to have to win at least ONE for me to put him in the same class as Phil Jackson.

    There's a very wide gap between "one of the best," and "THE best."

    To be fair, I didn't consider Larry Brown the best coach in the NBA, until he proved to me that he could win the big game.

    Now, you might say, Larry Brown had almost 20 years of NBA coaching experience. However, this thread isn't about where Rick COULD be in 18 years, it's about where is is now, and you can't just assume that Rick is earmarked for the hall of fame, and pass it off as fact. Is he on the right track? Absolutely. He just isn't there yet.

    It wasn't about being the team everyone loved, it was about beating the teams everyone else loved.

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    Default Re: Rick Carisle's Respect

    Quote Originally Posted by Naptown Seth
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    It doesnt take great coaching to win the championship, just great players.
    Well who cares who our coach is then? If it's all about the players, why does it matter if Carlisle is the best in the biz? Let's dump him and pick up someone cheaper.

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    Default Re: Rick Carisle's Respect

    And I'm still trying to figure out how championships equate to coach of the year...

    For last year's impressive record considering circumstances, RC deserved COY without a doubt in my mind. Give me Nash, Stoudamire, Marion and whoever else there is on that team, and I could win 60 games. Give me Britton Johnson and John Edwards, and I wouldn't win 10 games.
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    Default Re: Rick Carisle's Respect

    Quote Originally Posted by Naptown Seth
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    It doesnt take great coaching to win the championship, just great players.
    Well, said, but not true. Of course, it usually takes both. And it basically always takes both to win more than one. Just look at all the superstars out there that HAVEN'T won ANYTHING.

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    Default Re: Rick Carisle's Respect

    Quote Originally Posted by Naptown Seth
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    It doesnt take great coaching to win the championship, just great players.
    If coaches are irrelevant why in the world did you start this thread?
    The poster formerly known as Rimfire

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    Member efx's Avatar
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    Default Re: Rick Carisle's Respect

    Anyone remember how many rings Shaq and Kobe won before Phil got there?

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    Default Re: Rick Carisle's Respect

    Poppovich is a good coach, but he often gets a free pass on what he did to Bob Hill before Duncan and Robinson joined together. Pop was the GM of the Spurs before the twin towers of Duncan and Robinson formed. Pop let Bob Hill suffer thru that miserable season while Robinson was hurt to get a poor enough record to have a sniff at drafting Tim Duncan. As soon as Duncan was drafted, Pop pulled the rug on B. Hill and took over as Coach and GM and cast B. Hill to the street ripping all the glory of bringing the Spurs over the brink.

    I think it is kinda funny how Pat Riley nearly did the same thing to Stan VanGundy and no one made mention of Pop's move to coaching the Spurs.

  24. #24

    Default Re: Rick Carisle's Respect

    Jackson deservs a lot of credit for the Lakers titles, too. The team before Jackson arrived was very mentally weak. Talanted, sure. but there have been many talanted teams in this league who have never won a title let alone three in a row.

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    Default Re: Rick Carisle's Respect

    Those who say it doesn't take a great coach to win championships are nothing but fools PERIOD. Rick Carlisle isn't the best, but he's up there just a notch below the Larry Browns, Phil Jacksons etc. The only thing that bothered me about his coaching is his tendency to be stubborn. Last year during the playoffs againt Detroit we won 2 games with Jermaine O'Neal playing a significantly diminished where in one of them he scored less than ten points and fouled out. On our four losses our offense kept on pounding it to O'Neal despite being unsuccessful more often than not with the exception of game 6. I'm not saying I know what should've been done I'm not the coach, but I guess to be considered one of the elite, adjustments should have been made regarding this. Rick's a great coach, but if we win a couple I think it will solidify him among the best ever. His track record is compelling!

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