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Thread: trade "options" in general

  1. #1
    Grumpy Old Man (PD host) able's Avatar
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    Default trade "options" in general

    Can't help myself today, am seeing so many trade proposals that I feel I need to have some rationale brought to all of this and see if TPTB on this board have opinions on it all.

    Trade speculations are always wild and often so far off-track that should be a major reason to not read the gm boards among others.
    Nonetheless I understand the "trade Ron" threads, hope rests among those that feel that Ron should be gone, no matter how outlandish the hope.
    Not that he will not be "on the block", I'm sure he will be in part, but in all reason, very few will want to give you "fair value" for Ron and that (in a business) is one of the things the Pacers are looking for, face it, even in business, (and now with an insurance in place) it is often better to take the risk and ride it then to dump and see someone else get rich of your doubts.
    But as I said, I understand those, stay out of it for the most part and move on, in the case of Ron I'm definitely in "we'll see what happens" mode.

    Then there were/are the "trade JO" threads, not for KG, TD or TMac, no.. for Bosh and filler and some such proposals.
    Well if I'm sure of anything then it's fact to me that if the P's would ever propose that to Toronto they would be saying yes so fast you wouldn't even be able to breath in between.

    An established perennial All Star, Franchise Player, Pillar of society and community for an as yet unproven talent, if you consider that the former is 26 and still has to reach his peak, you are somewhat reaching there.

    (yes you guessed right, I'm going over the roster and the trades proposed or their "value" in a trade IF)

    Let's see, next trade Jamaal Tinsley: He's a "streetballer" he's bad, he's always injured, need I go on?
    OK if he's that bad, then we do need to replace him, but help me wonder, if he's that bad how would we stand a chance of getting a "decent" PG back for him? Or do we expect all other GM's to be raving lunatics?
    Few things on Jamaal, yes he was injured in both late-seasons, though under "normal" circumstances he would probably not have played in the Detroit series, yet he came and played, injury and all. In the previous year, he had a legit injury as well, now I still rank this as "freak" and not as a pattern, the one this year was misdiagnosed and that is far more a reason as to why it was so long then anything else.
    As for the games he missed the previous year, people seem to forget he only got his starting place back round the All Star break.
    He has shown a constant improvement in all fields, pre-season conditioning, in season conditioning, calm, shooting, less and less "wild" passes, and better and better on defense.
    He's 27 years old, has had his first 4 years in the legue not completely without his personal problems, and is becoming on of the top PG's in the league. This is a guy Larry Bird said in public of somewhere this season that he expects him to be the next Pacer to make the All Star game.
    He is also a player who is not a favorite of Rick Carlisle, so much is clear, however he is a favorite among the team (JO: JT is the engine of this team, without him it all gets a lot more difficult) and management (read LB).
    Now in trades we are getting no other PG back, no we are making do with AJ (God forbid) or a "talented youngster"
    Now besides the question of why someone would want to give us a 1- 2 yr experienced PG with all the talent to be of at least eqaul class as JT is beyond me, and getting an aging PG that doesn't work on other teams is not something I see as reasonable, so barring miracles I do not see JT traded.
    And no not even when we would get Saras, let's be fair, no matter how good he did in Europe, this is the NBA and a whole different kettle of fish.
    Finally you all seem to forget that JT is BYC this year.
    So to me, those 3 have a "not very high" percentage chance of being traded.
    In fact I think there's about 0.01% chance for those 3.
    The rest of the team "could" be dealt, however.......
    Harrisson, seen many a time as a filler in a trade, strange seeing as what he did in his first year and the possible "upside" he brings and the price he cost.
    This guy is not going anywhere, if anything but the starting line-up.
    Big guys are so rare that; NY drafted one that most teams would not have, LA signed one that will probably see his first minutes in 2009 and Detroit drafted one at 2 years ago that only sees mop-up time.
    In fact we went through the roof with happiness when we could pick up DD for next to nothing last season and he moved straight into the starting spot because "Big Guys" are "dime a dozen"?
    We were willing (on this board) last year to sell our stamp collections to get Dampier, we are still *****ing about losing Brad Miller, while we have Foster and Pollard, yet you guys make a 22 year old rookie a "filler" on a trade..
    Any idea how many teams would jump on that offer?

    Then we have the "untradeables" the ones that indeed are either completeley untradeable for whatever reason or at best are fillers.
    Cro, the contract says it all, henceforth my theory is that he will be waived under the amnesty clause.
    Bender, injured so often they are considering naming an injury after him.
    (though admittedly, only 24 years old)
    Do I put Ron Artest on again here?

    Then the players with "value" in any sense:

    AJ, has shown last year that he is a decent backup but would be "OTT" if we signed Saras, which is someone that the world believes the Pacers have the inside edge on and LB is high on, AJ has a reasonable contract and is a good soldier, has the value his contract demands.
    Fred Jones, lots of upside, young, and most likely without a spot on this roster, has certain values so is a commodity.
    Eddie Gill, never more then a filler, though will be in a final year, be it likekly for the leagues minimum.
    Jeff Foster; the one that does most of the rebounding for us, decent contract has great value, but would leave us somewhat exposed, therefore only in the case of a "big" deal and then most likely in combination with re-signing DD and trading;
    Jackson; I am not convinced that management is happy with this choice, quite sure that his teammates and the coaching staff are non to happy with his "out of offense" play at times and as an added concern is a hot-head that might trigger other nastyness on our team.
    Pretty sure if they can make a deal for a decent SG he will be on the block, the better the quality SG the more likely it will also involve Fred and Jeff.
    That leaves Pollard, who's value will be highest at the trade deadline, for his expiring contract, though if Foster is gone I expect us to keep him for the year as insurance, unless something special pops up.

    Now if we discussed possbible trades on those premises then I could understand them, participate and be hopeful, but to say differently would be rather "opposed" to what are facts and only result in pipedreams for the tradejunks.

    On the other front, JJ will be re-signed, every publication from the Pacers reeks of that, yet they are nowhere near a deal with DD, which I conclude from the same publications.
    The latter part will rule some of the trade-options we may have.

    Summer league this year will not only be fun, it will also be important to see what the progress is on some and as such influence our "trade behaviour".
    So Long And Thanks For All The Fish.

    If you've done 6 impossible things today?
    Then why not have Breakfast at Milliways!


  2. #2

    Default Re: trade "options" in general

    *Sigh of relief* Finally, a poster who makes sense...Thank you, able. Good monologue.

  3. #3

    Default Re: trade "options" in general

    I agree with almost everything you said and interestingly enough followed similar points with my "dream" of changing the team post yesterday. Only thing I disagree on is Bender.... and that just being that in a couple of situations he does have trade value. New Orleans being one since he is a "local prep legend" in that area.

    Overall, I agree completely.

    Outsider

  4. #4
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    Default Re: trade "options" in general

    I have nothing to add to this thread, but this is a great post. It doesn't need to fall into obscurity on the second page.

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