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Thread: Have we officially passed the torch????

  1. #1
    Administrator Peck's Avatar
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    Default Have we officially passed the torch????

    I've been thinking about this since the entire training staff was re-assigned.

    Has Bird now officially taken over the reigns of the franchise? Don't get me wrong, as long as Walsh is alive & connected to the Pacers he will always be consulted. But there just have been subtle & in the case of the training staff not so subtle differances we've seen this off-season.

    Case in point. I have yet to read, hear or see any comment by Walsh about last nights draft picks. Now last season he let Bird be front & center but the local press still sought him out & got his thoughts.

    This year, nothing.

    The entire training staff thing just did not sound like Walsh at all. He would never have done something like that publicly to Craig. Even if he wanted to move him out of being the lead trainer I think he would have just transfered some duty's & not taken away the title publicly. On the other hand, this sounds like Bird.

    The pick apperantly was a no brainer, so I'm sure there was no debate at all on this. But still I've never EVER seen Walsh this disconnected to the process before.

    A new day may be dawning in Indiana. Again, I will state that as long as he's connected he will have the ultimate say, but I now actually beleive that Bird may be making player moves without directly working with Donnie.

    Good or bad? We will see.


    Basketball isn't played with computers, spreadsheets, and simulations. ChicagoJ 4/21/13

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    Member burnzone's Avatar
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    Default Re: Have we officially passed the torch????

    I was thinking the same thing myself after I saw all the newscasts, and read the articles in the indystar, and saw clips of Larry, and Rick, but I have not once seen, or heard anything from Donnie yet.

    So I would agree with you, the torch has been paseed as far as who is the final, and ultimate authority on player selection, and movement, Larry is in charge now.

    And yes, Donnie still has input, but this is the first year I can think of since Donnie has been here, that during draft time he's been absent in the local media quotes, immediately after the draft when every local station, paper, and source is putting out their 'first' article on who the Pacers drafted.

    I mean, maybe Donnie is out of town or something, but I would say the regime has changed hands of power.

    But for Larry's first draft, he got one hell of a pick for the 17th spot, it's not everyday you can get a lottery pick there.

    Hopefully with these 'moves' he says we're not done making, we can balace out the roster, and maybe still address the point guard depth.

    All in all, I'm feeling pretty good about where we're at going into next season, as long as you know who keeps the cranium firmly screwed on.

  3. #3
    White and Nerdy Anthem's Avatar
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    Default Re: Have we officially passed the torch????

    What's the deal with the training staff? I must have missed it.
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  4. #4

    Default Re: Have we officially passed the torch????

    I think so. The picks since Bird arrived in 2003 have followed a definite pattern (if you include 2003 which was held just before Bird was announced)

    • Granger, Harrison, J. James, are all American college guys that dropped to the Pacers becasue other GM's were enamored with HS and foreign players.
    • All 3 had at least 3 years of college.
    • All seemed to be "The best player available"
    • All seem to be good character guys, though Harrison's work ethic was questioned.
    It does seem as though Walsh kind of eased Bird into the role, but its hard to believe that Bird isn't making the decisions now.

  5. #5
    Administrator Unclebuck's Avatar
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    Default Re: Have we officially passed the torch????

    Yes, I think Bird has taken over the draft 100%. DW did not scout much at all last season, Bird did a lot of scouting, he controls the scouting staff.

    I think Bird controls the draft now.

  6. #6
    Intuition over Integers McKeyFan's Avatar
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    Default Re: Have we officially passed the torch????

    Quote Originally Posted by Anthem
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    What's the deal with the training staff? I must have missed it.
    Same here.

    And who's the guy here who's been barking about it all year? He should get a cookie.

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    Administrator/ The Real Jay ChicagoJ's Avatar
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    Default Re: Have we officially passed the torch????

    I'm amazed these guys even had time to scout, with all the extracirricular stuff they had to do just to try to get thier players back onto the court...
    Why do the things that we treasure most, slip away in time
    Till to the music we grow deaf, to God's beauty blind
    Why do the things that connect us slowly pull us apart?
    Till we fall away in our own darkness, a stranger to our own hearts
    And life itself, rushing over me
    Life itself, the wind in black elms,
    Life itself in your heart and in your eyes, I can't make it without you


  8. #8
    Administrator/ The Real Jay ChicagoJ's Avatar
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    Default Re: Have we officially passed the torch????

    David Craig was "pushed" to the front office.

    http://www.indystar.com/apps/pbcs.dl.../1088/SPORTS04

    Disguised as a "promotion."
    Why do the things that we treasure most, slip away in time
    Till to the music we grow deaf, to God's beauty blind
    Why do the things that connect us slowly pull us apart?
    Till we fall away in our own darkness, a stranger to our own hearts
    And life itself, rushing over me
    Life itself, the wind in black elms,
    Life itself in your heart and in your eyes, I can't make it without you


  9. #9

    Default Re: Have we officially passed the torch????

    By the looks of it Bird has definitely taken over control. Since he is doing most of the scouting now, he probably has a better view of who is actually good and will fit with the team. Not exactly sure how much Donnie looks at players now
    Don't ask Marvin Harrison what he did during the bye week. "Batman never told where the Bat Cave is," he explained.

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    CA Pacer Fan A-Train's Avatar
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    Default Re: Have we officially passed the torch????

    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck
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    I think Bird controls the draft now.
    And I say good! Not that Walsh has done a bad job in the past, but if Bird is going to eventually take over, I'm glad it's happening sooner rather than later. No need for the whole "transition" period to last longer than necessary. Too many questions that way.

    Best to have a definite leader, and handing the reigns over to Larry Legend ain't a bad way to go. I'm looking forward to the Bird Years.

  11. #11
    Harmonica
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    Default Re: Have we officially passed the torch????

    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck
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    Yes, I think Bird has taken over the draft 100%. DW did not scout much at all last season, Bird did a lot of scouting, he controls the scouting staff.

    I think Bird controls the draft now.
    Donnie has never done much scouting. And all of you are right. Donnie retreated to his den, turned off his phone and watched the draft. He and Larry never talk anymore.

  12. #12
    White and Nerdy Anthem's Avatar
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    Default Re: Have we officially passed the torch????

    Quote Originally Posted by Jay@Section204
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    David Craig was "pushed" to the front office.

    http://www.indystar.com/apps/pbcs.dl.../1088/SPORTS04

    Disguised as a "promotion."
    The dude's got to be close to 60 years old. He's travelled with the team to every game in the last 35 years. How long is he supposed to do that? He's staying with the organization. He said it was a mutual decision. That doesn't seem negative to me.

    That said, last year was pretty rough from an athletic trainer perspective.
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  13. #13
    How are you here? Kegboy's Avatar
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    Default Re: Have we officially passed the torch????

    Quote Originally Posted by Jay@Section204
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    David Craig was "pushed" to the front office.

    http://www.indystar.com/apps/pbcs.dl.../1088/SPORTS04

    Disguised as a "promotion."


    I tell you, if we start having conditioning issues and related injuries, god help me, this will become my "Brad Miller." People will start calling David Craig "Kegboy's girlfriend". It's gonna be ugly.
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    Running with the Big Boys BillS's Avatar
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    Default Re: Have we officially passed the torch????

    I know that deep down you're heartbroken, Peck. You don't have nearly as good a nickname for Bird
    BillS

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    Default Re: Have we officially passed the torch????

    Quote Originally Posted by BillS
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    I know that deep down you're heartbroken, Peck. You don't have nearly as good a nickname for Bird
    Or a theme song.
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  16. #16
    Administrator Peck's Avatar
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    Default Re: Have we officially passed the torch????

    Quote Originally Posted by Harmonica
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    Donnie has never done much scouting. And all of you are right. Donnie retreated to his den, turned off his phone and watched the draft. He and Larry never talk anymore.

    Now now now, if you reread I said that Donnie was consulted & will always be. I just think he might now be taking a backseat. Which btw, would be of his own choosing.

    He still is the boss, because ultimately he can always fire Larry Bird. But since he hand picked him I think this is just the way it's gonna be.


    Basketball isn't played with computers, spreadsheets, and simulations. ChicagoJ 4/21/13

  17. #17
    Harmonica
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    Default Re: Have we officially passed the torch????

    Quote Originally Posted by Peck
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    Now now now, if you reread I said that Donnie was consulted & will always be. I just think he might now be taking a backseat. Which btw, would be of his own choosing.

    He still is the boss, because ultimately he can always fire Larry Bird. But since he hand picked him I think this is just the way it's gonna be.
    Donnie would obviously like Larry to take over more responsibility and it's happening gradually, but it certainly isn't as cut and dried as some people might think. Just because Larry is being quoted about the draft doesn't mean that Donnie has taken a back seat. Last week it was Donnie who squelched the Lakers trade rumor. What does that mean? It just works out that way sometimes. Sometimes a GM from another team will call Donnie, sometimes they call Larry. But Donnie still has two years left on his contract and will be very much involved until then. And I will be quite surprised if he "retires."

  18. #18
    Jimmy did what Jimmy did Bball's Avatar
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    Default Re: Have we officially passed the torch????

    Quote Originally Posted by Kegboy
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    I tell you, if we start having conditioning issues and related injuries, god help me, this will become my "Brad Miller." People will start calling David Craig "Kegboy's girlfriend". It's gonna be ugly.
    Am I misreading you? We already HAVE those issues with nagging injuries....

    That is why I assume the change occured.

    -Bball
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  19. #19
    Jimmy did what Jimmy did Bball's Avatar
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    Default Re: Have we officially passed the torch????

    Quote Originally Posted by Harmonica
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    Last week it was Donnie who squelched the Lakers trade rumor. What does that mean?
    It means I am sad because that glimmer of hope I had that Bender could be G O N E ... has flamed out again.

    _Bball
    Nuntius was right. I was wrong. Frank Vogel has retained his job.

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    "A player who makes a team great is more valuable than a great player. Losing yourself in the group, for the good of the group, thatís teamwork."

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  20. #20
    ENABEABLER MagicRat's Avatar
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    Default Re: Have we officially passed the torch????

    Apparently Donnie was on "The Drive" with JMV this afternoon, although I missed it......

    I hope he asked Larry if he was allowed to.......

    I'm currently listening to ESPN 950. Montieth is going to be on soon and they are supposed to have an interview of some sort with Granger......
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  21. #21
    ENABEABLER MagicRat's Avatar
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    Default Re: Have we officially passed the torch????

    Granger is on "The Drive" on 1260 now.....
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  22. #22
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    Default Re: Have we officially passed the torch????

    Quote Originally Posted by MagicRat
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    Granger is on "The Drive" on 1260 now.....
    Please keep us informed, I can't get to a radio.
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  23. #23
    ENABEABLER MagicRat's Avatar
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    Default Re: Have we officially passed the torch????

    I missed the beginning, but here's some of what I heard:

    Says his upbringing has helped him. He has gone door to door and gotten doors slammed in his face.

    The rules at the court in his backyard were no cussing, no fighting and no crying.

    He started at Bradley, but the coach got fired and the assistant who recruited him went to NM, so he followed him.

    He really liked Indy when he came to visit. Liked meeting Bird. Thought the scenery was nice.

    He's looking forward to meeting Ron Artest. He hears he's a great guy.

    He thinks he had the best suit last night.


    Sounded like a good kid......
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    Default Re: Have we officially passed the torch????

    Quote Originally Posted by MagicRat
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    I missed the beginning, but here's some of what I heard:

    Says his upbringing has helped him. He has gone door to door and gotten doors slammed in his face.

    The rules at the court in his backyard were no cussing, no fighting and no crying.

    He started at Bradley, but the coach got fired and the assistant who recruited him went to NM, so he followed him.

    He really liked Indy when he came to visit. Liked meeting Bird. Thought the scenery was nice.

    He's looking forward to meeting Ron Artest. He hears he's a great guy.

    He thinks he had the best suit last night.


    Sounded like a good kid......

    Oh goodness. NOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!

    Thanks MR.
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  25. #25
    How are you here? Kegboy's Avatar
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    Default Re: Have we officially passed the torch????

    Quote Originally Posted by Bball
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    Am I misreading you? We already HAVE those issues with nagging injuries....

    That is why I assume the change occured.

    -Bball
    As I've covered multiple times, our injuries this year were not due to conditioning issues.

    If David Harrison turns into Michael Sweetney, don't say I didn't warn you.
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