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Thread: I have a question . . .

  1. #26
    PacerSoul
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    Default Re: I have a question . . .

    Quote Originally Posted by Savior-Self
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    Naa, the reason they look like MVP's is because they're performing like MVP's. Granted, Shaq has an impact in every game that he plays, but if you put Howard Eisely, Jerome Moiso, Courtney Alexander and Micheal Curry around him to round out his starting five, I guarantee you he won't make them look any better than they are. Shaq makes the players around him better, but in a sense, they make him better as well. For all of his good traits, he has his flaws in his game. Detroit has now exposed them twice. Shaq needed Penny, Kobe, and Wade as much as they needed him.
    Detroit didn't expose him this season. He was playing injured and Wade got injured.

    Look Shaq needs a good player to be on his team to win titles but he is the most dominant player. Respectfully we disagree how dominant Shaq is but only Shaq had a system like the "Hack-A-Shaq" named after him.

    They look like MVP's because Shaq is on the team! WIthout Shaq they wouldn't play like MVPS!!!!!! We just disagree but I think most NBA commentators and experts would take my side on this. Shaq is just too dominant of a player (or was) but I think he will be fine next season after he rests his body in the off-season. Next year the championship will go through Heat-Pacers.

  2. #27
    Savior-Self
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    Default Re: I have a question . . .

    Quote Originally Posted by PacerSoul
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    Detroit didn't expose him this season. He was playing injured and Wade got injured.

    Look Shaq needs a good player to be on his team to win titles but he is the most dominant player. Respectfully we disagree how dominant Shaq is but only Shaq had a system like the "Hack-A-Shaq" named after him.

    They look like MVP's because Shaq is on the team! WIthout Shaq they wouldn't play like MVPS!!!!!! We just disagree but I think most NBA commentators and experts would take my side on this. Shaq is just too dominant of a player (or was) but I think he will be fine next season after he rests his body in the off-season. Next year the championship will go through Heat-Pacers.
    Detroit exposed him last season, and while yes, you can argue that he was injured this season, those "NBA commentators and experts" that would disagree with me... were widely reporting Shaq's great progression in terms of his injury having been healed. The fact that Shaq said himself that he was finally feeling good a few games into the ECF (was it game 4 or 5? Can't remember.) during the post game interviews, should serve as enough proof. If anyone would like to come in and back me up on this, feel free to do so.

    Pacersoul, I don't know if you know this, but players that haven't had Shaq on there team have won the MVP before.

    All kidding aside, I'll explain again that even though Shaq is the most dominant player in the league* (I'll address what the asterisk means after I finish my thought.), if you were to put four scrubs around him, he would falter just as much as the next great player. Jordan never won without Pippen. Bird never won without McHale/Parrish, Magic never won without Kareem. If you look at Shaq's first season, you'll see that his Orlando team managed to finish only 41-41 in the regular season, ultimately missing the playoffs. That was before Penny. If you look at his tenure with the Lakers, until Kobe finally came along roughly 3 seasons in, Shaq and the lakers were consistantly swept in the first round. In Miami, without Wade, the Heat were blown out in game 6, and game 7, without a healthy Wade, Shaq couldn't deliver the goods. The formula is simple, 2 superstars. With or without Shaq, unless you're the Pistons.

    Btw, you're right about Jordan never having a "Hack-a-Jordan" gameplan drawn up for him. He had "The Jordan Rules".

    Next season, the title does go through Miami and Indiana if both teams can stay healthy and out of trouble. That I do agree with.


    Now, for the asterisk. I think the Shaq of today is earning his "most dominant" title based simply on respect and... well, the fact that he's Shaq. Whether it be the refs, or the opposing team that guards him every night, Shaq is rarely left in one on one coverage, Shaq rarely gets called for his punishing clear out moves, and overall, he's just given too much leeway to do whatever he wants. Going into this season, having heard that he had lost 30 pounds and what not, how many of us can honestly say that we thought any team other than Detroit would consider guarding Shaq one on one in the post? Exactly. Now, after watching Superman weaken a bit, how many teams are going to at least attempt to stop him by trying to guard him one on one? I can bet that there'll be a few.

    His mobility is declining, his age is getting up in the danger zone for big men, his ability to take over a game is all but gone. Shaq is no longer the player who can carry you with 35 points and 23 rebounds, he's not THAT Shaq. He's a seasoned veteran, a champion, a person who just usually goes through the motions nowadays. He'll dominate you the first quarter, maybe the first half, he'll coast the third and then he'll make a few buckets in the fourth and finish it off with a few foul shots. That's Shaquille O'neal. His importance, in today's game, lies in who he is, not who he was. His teammates look for guidance, confidence, leadership... that's what he does best. I'm sure you've heard the Jamie Fox "he showed them the rings at a team dinner" story, or the "Flash, they can't stop you" phone call or the "Rasual, keep your head up, your time will come" motivational transcripts. Everyone has, and we'll continue to hear about them. Every few games he'll remind us who he is, whether it be an emphatic dunk or two, three, maybe four. He'll prove that he's more than some shadow of his former self, and he'll "remind" everyone else. Then he'll take a few games to coast, only as he can, go through the motions and rest his old, aging body. As great players get older, the game becomes much more of a cerebral one than a physical/talent one. Shaq's mastered the art form.

    All in all though, I still think he's an amazing player and person, and he should've won the MVP this season. His contribution is one that cannot be matched based only on box scores and stat sheets.

  3. #28
    Administrator Unclebuck's Avatar
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    Default Re: I have a question . . .

    I know I'm beating a dead horse.

    But if J.O. ever shoots 1 of 7 in the 4th quarter of an NBA Finals game, I shudder to think how he would be criticized in this forum. It would be taked about and used as proof for certain arguments for years and years.

    TD had a great game overall though

  4. #29
    Harmonica
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    Default Re: I have a question . . .

    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck
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    I know I'm beating a dead horse.

    But if J.O. ever shoots 1 of 7 in the 4th quarter of an NBA Finals game, I shudder to think how he would be criticized in this forum. It would be taked about and used as proof for certain arguments for years and years.
    TD has two titles under his belt. That tends to make fans a little more forgiving.

  5. #30
    PacerSoul
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    Default Re: I have a question . . .

    Quote Originally Posted by Harmonica
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    TD has two titles under his belt. That tends to make fans a little more forgiving.
    Jermaine will have one next season. I would love to see a J.O.-Duncan Finals next year.

  6. #31
    Jimmy did what Jimmy did Bball's Avatar
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    Default Re: I have a question . . .

    Quote Originally Posted by Harmonica
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    TD has two titles under his belt. That tends to make fans a little more forgiving.
    Yeah but JO doesn't pound his chest and pump up like a proud bull after a dunk like TD does.... errrr wait a minute... it's JO that acts like that.... Nevermind!

    -Bball
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    "A player who makes a team great is more valuable than a great player. Losing yourself in the group, for the good of the group, thatís teamwork."

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  7. #32
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    Default Re: I have a question . . .

    Quote Originally Posted by Will Galen
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    If you can't hit your free throws can you be considered clutch?
    Depends on how well you shoot them all the time. Duncan choked last night. I wouldn't say he isn't clutch in general but he wasn't last night.

    OTOH, if Shaq shoots 50% down the stretch he didn't choke - that's what he does.

    Duncan's either feast or famine from what I've seen - he doesn't put up 8-of-12 games (at least not these playoffs). He hits 9-of-10 one time, then 4-of-11. Definitely a mental problem. Dunno what the deal is - he's had several years over 70% - one time close to 80.

    His career playoff % is higher than regular season if that means anything.
    The poster formerly known as Rimfire

  8. #33
    woman without a team
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    Default Re: I have a question . . .

    IMO if you can't hit free throws then you aren't clutch.

    Anybody remember "The White Shadow"? I wish I could remember what episode it was in, but the coach told his team that free throws should be automatic. He was shooting free throws while he lectured them. At the time I think I heard that when Ken Howard was shooting the scene he didn't miss any of his shots.

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