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Thread: If Ron were inevitably going to be traded...

  1. #76
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    Default Re: If Ron were inevitably going to be traded...

    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck
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    Maybe I'm taking your quote out of context, but it is not a fact that Ron ever said he wanted to retire. In fact we have articles, (Jay posted one yesterday) that does not mention retirement

    I don't believe for one minute that he said he wanted to retire. Take some time off, yes.
    "Retire" isn't the right word. But its awfully hard to not call him a "quitter", five games into a season with championship hopes ("One goal", remember).
    Why do the things that we treasure most, slip away in time
    Till to the music we grow deaf, to God's beauty blind
    Why do the things that connect us slowly pull us apart?
    Till we fall away in our own darkness, a stranger to our own hearts
    And life itself, rushing over me
    Life itself, the wind in black elms,
    Life itself in your heart and in your eyes, I can't make it without you


  2. #77
    ENABEABLER MagicRat's Avatar
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    Default Re: If Ron were inevitably going to be traded...

    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck
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    I don't believe for one minute that he said he wanted to retire. Take some time off, yes.
    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck
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    Yes Ron said he wanted to retire. I don't doubt that. But he obviously didn't retire. And if he really wanted to retire, suspending him would have pushed him into retirement even faster. So obviously Ron decided not to retire
    I'm so confused.....
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    Default Re: If Ron were inevitably going to be traded...

    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck
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    Maybe I'm taking your quote out of context, but it is not a fact that Ron ever said he wanted to retire. In fact we have articles, (Jay posted one yesterday) that does not mention retirement

    I don't believe for one minute that he said he wanted to retire. Take some time off, yes.

    An Article I read said that Ron wanted to retire.

    That's what I'm basing my statement off of.

    Here is the link. The article is dated November 12, 2004.

    http://www.slamonline.com/links/11082004/

    Here is what I'm referring to

    Also, since we talked about Ron Artest yesterday, some information surfaced last night that finally shed some light on what's going on. First, the info. We'll discuss the source -- an actual NBA Insider -- in a moment...
    Multiple sources have told me that at the beginning of this week Ron Artest went to Rick Carlisle and said that he wanted to retire. He said he did not feel like he wanted to play basketball anymore. He said he was just worn out, I guess from promoting his CD...That was the genesis of this benching. I spoke with Rick Carlisle in the last half-hour and he said Ron Artest is with the team and that he will play tomorrow night. I was also told by a source that Ron Artest and Jermaine O'Neal may have had a physical confrontation. Rick Carlisle specifically denied that that happened, but I was told that by a pretty good source. I can tell you this, regardless of whether that happened Jermaine O'Neal and Ron Artest have been at loggerheads for the last year or so. I can tell you that Jermaine O'Neal is just about done with Ron Artest...It's a question of whether or not he can trust Ron Artest and he does not feel that he can. I asked Rick Carlisle about a half-hour ago whether he could trust Ron Artest and he said 'I don't know, trust is something you earn'."
    That's what David Aldridge reported last night. I loved it because for the last 36 hours, everyone on ESPN had come up with all kinds of stories and stuff and talk and flash, but no one had reported what actually happened. Until the guy that ESPN got rid of told the story.

  4. #79
    Administrator Unclebuck's Avatar
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    Default Re: If Ron were inevitably going to be traded...

    Quote Originally Posted by MagicRat
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    I'm so confused.....

    **** MR just leave us alone. I had a fun argument going. Now I'm exposed.


    Well, maybe he did say he wanted to retire, or maybe he didn't. It is not a fact though, we have conflicting stories. I am barely holding on here, someone throw me a rope

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    Default Re: If Ron were inevitably going to be traded...

    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck
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    **** MR just leave us alone. I had a fun argument going. Now I'm exposed.



    I haven't read all of these Artest threads, so I don't know which article Jay posted, but the GQ article did specifically mention retirement.....................

    ***************************
    He carefully places what's left of his ice cream cake back in the freezer—which Lou has somehow fixed. Then he sits back on the stool and says there's one thing he should have made clear. "When they said I wanted to retire to do a rap album? That's not true." He is referring to the comment he made at the beginning of this season that infuriated the sports world. How dare Ron Artest, making $6 million a year to play a game, want to take time off to cut a frickin' rap album?

    So what part wasn't true?

    "Honestly? At that time, I wanted to get out. At the time. There was a lot of stress."

    He explains how his grandmother had just died, and when he saw all his family at the funeral he started to wonder what was important to him. Things hit home. "It was pretty bad. So I just—I was really ready to move out of this whole lifestyle, just go home and maybe get a little apartment and just have a different lifestyle." He thought maybe he could get a real job. That's why, he says, he applied for that job at Circuit City.

    When Ron Artest filled out a Circuit City job application—after signing a $3 million contract with the Chicago Bulls—the sportswriters howled, of course. How weird is this guy?

    "I just wanted, you know, to work. I tell my wife, I wanna get a job," he says. A real job. "When I first got in the NBA, I was a little overwhelmed and stuff." He just wanted, you know, a normal life. He explains how he was hanging out at the Chicago Circuit City every day anyway, "and the boss liked me. So I said, you know, Why not work there? I had lots of free time. It would have been fun. Plus, I would have got, you know, like 15 percent off, or something."

    So he applied for a minimum-wage job, listing as his current employer "the Chicago Bulls." And then it got out in the press, and that was that. "That was bad."

    What was bad?

    "I couldn't take the job."

    His kids rush into the kitchen. They want to watch Shark Tale again. Ron tells them it is past their bedtime, and he'll be right up to tuck them in.

    When he's alone again, I ask him if he still wants out.

    "Oh, no," he says. "My goodness. That was a tough time, but I have some good family support, and they helped me get through it. Which was definitely needed at the time." He says he intends to play in the NBA for at least twenty seasons. He wants to win a championship, at least one. There is nothing he loves more than basketball.

    And that retirement thing?

    He's over that...........

    **************

    Sorry. Back to glorified lurker mode...........
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    Default Re: If Ron were inevitably going to be traded...

    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck
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    Jax is an upgrade over Reggie. Tinsley if healthy is better than two years ago,. Fred Jones is better than two years ago. Jax can defend Rip better than the players we had in 2004.

    Our toughness and experience is better than 2004. Haven't I already posted this.
    Don't forget James Jones.
    "If you ever crawl inside an old hollow log and go to sleep, and while you're in there some guys come and seal up both ends and then put it on a truck and take it to another city, boy, I don't know what to tell you." - Jack Handy

  7. #82
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    Default Re: If Ron were inevitably going to be traded...

    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck
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    For those who just want to cut our losses and get something for him. Give me some names. How does Bonzi sound. Ron's trade value is low. If Ron is traded, I'll recover, but I'll be an *** as Ron cleans up his act and helps whatever team he goes to all the while the player we got is maybe the 6th best player on the team.
    Before I answer this, I want to clarify something. I've made my feelings about Ron (as a player) pretty well known, but I was willing to give him the benefit of doubt going into this season. I started having my doubts around the time he had his thumb surgery, but still maintained some hope that all the behind-the-scenes grumblings I was hearing were incidental in the bigger scheme of things. Even the ECFs didn't completely drag me down even though I knew he was being shopped last summer largely because of what was perceived to be an inability to handle the pressure of a deep playoff run. Watching the first 7 games of this past season was incredibly uplifting and when we shredded the defending champs on their own court, I was ecstatic.

    That all evaporated when Ron charged into the stands.

    Now, I sat there and watched the replays and wanted to find some modicum of comfort in what the commentators were saying that night by placing the blame largely on the fans. I really wanted to believe that...but it didn't sit right with me. Deep down I knew that our season had been destroyed and that the franchise's reputation had been sullied, and at the center of all that was none other than who else. And please pay particular attention to those last two words—Who else. Because that is where my chagrin lies.

    That said, who would I like to see us get for Ron? Well, there have been times this past season where I've thought we should just cut him and move on. And that feeling hasn't completely gone away. And then there's a part of me that wants to keep him and see how this core group of players does, although the saying, "Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me" rings loudly in my ears. I also can't overlook his meltdown in the ECFs and how that impacted his value. So if there was a realistic chance of getting any one of these guys, I'd probably do it: Odom, Iguodala, Marion, Pierce, Johnson or Dunleavy.

  8. #83
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    Default Re: If Ron were inevitably going to be traded...

    Quote Originally Posted by Harmonica
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    So if there was a realistic chance of getting any one of these guys, I'd probably do it: Odom, Iguodala, Marion, Pierce, Johnson or Dunleavy.

    OK, that is fair enough, the next question is would any of those teams do that trade.

    Lakers won't. Phil is said to be a huge fan of Odom.

    Suns will not. They aren't going to take a chance on a 62 win team. Plus Ron does not fit that team at all.

    Wow you would really take Dunleavy. holy cow there goes our defense. Not even sure the Warriors would do that, but maybe

    That leaves us with the Sixers and Celts. Word I the Celts are looking to trade Pierce so maybe they might

    Sixers, I think are really high on Ig, maybe DD can chime in here, but not ue they would make the trade either.

    So do you want Pierce

  9. #84
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    Default Re: If Ron were inevitably going to be traded...

    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck
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    So do you want Pierce?
    Hell yes.

  10. #85
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    Default Re: If Ron were inevitably going to be traded...

    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck
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    Wow you would really take Dunleavy. Holy cow there goes our defense. Not even sure the Warriors would do that, but maybe.
    I think his defense would improve here. I think most players' defense would.

  11. #86
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    Default Re: If Ron were inevitably going to be traded...

    Quote Originally Posted by Harmonica
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    Before I answer this, I want to clarify something. I've made my feelings about Ron (as a player) pretty well known, but I was willing to give him the benefit of doubt going into this season. I started having my doubts around the time he had his thumb surgery, but still maintained some hope that all the behind-the-scenes grumblings I was hearing were incidental in the bigger scheme of things. Even the ECFs didn't completely drag me down even though I knew he was being shopped last summer largely because of his behavior in that series (both on and off the court). Watching the first 7 games of this past season was incredibly uplifting and when we shredded the defending champs on their own court, I was ecstatic.

    That all evaporated when Ron charged into the stands.

    Now, I sat there and watched the replays and wanted to find some modicum of comfort in what the commentators were saying that night by placing the blame largely on the fans. I really wanted to believe that...but it didn't sit right with me. Deep down I knew that our season had been destroyed and that the franchise's reputation had been sullied, and at the center of all that was none other than who else. And please pay particular attention to those last two words—Who else. Because that is where my chagrin lies.

    That said, who would I like to see us get for Ron? Well, there have been times this past season where I've thought we should just cut him and move on. And that feeling hasn't completely gone away. And then there's a part of me that wants to keep him and see how this core group of players does, although the saying, "Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me" rings loudly in my ears. I also can't overlook his meltdown in the ECFs and how that impacted his value. So if there was a realistic chance of getting any one of these guys, I'd probably do it: Odom, Iguodala, Marion, Pierce, Johnson or Dunleavy.

    VERY good discription of my emotions....WHO ELSE.

    I've always said I like Ron, I used to be one of his loudest supporters, but there comes a time, and mine was last year....enhanced by the "retirement" and confirmed by the follow-up.....but Dunleavy????
    If you get to thinkin’ you’re a person of some influence, try orderin’ somebody else’s dog around..

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    Quote Originally Posted by indygeezer
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    VERY good discription of my emotions....WHO ELSE.

    I've always said I like Ron, I used to be one of his loudest supporters, but there comes a time, and mine was last year....enhanced by the "retirement" and confirmed by the follow-up.....but Dunleavy????
    Am I placing too much value on Ron?

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    Default Re: If Ron were inevitably going to be traded...

    Quote Originally Posted by PacerFanAdam
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    I'm a PACERS fan, and the Pacers franchise is more important to me than any single player. Ron Artest, IMO, has wrecked the franchise's image over the past couple of years.


    The Pacers have 4 WORTHLESS Central Division Championships and 1 Eastern Conference Championship. You have to win a championship to be an elite franchise. You earn admiration amongst other franchises for winning a ring.
    So what part do we as fans want? Is it more important to have a wonderful image or to win a championship since anything less is worthless?

    Not trying to be a smart @ss here but I will say this once again. I use to worry about the Ps image as well. It was a good excuse to make me feel better about the franchise when they were winning only 20 games a year. We're not very good, but dammit our guys are classy and well liked. It took a Blazer to open my eyes. Wish I could find the exact quote but it was basically "the Pacers are really nice and classy guys, too bad they play like a CBA team". He was talking about Clark Kellogg, Herb Williams, to give you an idea when this took place. As a fan I hated to hear the truth and to me that really stung.

    Until Chuck Person with a chip on his shoulder and Jack Ramsey with his arrogance as a coach arrive did we finally see some wins.

    When it comes to professional sports I don't concern myself with their image. That's something to worry about in real life.

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    Default Re: If Ron were inevitably going to be traded...

    LMFAOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO, Mike Dunleavy for Ron Artest. I know you hate Ron Artest but COME ON, Mike Dunleavy. I would much rather have the guy backing up Dunleavy, Mickel Pietrus. The guy is going to be a star. Dunleavy wont be nothing but a role player.

    Mike Dunleavy for Ron Artest BABY, The move to make the Pacers a better team.

  15. #90
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    Default Re: If Ron were inevitably going to be traded...

    Quote Originally Posted by Jermaniac
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    LMFAOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO, Mike Dunleavy for Ron Artest. I know you hate Ron Artest but COME ON, Mike Dunleavy. I would much rather have the guy backing up Dunleavy, Mickel Pietrus. The guy is going to be a star. Dunleavy wont be nothing but a role player.

    Mike Dunleavy for Ron Artest BABY, The move to make the Pacers a better team.
    I don't hate Ron. That's a shortcut to thinking.

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    Default Re: If Ron were inevitably going to be traded...

    Quote Originally Posted by foretaz
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    so much venom at such a young age....

    not sure what it is....but u certainly seem to have a great deal of negative emotion towards ron....what did he do to u???

    btw....there was no rap album....if ur gonna get on a soap box u probably should have ur facts straight.....i wont go into the rest of it....seems u just need to vent....get a good nites sleep...everything should be better in the morning
    1.) He's older than me.

    2.) His post wasn't venomous, it was correct.

    3.) That post of yours right there really pissed me off. For several reasons.

    3a.) You brought youth into it.

    3b.) He should "have his facts straight?" I can't believe you would say something like this, because according to you there are no facts, EVERYTHING is fabricated, you don't believe what you hear/see, unless it is convenient to, of course.

    3c.) That damned purple.

    3d.) I don't believe he was ranting, really. Ranting is what I am doing now.

    3e.) That damned purple.

    4.) Have a nice day.
    You, Never? Did the Kenosha Kid?

  17. #92
    Administrator Unclebuck's Avatar
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    Default Re: If Ron were inevitably going to be traded...

    Pietrus, yes I like him.

  18. #93
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    Default Re: If Ron were inevitably going to be traded...

    Outgoing
    Ron Artest
    6-7 SF from St. Johns
    24.6 ppg, 6.4 rpg, 3.1 apg in 41.6 minutes
    Incoming
    Mike Dunleavy
    6-9 SF from Duke
    13.4 ppg, 5.5 rpg, 2.6 apg in 32.5 minutes
    Rodney White
    6-9 SF from North Carolina-Charlotte
    5.6 ppg, 1.8 rpg, 0.9 apg in 12.6 minutes
    Change in team outlook: -5.6 ppg, +0.9 rpg, and +0.4 apg.


    Golden State Trade Breakdown
    Outgoing
    Mike Dunleavy
    6-9 SF from Duke
    13.4 ppg, 5.5 rpg, 2.6 apg in 32.5 minutes
    Rodney White
    6-9 SF from North Carolina-Charlotte
    5.6 ppg, 1.8 rpg, 0.9 apg in 12.6 minutes
    Incoming
    Ron Artest
    6-7 SF from St. Johns
    24.6 ppg, 6.4 rpg, 3.1 apg in 41.6 minutes
    Change in team outlook: +5.6 ppg, -0.9 rpg, and -0.4 apg.



    Successful Scenario
    Due to Indiana and Golden State being over the cap, the 15% trade rule is invoked. Indiana and Golden State had to be no more than 115% plus $100,000 of the salary given out for the trade to be accepted, which did happen here. This trade satisfies the provisions of the Collective Bargaining Agreement





    I happen to like Dunlevy. I've seen him play on a quite a few occasions & I've never thought he was this empty space on defense that he is being portrayed on here.

    Is he Artest on defense? No. He's not even S. Jax on defense. But he is not a siv either.

    However he can shoot better than anybody on our team & he is not a horrid rebounder (although I would prefer a 6'9" player get more than 5 a game).

    The deal I offer let's you evaluate R. White because he only has one year left on his contract so if you don't want to re-sign him you wouldn't have to.

    That would give you Pollard, White & Reggie Miller coming off of the books at the same time for roughly 13 million in savings.


    Basketball isn't played with computers, spreadsheets, and simulations. ChicagoJ 4/21/13

  19. #94
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    Question Re: If Ron were inevitably going to be traded...

    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck
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    For those who just want to cut our losses and get something for him. Give me some names. How does Bonzi sound. Ron's trade value is low. If Ron is traded, I'll recover, but I'll be an *** as Ron cleans up his act and helps whatever team he goes to all the while the player we got is maybe the 6th best player on the team.
    Why would we trade one problem child for another??????????????

    Of COURSE the risk is there that he'll stay clean and we'd regret it.
    The risk is also that he's easily capable of destroying THIS team. Again.
    HOW will you supporters respond if we keep him and he blows up again. Costing this VERY CLOSE to champion team ANOTHER F'ING YEAR? Teams don't get endless shots at the title...........

    WHY isn't the fact that he cost us the finals in REGGIE"S FINAL F'ING YEAR enough for you??

  20. #95
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    Default Re: If Ron were inevitably going to be traded...

    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck
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    And you said somebody ELSE was crazy?
    Reggie was HURT last year, remember?

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    Default Re: If Ron were inevitably going to be traded...

    Quote Originally Posted by RWB
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    So what part do we as fans want? Is it more important to have a wonderful image or to win a championship since anything less is worthless?

    Not trying to be a smart @ss here but I will say this once again. I use to worry about the Ps image as well. It was a good excuse to make me feel better about the franchise when they were winning only 20 games a year. We're not very good, but dammit our guys are classy and well liked. It took a Blazer to open my eyes. Wish I could find the exact quote but it was basically "the Pacers are really nice and classy guys, too bad they play like a CBA team". He was talking about Clark Kellogg, Herb Williams, to give you an idea when this took place. As a fan I hated to hear the truth and to me that really stung.

    Until Chuck Person with a chip on his shoulder and Jack Ramsey with his arrogance as a coach arrive did we finally see some wins.

    When it comes to professional sports I don't concern myself with their image. That's something to worry about in real life.
    TEAM'S win championships. There is no team in Ron Artest's vocabulary. That IS performance relevent.
    Has not an iota to do with public image.
    He DESTROYS team.
    That can't win championships.

  22. #97
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    Default Re: If Ron were inevitably going to be traded...

    Quote Originally Posted by PacerMan
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    And you said somebody ELSE was crazy?
    Reggie was HURT last year, remember?
    He broke his hand. He got better. Jax is an upgrade over the Reggie of the last few seasons.

  23. #98
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    Default Re: If Ron were inevitably going to be traded...

    Quote Originally Posted by Peck
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    Outgoing
    Ron Artest
    6-7 SF from St. Johns
    24.6 ppg, 6.4 rpg, 3.1 apg in 41.6 minutes
    Incoming
    Mike Dunleavy
    6-9 SF from Duke
    13.4 ppg, 5.5 rpg, 2.6 apg in 32.5 minutes
    Rodney White
    6-9 SF from North Carolina-Charlotte
    5.6 ppg, 1.8 rpg, 0.9 apg in 12.6 minutes
    Change in team outlook: -5.6 ppg, +0.9 rpg, and +0.4 apg.


    Golden State Trade Breakdown
    Outgoing
    Mike Dunleavy
    6-9 SF from Duke
    13.4 ppg, 5.5 rpg, 2.6 apg in 32.5 minutes
    Rodney White
    6-9 SF from North Carolina-Charlotte
    5.6 ppg, 1.8 rpg, 0.9 apg in 12.6 minutes
    Incoming
    Ron Artest
    6-7 SF from St. Johns
    24.6 ppg, 6.4 rpg, 3.1 apg in 41.6 minutes
    Change in team outlook: +5.6 ppg, -0.9 rpg, and -0.4 apg.



    Successful Scenario
    Due to Indiana and Golden State being over the cap, the 15% trade rule is invoked. Indiana and Golden State had to be no more than 115% plus $100,000 of the salary given out for the trade to be accepted, which did happen here. This trade satisfies the provisions of the Collective Bargaining Agreement





    I happen to like Dunlevy. I've seen him play on a quite a few occasions & I've never thought he was this empty space on defense that he is being portrayed on here.

    Is he Artest on defense? No. He's not even S. Jax on defense. But he is not a siv either.

    However he can shoot better than anybody on our team & he is not a horrid rebounder (although I would prefer a 6'9" player get more than 5 a game).

    The deal I offer let's you evaluate R. White because he only has one year left on his contract so if you don't want to re-sign him you wouldn't have to.

    That would give you Pollard, White & Reggie Miller coming off of the books at the same time for roughly 13 million in savings.
    I like Dunlevy as well, he can do alot of things very well especially on the offensive end. Of course I would rather get a star like Odom, Pierce, joe Johnson, Marion to take over that position if we were to trade Artest but getting a guy like Dunlevey is not a bad deal. He's still on his rookie contract I believe, he continues to improve, hes a good shooter, very good fundamentally sound and is a team player.

    I've watched a couple of games where Golden State played him as a point forward and he was very impressive and Golden State likes him so I don't even know if he is available.

  24. #99

    Default Re: If Ron were inevitably going to be traded...

    Quote Originally Posted by Peck
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    The deal I offer let's you evaluate R. White because he only has one year left on his contract so if you don't want to re-sign him you wouldn't have to.

    That would give you Pollard, White & Reggie Miller coming off of the books at the same time for roughly 13 million in savings.
    Egads. That's a new low for justifying an Artest trade. Most of that 13 million is Pollard and Miller's salary. White makes peanuts.

  25. #100
    foretaz
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    Default Re: If Ron were inevitably going to be traded...

    Quote Originally Posted by vapacersfan
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    I have to say one thing, and if I get bashed for it, so be it.

    If you are quote unquote Anti-Artest, on this forum the pro guys will just have a field day with you.

    But I have seen several posts, myself making a few of them talking about Artest, where posters have come back with "you dont know the whole story" and "why so much hate, its just a game"

    Foretez wasnt the only one to do it, but he just did it again in this thread in http://www.pacersdigest.com/forums/s...2&postcount=61

    You know, its not just a game. Its a way of life. And just because you dont agree with the person, that doesnt mean they are a bad person or angry at the world. Or even.............................................."A hater"
    for many of us it is more than a game....however to those of us where it is more than just a game, we tend to know a bit more about it-which is evident how serious it is to us....

    PFA, has this knack for only regurgitating what he reads.....almost as if hes an uninformed spokesperson on here....

    those that truly have disdain for ron are usually able to give an 'accurate' laundry list defining such, and most do it within a context that directly relates how it strikes them personally....

    PFA, on the one hand, is only 17....hes got so much that could be going on his life and i have a feeling he does....it appears this whole ron-ron thing is much more of a 'game' to him and that it doesnt really mean that much to him personally...and my reasons for saying such are that his statements on here are borderline plagiaristic and lacking IMO any real reflection from him....only things hes seen typed before....the fact that some of the very things hes typed and grandstanded about are in error....the type of error that is made by the uninformed media trying to put out propaganda....when someone mentions ron did a rap album.....they lose all credibility with me....if ur so passionate about this whole issue yet u dont have a clue about the truth, well something doesnt ring true in that scenario....ron produced an R&B record...he didnt do a rap album....anyone that is truly interested would know the truth....anyone that just reads haphazardly some stuff and wants to jump in for whatever reason, might not...

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