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Thread: Artest for Dampier

  1. #26
    Administrator Roaming Gnome's Avatar
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    Default Re: Artest for Dampier

    Some of these scenarios just make me wonder, if just cutting Artest outright would satisfy you? Dampier, Bradley, and Nesterovich..come on, I wouldn't trade my old, blind, crippled dog, or Jonathan Bender for the likes of those stiffs!

    Artest is not that worthless!!!

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    Default Re: Artest for Dampier

    foretaz

    I appreciate your efforts to keep this forum alive during the offseason but NO THANKS for that trade proposal

    Dampier is a lazy bum who plays like he has had a bucket of KFC every quarter. He is no answer to Detroit's frontline and Shaq. He has a huge salary that I would not even touch.

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    Default Re: Artest for Dampier

    I would kill my self if we did this

  4. #29
    foretaz
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    Default Re: Artest for Dampier

    Quote Originally Posted by Roaming Gnome
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    Some of these scenarios just make me wonder, if just cutting Artest outright would satisfy you? Dampier, Bradley, and Nesterovich..come on, I wouldn't trade my old, blind, crippled dog, or Jonathan Bender for the likes of those stiffs!

    Artest is not that worthless!!!
    i even mentioned the possibility of releasing him being better than taking on dampiers albatross contract....reading some of these responses u do wonder if releasing him would satisfy some....

    i think a couple of things are of note....this whole idea is about taking a look at any semi logical scenarios to try and see just how feasible this whole thing is....

    the first thing that would be important is trading him to a western conference team....u simply dont want to play a traded artest and what he might turn into as he matures anymore than absolutely necessary....u dont want to see him in the playoffs unless its the finals, when u have to....

    to me that narrows it down to two teams....the mavs because i could see cuban being all over artest, though he might publicly take a more politically correct stance and the LA Lakers if they rehire Jackson-i think phil would like ron in his triangle...comparisons could definitely be made between artest and pippen...

    the thing then becomes what these teams would give up....and it wont be much based on two things....one, artests history and two the fact not many would be interested therefore the demand wouldnt be high at all....

    people love to talk about how they want to be rid of him and addition by subtraction and all that mumbo jumbo....bottom line is trading him is next to impossible when u start getting into the nuts and bolts of it....and the realities of a potential deal are disheartening to say the very least-even for the most ardent artest detractor...

  5. #30
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    Default Re: Artest for Dampier

    Quote Originally Posted by foretaz
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    -snip- the first thing that would be important is trading him to a western conference team....u simply dont want to play a traded artest and what he might turn into as he matures anymore than absolutely necessary....u dont want to see him in the playoffs unless its the finals, when u have to....

    I don't buy that for a second. If you're trading him, the furthest thing from your mind is "but what if he matures?" You've already answered that question by deciding to trade him. Send him to either a) your worst enemy, just to watch them suffer, or b) another contender, for the same reason.

    Clearly, if you think there's any chance of him 'getting it', you hang onto him, admit that the team is still 3/4 years away so he's got enough time to 'get it', and rebuild around what the team needs to look like in 2008-09 with him. And that's also a fine alternative if you're so in love with Ron that you'd rather the Pacers wait on him to grow up than to do a quick lineup tweak and re-load without him. I'm just not that patient, and as you all know I don't believe in the fantasy that this team is a contender just by dropping Ron back into the mix.
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  6. #31
    foretaz
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    Default Re: Artest for Dampier

    Quote Originally Posted by Jay@Section204
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    I don't buy that for a second. If you're trading him, the furthest thing from your mind is "but what if he matures?" You've already answered that question by deciding to trade him. Send him to either a) your worst enemy, just to watch them suffer, or b) another contender, for the same reason.

    Clearly, if you think there's any chance of him 'getting it', you hang onto him, admit that the team is still 3/4 years away so he's got enough time to 'get it', and rebuild around what the team needs to look like in 2008-09 with him. And that's also a fine alternative if you're so in love with Ron that you'd rather the Pacers wait on him to grow up than to do a quick lineup tweak and re-load without him. I'm just not that patient, and as you all know I don't believe in the fantasy that this team is a contender just by dropping Ron back into the mix.

    ahhh...but thats just it....and many of u have made it abundantly clear....the reason ron gets traded is that the pacers are simply tired of his antics and 'babysitting' him....if they truly believe he wont mature(which i think is a bit of a ridiculous idea-everyone matures, though maturation is not the only issue here) then they would not be so reluctant to trade him....i think they do believe he will mature....everyone does....look at sheed...hes no saint...and i think an argument could be made that hes a cancer....even still the contributions hes able to make are substantial....and its very reasonable to assume the pacers feel the same way about ron....i think they have very little desire to face a revengeful ron any more than they absolutely have to....

    you do not trade him to a contender in the east....to do so would be almost certain disaster.....playing that team in the playoffs would be asking for trouble....ron would have something to prove....just as he does now....id much rather be on the benefitting end of rons trying to prove to the world how could he can be both on and off the court versus being a key motivating factor for his 'redemption' and have him almost single handedly shut us down in the playoffs....

    i would be shocked if he was traded to a contender in the east...and anyone u trade him to potentially becomes a playoff team if they are not already....the brass is too smart to totally discard this notion....like i said....they might feel that the team might run a little smoother in the next couple years without him....however the impact of making him gone appears to be dramatic at best....hence, why it is damn near impossible for them to come up with a trade that they could live with....

    this team has a history of trading away players who were on the cusp of greatness, now while the circumstances are a bit different this time, the end result would still be the same....you have much more reason to believe he will continue to mature and continue to be an all nba selection and DPOY than u do reason to believe that he will get suspended for the whole season every year....

  7. #32
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    Default Re: Artest for Dampier

    BS, what a waste of a thread

    Artest is a All Star and Former Defencive Player of the year and Dampier is a over weight C that are a dime a dozen.. thats all i have to say, Heck Foster would be Dampier to every rebound under the sun

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    Default Re: Artest for Dampier

    Quote Originally Posted by Jay@Section204
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    If the salaries matched, I'd trade Ron for him simply because you might not be able to do better.
    Wow thats sad. I dont care how crazy a damn player is, I would much rather have a crazy player who shows up and gives a **** if his team wins or loses.Eric Dampier plays hard when his contract is about to run out, as soon as he gets a new one well thats it for him playing hard for you. And you would trade Ron for him.I feel sorry for you.

  9. #34
    PCC87
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    Default Re: Artest for Dampier

    This would probably be one of worst deals the Pacers could get for Ronnie.

  10. #35
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    Default Re: Artest for Dampier

    I'd rather see Ron have his last chance with us than somewhere else. I think we can all agree that this team is lacking some mental toughness and there's nobody that can beat Ron in that category...ESPECIALLY Dampier. Dampier doesn't give a rats crap if his team wins or loses. We make that trade and we're right back where we were after 11/19...STRUGGLING TO WIN. Not only that but I think our front office would have to be staffed with the biggest idiots on earth to make a Dampier for Artest deal. I know Artest's value isn't as high as we'd like but it aint THAT low! I can name 100 players I'd rather have than Dampier.

  11. #36
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    Default Re: Artest for Dampier

    Dampier is a solid prototypical True Center. Watching him play at GSW...he is capable of being a great "top 5" ( as he believes ) Center in the league. He has very broad shoulders that make it hard for players to get around, he's fairly big and difficult to push around ( even from players like Shaq ), is a very capable rebounding/shotblocker and plays pretty solid defense. When he applies himself, he can give you a double-double every other night. The problem is that he has a tendency to do very well in contract years....like his last year before he got traded to the Mavs and the first time his contract was up.

    IMHO....Dampier would be an upgrade over DDavis or Foster in the long run ( as DDavis is only going to start breaking down as he gets older ). A Non-Contract year version of Dampier is still capable of providing solid numbers. But I do not feel that he is worth the huge contract that he got from Cuban and/or worth trading Artest for. I would trade Foster and all the Pacers bad contracts for Dampier....but not Artest.

  12. #37
    Diesel
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    Default Re: Artest for Dampier

    Quote Originally Posted by foretaz
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    [SIZE=3]

    to me that narrows it down to two teams....the mavs because i could see cuban being all over artest, though he might publicly take a more politically correct stance and the LA Lakers if they rehire Jackson-i think phil would like ron in his triangle...comparisons could definitely be made between artest and pippen...

    SIZE]

    I think your right Artest would be a good fit with the Lakers in a triangle offense but unless they're going to give up Odom its not going to happen. I wouldn't mind seeing us get rid of Artest if we can find somebody on his level which probably won't happen or somebody with the potential to be as good as he is. Examples of players who fit in that catagory would be Odom, Joe Johnson.

  13. #38
    foretaz
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    Quote Originally Posted by Diesel
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    I think your right Artest would be a good fit with the Lakers in a triangle offense but unless they're going to give up Odom its not going to happen. I wouldn't mind seeing us get rid of Artest if we can find somebody on his level which probably won't happen or somebody with the potential to be as good as he is. Examples of players who fit in that catagory would be Odom, Joe Johnson.
    personally, you can have odom....IMO hes way overpaid and overrated as well....joe johnson is a different story....but phoenix isnt letting him out of there sight....that kid has all the makings of being a star....

  14. #39
    Administrator Peck's Avatar
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    Default Re: Artest for Dampier

    Who was it Boston gave up for Joe Johnson a few years ago???


    Basketball isn't played with computers, spreadsheets, and simulations. ChicagoJ 4/21/13

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    Default Re: Artest for Dampier

    Quote Originally Posted by Peck
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    Who was it Boston gave up for Joe Johnson a few years ago???
    Was it Kedrick Brown?
    You, Never? Did the Kenosha Kid?

  16. #41
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    Default Re: Artest for Dampier

    Quote Originally Posted by foretaz
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    this is primarily directed at those that have a certain disdain for artest and would prefer to see him gone....

    ive seen that dampier was a hot commodity around this board last offseason...granted his season this season has probably cooled people a great deal....

    but im curious...because i have a feeling cuban would love to get rid of him now....and cuban definitely strikes me as someone who would tackle the artest situation....what would ur thoughts be on an artest for dampier trade...it would have to be tinkered with a bit ...but its very close....does ur dislike for artest allow u to take on dampier and his albatross contract....knowing jo kinda likes him and he would provide another decent big body????....im curious....so please...do tell...others can chime in as well....ive made it very clear what i think of any trade regarding artest....so that shouldnt really be an issue...
    No because it doesn't make us any better. Why trade a guy that MIGHT hurt us next season for a guy known to only play hard for a contract?

    The rest of the Mav players you mentioned are garbage as well. Odum from the Lakers is the only one that comes close to being equal value, but I'm not sure how he would fit. I don't think anyone wants to dump Artest just to get rid of him. That would be foolish.

  17. #42
    Diesel
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    Default Re: Artest for Dampier

    Quote Originally Posted by foretaz
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    personally, you can have odom....IMO hes way overpaid and overrated as well....joe johnson is a different story....but phoenix isnt letting him out of there sight....that kid has all the makings of being a star....
    Well Odom sometimes has a problem of being to unselfish, but if you look what he did in Miami a season ago it was like mission impossible to guard him. He takes the bigger smallforwards off the dribble, over powers the smaller ones, hes got excellent passing skills, good rebounder. He really does it all on the offensive end. I think playing for a demanding coach like Carlisle plus a system that utilizes all of his talents he could really be a monster. I expect him to have a tremendous season in LA next year under Phil Jackson if he isn't moved out.

  18. #43
    Member Isaac's Avatar
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    Default Re: Artest for Dampier

    Quote Originally Posted by Jermaniac
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    I would kill my self if we did this
    Seconded

  19. #44
    foretaz
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    Default Re: Artest for Dampier

    Quote Originally Posted by Diesel
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    Well Odom sometimes has a problem of being to unselfish, but if you look what he did in Miami a season ago it was like mission impossible to guard him. He takes the bigger smallforwards off the dribble, over powers the smaller ones, hes got excellent passing skills, good rebounder. He really does it all on the offensive end. I think playing for a demanding coach like Carlisle plus a system that utilizes all of his talents he could really be a monster. I expect him to have a tremendous season in LA next year under Phil Jackson if he isn't moved out.
    i agree with odom having a great year in LA....if he stays healthy....which is no small concern with him...phils a great coach....the triangle should be a great offense for him...should be interesting...

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