Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 44

Thread: Artest for Dampier

Hybrid View

  1. #1
    foretaz
    Guest

    Default Artest for Dampier

    this is primarily directed at those that have a certain disdain for artest and would prefer to see him gone....

    ive seen that dampier was a hot commodity around this board last offseason...granted his season this season has probably cooled people a great deal....

    but im curious...because i have a feeling cuban would love to get rid of him now....and cuban definitely strikes me as someone who would tackle the artest situation....what would ur thoughts be on an artest for dampier trade...it would have to be tinkered with a bit ...but its very close....does ur dislike for artest allow u to take on dampier and his albatross contract....knowing jo kinda likes him and he would provide another decent big body????....im curious....so please...do tell...others can chime in as well....ive made it very clear what i think of any trade regarding artest....so that shouldnt really be an issue...

  2. #2
    Administrator Peck's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    12,611

    Default Re: Artest for Dampier

    Quote Originally Posted by foretaz
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    this is primarily directed at those that have a certain disdain for artest and would prefer to see him gone....

    ive seen that dampier was a hot commodity around this board last offseason...granted his season this season has probably cooled people a great deal....

    but im curious...because i have a feeling cuban would love to get rid of him now....and cuban definitely strikes me as someone who would tackle the artest situation....what would ur thoughts be on an artest for dampier trade...it would have to be tinkered with a bit ...but its very close....does ur dislike for artest allow u to take on dampier and his albatross contract....knowing jo kinda likes him and he would provide another decent big body????....im curious....so please...do tell...others can chime in as well....ive made it very clear what i think of any trade regarding artest....so that shouldnt really be an issue...
    Not if we re-sign Dale.

    Even if we didn't re-sign Dale I am just sick of injured players. Sorry I've just lost patience with them (yes for those of you who want to bring him up I'm sure I'd be sick of Brad doing the same thing now to).

    I like Dampiers size & there are times that he plays great. But there are just to many times we see what Bird was talking about back in his first season here. Dampier is lazy.


    Basketball isn't played with computers, spreadsheets, and simulations. ChicagoJ 4/21/13

  3. #3
    foretaz
    Guest

    Default Re: Artest for Dampier

    Quote Originally Posted by Peck
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Not if we re-sign Dale.

    Even if we didn't re-sign Dale I am just sick of injured players. Sorry I've just lost patience with them (yes for those of you who want to bring him up I'm sure I'd be sick of Brad doing the same thing now to).

    I like Dampiers size & there are times that he plays great. But there are just to many times we see what Bird was talking about back in his first season here. Dampier is lazy.

    i bet u would really like the deal if harrison was included in the trade, wouldnt u??

    speaking of the mavs....anyone see much of darrell armstrong this year??? hes the type of pg i think would be a good fit for the pacers....of course im thinking of the darrell armstrong in his prime...full of energy...great defender..tons of speed...decent three point shooter...now hes much older...anyone seen him play recently? has he slowed down alot? is he only a shadow of his former self? he had heart, that was for sure...

  4. #4

    Default Re: Artest for Dampier

    Dampier is garbage, especially when you consider his contract.

  5. #5
    Member
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Location
    Evansville, IN
    Posts
    1,078

    Default Re: Artest for Dampier

    i will admit, i was high on dampier after last season b/c it looked like he had finally turned the corner........now, i want nothing to do with him..........his contract is ridiculous and it's obvious after his performance this season that he's a lazy/unmotivated player. he put up big numbers in 2003-2004 to get that contract and now has gone back to his old ways......he fooled a lot of people and i would be pissed if i were a mavs fan.

    the guy is seriously messed in the head too. i about $#%ing lost it when he said he was the 2nd best center in the league back in may..........then he goes out and gets his *** handed to him by Yao in the 1st round.

    he's a headcase, he's lazy, and he's overpaid. good riddence for GS.......he's cuban's problem now.

  6. #6
    Administrator/ The Real Jay ChicagoJ's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Chicago
    Age
    44
    Posts
    17,000

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: Artest for Dampier

    I was an advocate of Dampier last season under certain scenarios:

    1) Dampier was the best post-defender available via free agency/ trade last summer, and that was (and to some extent, still is) a major need for this team. However, drafting Harrison (and later re-signind DD) were each 'better' ways to address that need.

    2) We already knew that Bird didn't think all that much of Dampier's practice habits from their brief time together during the rookie/FA camp before Damp's second season, so I was certain that we wouldn't overpay for him if we targeted him. Cuban, on the other hand, really needs to hand over the checkbook to somebody with a better bball IQ.

    As it is now, I'd trade lesser players for him (I'd trade Fred, JJ and Pollard for Dampier, for example), but I'm pretty sure a) that won't work under the current CBA and b) Cuban would scoff at that although I think he'd be hard pressed to do better.

    If the salaries matched, I'd trade Ron for him simply because you might not be able to do better. But unless Pollard's salary exactly made up the difference, I wouldn't add anybody else to that trade.
    Why do the things that we treasure most, slip away in time
    Till to the music we grow deaf, to God's beauty blind
    Why do the things that connect us slowly pull us apart?
    Till we fall away in our own darkness, a stranger to our own hearts
    And life itself, rushing over me
    Life itself, the wind in black elms,
    Life itself in your heart and in your eyes, I can't make it without you


  7. #7
    foretaz
    Guest

    Default Re: Artest for Dampier

    Quote Originally Posted by Jay@Section204
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    I was an advocate of Dampier last season under certain scenarios:

    1) Dampier was the best post-defender available via free agency/ trade last summer, and that was (and to some extent, still is) a major need for this team. However, drafting Harrison (and later re-signind DD) were each 'better' ways to address that need.

    2) We already knew that Bird didn't think all that much of Dampier's practice habits from their brief time together during the rookie/FA camp before Damp's second season, so I was certain that we wouldn't overpay for him if we targeted him. Cuban, on the other hand, really needs to hand over the checkbook to somebody with a better bball IQ.

    As it is now, I'd trade lesser players for him (I'd trade Fred, JJ and Pollard for Dampier, for example), but I'm pretty sure a) that won't work under the current CBA and b) Cuban would scoff at that although I think he'd be hard pressed to do better.

    If the salaries matched, I'd trade Ron for him simply because you might not be able to do better. But unless Pollard's salary exactly made up the difference, I wouldn't add anybody else to that trade.
    actually artest and eddie gill for dampier would work...u would do this? knowing there is 6 years and 60 million dollars left on dampiers contract?

  8. #8
    All is full of Orange! Mourning's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Bilthoven, The Netherlands
    Age
    38
    Posts
    8,982

    Default Re: Artest for Dampier

    Quote Originally Posted by foretaz
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    actually artest and eddie gill for dampier would work...u would do this? knowing there is 6 years and 60 million dollars left on dampiers contract?
    No Freaking way!!!!!!!

    Regards,

    Mourning
    2012 PD ABA Fantasy Keeper League Champion, sports.ws

    2011 PD ABA Fantasy Keeper League Champion, sports.ws

    2006 PD ABA Fantasy League runner up, sports.ws

  9. #9
    foretaz
    Guest

    Default Re: Artest for Dampier

    Quote Originally Posted by Mourning
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    No Freaking way!!!!!!!

    Regards,

    Mourning
    lol...oh i was pretty sure u would feel that way...as i obviously do...i am curious as to what those that have the disdain for artest think, though...cause this is the type of deal that we can probably expect....in fact this might be considered a best case scenario....one could argue that the pacers would be better off to release him than this deal...as far as im concerned...or at least get a draft choice...but these are the type of scenarios that people are dealing with when the subject of trading or getting rid of artest comes up....

  10. #10
    Banned Jermaniac's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Your baby moms house
    Age
    25
    Posts
    11,717

    Default Re: Artest for Dampier

    Quote Originally Posted by Jay@Section204
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

    If the salaries matched, I'd trade Ron for him simply because you might not be able to do better.
    Wow thats sad. I dont care how crazy a damn player is, I would much rather have a crazy player who shows up and gives a **** if his team wins or loses.Eric Dampier plays hard when his contract is about to run out, as soon as he gets a new one well thats it for him playing hard for you. And you would trade Ron for him.I feel sorry for you.

  11. #11
    Member Ragnar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Fort Wayne, IN
    Age
    42
    Posts
    5,856

    Sports Logo

    Default Re: Artest for Dampier

    No thank you.

  12. #12
    Tree People to the Core! indygeezer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Cumberland
    Posts
    15,252
    Mood

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: Artest for Dampier

    Nope. Other than laziness, he had issues with a knee going back to his time here.
    If you get to thinkin’ you’re a person of some influence, try orderin’ somebody else’s dog around..

  13. #13
    Pacer Junky Will Galen's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    10,046

    Default Re: Artest for Dampier

    Ruling out the posters just want to get rid of Ron, I think most people that want to trade him wouldn't do so much faster than the ones that like him.

  14. #14
    foretaz
    Guest

    Default Re: Artest for Dampier

    ok...if u dont like dampier...because of knees, laziness, and contract issues....

    how bout shawn bradley and a signed and traded darrell armstrong...

  15. #15
    Member Evan_The_Dude's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    Indianapolis, In. via Oakland, Ca.
    Age
    33
    Posts
    3,413

    Default Re: Artest for Dampier

    I'd rather be shot than accept an Artest for Dampier trade. I watched Dampier's pure laziness from the day he was traded to the left coast. Then when it came close to contract year, he decides to earn his pay. I admit that he looked great last offseason, but I was never sold on him because I watched nearly every game he played in his stint with the Warriors and for the most part I was thoroughly unimpressed. That and also the fact that he is lacking mental toughness, he doesn't have that will to win, and he has butter hands.

  16. #16
    flexible and robust SoupIsGood's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Lappy Go Hucky
    Age
    26
    Posts
    17,540

    Default Re: Artest for Dampier

    Uh, no thanks.

    I would trade Ron for that Josh Howard kid though.

    How good is Marquis Daniels? I never saw him play, is he a good defender?
    You, Never? Did the Kenosha Kid?

  17. #17
    foretaz
    Guest

    Default Re: Artest for Dampier

    Quote Originally Posted by SoupIsGood
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Uh, no thanks.

    I would trade Ron for that Josh Howard kid though.

    How good is Marquis Daniels? I never saw him play, is he a good defender?
    theyre both good players...as is devin harris....though i dont think cuban would trade any of them...as they are all part of the core hes put together....

    i think cuban is one of the few guys that would be very interested in artest...especially at the right price....but thats just it....i dont think these types of deals are gonna get much better, given all that has happened...

    which would be the dilemma before the court...if u want to get rid of him....do u do this type of a deal??? some have implied u do...im just hoping to get takes on actual scenarios...

    i think u can kiss sacramento as a trading partner goodbye....theyre trying to get a new building....and critics of that new building would have a heyday with artest....

  18. #18
    flexible and robust SoupIsGood's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Lappy Go Hucky
    Age
    26
    Posts
    17,540

    Default Re: Artest for Dampier

    Quote Originally Posted by foretaz
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote


    i think cuban is one of the few guys that would be very interested in artest...especially at the right price....but thats just it....i dont think these types of deals are gonna get much better, given all that has happened...

    That's what I've been thinking. I just hope he's stupid enough to give up some of his young talent.
    You, Never? Did the Kenosha Kid?

  19. #19
    foretaz
    Guest

    Default Re: Artest for Dampier

    Quote Originally Posted by SoupIsGood
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    That's what I've been thinking. I just hope he's stupid enough to give up some of his young talent.
    all the reasons i think he would be interested in artest are all the reasons i think he wont give up his young talent....

    but i definitely could see cuban wanting artest....but hes a good businessman...he knows if the pacers will part with him its because they want and need to....so he knows he wont have to pay....

    as someone else said...the pacers are damned if they do and damned if they dont....and really dont have any real negotiating power....their hand is pretty much dealt and played....

    give him away....or its all about the long haul....the pacers best chance at getting anything real for artest is him having the kind of year he will probably have and then trade him next offseason....anything else will be bad...just bad

  20. #20
    Member Evan_The_Dude's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    Indianapolis, In. via Oakland, Ca.
    Age
    33
    Posts
    3,413

    Default Re: Artest for Dampier

    Quote Originally Posted by foretaz
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    the pacers best chance at getting anything real for artest is him having the kind of year he will probably have and then trade him next offseason....anything else will be bad...just bad
    I agree, but then at that point who would we want?

  21. #21
    .
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Posts
    52,583

    Default Re: Artest for Dampier

    Last year I might have said yes. Not now.

  22. #22
    Administrator Roaming Gnome's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Indy's Wild Wild West Side: 8 sec-check...Club Rio-check...Cloud 9-check
    Age
    40
    Posts
    5,935

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: Artest for Dampier

    Some of these scenarios just make me wonder, if just cutting Artest outright would satisfy you? Dampier, Bradley, and Nesterovich..come on, I wouldn't trade my old, blind, crippled dog, or Jonathan Bender for the likes of those stiffs!

    Artest is not that worthless!!!

  23. #23
    foretaz
    Guest

    Default Re: Artest for Dampier

    Quote Originally Posted by Roaming Gnome
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Some of these scenarios just make me wonder, if just cutting Artest outright would satisfy you? Dampier, Bradley, and Nesterovich..come on, I wouldn't trade my old, blind, crippled dog, or Jonathan Bender for the likes of those stiffs!

    Artest is not that worthless!!!
    i even mentioned the possibility of releasing him being better than taking on dampiers albatross contract....reading some of these responses u do wonder if releasing him would satisfy some....

    i think a couple of things are of note....this whole idea is about taking a look at any semi logical scenarios to try and see just how feasible this whole thing is....

    the first thing that would be important is trading him to a western conference team....u simply dont want to play a traded artest and what he might turn into as he matures anymore than absolutely necessary....u dont want to see him in the playoffs unless its the finals, when u have to....

    to me that narrows it down to two teams....the mavs because i could see cuban being all over artest, though he might publicly take a more politically correct stance and the LA Lakers if they rehire Jackson-i think phil would like ron in his triangle...comparisons could definitely be made between artest and pippen...

    the thing then becomes what these teams would give up....and it wont be much based on two things....one, artests history and two the fact not many would be interested therefore the demand wouldnt be high at all....

    people love to talk about how they want to be rid of him and addition by subtraction and all that mumbo jumbo....bottom line is trading him is next to impossible when u start getting into the nuts and bolts of it....and the realities of a potential deal are disheartening to say the very least-even for the most ardent artest detractor...

  24. #24
    Administrator/ The Real Jay ChicagoJ's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Chicago
    Age
    44
    Posts
    17,000

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: Artest for Dampier

    Quote Originally Posted by foretaz
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    -snip- the first thing that would be important is trading him to a western conference team....u simply dont want to play a traded artest and what he might turn into as he matures anymore than absolutely necessary....u dont want to see him in the playoffs unless its the finals, when u have to....

    I don't buy that for a second. If you're trading him, the furthest thing from your mind is "but what if he matures?" You've already answered that question by deciding to trade him. Send him to either a) your worst enemy, just to watch them suffer, or b) another contender, for the same reason.

    Clearly, if you think there's any chance of him 'getting it', you hang onto him, admit that the team is still 3/4 years away so he's got enough time to 'get it', and rebuild around what the team needs to look like in 2008-09 with him. And that's also a fine alternative if you're so in love with Ron that you'd rather the Pacers wait on him to grow up than to do a quick lineup tweak and re-load without him. I'm just not that patient, and as you all know I don't believe in the fantasy that this team is a contender just by dropping Ron back into the mix.
    Why do the things that we treasure most, slip away in time
    Till to the music we grow deaf, to God's beauty blind
    Why do the things that connect us slowly pull us apart?
    Till we fall away in our own darkness, a stranger to our own hearts
    And life itself, rushing over me
    Life itself, the wind in black elms,
    Life itself in your heart and in your eyes, I can't make it without you


  25. #25
    foretaz
    Guest

    Default Re: Artest for Dampier

    Quote Originally Posted by Jay@Section204
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    I don't buy that for a second. If you're trading him, the furthest thing from your mind is "but what if he matures?" You've already answered that question by deciding to trade him. Send him to either a) your worst enemy, just to watch them suffer, or b) another contender, for the same reason.

    Clearly, if you think there's any chance of him 'getting it', you hang onto him, admit that the team is still 3/4 years away so he's got enough time to 'get it', and rebuild around what the team needs to look like in 2008-09 with him. And that's also a fine alternative if you're so in love with Ron that you'd rather the Pacers wait on him to grow up than to do a quick lineup tweak and re-load without him. I'm just not that patient, and as you all know I don't believe in the fantasy that this team is a contender just by dropping Ron back into the mix.

    ahhh...but thats just it....and many of u have made it abundantly clear....the reason ron gets traded is that the pacers are simply tired of his antics and 'babysitting' him....if they truly believe he wont mature(which i think is a bit of a ridiculous idea-everyone matures, though maturation is not the only issue here) then they would not be so reluctant to trade him....i think they do believe he will mature....everyone does....look at sheed...hes no saint...and i think an argument could be made that hes a cancer....even still the contributions hes able to make are substantial....and its very reasonable to assume the pacers feel the same way about ron....i think they have very little desire to face a revengeful ron any more than they absolutely have to....

    you do not trade him to a contender in the east....to do so would be almost certain disaster.....playing that team in the playoffs would be asking for trouble....ron would have something to prove....just as he does now....id much rather be on the benefitting end of rons trying to prove to the world how could he can be both on and off the court versus being a key motivating factor for his 'redemption' and have him almost single handedly shut us down in the playoffs....

    i would be shocked if he was traded to a contender in the east...and anyone u trade him to potentially becomes a playoff team if they are not already....the brass is too smart to totally discard this notion....like i said....they might feel that the team might run a little smoother in the next couple years without him....however the impact of making him gone appears to be dramatic at best....hence, why it is damn near impossible for them to come up with a trade that they could live with....

    this team has a history of trading away players who were on the cusp of greatness, now while the circumstances are a bit different this time, the end result would still be the same....you have much more reason to believe he will continue to mature and continue to be an all nba selection and DPOY than u do reason to believe that he will get suspended for the whole season every year....

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •