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Thread: Pierce Being Shopped

  1. #26
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    Default Re: Pierce Being Shopped

    Quote Originally Posted by SoupIsGood
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    Artest is nowhere near a top 10 player. Maybe, MAYBE a top 10 talent.


    I knew we should have tanked after the brawl this year... we could be trading our high draft pick for Paul Pierce.
    I think some of you haven't seen Ronnie play in so long that your last image of him has skewed your perception of his game. Ron Artest is very arguably a Top 10 player -- Top 15 AT WORST. Don't confuse your anger/disappointment at Ronnie with his game. There's a reason we were titled a championship contender with him, and lost w/o him.

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    Default Re: Pierce Being Shopped

    Quote Originally Posted by Peck
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    While we're talking about cost, how many games did Pierce cost his team last season because he was suspended? How many games has he cost his team because he's been suspended over the past 4 years?

    Yes Pierce has had problems with coach's, he has a problem with Doc now. But how many times has he gone to the press & said he didn't know if he wanted to stay with the team because he wasn't happy with the new rules?

    Perfectly said.

    Like I mentioned earlier, the most games Paul has ever missed is 9.

    Question his attitude if you want, but Paul is always ready to play.

  3. #28
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    Default Re: Pierce Being Shopped

    Quote Originally Posted by Peck
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    While we're talking about cost, how many games did Pierce cost his team last season because he was suspended? How many games has he cost his team because he's been suspended over the past 4 years?

    Yes Pierce has had problems with coach's, he has a problem with Doc now. But how many times has he gone to the press & said he didn't know if he wanted to stay with the team because he wasn't happy with the new rules?
    Paul Pierce has had quite the attitude problem over the years. Though not quite as bad as Ron, let's not make PP out to be a saint here. He would drive the anti-Artest ppl just as crazy with his antics.

  4. #29

    Default Re: Pierce Being Shopped

    I think Paul Pierce is a beyotch. I think Ron Artest is wacko. So, um, it's uh ... wash? I don't know.

    In 2003, though, I do disictly remember watching Al Harrington get dogged by Pierce for much of the game. Surely, we all remember the one shot. The dribble, the stare, the dribble, the stare ... and then, the jumper in Al's grill.

    I've read way to many stories out of Boston about how Pierce is disrespectful to basically everyone.

    Artest respects basically everybody it seems. Everybody except himself, that is.

    From a sheer basketball perspective, a swap of those two players is definitely not going to make the Pacers a better team in my mind.

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    Default Re: Pierce Being Shopped

    Quote Originally Posted by Shade
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    I think some of you haven't seen Ronnie play in so long that your last image of him has skewed your perception of his game. Ron Artest is very arguably a Top 10 player -- Top 15 AT WORST. Don't confuse your anger/disappointment at Ronnie with his game. There's a reason we were titled a championship contender with him, and lost w/o him.
    Shaquille O'Neal
    Tim Duncan
    Kevin Garnett
    Dirk Nowitzki
    Allen Iverson
    Kobe Bryant
    Tracy McGrady
    healthy Jason Kidd
    Dwayne Wade
    Lebron James
    Ray Allen
    healthy Jermaine
    Steve Nash
    Amare
    Marion

    Those 15 players are EASILY better overall players than Ron Artest. If you took Ron over any of them, you'd be crazy.

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    Default Re: Pierce Being Shopped

    Quote Originally Posted by Shade
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    Paul Pierce has had quite the attitude problem over the years. Though not quite as bad as Ron, let's not make PP out to be a saint here. He would drive the anti-Artest ppl just as crazy with his antics.
    Thats the overstatement of the year.

    Paul Pierce actually plays an entire season without getting suspended, believe it or not.

    "Anti-Artest" people are upset mostly because Ron does things to get suspended. That's something Pierce simply does not do.

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    Default Re: Pierce Being Shopped

    Btw, if we got rid of all the Pacers with "attitude problems," we would be left with:

    C - Pollard/Harrison/Edwards
    PF - Foster/Croshere
    SF - JJones/Bender
    SG - FJones
    PG - Johnson/Gill

    So, IOW, let's jettison off our Top 4 players for "nice guys" and change our name to the Indiana Saints. After all, we're getting a new logo and jerseys anyway...

  8. #33

    Default Re: Pierce Being Shopped

    Quote Originally Posted by PacerFanAdam
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    Shaquille O'Neal
    Tim Duncan
    Kevin Garnett
    Dirk Nowitzki
    Allen Iverson
    Kobe Bryant
    Tracy McGrady
    healthy Jason Kidd
    Dwayne Wade
    Lebron James
    Ray Allen
    healthy Jermaine
    Steve Nash
    Amare
    Marion

    Those 15 players are EASILY better overall players than Ron Artest. If you took Ron over any of them, you'd be crazy.
    I'd agree with most of that.

    Nowitski's amazing, but I don't see him ever putting a team in the Finals. I don't think we'll see a fully healthy J-Kidd again. Jermaine/Artest healthy and sane are nearly a wash to me.

    And Marion, well, uh ... that's probably the one I disagree with the most. Great rebounder, but the offensive arsenal is rough and I've always thought he's an overrated defender in a team D concept.

    Just a little devil's advocate.

  9. #34
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    Default Re: Pierce Being Shopped

    Quote Originally Posted by PacerFanAdam
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    Thats the overstatement of the year.

    Paul Pierce actually plays an entire season without getting suspended, believe it or not.

    "Anti-Artest" people are upset mostly because Ron does things to get suspended. That's something Pierce simply does not do.
    Paul Pierce is Kobe Bryant with less talent.

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    Default Re: Pierce Being Shopped

    Quote Originally Posted by Shade
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    Btw, if we got rid of all the Pacers with "attitude problems," we would be left with:

    C - Pollard/Harrison/Edwards
    PF - Foster/Croshere
    SF - JJones/Bender
    SG - FJones
    PG - Johnson/Gill

    So, IOW, let's jettison off our Top 4 players for "nice guys" and change our name to the Indiana Saints. After all, we're getting a new logo and jerseys anyway...

    Alot of players in the NBA have attitude problems

    Very few get suspended every season (Ron was suspended many times in 02-03, a game in the 04 playoffs, and of course this year).

    No players get suspended the entire year........except Ron.

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    Default Re: Pierce Being Shopped

    Quote Originally Posted by PacerFanAdam
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    Shaquille O'Neal
    Tim Duncan
    Kevin Garnett
    Dirk Nowitzki
    Allen Iverson
    Kobe Bryant
    Tracy McGrady
    healthy Jason Kidd
    Dwayne Wade
    Lebron James
    Ray Allen
    healthy Jermaine
    Steve Nash
    Amare
    Marion

    Those 15 players are EASILY better overall players than Ron Artest. If you took Ron over any of them, you'd be crazy.
    Easily?

    Shaquille O'Neal
    Tim Duncan
    Kevin Garnett
    healthy Jason Kidd
    Dwayne Wade
    Steve Nash
    Amare

    I'll give you those, and only Amare based on his recent offensive prowess against the Spurs. Though Amare's defense was still lacking for the most part, and his offense would probably be considerably less on a team like the Pacers, who emphasize defense over offense.

    The other players, Ron is near or at the level of.

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    Default Re: Pierce Being Shopped

    Quote Originally Posted by Kraft
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    I'd agree with most of that.

    Nowitski's amazing, but I don't see him ever putting a team in the Finals. I don't think we'll see a fully healthy J-Kidd again. Jermaine/Artest healthy and sane are nearly a wash to me.

    And Marion, well, uh ... that's probably the one I disagree with the most. Great rebounder, but the offensive arsenal is rough and I've always thought he's an overrated defender in a team D concept.

    Just a little devil's advocate.

    I personally think that Shawn Marion is one of the most underrated players in the league.

    I agree, I dont think Dirk will ever lead a team to the finals, but neither will Artest. Nowitzki is superior to Artest, and that was the purpose of the list, to name 15 players better than Ron.

    If you dont want the Matrix on the list, I'm sure you could sub in another player. You could put in Elton Brand(underrated) or a healthy Chris Webber.

    I'd easily put the Vince Carter we saw in NJ this year on that list.

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    Default Re: Pierce Being Shopped

    Quote Originally Posted by PacerFanAdam
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    Alot of players in the NBA have attitude problems

    Very few get suspended every season (Ron was suspended many times in 02-03, a game in the 04 playoffs, and of course this year).

    No players get suspended the entire year........except Ron.
    Ron's suspension wasn't exactly fair. Other players have gotten considerably less punishment for worse behavior.

  14. #39

    Default Re: Pierce Being Shopped

    A continually healthy Grant Hill and Andrei Kirilenko are also in there, I'd say.

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    Default Re: Pierce Being Shopped

    Quote Originally Posted by Shade
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    Easily?

    Shaquille O'Neal
    Tim Duncan
    Kevin Garnett
    healthy Jason Kidd
    Dwayne Wade
    Steve Nash
    Amare

    I'll give you those, and only Amare based on his recent offensive prowess against the Spurs. Though Amare's defense was still lacking for the most part, and his offense would probably be considerably less on a team like the Pacers, who emphasize defense over offense.

    The other players, Ron is near or at the level of.
    Come on, like them or not, Kobe and Tmac are amazing basketball players. Ron is not on their level.

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    Default Re: Pierce Being Shopped

    Quote Originally Posted by Shade
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    Ron's suspension wasn't exactly fair. Other players have gotten considerably less punishment for worse behavior.

    We could debate that all day.

    The bottom line is, he was suspended the entire season. At the end of the day, that's all that mattered.

  17. #42
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    Default Re: Pierce Being Shopped

    Quote Originally Posted by PacerFanAdam
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    Alot of players in the NBA have attitude problems

    Very few get suspended every season (Ron was suspended many times in 02-03, a game in the 04 playoffs, and of course this year).

    No players get suspended the entire year........except Ron.
    Like your list was flawed, there are several players not in the same class as Ron, this is more nonsense, unless you want to call the "flagrant" he got in the 04 playoffs that cost him a game really a foul.

    If you do then I suggest that you look at some of the footage from it, and you will see that that was another really bad call.

    Why is it yet again that a thread gets turned into Artest bashing? is that all you can think of?


    Pierce is not a good fit for the Pacers, will never be a Pacer and is in general overrated, why else would teams trade him yet again? There is a reason his name is oince again in whispers on possbile trades, even for a pick no less, really shows his value.
    There is more to that then you might think.
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  18. #43
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    Default Re: Pierce Being Shopped

    Quote Originally Posted by PacerFanAdam
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    Come on, like them or not, Kobe and Tmac are amazing basketball players. Ron is not on their level.
    TMac is inconsistant, but at his best, he's better than Ron.

    Kobe fell off quite a bit this year.

    Ron showed in the few games he played this season that he has the ability to nearly score at will if he wants to, as well as the ability to shut down nearly anyone he can stay in front of. I hope he isn't too rusty next year.

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    Default Re: Pierce Being Shopped

    Quote Originally Posted by able
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    Like your list was flawed, there are several players not in the same class as Ron, this is more nonsense, unless you want to call the "flagrant" he got in the 04 playoffs that cost him a game really a foul.

    If you do then I suggest that you look at some of the footage from it, and you will see that that was another really bad call.

    Why is it yet again that a thread gets turned into Artest bashing? is that all you can think of?


    Pierce is not a good fit for the Pacers, will never be a Pacer and is in general overrated, why else would teams trade him yet again? There is a reason his name is oince again in whispers on possbile trades, even for a pick no less, really shows his value.
    There is more to that then you might think.
    Truly great players step it up a notch once traded. Shaq, Vince, TMac, and Kidd are great recent examples of this, not to mention JO and Ron. As for Pierce, we'll see how he responds if he's sent packing.

  20. #45
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    Default Re: Pierce Being Shopped

    Quote Originally Posted by PacerFanAdam
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    Shaquille O'Neal
    Tim Duncan
    Kevin Garnett
    Dirk Nowitzki
    Allen Iverson
    Kobe Bryant
    Tracy McGrady
    healthy Jason Kidd
    Dwayne Wade
    Lebron James
    Ray Allen
    healthy Jermaine
    Steve Nash
    Amare
    Marion

    Those 15 players are EASILY better overall players than Ron Artest. If you took Ron over any of them, you'd be crazy.
    and with the exceptions of lebron, amare, and wade....they all make over twice what ron makes and in many cases 3 times what ron makes....

    like it or not this is a business.....and the simple fact u compare him to these guys only make it more obvious of his value.....i dont agree with all of these on this list...but thats really irrelevant....what is relevant is that he is comparable to these players....hes an allstar and dpoy....all these others are basically allstars....yet rons salary is on par with a role player...which allows us tremendous flexibility....in this case to overpay austin...lol...

    find a guy whos making 6 million a year thats not on a rookie contract....compare ron to those guys and see what u think....its no contest....if u want to get rid of ron its simply a personal issue...it has nothing to do with performance or the business of basketball....

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    Default Re: Pierce Being Shopped

    Quote Originally Posted by Shade
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    Truly great players step it up a notch once traded. Shaq, Vince, TMac, and Kidd are great recent examples of this, not to mention JO and Ron. As for Pierce, we'll see how he responds if he's sent packing.
    TRULY great players don't need the motivation of getting traded in order to be great.

  22. #47
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    Default Re: Pierce Being Shopped

    Quote Originally Posted by shags
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    TRULY great players don't need the motivation of getting traded in order to be great.
    I'm referring to players that were already great or borderline and stepped it up to superstar status once sent to a new location.

    My point is, I don't see Pierce revitalizing Portland and taking them deep into the playoffs. Do you?

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    Default Re: Pierce Being Shopped

    Quote Originally Posted by foretaz
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    and with the exceptions of lebron, amare, and wade....they all make over twice what ron makes and in many cases 3 times what ron makes....

    like it or not this is a business.....and the simple fact u compare him to these guys only make it more obvious of his value.....i dont agree with all of these on this list...but thats really irrelevant....what is relevant is that he is comparable to these players....hes an allstar and dpoy....all these others are basically allstars....yet rons salary is on par with a role player...which allows us tremendous flexibility....in this case to overpay austin...lol...

    find a guy whos making 6 million a year thats not on a rookie contract....compare ron to those guys and see what u think....its no contest....if u want to get rid of ron its simply a personal issue...it has nothing to do with performance or the business of basketball....
    Would any GM be stupid enough to hand the franchise to Ron and give him a max size contract?

    Don't think so

  24. #49
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    Default Re: Pierce Being Shopped

    Quote Originally Posted by PacerFanAdam
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    Would any GM be stupid enough to hand the franchise to Ron and give him a max size contract?

    Don't think so
    *coughZekecough*


  25. #50
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    Default Re: Pierce Being Shopped

    Quote Originally Posted by PacerFanAdam
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    Would any GM be stupid enough to hand the franchise to Larry Brown?

    Don't think so
    Fixed.

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