Announcement

Collapse

The Rules of Pacers Digest

Hello everyone,

Whether your are a long standing forum member or whether you have just registered today, it's a good idea to read and review the rules below so that you have a very good idea of what to expect when you come to Pacers Digest.

A quick note to new members: Your posts will not immediately show up when you make them. An administrator has to approve at least your first post before the forum software will later upgrade your account to the status of a fully-registered member. This usually happens within a couple of hours or so after your post(s) is/are approved, so you may need to be a little patient at first.

Why do we do this? So that it's more difficult for spammers (be they human or robot) to post, and so users who are banned cannot immediately re-register and start dousing people with verbal flames.

Below are the rules of Pacers Digest. After you have read them, you will have a very good sense of where we are coming from, what we expect, what we don't want to see, and how we react to things.

Rule #1

Pacers Digest is intended to be a place to discuss basketball without having to deal with the kinds of behaviors or attitudes that distract people from sticking with the discussion of the topics at hand. These unwanted distractions can come in many forms, and admittedly it can sometimes be tricky to pin down each and every kind that can rear its ugly head, but we feel that the following examples and explanations cover at least a good portion of that ground and should at least give people a pretty good idea of the kinds of things we actively discourage:

"Anyone who __________ is a liar / a fool / an idiot / a blind homer / has their head buried in the sand / a blind hater / doesn't know basketball / doesn't watch the games"

"People with intelligence will agree with me when I say that __________"

"Only stupid people think / believe / do ___________"

"I can't wait to hear something from PosterX when he/she sees that **insert a given incident or current event that will have probably upset or disappointed PosterX here**"

"He/she is just delusional"

"This thread is stupid / worthless / embarrassing"

"I'm going to take a moment to point and / laugh at PosterX / GroupOfPeopleY who thought / believed *insert though/belief here*"

"Remember when PosterX said OldCommentY that no longer looks good? "

In general, if a comment goes from purely on topic to something 'ad hominem' (personal jabs, personal shots, attacks, flames, however you want to call it, towards a person, or a group of people, or a given city/state/country of people), those are most likely going to be found intolerable.

We also dissuade passive aggressive behavior. This can be various things, but common examples include statements that are basically meant to imply someone is either stupid or otherwise incapable of holding a rational conversation. This can include (but is not limited to) laughing at someone's conclusions rather than offering an honest rebuttal, asking people what game they were watching, or another common problem is Poster X will say "that player isn't that bad" and then Poster Y will say something akin to "LOL you think that player is good". We're not going to tolerate those kinds of comments out of respect for the community at large and for the sake of trying to just have an honest conversation.

Now, does the above cover absolutely every single kind of distraction that is unwanted? Probably not, but you should by now have a good idea of the general types of things we will be discouraging. The above examples are meant to give you a good feel for / idea of what we're looking for. If something new or different than the above happens to come along and results in the same problem (that being, any other attitude or behavior that ultimately distracts from actually just discussing the topic at hand, or that is otherwise disrespectful to other posters), we can and we will take action to curb this as well, so please don't take this to mean that if you managed to technically avoid saying something exactly like one of the above examples that you are then somehow off the hook.

That all having been said, our goal is to do so in a generally kind and respectful way, and that doesn't mean the moment we see something we don't like that somebody is going to be suspended or banned, either. It just means that at the very least we will probably say something about it, quite possibly snipping out the distracting parts of the post in question while leaving alone the parts that are actually just discussing the topics, and in the event of a repeating or excessive problem, then we will start issuing infractions to try to further discourage further repeat problems, and if it just never seems to improve, then finally suspensions or bans will come into play. We would prefer it never went that far, and most of the time for most of our posters, it won't ever have to.

A slip up every once and a while is pretty normal, but, again, when it becomes repetitive or excessive, something will be done. Something occasional is probably going to be let go (within reason), but when it starts to become habitual or otherwise a pattern, odds are very good that we will step in.

There's always a small minority that like to push people's buttons and/or test their own boundaries with regards to the administrators, and in the case of someone acting like that, please be aware that this is not a court of law, but a private website run by people who are simply trying to do the right thing as they see it. If we feel that you are a special case that needs to be dealt with in an exceptional way because your behavior isn't explicitly mirroring one of our above examples of what we generally discourage, we can and we will take atypical action to prevent this from continuing if you are not cooperative with us.

Also please be aware that you will not be given a pass simply by claiming that you were 'only joking,' because quite honestly, when someone really is just joking, for one thing most people tend to pick up on the joke, including the person or group that is the target of the joke, and for another thing, in the event where an honest joke gets taken seriously and it upsets or angers someone, the person who is truly 'only joking' will quite commonly go out of his / her way to apologize and will try to mend fences. People who are dishonest about their statements being 'jokes' do not do so, and in turn that becomes a clear sign of what is really going on. It's nothing new.

In any case, quite frankly, the overall quality and health of the entire forum's community is more important than any one troublesome user will ever be, regardless of exactly how a problem is exhibiting itself, and if it comes down to us having to make a choice between you versus the greater health and happiness of the entire community, the community of this forum will win every time.

Lastly, there are also some posters, who are generally great contributors and do not otherwise cause any problems, who sometimes feel it's their place to provoke or to otherwise 'mess with' that small minority of people described in the last paragraph, and while we possibly might understand why you might feel you WANT to do something like that, the truth is we can't actually tolerate that kind of behavior from you any more than we can tolerate the behavior from them. So if we feel that you are trying to provoke those other posters into doing or saying something that will get themselves into trouble, then we will start to view you as a problem as well, because of the same reason as before: The overall health of the forum comes first, and trying to stir the pot with someone like that doesn't help, it just makes it worse. Some will simply disagree with this philosophy, but if so, then so be it because ultimately we have to do what we think is best so long as it's up to us.

If you see a problem that we haven't addressed, the best and most appropriate course for a forum member to take here is to look over to the left of the post in question. See underneath that poster's name, avatar, and other info, down where there's a little triangle with an exclamation point (!) in it? Click that. That allows you to report the post to the admins so we can definitely notice it and give it a look to see what we feel we should do about it. Beyond that, obviously it's human nature sometimes to want to speak up to the poster in question who has bothered you, but we would ask that you try to refrain from doing so because quite often what happens is two or more posters all start going back and forth about the original offending post, and suddenly the entire thread is off topic or otherwise derailed. So while the urge to police it yourself is understandable, it's best to just report it to us and let us handle it. Thank you!

All of the above is going to be subject to a case by case basis, but generally and broadly speaking, this should give everyone a pretty good idea of how things will typically / most often be handled.

Rule #2

If the actions of an administrator inspire you to make a comment, criticism, or express a concern about it, there is a wrong place and a couple of right places to do so.

The wrong place is to do so in the original thread in which the administrator took action. For example, if a post gets an infraction, or a post gets deleted, or a comment within a larger post gets clipped out, in a thread discussing Paul George, the wrong thing to do is to distract from the discussion of Paul George by adding your off topic thoughts on what the administrator did.

The right places to do so are:

A) Start a thread about the specific incident you want to talk about on the Feedback board. This way you are able to express yourself in an area that doesn't throw another thread off topic, and this way others can add their two cents as well if they wish, and additionally if there's something that needs to be said by the administrators, that is where they will respond to it.

B) Send a private message to the administrators, and they can respond to you that way.

If this is done the wrong way, those comments will be deleted, and if it's a repeating problem then it may also receive an infraction as well.

Rule #3

If a poster is bothering you, and an administrator has not or will not deal with that poster to the extent that you would prefer, you have a powerful tool at your disposal, one that has recently been upgraded and is now better than ever: The ability to ignore a user.

When you ignore a user, you will unfortunately still see some hints of their existence (nothing we can do about that), however, it does the following key things:

A) Any post they make will be completely invisible as you scroll through a thread.

B) The new addition to this feature: If someone QUOTES a user you are ignoring, you do not have to read who it was, or what that poster said, unless you go out of your way to click on a link to find out who it is and what they said.

To utilize this feature, from any page on Pacers Digest, scroll to the top of the page, look to the top right where it says 'Settings' and click that. From the settings page, look to the left side of the page where it says 'My Settings', and look down from there until you see 'Edit Ignore List' and click that. From here, it will say 'Add a Member to Your List...' Beneath that, click in the text box to the right of 'User Name', type in or copy & paste the username of the poster you are ignoring, and once their name is in the box, look over to the far right and click the 'Okay' button. All done!

Rule #4

Regarding infractions, currently they carry a value of one point each, and that point will expire in 31 days. If at any point a poster is carrying three points at the same time, that poster will be suspended until the oldest of the three points expires.

Rule #5

When you share or paste content or articles from another website, you must include the URL/link back to where you found it, who wrote it, and what website it's from. Said content will be removed if this doesn't happen.

An example:

If I copy and paste an article from the Indianapolis Star website, I would post something like this:

http://www.linktothearticlegoeshere.com/article
Title of the Article
Author's Name
Indianapolis Star

Rule #6

We cannot tolerate illegal videos on Pacers Digest. This means do not share any links to them, do not mention any websites that host them or link to them, do not describe how to find them in any way, and do not ask about them. Posts doing anything of the sort will be removed, the offenders will be contacted privately, and if the problem becomes habitual, you will be suspended, and if it still persists, you will probably be banned.

The legal means of watching or listening to NBA games are NBA League Pass Broadband (for US, or for International; both cost money) and NBA Audio League Pass (which is free). Look for them on NBA.com.

Rule #7

Provocative statements in a signature, or as an avatar, or as the 'tagline' beneath a poster's username (where it says 'Member' or 'Administrator' by default, if it is not altered) are an unwanted distraction that will more than likely be removed on sight. There can be shades of gray to this, but in general this could be something political or religious that is likely going to provoke or upset people, or otherwise something that is mean-spirited at the expense of a poster, a group of people, or a population.

It may or may not go without saying, but this goes for threads and posts as well, particularly when it's not made on the off-topic board (Market Square).

We do make exceptions if we feel the content is both innocuous and unlikely to cause social problems on the forum (such as wishing someone a Merry Christmas or a Happy Easter), and we also also make exceptions if such topics come up with regards to a sports figure (such as the Lance Stephenson situation bringing up discussions of domestic abuse and the law, or when Jason Collins came out as gay and how that lead to some discussion about gay rights).

However, once the discussion seems to be more/mostly about the political issues instead of the sports figure or his specific situation, the thread is usually closed.

Rule #8

We prefer self-restraint and/or modesty when making jokes or off topic comments in a sports discussion thread. They can be fun, but sometimes they derail or distract from a topic, and we don't want to see that happen. If we feel it is a problem, we will either delete or move those posts from the thread.

Rule #9

Generally speaking, we try to be a "PG-13" rated board, and we don't want to see sexual content or similarly suggestive content. Vulgarity is a more muddled issue, though again we prefer things to lean more towards "PG-13" than "R". If we feel things have gone too far, we will step in.

Rule #10

We like small signatures, not big signatures. The bigger the signature, the more likely it is an annoying or distracting signature.

Rule #11

Do not advertise anything without talking about it with the administrators first. This includes advertising with your signature, with your avatar, through private messaging, and/or by making a thread or post.
See more
See less

Bball's Season Ending Ramblings

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Bball's Season Ending Ramblings

    I was a little slow getting to write this for a couple of reasons. One, I wasn't sure what I was going to write or where I'd take this. There's just so much ground to cover that it will probably be impossible to cover it all. And truthfully, I still don't know exactly where these meanderings will lead me.

    Secondly, somebody say "ouch" because for several days I was suffering with back pain that made extended stays in the computer chair more than I could handle. It's still not gone but it only hurts mainly to get up now... so that probably means this might end up l o o o o n g .

    I've already posted my goodbye to Reggie so I won't really rehash it here. It was wonderful to see him strap us all in the rollercoaster one last time and take us for another ride giving us all reason to believe one more time. His final game, against the dreaded Detroit Pistons, was all (and more) that his fans could've expected. He was the best Pacer on the court.

    This season was inspiring, frustrating, sad, and in the end draining for me. I'm not sure how Rick Carlisle was able to keep bringing back the team from the dead. Just when it looked like we were finished, out of gas, overmatched, etc the team played an inspired game.

    I have to admit, I questioned some of the things Rick did this season. Starting and overusing Curry. Relegating James Jones to the bench after some good games, and replacing him with Curry (when I thought it was clear we needed to be using James Jones and hoping the extended minutes helped ready him for later in the season and next year rather than wasting behind Curry). The 'throw it into JO' offense can end yesterday as far as I am concerned if that is all there is going to be to it. How can the players be buying into that and watching JO shoot bad shots and ignore open teammates? But somehow, someway, Carlisle always brought them around. At least I assume it was Carlisle. I guess the pessimist in me wonders if it was Reggie's presence and hope/respect his teammates had for his legacy that brought the players around more than anything Carlisle was doing.

    I do think Carlisle's weakness is in game adjustments. His strong suit seems to be game to game adjustments. But overall, how he kept this team together and battling to the end, was nothing short of amazing. Very much COTY material. Even with my complaints and questions I can see that. I think Carlisle is a very good coach but I don't think he is a perfect coach. But perfect coaches are rare indeed... if they even exist at all.

    I guess I have to mention 11/19 because everything changed that night. I personally don't think Artest's reaction was much different than many starters in the NBA would be in similar circumstances. The problem is, Artest was the last player (thanks to his history) that could do something like that. I also believe the mitigating circumstance should've allowed Artest to serve a long suspension but be back this year, even with his history.

    I also believe 11/19 pointed out a problem with punishments in the NBA and a need for more creativity in handing out something other than 'death sentence' punishments. It's not fair to anybody, fans, players, owners, city, etc because too much money rides on the success of NBA teams. From the hard earned money spent by fans at the games, to the money spent at surrounding businesses in the city, to the money needed to operate the team, there needs to be a better way. Besides the money angle, it also puts players and coaches into situations where lots of questions are brought up. Overused players get injured and don't perform as well as hoped once they are forced out of the comfort zone. Coaching gets questioned.

    And I am not sure these questions that are raised will automatically be answered and heal. They may be more like cracks in a foundation that grow and grow. That worries me. Can Humpty Dumpty be put back together again?

    And while I am at it I want to mention all the talk we've heard in the past about the respect Walsh gets or how the Pacers are a model NBA team in the league. All that counted for apparently nothing come 11/19.

    Meanwhile, the Pistons, the organization and fans, were allowed to walk away with barely a bump in their season. Not even a verbal lashing from the league- leaving Indiana to bear the brunt even tho there was more to the story than just Indiana at fault.

    But what happened wasn't all bad. We did get a look at how our team reacts to adversity. Some get high marks... some... welllllll....

    I question Carlisle's quick reinsertion of players back into the rotation. In the end, he ended up questioning it as well. I'm not as down on SJax as some of you are. I think there were some missed things in the Detroit episode that got his dander up to begin with (a major shove and who knows what was being said)... and I have no idea what was in his mind when he went into the stands. Did he really go in swinging randomly? No...
    Was he going to get Ron? Was he going to pick random fights? We'll never know because several Piston fans reacted first.

    JO was probably overused on his return but IMHO Sjax most certainly was.

    I think this season also exposed several things. Artest's importance is one of them. That doesn't mean he couldn't be replaced but it is clear to me that of the current players Artest is more valuable than JO. I now believe JO is overrated and has much farther to go before he can carry a team... if he ever can. He has lots to work on, much of it above his injured shoulder. JO is more of a complimentary type player and needs others. He's Robin, he needs a Batman. The fallacy of thinking he is anywhere near Duncan should've been put to rest this season. That is not to say JO should be tossed out with the first deal that comes along to rid ourselves of the Bender curse but it is to say we (fans and coaches) need to ratchet down the expectations that JO is our savior. He may not even end up the heir to the throne that Reggie just abdicated.... altho I am sure he'll sit on it and declare himself emperor.

    I worry that he won't 'get it', that he'll have trouble being second fiddle. That he will 'dominate' the ball. That he will force the team to choose between the best for the team and some balance that keeps JO happy.... that nobody will be willing to tell the emperor he has no clothers. He'll be 27 I believe this next season. It's way past time to quit using youth or immaturity as an excuse. He's been in this league 8-9 years.
    He's our max player. I don't think it is asking too much that he be expected to lead by example and that means hard work, fundamentals, sharing the ball, not forcing shots, playing defense, making his teammates better, etc..

    Bender.... If no deal can be found to take him then I say cut him. Eat the money and send a signal that enough is enough and this team is expected to be TOUGH. Bender and 'tough' don't belong in the same sentence. This past season should have shown all of us the problem of wasting roster spots on players who can't or won't play for whatever reason.

    I'm pretty much resigned to the fact Artest will be here next season. We need to make sure the cupboard isn't bare if he should get suspended.... or decide he wants to retire or only play on days with a "T" in the name... or whatever (and I am one of the people who believes his retirement was FAR worse than what he did in Detroit). But then maybe if JO is the prima donna I am starting to believe he could be then that could wear on anyone... especially somebody that isn't wired quite the same as most people in the first place. While we can't expect equal value for Artest at this point, our insurance policy could certainly be someone of the quality (or better) than we could expect in a trade. IOW, instead of trading Artest for an average player and then being without Artest, why not just sign an average or better player as the insurance policy and just keep Artest? Could that be James Jones?

    I'm still not convinced Gregg Foster is starting material. I like him as the energy guy off the bench. To me, that there's an argument that Jeff should be our starting center points out how weak we are there. I'm intrigued by Harrison. Maybe he can learn from Dale (and his season with Reggie) about what it is going to take and he can put to rest questions of who starts.

    When Larry Bird was announced to be heading to the front office I got pretty excited. I thought maybe the days of standing pat were behind us. I believed Bird wouldn't be satisfied with anything but a championship. Well, it's time for him to get to work... or for Donnie to lean on him... because it is not a given that we'll be on par with Detroit next year (they own JO and Artest didn't exactly eat them up in 2004)... Does Sjax make the difference with our core? And then Miami scares me even tho we did well against them this year. And Scott Skiles scares me as well. He can coach.

    I'm a firm believer that you do have to make trades and tweaks just to keep from getting stale. It also energizes the fanbase... altho a "Bender is healing" story seems to energize some Pacer fans WAY more than it should.

    Tinsley.... I am now officially worried about Tinsley as our starting PG. I know I tend to 'see' things some of you easily dismiss BUT I think there was more to his extended leave after his mother died than we were told. I don't know what it might've been- problem with a teammate, injury, quit on the team, etc... but I will always think there was more to the story besides mourning. Regardless, we still have the injury plague with him. We have more seasons where he can't play... or can't play at 100%, because he's injured. Again.

    Patterns are important.

    Another thing I am worried about with this collection of players is them trying to fill the vacuum created with Reggie's departure. Rather than let it naturally happen I could see some of these guys forcing things and causing problems. Rick might have his work cut out for him here. But then he somehow managed to pull them together this season.

    I will say this, if Carlisle is to blame for this "throw it into JO" offense and "never see the ball again until after JO shoots" then I am ready to start helping Carlisle pack. I'm doubting this is exactly what Carlisle wants tho. Regardless of why we see it, if we still see it overused (abused) again next season then we can forget about a championship. Until that is corrected, until JO learns to pass the ball, until he learns not to force things, until he learns to keep his head into the game, we WILL be beat in the playoffs. That is just too easy to defend AND demoralizing for the team and fans.

    11/19 as brought us a lot of questions. It might have also given us some answers... although not necessarily answers we are wanting to hear.

    -Bball

    BTW... Our little run without JO and with Reggie again the focus and Dale setting screens and grabbing IMPORTANT rebounds pretty much told me what I knew all along. The 1999 and 2000 teams had more in the tank even without Rik. Deferring to JO has been a mistake on either Reggie's part, coaching, or management's part.

    On another note... I don't think I'll ever forget that Orlando game with only 6 players available. And the Boston game a few nights later will also stay with me. I can still see a frustrated Paul Pierce complaining about losing to the "3rd string".
    Nuntius was right for a while. I was wrong for a while. But ultimately I was right and Frank Vogel has been let go.

    ------

    "A player who makes a team great is more valuable than a great player. Losing yourself in the group, for the good of the group, that’s teamwork."

    -John Wooden

  • #2
    Re: Bball's Season Ending Ramblings

    Great post.

    Reading posts like this, Pecks, and UncleBuck's make me wish I was that smart.

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Bball's Season Ending Ramblings

      Exceptional post. We mirror a lot of opinions about the team, which we have for years.

      But I have to disagree with one part of your post on this.

      Bball said "Bender and 'tough' don't belong in the same sentence."

      You see I can easily think of many times when Bender & tough do belong in the same sentence.

      Example # 1: It is tough to think that Bender is the 3rd highest paid player on the team.

      Example # 2: Bender is to tough as Macarroni is to Brown shoes.

      Example # 3: The lack of being tough has often led Bender to sit in street clothes while other players have soldiered on.

      I could go on & on.

      As to O'Neal, I share the same fears.


      Basketball isn't played with computers, spreadsheets, and simulations. ChicagoJ 4/21/13

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Bball's Season Ending Ramblings

        Very good post!

        I think you are annually as viable a candidate as most for armchair coach of the year except your sometimes diving overboard hurts you. You will never convince me and others that cutting Bender is justifiable and a smart move. It's a reactionary move brought about by frustration. Understandable though!

        I could see trading him for expiring contracts as rumored though.

        Originally posted by Bball
        The 'throw it into JO' offense can end yesterday as far as I am concerned if that is all there is going to be to it. How can the players be buying into that and watching JO shoot bad shots and ignore open teammates?
        Amen to that!

        The reason it was bought into was because Reggie bought into it. How could the rest not follow suit? Artest wouldn't have bought into it though and he won't buy into it. Of course with him in the lineup he's part of Carlisle's inside out game and then it works because there is more than one inside option. I don't think it will be a problem as long as Artest is here.

        The problem will still be JO holding the ball for five seconds while he decides on which fake to use, and others standing around while he does.

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Bball's Season Ending Ramblings

          Great post bball, made me decide to answer here instead of in Peck's thread

          I do not join the fear that rises through the ranks at the moment for next year, not only have we not seen anything close to what is was supposed to be last year, we have made some significant changes already and will make a few more I think.

          JO/Ron/Jamaal will be the nucleus of this team in my opinion and despite the fact that i worry less then most about JT's injuries or a so-called patern to it, even IF I would agree on that I would still wait another year before pulling the plug for the simple reason that at current cost (the new contract) he is still a very high quality PG for a very reasonable amount of money, even if it means getting a "better" backup.

          I think however there are other problems surrounding this team that has little to do with the players, but far more witch coaching staff and ideolegy of that staff, that is in my opinion also responsible for the "throw it in JO" offense, where I will admit the presence of Ron would "open things up" more then a bit.
          Still the lack of movement AFTER the ball is thrown to JO is a major reason for the little amount of passing he does, game 7 of the Boston series made clear that he CAN pass the ball, IF there is someone in a "decent" position.
          His lack of movement in his shoulder is more then likely a good reason for a lesser performance on all levels, where he was still expected to carry the entire load, it was not until we decided to run through Reggie as well in game 6 that things "opened" up.

          I see jax as a problem for the coming year, despite liking his effort and winning mindset, I do not like how it works out on the team, since he is breaking offensive sets and taking shots out of offense which causes players to get annoyed and they start playing out of offense and it all (once again) ends up in shambles.
          It is best made clear showing that Jax is best around 15 attempts per game.
          If within the offense he is dangerous, outside he is nothing but distraction.

          Ron remains a questionmark as to whether he will remain solid or not, we can discuss that till hell freezes over, but wait and see is in effect all we can do, we will certainly at the moment, not get a decent value for him.

          Harrison is a prospect I have high hopes for this coming season, if he can learn from DD we will be pleasantly surprised.

          JJ re-signing would be very good, as I think he will be our SG of the future who will be very capable playing SG as well when needed, so insurance on several levels.

          With all players healthy, I think we have more then a decent chance.

          One little ball I want to toss up:

          Could it be that Reggie, with all the deferring, we played a system no player was happy with? That looking for Reggie and him throwing the ball back was somehow in some form detriment to the team?

          Was the forced "change" something that held back certain players, irritated others and in the end cretaed something that was a bad influence?

          One thing is sure in my opinion, we need a VERY good replacement fo Mike in the coaching staff because he is more important to the team then most will realize, Kevin and Rick are both not exactly known for offense prowess and "player-psychology".
          So Long And Thanks For All The Fish.

          If you've done 6 impossible things today?
          Then why not have Breakfast at Milliways!

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Bball's Season Ending Ramblings

            Originally posted by Dr Huxtable
            Great post.

            Reading posts like this, Pecks, and UncleBuck's make me wish I was that smart.
            I only wish i could talk that good english!!

            BTW: Great post BBall!

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Bball's Season Ending Ramblings

              Great post Bball.

              Does anyone else remember when Scott Skiles was a player for the Pacers. He left the team for several days and had to be convinced to come back by Donnie Walsh. How does that compare to what Ron did, I'm not sure, but I thought I would just mention it here

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Bball's Season Ending Ramblings

                Skiles left the team? Wow - that's suprising. What was the reason?
                The best exercise of the human heart is reaching down and picking someone else up.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Bball's Season Ending Ramblings

                  Originally posted by Unclebuck
                  Great post Bball.

                  Does anyone else remember when Scott Skiles was a player for the Pacers. He left the team for several days and had to be convinced to come back by Donnie Walsh. How does that compare to what Ron did, I'm not sure, but I thought I would just mention it here
                  I remember it UB and Scotty Skiles was VERY high strung like Artest. I had the pleasure of talking to Skiles for about 30 minutes after a game and he was the most paranoid person I've ever seen. I don't know if he had received threats on his life or what but every few minutes he would constantly look behind him and to the side. It was so bad he was making me nervous.
                  You know how hippos are made out to be sweet and silly, like big cows, but are actually extremely dangerous and can kill you with stunning brutality? The Pacers are the NBA's hippos....Matt Moore CBS Sports....

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Bball's Season Ending Ramblings

                    Originally posted by ABADays
                    Skiles left the team? Wow - that's suprising. What was the reason?


                    ABA, I'm not sure if you are being sarcastic or not. But as I remember he left because the team was horrible, they did not play as hard as he thought they should. He did not think the Pacers played the right way. (I don't think SS was producing a rap CD.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Bball's Season Ending Ramblings

                      I could totally be off basis here but I'm pretty sure that Scott only decided to retire after a loss (I think it was after a loss to Washington) & on the plane ride home Walsh had to talk him into staying. I don't think he ever left the team for any days or missed any games.

                      What is the differance?

                      Scott was upset about a loss & constant losing.

                      Ron was upset about not having enough of the offense flow his way.

                      Scott retiring fired the team up & they went on to win 4 of thier next 5 games.

                      Ron caused absolute havok & the team went on to one of the most embarrasing losses in Pacers history (Clippers game)

                      Scot came back to have a productive season.

                      Ron came back to....... well I think we all know this one.


                      Basketball isn't played with computers, spreadsheets, and simulations. ChicagoJ 4/21/13

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Bball's Season Ending Ramblings

                        Bball, that was excellent and I generally agree with everything you said.

                        I haven't had time to write a post-mortem myself, but it wouldn't have been much different.

                        As for the Scott Skiles incident - I remember it similar to Peck's, although I thought Skiles "retired" in MSG after a tough loss. Then he got on the team plane (contrast that to Ron) and DW talked him out of quitting. But wasn't that during the 28-win season in which we had 340 different head coaches and finally settled on the one coach (Versace) that could make George Irvine and Isiah Thomas look remotely competent??

                        I've always thought, "who could blame him?" during that situation.
                        Why do the things that we treasure most, slip away in time
                        Till to the music we grow deaf, to God's beauty blind
                        Why do the things that connect us slowly pull us apart?
                        Till we fall away in our own darkness, a stranger to our own hearts
                        And life itself, rushing over me
                        Life itself, the wind in black elms,
                        Life itself in your heart and in your eyes, I can't make it without you

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Bball's Season Ending Ramblings

                          So long as we have Ron Artest, I'm not scared of alot of these teams in the Eastern Conference. I really don't think we need to trade him just because we need him so much more then everyone thinks. Without him, We have nobody with the defensive prowess to hold players like Lebron, Pierce, or Carter to 12 point 6 rebound nights.

                          I would watch out for the Pacers next year defensively..We are going to be defensive monsters. You have Stephen Jackson and Ron Artest as your defensive swingmen who can guard the 2 and 3's of each team which are usually a huge factor in winning games.

                          I also think JO will become a much more effective passer if he even needs to be. I get the feeling he will no longer face any double teams as long as Tinsley, Jackson, and Artest are on the court. We should alternate DD and Foster in starts based on matchups. Foster should guard the more athletic and shorter centers while DD should be in there against the bigger and stronger ones. We have 5 extremely solid defensive and offensive starters and a fantastic bench full of guys who have shown they can step it up when we need it.

                          If we didn't make any trades in the off-season, We would still probably be the number 1 team in the Eastern Conference. I'm not worried about team chemistry..Artest will come back next year rejuvenated and ready to play. He wont complain about time off or any stupid **** like that anymore.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Bball's Season Ending Ramblings

                            Originally posted by Peck
                            Ron was upset about not having enough of the offense flow his way.


                            Ron caused absolute havok & the team went on to one of the most embarrasing losses in Pacers history (Clippers game)


                            Ron came back to....... well I think we all know this one.

                            What ?

                            Ron wanted to retire because the offense was not going through him enough. That is a new one to me.

                            Yes and all that havok also produced one of the best wins of the season at Minnesota

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Bball's Season Ending Ramblings

                              Originally posted by Unclebuck
                              What ?

                              Ron wanted to retire because the offense was not going through him enough. That is a new one to me.

                              Yes and all that havok also produced one of the best wins of the season at Minnesota
                              You - of all people - pointing to the Minnesota game?

                              That was the night all the players looked like they'd been let out of prison - the "let's prove to the world we can beat a team everyone thinks is a contender (and on the road, no less) without that knucklehead who wants to quit on us because we don't need his physcho @$$ on our team" game.

                              Granted, in hindsight, beating Minnesota wasn't such a difficult task this season.
                              Why do the things that we treasure most, slip away in time
                              Till to the music we grow deaf, to God's beauty blind
                              Why do the things that connect us slowly pull us apart?
                              Till we fall away in our own darkness, a stranger to our own hearts
                              And life itself, rushing over me
                              Life itself, the wind in black elms,
                              Life itself in your heart and in your eyes, I can't make it without you

                              Comment

                              Working...
                              X