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Rule #1

Pacers Digest is intended to be a place to discuss basketball without having to deal with the kinds of behaviors or attitudes that distract people from sticking with the discussion of the topics at hand. These unwanted distractions can come in many forms, and admittedly it can sometimes be tricky to pin down each and every kind that can rear its ugly head, but we feel that the following examples and explanations cover at least a good portion of that ground and should at least give people a pretty good idea of the kinds of things we actively discourage:

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We also dissuade passive aggressive behavior. This can be various things, but common examples include statements that are basically meant to imply someone is either stupid or otherwise incapable of holding a rational conversation. This can include (but is not limited to) laughing at someone's conclusions rather than offering an honest rebuttal, asking people what game they were watching, or another common problem is Poster X will say "that player isn't that bad" and then Poster Y will say something akin to "LOL you think that player is good". We're not going to tolerate those kinds of comments out of respect for the community at large and for the sake of trying to just have an honest conversation.

Now, does the above cover absolutely every single kind of distraction that is unwanted? Probably not, but you should by now have a good idea of the general types of things we will be discouraging. The above examples are meant to give you a good feel for / idea of what we're looking for. If something new or different than the above happens to come along and results in the same problem (that being, any other attitude or behavior that ultimately distracts from actually just discussing the topic at hand, or that is otherwise disrespectful to other posters), we can and we will take action to curb this as well, so please don't take this to mean that if you managed to technically avoid saying something exactly like one of the above examples that you are then somehow off the hook.

That all having been said, our goal is to do so in a generally kind and respectful way, and that doesn't mean the moment we see something we don't like that somebody is going to be suspended or banned, either. It just means that at the very least we will probably say something about it, quite possibly snipping out the distracting parts of the post in question while leaving alone the parts that are actually just discussing the topics, and in the event of a repeating or excessive problem, then we will start issuing infractions to try to further discourage further repeat problems, and if it just never seems to improve, then finally suspensions or bans will come into play. We would prefer it never went that far, and most of the time for most of our posters, it won't ever have to.

A slip up every once and a while is pretty normal, but, again, when it becomes repetitive or excessive, something will be done. Something occasional is probably going to be let go (within reason), but when it starts to become habitual or otherwise a pattern, odds are very good that we will step in.

There's always a small minority that like to push people's buttons and/or test their own boundaries with regards to the administrators, and in the case of someone acting like that, please be aware that this is not a court of law, but a private website run by people who are simply trying to do the right thing as they see it. If we feel that you are a special case that needs to be dealt with in an exceptional way because your behavior isn't explicitly mirroring one of our above examples of what we generally discourage, we can and we will take atypical action to prevent this from continuing if you are not cooperative with us.

Also please be aware that you will not be given a pass simply by claiming that you were 'only joking,' because quite honestly, when someone really is just joking, for one thing most people tend to pick up on the joke, including the person or group that is the target of the joke, and for another thing, in the event where an honest joke gets taken seriously and it upsets or angers someone, the person who is truly 'only joking' will quite commonly go out of his / her way to apologize and will try to mend fences. People who are dishonest about their statements being 'jokes' do not do so, and in turn that becomes a clear sign of what is really going on. It's nothing new.

In any case, quite frankly, the overall quality and health of the entire forum's community is more important than any one troublesome user will ever be, regardless of exactly how a problem is exhibiting itself, and if it comes down to us having to make a choice between you versus the greater health and happiness of the entire community, the community of this forum will win every time.

Lastly, there are also some posters, who are generally great contributors and do not otherwise cause any problems, who sometimes feel it's their place to provoke or to otherwise 'mess with' that small minority of people described in the last paragraph, and while we possibly might understand why you might feel you WANT to do something like that, the truth is we can't actually tolerate that kind of behavior from you any more than we can tolerate the behavior from them. So if we feel that you are trying to provoke those other posters into doing or saying something that will get themselves into trouble, then we will start to view you as a problem as well, because of the same reason as before: The overall health of the forum comes first, and trying to stir the pot with someone like that doesn't help, it just makes it worse. Some will simply disagree with this philosophy, but if so, then so be it because ultimately we have to do what we think is best so long as it's up to us.

If you see a problem that we haven't addressed, the best and most appropriate course for a forum member to take here is to look over to the left of the post in question. See underneath that poster's name, avatar, and other info, down where there's a little triangle with an exclamation point (!) in it? Click that. That allows you to report the post to the admins so we can definitely notice it and give it a look to see what we feel we should do about it. Beyond that, obviously it's human nature sometimes to want to speak up to the poster in question who has bothered you, but we would ask that you try to refrain from doing so because quite often what happens is two or more posters all start going back and forth about the original offending post, and suddenly the entire thread is off topic or otherwise derailed. So while the urge to police it yourself is understandable, it's best to just report it to us and let us handle it. Thank you!

All of the above is going to be subject to a case by case basis, but generally and broadly speaking, this should give everyone a pretty good idea of how things will typically / most often be handled.

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If this is done the wrong way, those comments will be deleted, and if it's a repeating problem then it may also receive an infraction as well.

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We prefer self-restraint and/or modesty when making jokes or off topic comments in a sports discussion thread. They can be fun, but sometimes they derail or distract from a topic, and we don't want to see that happen. If we feel it is a problem, we will either delete or move those posts from the thread.

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Montieth: Pacers need to upgrade point guard position

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  • #16
    Re: Montieth: Pacers need to upgrade point guard position

    We need to keep this in perspective, Jamaal only really got to play about 10 games with these guys since his injury, and this was not nearly the same team he was playing with before his injury. The real reason we lost this series was because we did not have chemistry. These guys had not gone through this with this particular group of guys. They did not know what worked and did not work with this lineup. Tinsley did not have enough time to develop chemistry with these guys.

    That's what the regular season is all about. Finding out what works for the team and what does not. But we did not have the luxery of having the regular season to have this group gel. A point guard's job is based on the tendencies of the other players on the team, something that is usually learned during the regular season, something Tinsley did not have the luxery of having.

    And the talk about him not having a jumpshot is bs. Have you all forgotten about the 15-20 points he averaged when he needed to during the regular season (before he was injured). His injury is the real reason he couldn't hit a shot. The reason he got this injury was because he was playing way to many minutes since there wasn't even one regular starter out there. Now that AJ can play, we can play Tinsley 30-35 minutes a game next year and get quality minutes with AJ.

    Tinsley is the perfect point guard for the Pacers, esp. considering that we'll have Ron back. He looks to pass first, which not a bad thing when you have J.O., Ron, and Jackson on the team. And his passing skills are only passed by 3 or 4 other point guards in the league.

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    • #17
      Re: Montieth: Pacers need to upgrade point guard position

      Originally posted by Anthem
      Well, Terry's not going anywhere, so who did you have in mind? Starbury?

      When I look at a lineup that includes Jermaine, Artest, and Jackson, my first thought is "we need another guy in the starting five that needs the ball!" I'd love a deadeye shooter off the bench, but that's a different story.
      Rick's offense doesn't require someone like Tinsley to make it run. The others can more or less play either way, but if you give them a 1 who can be a deadly shooter, it makes it tougher on the opposition. Look at what Billups did to us.

      Comment


      • #18
        Re: Montieth: Pacers need to upgrade point guard position

        Originally posted by vapacersfan
        Ragnar,

        I love JT as much as you, but in that fourth quarter when everything started going wrong the crowd got really pissed at the refs.

        JT got taken out because he got frustrated, and feeding off of the crowd IMO he grabbed and took a stupid foul.

        I would have benched him as well, he wasnt playing with his brain, he was playing with his heart at that point.

        Thats fine on the street, but not in game number 6 of the ECF
        So you pull him out, have a quick conversation, then put him back in.

        Though I don't think the Pacers could do anything to stop the Pistons last night. Reggie said it in his press conf very well. Very good, physical teams do that. They hang around and hang around and at the end of the games they just wear you down and grab it.

        The '90's Pacers and Knicks both used to do the same thing.
        The poster formerly known as Rimfire

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        • #19
          Re: Montieth: Pacers need to upgrade point guard position

          I think JT was out of gas and sync. You don't miss 3 months and comeback ready to play. J.O. was obviously affected by his injuries. Artest if he isn't traded will make a huge difference. We do need to make some changes, but not drastic, we got the pieces. I think our biggest upgrade would be at the center position, DD is not a center but is good fit if the other teams is weak there also.
          Tinsleys injury problems are not the type of chronically injured players (somebody stepped on his foot) hamstring,calf etc. Yes we need to do something, but don't forget we won 61 games a season ago with nearly the same team.
          "He wanted to get to that money time. Time when the hardware was on the table. That's when Roger was going to show up. So all we needed to do was stay close"
          Darnell Hillman (Speaking of former teammate Roger Brown)

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          • #20
            Re: Montieth: Pacers need to upgrade point guard position

            Originally posted by Hicks
            Rick's offense doesn't require someone like Tinsley to make it run. The others can more or less play either way, but if you give them a 1 who can be a deadly shooter, it makes it tougher on the opposition. Look at what Billups did to us.
            So who would you pick? Let's name names here. I don't see anybody out there that would be an improvement on Tinsley. If we're talking AJ, then that's another story.
            This space for rent.

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            • #21
              Re: Montieth: Pacers need to upgrade point guard position

              I've been posting for a while about my problems with Tinsley for this team, as good as he is.

              I'm surprised but, honestly, pretty happy to hear that changes may be in order.

              I agree with Anthem, though. Who? Specific names need to be discussed.

              But, with Tinsley, it's hard to use him at crunch time in big games: inconsistent shooter, inconsistent free throw shooter, not championship level defense, unpredictable emotions and decision making. It's a shame to see someone so good have to sit at the end.
              "Look, it's up to me to put a team around ... Lance right now." —Kevin Pritchard press conference

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              • #22
                Re: Montieth: Pacers need to upgrade point guard position

                Oh, yeah. I meant to post this last night. I thought it was perhaps a tip-off of a Tinsley trade when Reggie, during the press conference, said the team belonged next year to Jermaine . . . (pause) . . . and Ron . . . and Stephen.

                No mention of Tinsley. For a guy that is holding on to the ball most of the time during the game, and is central to the offense, you think Reggie would have mentioned him. But he does mention Ron, despite all the wild trade speculation going on! I believe that Reggie may have a sense that the "changes" Rick was talking about involve Tinsley.
                "Look, it's up to me to put a team around ... Lance right now." —Kevin Pritchard press conference

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                • #23
                  Re: Montieth: Pacers need to upgrade point guard position

                  Jamaal has a poison pill provision and will be a base year player next year. I could see a trade to bring in a new starter but Jamaal will be here next year. He would be almost impossible to trade due to the base year status. It would be a very stupid move on the Pacers part if they trade him.


                  VA he was taken out after a Detroit foul not a foul by him. The bottom line is that we were in that game untill the second he took Tinsley out. You can say he made a stupid play all you want but we were in that game. We imediatly went in the ****ter when he was pulled. That was the dumbest coaching move of Ricks career.

                  He was playing injured yes he was not as quick as he had been. He tore a ligament in his foot that takes 6 to 9 months to heal. That happaned to my wife in High School and she is astounded he was able to come back so soon.

                  He came back early because we were not getting out of the 1st round. Remember we were toast. He came back and he won 2 games in the 2nd round for us. And without him we would not have won a single game aganst Detroit we would have been swept. We would not have even made the second round had he not come back.

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                  • #24
                    Re: Montieth: Pacers need to upgrade point guard position

                    Originally posted by Ragnar
                    He came back early because we were not getting out of the 1st round. Remember we were toast. He came back and he won 2 games in the 2nd round for us. And without him we would not have won a single game aganst Detroit we would have been swept. We would not have even made the second round had he not come back.
                    Exactly!
                    "Just look at the flowers ........ BANG" - Carol "The Walking Dead"

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                    • #25
                      Re: Montieth: Pacers need to upgrade point guard position

                      A Tinsley trade, if there were one, would almost certainly need to involve a team under the cap

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Re: Montieth: Pacers need to upgrade point guard position

                        Tinsley is good but that's only when the moon is aligned correctly.. and also when he wants to show up.

                        AJ is a decent backup but he needs to learn how to decide on what he's doing instead of holding the ball 12 plus seconds every time he brings it up court.

                        Time to stop hoping things will get better.. I think we need a player at PG that is consistent enough to help us get over that bridesmaid hump.

                        Someone that's an immediate threat.

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Re: Montieth: Pacers need to upgrade point guard position

                          Outside of making a run at Jason Kidd, I don't really think there's an available PG that is clearly better than Tinsley.

                          If we trade Tinsley, I want someone who plays better defense and shoots better thank Tinsley in return. Outside of using him to shoot up in the draft, I don't really know who'd that be.
                          You, Never? Did the Kenosha Kid?

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                          • #28
                            Re: Montieth: Pacers need to upgrade point guard position

                            Naming names...
                            What about the foreign PG that Bird has supposedly been following?

                            I remember someone commenting about him replacing AJ... and I replied "Maybe it isn't AJ they are looking to replace?"

                            I'm sure someone knows the name of the player I am talking about. I'm surprised someone hasn't already brought it up considering there have been recent reports and threads here about Bird's interest.

                            In 'speculation mode' doesn't this all kind of 'fit'?

                            -Bball
                            Nuntius was right for a while. I was wrong for a while. But ultimately I was right and Frank Vogel has been let go.

                            ------

                            "A player who makes a team great is more valuable than a great player. Losing yourself in the group, for the good of the group, that’s teamwork."

                            -John Wooden

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                            • #29
                              Re: Montieth: Pacers need to upgrade point guard position

                              This draft is supposed to be one of the deepest PG drafts in a while.

                              Maybe we are going to package Ron and Tinsley together for one great player, and try to snag a PG who drops too low in the draft?

                              Or, even more interesting... we could package JO and Tinsley together.

                              I freely admit I don't know how BYC works though, just wishful thinking here, really.
                              You, Never? Did the Kenosha Kid?

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Re: Montieth: Pacers need to upgrade point guard position

                                Originally posted by SoupIsGood
                                This draft is supposed to be one of the deepest PG drafts in a while.

                                Maybe we are going to package Ron and Tinsley together for one great player, and try to snag a PG who drops too low in the draft?

                                Or, even more interesting... we could package JO and Tinsley together.

                                I freely admit I don't know how BYC works though, just wishful thinking here, really.

                                I would be shocked... shocked... shocked... to see the Pacers get anyone but a veteran for the starting PG role or first off the bench.

                                -Bball
                                Nuntius was right for a while. I was wrong for a while. But ultimately I was right and Frank Vogel has been let go.

                                ------

                                "A player who makes a team great is more valuable than a great player. Losing yourself in the group, for the good of the group, that’s teamwork."

                                -John Wooden

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