Page 12 of 12 FirstFirst ... 289101112
Results 276 to 297 of 297

Thread: Kevin Pritchard ready to use aggressive approach on Indiana Pacers' revamp

  1. #276
    Whale Shepherd cdash's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    The Sprawl
    Age
    31
    Posts
    30,645

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: Kevin Pritchard ready to use aggressive approach on Indiana Pacers' revamp

    Quote Originally Posted by freddielewis14 View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    He does, but we can go into lux to re-sign him and only his hold counts against the cap.
    So assuming CJ opts out (he will), his cap hold is 120% of ~$4.6 million. That hold is on the books until we renounce him, he signs with another team, or he re-signs with us, at which point his new salary does count against the cap and the cap hold is wiped out. I'm 90% sure that's how cap holds work.

  2. #277
    --------- freddielewis14's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    indianapolis
    Posts
    6,599

    Default Re: Kevin Pritchard ready to use aggressive approach on Indiana Pacers' revamp

    Quote Originally Posted by cdash View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    So assuming CJ opts out (he will), his cap hold is 120% of ~$4.6 million. That hold is on the books until we renounce him, he signs with another team, or he re-signs with us, at which point his new salary does count against the cap and the cap hold is wiped out. I'm 90% sure that's how cap holds work.
    Correct. My point is the pathway to signing a max deal isn't about CJ, it's about Monta and Al. You stretch, buyout or trade those deals you can get a max guy. And at that point you're going to lux and need shooters and fill out team. So why wouldn't you keep CJ?

  3. #278
    2017-18 Starting PG? BlueNGold's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Location
    Indianapolis
    Posts
    22,738

    Default Re: Kevin Pritchard ready to use aggressive approach on Indiana Pacers' revamp

    All I know is that the Pacers need to stretch whatever they need to and make whatever moves they need to make to get Gordon Hayward short of sending Paul George out.
    Lance is finally home. Whether he becomes our starting PG or he's 6th man, he's getting big minutes and he's here to stay. #llortontnia

  4. The Following User Says Thank You to BlueNGold For This Useful Post:


  5. #279
    Whale Shepherd cdash's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    The Sprawl
    Age
    31
    Posts
    30,645

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: Kevin Pritchard ready to use aggressive approach on Indiana Pacers' revamp

    Quote Originally Posted by freddielewis14 View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Correct. My point is the pathway to signing a max deal isn't about CJ, it's about Monta and Al. You stretch, buyout or trade those deals you can get a max guy. And at that point you're going to lux and need shooters and fill out team. So why wouldn't you keep CJ?
    If you have to stretch and trade guys and all that to create max space (would still be close, iirc), then you probably renounce CJ and when you do that, you can no longer go over the cap to re-sign him.

    Longshot scenario either way. Unless Hayward's camp is sending out some real, "Gordon wants to come home" signals before free agency, putting your chips in that basket is not very smart imo.

  6. The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to cdash For This Useful Post:


  7. #280
    --------- freddielewis14's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    indianapolis
    Posts
    6,599

    Default Re: Kevin Pritchard ready to use aggressive approach on Indiana Pacers' revamp

    Quote Originally Posted by cdash View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    If you have to stretch and trade guys and all that to create max space (would still be close, iirc), then you probably renounce CJ and when you do that, you can no longer go over the cap to re-sign him.

    Longshot scenario either way. Unless Hayward's camp is sending out some real, "Gordon wants to come home" signals before free agency, putting your chips in that basket is not very smart imo.
    No, it's close if you ONLY stretch Al and get rid of everyone not guaranteed (Monta still on books). If you stretch,buyout or trade contracts (w/o taking much back) BOTH Monta and Al you are comfortably there.

    I said in another thread, but if Simon is willing to spend he can make the space pretty easy w/o killing us long term.

  8. #281
    Member Grimp's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Posts
    10,190

    Default Re: Kevin Pritchard ready to use aggressive approach on Indiana Pacers' revamp

    I honestly don't think trading Al and Monta will be THAT hard. The way their contracts are structured, Monta is also signed under the old CBA. Both players are not perpetually injured, or off the court problems. It won't be super easy, but like I mentioned before. We moved Roy Hibbert and his 1-year $15 mil in a trade one Summer and didn't have to take back any salary. Roy who was slow, couldn't score in the post as well as he used to, and was having mental/confidence issues.

  9. #282
    Member CableKC's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    San Jose, CA ( 1123, 6536, 5321 )
    Age
    44
    Posts
    32,054

    Sports Logo

    Default Re: Kevin Pritchard ready to use aggressive approach on Indiana Pacers' revamp

    Quote Originally Posted by freddielewis14 View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Say you get rid of Monta and Al and you get Hayward, why would you then get rid of CJ Miles? You have to fill out your bench with shooters and you won't get a better player for CJ caphold. Let alone 2 players!

    If you're keeping PG, next year is very important. Landing a big FA is reason to keep CJ not let him go.
    Irrelevant to me.... I have ZERO interest in retaining CJ. I'd use whatever Salary Cap space to retain Teague...not CJ.
    Ash from Army of Darkness: Good...Bad...I'm the guy with the gun.

  10. The Following User Says Thank You to CableKC For This Useful Post:


  11. #283
    Member CableKC's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    San Jose, CA ( 1123, 6536, 5321 )
    Age
    44
    Posts
    32,054

    Sports Logo

    Default Re: Kevin Pritchard ready to use aggressive approach on Indiana Pacers' revamp

    Quote Originally Posted by docpaul View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    I'm personally not saying to avoid resigning him. I'm saying that he's far from a slam dunk foundation player and given that the future strategy around PG and the team is in the air, many people are hesitant to overpay unless he fits like a true puzzle piece into the overall team strategy.

    Having him locked in for four years without a complementary backcourt player is staring intently at mediocrity for the next 4-5 years.
    I get that many here don't want to overpay him.....but let's set that aside for now.

    Someone is going to have to explain to me how a 28 year old Starting quality PG ( may not be elite but considered slightly above average ) that has played 4 out of every 5 games in his career while averaging 15 ppg / 7 apg last season shouldn't even be considered a foundational Starting piece of a Non-Elite Team like the Pacers. I know his defense sucks......but ( as you suggest ) all we need to do is find a quality defensive Wing that is somewhat capable of hitting a 3pt shot and an actual defensive scheme....and you can minimize his short comings.

    What I don't understand is that if we are at the point where we are going to go "All In" with PG13 ( assuming he gets the Super MAX ) why Teague shouldn't be considered an option. PG13 signing the Super Extension means that we have to use every cent that we can spend to maximize this talent on this roster. CJ and Teague are the only 2 quality Players that we can re-sign without using a penny of the Salary Cap ( which should go towards making a run at a FA ). I get back to what I said before....Teague isn't a CP3 or even a Kyle Lowry.....but he's a Starting quality PG that is young, a capable scorer and a decent floor general. That is what we need to fill out the roster while surrounding as much talent as possible within the constraints of the Salary Cap. Teague fits that much better than anyone else that we can get via Free Agency.

    Quote Originally Posted by docpaul View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    They will hold on signing him until they understand what other pieces they get. That's the right strategy, IMO.
    I'd assume that if some team comes in and offers him a contract that you'd just let him go? Teague is a UFA....he doesn't have to sit around and wait for the Pacers to match his contract or decide what to do with the offer.

    Quote Originally Posted by docpaul View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    If he was a rookie or on a contract like Monta's, we wouldn't be having this conversation. Most would gladly plug him into the starting lineup and figure out who to complement him with.
    Very few Players in today's NBA that is in his prime would be under a Monta Like contract....so it's moot. You have to operate under the current situation....and the reality is that talent like Teague ( like it or not...an asset ) is going to command a larger contract that is based off of the Market value for such a Player.

    Quote Originally Posted by docpaul View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    All of my comments are with the undercurrent of belief that we are teetering very close to a full on rebuild.
    You are right....there is a possiblity that we will go into a full rebuild mode.....if PG13 isn't staying. But if PG13 is staying....then we aren't going into a full Rebuild mode....it's "All In" mode....which makes even more sense to re-sign Teague ( no CJ...screw CJ and his streaky shot ). Of course, we will know in 3 days.....so we can leave this question for another couple of days.

    Quote Originally Posted by docpaul View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    For example, George Hill has an awakening and suddenly wants to come back to Indy to close out his career on a 3 year deal? Then by all means, sign Teague and don't look back!
    GH isn't walking through that door again. I am fairly certain that GH will have some revelation that he wants to come home and play in Indy with Lance in the backcourt rotation with him so that he can once again setup real estate at the 3pt line again. I am not holding out hope that GH is coming back....especially with the change in the FO and Nate as the Coach.
    Ash from Army of Darkness: Good...Bad...I'm the guy with the gun.

  12. The Following User Says Thank You to CableKC For This Useful Post:


  13. #284
    Member CableKC's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    San Jose, CA ( 1123, 6536, 5321 )
    Age
    44
    Posts
    32,054

    Sports Logo

    Default Re: Kevin Pritchard ready to use aggressive approach on Indiana Pacers' revamp

    Quote Originally Posted by ksuttonjr76 View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Am I missing something? I thought Miles had a player option on his contract?
    Quote Originally Posted by Tom White View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    The thought is, he may test being a FA if he thinks he can get more money.
    Yeah....a 3pt shooting Wing that hit 41% of his shots last season while being oft-injured? Some Team is going to offer him a 3 or 4 year deal just because of that. 3pt shooting is at a premium.
    Ash from Army of Darkness: Good...Bad...I'm the guy with the gun.

  14. #285
    Member CableKC's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    San Jose, CA ( 1123, 6536, 5321 )
    Age
    44
    Posts
    32,054

    Sports Logo

    Default Re: Kevin Pritchard ready to use aggressive approach on Indiana Pacers' revamp

    Quote Originally Posted by Ace E.Anderson View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Literally NONE of those things are going to happen. Also I'm on the other end of the spectrum.

    There are so many good PGs out there, theres no reason to overpay a mid tier guy Unless:

    1. He fits PERFECTLY with the roster
    2. He's young enough to have some untapped potential
    3. You're in a spot to contend RIGHT now.

    Now with option 3, I feel that the proof has to already be in the pudding that a the guy would be a main cog on said team, thus warranting not being replaced.

    Atlanta played it brilliantly. They had a few decent to very good runs with Teague at the helm. But they weren't going anywhere with him so instead of eventually overpaying him, they traded him for a draft pick.

    Luckily for them, they had a PG waiting in the wings and their production at the position has stayed about the same give or take, while gaining a very good asset for cheap for the best several years.
    I have no clue what our Salary Cap situation is. Can someone tell me how much $$$ we can use to make an offer at a Non-Pacers FA if we renounce either Teague or CJ ( while keeping the other ) and if we decide to renounce both?

    What good PGs are out there that we can sign with the available Salary Cap Space that we have via FA or trade for without losing any real assets?
    Last edited by CableKC; 05-16-2017 at 01:30 AM.
    Ash from Army of Darkness: Good...Bad...I'm the guy with the gun.

  15. #286
    Member CableKC's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    San Jose, CA ( 1123, 6536, 5321 )
    Age
    44
    Posts
    32,054

    Sports Logo

    Default Re: Kevin Pritchard ready to use aggressive approach on Indiana Pacers' revamp

    Quote Originally Posted by freddielewis14 View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    I think everyone agrees you only keep Teague if you're a contender. Heck, that's the only way you keep PG.
    I don't agree with that. If PG13 signs the SuperMAX Extension....then I'm all for re-signing Teague. But I may change my answer once we find out if PG13 is going to get the Super MAX or not.
    Ash from Army of Darkness: Good...Bad...I'm the guy with the gun.

  16. #287
    Member CableKC's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    San Jose, CA ( 1123, 6536, 5321 )
    Age
    44
    Posts
    32,054

    Sports Logo

    Default Re: Kevin Pritchard ready to use aggressive approach on Indiana Pacers' revamp

    Quote Originally Posted by freddielewis14 View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    No, it's close if you ONLY stretch Al and get rid of everyone not guaranteed (Monta still on books). If you stretch,buyout or trade contracts (w/o taking much back) BOTH Monta and Al you are comfortably there.

    I said in another thread, but if Simon is willing to spend he can make the space pretty easy w/o killing us long term.
    What do you mean "willing to spend"? The only way that we will be able to trade either Monta and/or AlJeff WITHOUT taking back any salary is by including sweetner like the 1st round pick...which will kill us for the long term. As someone said before ( forgot who ), if we are going this route WE MUST have some rookie Salaries on the books that are playing rotational minutes. We should not be trade away firsts to do that.

    I will nominate KP as the Executive of the Year if he is able to dump BOTH Monta and AlJeff while getting back nothing AND not trading away any future 1st round picks.
    Ash from Army of Darkness: Good...Bad...I'm the guy with the gun.

  17. #288
    Member CableKC's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    San Jose, CA ( 1123, 6536, 5321 )
    Age
    44
    Posts
    32,054

    Sports Logo

    Default Re: Kevin Pritchard ready to use aggressive approach on Indiana Pacers' revamp

    Quote Originally Posted by Grimp View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    I honestly don't think trading Al and Monta will be THAT hard. The way their contracts are structured, Monta is also signed under the old CBA. Both players are not perpetually injured, or off the court problems. It won't be super easy, but like I mentioned before. We moved Roy Hibbert and his 1-year $15 mil in a trade one Summer and didn't have to take back any salary. Roy who was slow, couldn't score in the post as well as he used to, and was having mental/confidence issues.
    I'm not as optimistic as you are.......I think that if a Team has $9.7 mil to $22 mil in Cap Space to burn....they'd use it to sign a quality FA.
    Ash from Army of Darkness: Good...Bad...I'm the guy with the gun.

  18. #289
    Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Brown County, Indiana
    Posts
    5,340

    Default Re: Kevin Pritchard ready to use aggressive approach on Indiana Pacers' revamp

    Quote Originally Posted by CableKC View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Someone is going to have to explain to me how a 28 year old Starting quality PG ( may not be elite but considered slightly above average ) that has played 4 out of every 5 games in his career while averaging 15 ppg / 7 apg last season shouldn't even be considered a foundational Starting piece of a Non-Elite Team like the Pacers.
    It is BECAUSE he plays for the Pacers. If he were still playing for another team, a lot of people would be wishing he were on the Pacers. "Man, if we could just get a point guard like Teague." It is the old "the grass is always greener" syndrome. In some people's eyes, a player becomes less desirable the moment he puts on a Pacers uniform, and they start to try to figure out a way for the team to get rid of him.


    I'd assume that if some team comes in and offers him a contract that you'd just let him go? Teague is a UFA....he doesn't have to sit around and wait for the Pacers to match his contract or decide what to do with the offer.
    Given how much he wanted to play for this team, and given that he appears to be a team player in all senses of the term, I think he and the Pacers could come to an understanding about the timing of his signing.

    He and the team go ahead and negotiate a contract, and as a showing of good faith they both agree not to sign it UNTIL the team has a chance to use the available cap space to their best advantage. It would take a level of trust on both sides, but I can see it happening.

  19. The Following 6 Users Say Thank You to Tom White For This Useful Post:


  20. #290
    Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Brown County, Indiana
    Posts
    5,340

    Default Re: Kevin Pritchard ready to use aggressive approach on Indiana Pacers' revamp

    Quote Originally Posted by CableKC View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Yeah....a 3pt shooting Wing that hit 41% of his shots last season while being oft-injured? Some Team is going to offer him a 3 or 4 year deal just because of that. 3pt shooting is at a premium.
    Oh, I know what you are saying, believe me. But that may not be what he is thinking.

  21. #291
    Running with the Big Boys BillS's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Danberry
    Age
    57
    Posts
    16,627

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: Kevin Pritchard ready to use aggressive approach on Indiana Pacers' revamp

    Quote Originally Posted by Tom White View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    It is BECAUSE he plays for the Pacers. If he were still playing for another team, a lot of people would be wishing he were on the Pacers. "Man, if we could just get a point guard like Teague." It is the old "the grass is always greener" syndrome. In some people's eyes, a player becomes less desirable the moment he puts on a Pacers uniform, and they start to try to figure out a way for the team to get rid of him.
    This 1000 times. We were all about the "need a pure point guard, Teague is perfect, everyone else is too much of a combo" at the end of last season, now it's all "Teague isn't really very good, pure PGs are a dime a dozen so we can get a comparable player for really cheap, or we could hand over the reins to a combo guard."
    BillS

    A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush.
    Or throw in a first-round pick and flip it for a max-level point guard...

  22. The Following 9 Users Say Thank You to BillS For This Useful Post:


  23. #292
    Member naptownmenace's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Cincinnati, Ohio
    Posts
    4,823
    Mood

    Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: Kevin Pritchard ready to use aggressive approach on Indiana Pacers' revamp

    The Teague situation is a problem for Pritchard. Not know how much he is going to cost exactly is going to make it difficult to determine how much more money they'll have to spend in FA. If his agent knows anything, he's going to point to that Mike Conley deal and say that's what you have to pay.

    Pritch is going to have to purge the salaries of Ellis and Jefferson through trades for 2nd round picks. If he can't do that, then there's not much hope in putting together a serious team that can compete for a championship.

  24. #293
    Member Ace E.Anderson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Indiana
    Posts
    16,397

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: Kevin Pritchard ready to use aggressive approach on Indiana Pacers' revamp

    Quote Originally Posted by BillS View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    This 1000 times. We were all about the "need a pure point guard, Teague is perfect, everyone else is too much of a combo" at the end of last season, now it's all "Teague isn't really very good, pure PGs are a dime a dozen so we can get a comparable player for really cheap, or we could hand over the reins to a combo guard."
    Is that why Pritchard came off a bit apprehensive when it came to discussing re-signing Jeff?

    Now obviously you dont want to negotiate through the press, but when a guy is your "answer" at a position you tend to be a little more open regarding the possibility of signing him to a new deal.

  25. #294
    2017-18 Starting PG? BlueNGold's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Location
    Indianapolis
    Posts
    22,738

    Default Re: Kevin Pritchard ready to use aggressive approach on Indiana Pacers' revamp

    Quote Originally Posted by Ace E.Anderson View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Is that why Pritchard came off a bit apprehensive when it came to discussing re-signing Jeff?

    Now obviously you dont want to negotiate through the press, but when a guy is your "answer" at a position you tend to be a little more open regarding the possibility of signing him to a new deal.
    He came off as apprehensive because he wants a bigger team and he knows the Pacers don't have the right players to pair with Teague...and getting those players is more difficult than getting better size. Also, and as you would expect from me, he already has Lance so he doesn't really need another starting PG.
    Lance is finally home. Whether he becomes our starting PG or he's 6th man, he's getting big minutes and he's here to stay. #llortontnia

  26. #295
    Member owl's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Posts
    6,824

    Default Re: Kevin Pritchard ready to use aggressive approach on Indiana Pacers' revamp

    Quote Originally Posted by BlueNGold View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    He came off as apprehensive because he wants a bigger team and he knows the Pacers don't have the right players to pair with Teague...and getting those players is more difficult than getting better size. Also, and as you would expect from me, he already has Lance so he doesn't really need another starting PG.
    The problem is if Lance becomes the new starting point you end up with a massive hole at back up point. Monta is not the answer. Joe Young, why is he still on the team?
    {o,o}
    |)__)
    -"-"-

  27. #296

    Default Re: Kevin Pritchard ready to use aggressive approach on Indiana Pacers' revamp

    Quote Originally Posted by owl View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    The problem is if Lance becomes the new starting point you end up with a massive hole at back up point. Monta is not the answer. Joe Young, why is he still on the team?
    Just draft Juwan Evans. At least he can defend and is aggressive despite his size.

  28. #297
    2017-18 Starting PG? BlueNGold's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Location
    Indianapolis
    Posts
    22,738

    Default Re: Kevin Pritchard ready to use aggressive approach on Indiana Pacers' revamp

    Quote Originally Posted by owl View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    The problem is if Lance becomes the new starting point you end up with a massive hole at back up point. Monta is not the answer. Joe Young, why is he still on the team?
    I am all for trading Monta, but if he's on the team he will be playing PG...and he's not going to start.
    Lance is finally home. Whether he becomes our starting PG or he's 6th man, he's getting big minutes and he's here to stay. #llortontnia

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •