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Thread: 2017 Free Agent Targets

  1. #151
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    Default Re: 2017 Free Agent Targets

    Quote Originally Posted by Pacersalltheway10 View Post
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    A team at or above the salary cap may not be allowed to renegotiate a contract. They can renegotiate even if they're just $1 million under the cap so they can still be able to use their extra cap space of around $22.27 million which includes the draft picks and Teague's cap hold. So to be able to offer a max contract, still only one of Al Jefferson or Monta needs to be dumped (this is assuming Stuckey, Miles, and Allen are all let go).

    The order would be
    1.) Use available cap space to sign free agents
    2.) Save a fraction of space to stay below the cap and renegotiate Paul George's contract
    3.) Sign Jeff Teague to a new contract

    Also, assuming the Pacers keep both draft picks and do not waive any non-guaranteed players, there would need to be only one roster spot filled to meet the new league minimum of 14 players.
    I believe Stuckey has a player option so we can't just let him go. I expect for CJ to opt out but I doubt that Stuckey would.
    Larry Bird qouted March 25th. 2015:

    Bird: I wanted to keep our group together because in the summer, if David and Roy opt out, we're back to zero, really. We don't have that much, so you leave your options open. If we did make a trade, I didn't want to take on a lot of contracts -- because that's what usually happens. Plus, I liked my guys. They're playing well. If we keep the core together and Paul comes back healthy, we'll be right back to where we were.

  2. #152
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    Default Re: 2017 Free Agent Targets

    Quote Originally Posted by Pacerized View Post
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    I believe Stuckey has a player option so we can't just let him go. I expect for CJ to opt out but I doubt that Stuckey would.
    CJ and Stuckey have an ETO in their contracts. Ultimately, the front office can decide to terminate both players contract prior to the draft and we gain that cap space. Stuckey it has been said has that option in his deal, while others say he doesn't. CJ Miles I know for certain, has that option in his contract.

  3. #153

    Default Re: 2017 Free Agent Targets

    We need to get Hayward and a defensive center and go back to smash mouth basketball.

  4. #154
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    Default Re: 2017 Free Agent Targets

    Quote Originally Posted by Grimp View Post
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    CJ and Stuckey have an ETO in their contracts. Ultimately, the front office can decide to terminate both players contract prior to the draft and we gain that cap space. Stuckey it has been said has that option in his deal, while others say he doesn't. CJ Miles I know for certain, has that option in his contract.
    Grimp, no. An ETO means the player can opt out of the final year of their contracts and enter free agency. The front office can't do **** all about it.

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  6. #155
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    Default Re: 2017 Free Agent Targets

    Quote Originally Posted by cdash View Post
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    Grimp, no. An ETO means the player can opt out of the final year of their contracts and enter free agency. The front office can't do **** all about it.
    http://www.basketballinsiders.com/in...s-team-salary/


    ^ According to basketball insiders it says the following about CJ's contract:

    Player option deadline 6/20/17 or two days after team completes season (playoffs). But no later than 6/29/17. Team can waive Miles before he executes the option.

    This means if we're going to let CJ go we have to decide that before the draft. We have until June 29th. Now some Pacers writers have said Stuckey has the same clause in his contract. But it is not listed on the site as so. Simply says we have Stuckey's full bird rights.

  7. #156
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    Default Re: 2017 Free Agent Targets

    CJ Miles is going to opt out for sure. Stuckey is the tricky one.

    Btw, that's not an ETO. An ETO is at the player's option, not the team's. It sounds like the last year of CJ's deal is unguaranteed, along with a player option for CJ - in effect, mutual opt outs. Sadly it doesn't say the same about Stuckey.

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    Default Re: 2017 Free Agent Targets

    Quote Originally Posted by wintermute View Post
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    CJ Miles is going to opt out for sure. Stuckey is the tricky one.

    Btw, that's not an ETO. An ETO is at the player's option, not the team's. It sounds like the last year of CJ's deal is unguaranteed, along with a player option for CJ - in effect, mutual opt outs. Sadly it doesn't say the same about Stuckey.
    Hopefully in the year end player interviews, Bird will tell Stuckey that if he opts in there is a good chance he will be traded. Maybe that will influence Stuckey to opt out.

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    Default Re: 2017 Free Agent Targets

    Quote Originally Posted by sav View Post
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    Hopefully in the year end player interviews, Bird will tell Stuckey that if he opts in there is a good chance he will be traded. Maybe that will influence Stuckey to opt out.
    If he opts in the perfect trade is Stuckey and our 2nd round pick (2017) to Portland for Alan Crabbe and their #22 pick. Portland dumps Crabbe's contract plus they don't have to pay 3 1st round picks this season. Portland would still have the #10 and #27 pick in 2017. But they'd be free of the #22 (a guaranteed contract) and Crabbe's $54 million over the next 3 years. Taking back just $7 mil and 1 year of Rodney.

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    Default Re: 2017 Free Agent Targets

    Because GRIII's contract is a 3 year agreement, he is also eligible for an extension starting on July 25 which is the second anniversary of his last signing. However, the only way an extension for him would happen is if PG gets traded because there'd be no space by then to renegotiate his contract.

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    Default Re: 2017 Free Agent Targets

    Quote Originally Posted by Grimp View Post
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    If he opts in the perfect trade is Stuckey and our 2nd round pick (2017) to Portland for Alan Crabbe and their #22 pick. Portland dumps Crabbe's contract plus they don't have to pay 3 1st round picks this season. Portland would still have the #10 and #27 pick in 2017. But they'd be free of the #22 (a guaranteed contract) and Crabbe's $54 million over the next 3 years. Taking back just $7 mil and 1 year of Rodney.
    Paying 3 first round picks would be sooo awful. You have a trade geared towards them saving money, then immediately stomp on that by "saving" them from having three more ultra value contracts, for a team that's in the midst of a mini rebuild. C'mon man save the goofiness for the trade thread.

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    Default Re: 2017 Free Agent Targets

    Quote Originally Posted by Ichi View Post
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    Paying 3 first round picks would be sooo awful. You have a trade geared towards them saving money, then immediately stomp on that by "saving" them from having three more ultra value contracts, for a team that's in the midst of a mini rebuild. C'mon man save the goofiness for the trade thread.
    Assuming Portland waives the non guaranteed contracts of Ezeli, Connaughton, and Quarterman and replace them with all 3 first round picks, they would still be $16,022,975 over the luxury tax. Grimp's proposed trade would save them $13,820,000. The trade would be unlikely because it would still leave them about $2.2 million over the luxury tax. While they'd lose a 1st round pick, they'd shed the 3rd largest contract on their roster. It depends on how much they want to try to gain future cap flexibility. Definitely not a ridiculous idea but they may be too much in the hole to go through with such a trade.

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    Default Re: 2017 Free Agent Targets

    I just did a really quick run through of what the future team salary would look like if they do the moves I'd expect them to do. In 2019-2020 the Pacers would be ~$7 million over the cap with only 8 or 9 guaranteed contracts (PG max, Teague at $20 mil, Turner at $20 mil, GRIII at $10 mil, whatever free agents they sign this off season at ~$20 mil combined, and 3 first round picks from now until then. Even if Young and Ellis opt out next season, there would still be only a fraction of cap space left to use. Now I see why Simon wanted to explore options about PG's suitors. Herb's going to have to pay the luxury tax sometime in the next few seasons for sure. Either hit some gems in the draft or pair PG with another superstar or else it's looking mediocre for years.

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    Default Re: 2017 Free Agent Targets

    Today my FA target would be Serge Ibaka...but it changes from day to day.

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    Default Re: 2017 Free Agent Targets

    Quote Originally Posted by Pacersalltheway10 View Post
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    Assuming Portland waives the non guaranteed contracts of Ezeli, Connaughton, and Quarterman and replace them with all 3 first round picks, they would still be $16,022,975 over the luxury tax. Grimp's proposed trade would save them $13,820,000. The trade would be unlikely because it would still leave them about $2.2 million over the luxury tax. While they'd lose a 1st round pick, they'd shed the 3rd largest contract on their roster. It depends on how much they want to try to gain future cap flexibility. Definitely not a ridiculous idea but they may be too much in the hole to go through with such a trade.


    Which is where Ed Davis comes in. He was tied to Pacer rumors during the trade deadline. I think the only Blazer we'd be interested in besides Crabbe would be Davis or Harkless.

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    Default Re: 2017 Free Agent Targets

    Quote Originally Posted by sav View Post
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    Today my FA target would be Serge Ibaka...but it changes from day to day.
    I'd like to sign him but he shares an agent with Kyle Lowry. You know how that goes. Unless Lowry bolts, I doubt Ibaka leaves.

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    Default Re: 2017 Free Agent Targets

    I would go all-in on Hayward. Significant talent at a position of need (kinda), and insurance if PG decides to bolt anyway.
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    Default Re: 2017 Free Agent Targets

    I think we could make a trade at the draft. The Suns are projected to pick PG Lonzo Ball with the 2nd pick. The Blazers are projected to pick SG Malik Monk with the 10th pick. The Suns have Bledose and Knight already on their roster. The Blazers have Crabbe and McCollum. Things will get very crowded at the PG position for Phoenix and the SG position for Portland if they pick the players most mock drafts have them choosing. We could trade for Bledsoe or Knight and Crabbe.

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    Default Re: 2017 Free Agent Targets

    Quote Originally Posted by Grimp View Post
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    I think we could make a trade at the draft. The Suns are projected to pick PG Lonzo Ball with the 2nd pick. The Blazers are projected to pick SG Malik Monk with the 10th pick. The Suns have Bledose and Knight already on their roster. The Blazers have Crabbe and McCollum. Things will get very crowded at the PG position for Phoenix and the SG position for Portland if they pick the players most mock drafts have them choosing. We could trade for Bledsoe or Knight and Crabbe.
    You can get Knight for a bag of chips. But why add another undersized Guard to the rotation with a $13+ mil a year guaranteed contract for the next 3 seasons?

    I'd rather keep Monta. Big PASS on Knight.
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    Default Re: 2017 Free Agent Targets

    Quote Originally Posted by CableKC View Post
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    You can get Knight for a bag of chips. But why add another undersized Guard to the rotation with a $13+ mil a year guaranteed contract for the next 3 seasons?

    I'd rather keep Monta. Big PASS on Knight.

    Knight's more of a shooter than Monta is. Knight's game is a better fit with the floor spacing era we're in now. If you look at their career trajectory's? Knight's been more apt to look for the 3 pt shot than Ellis. As our backup point guard, he'd be a better fit right now. When the ball swings, Knight will take the 3-pt shot as opposed to Ellis ball-faking and driving. It's really more about fit.

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    Default Re: 2017 Free Agent Targets

    Quote Originally Posted by Shade View Post
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    I would go all-in on Hayward. Significant talent at a position of need (kinda), and insurance if PG decides to bolt anyway.
    I would love Hayward as a Pacer. I expect Boston to make a run at him though.

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    Default Re: 2017 Free Agent Targets

    Quote Originally Posted by Handoverfist View Post
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    I would love Hayward as a Pacer. I expect Boston to make a run at him though.
    I'd be shocked if he left Utah, but yeah, Hayward would change everything for this team.

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    Default Re: 2017 Free Agent Targets

    Quote Originally Posted by Handoverfist View Post
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    I would love Hayward as a Pacer. I expect Boston to make a run at him though.
    He won't get many shots in Boston though. IT dominates the ball. Bradley needs his shots. Horford, Crowder, Brown, Smart, also their pick this Summer as well. In Indiana... the offense on the perimeter will run through him and Paul. Teague can score but prefers to assist most of the time. Although he can put together stretches where he averages 20 pts and 10 assists. It's not his thing most of the time. Also he has family here in Indy so I imagine getting to see family and play in your home town would take preference over reuniting with your college coach. Not to mention Boston has no real superstar player like we do.

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    Default Re: 2017 Free Agent Targets

    Quote Originally Posted by cdash View Post
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    I'd be shocked if he left Utah, but yeah, Hayward would change everything for this team.
    Utah is a good team now but George Hill is aging and this toe injury is become a chronic problem. Could affect what he gets this Summer. Favors could be moved to free up money to sign Hayward and Hill. Not sure how they'd replace him. Utah is not really a destination. Indy is more of a destination than Utah. Much more. Utah also isn't a western conference powerhouse team. They've had a good season, but is there a future there for that team in a conference dominated by GSW, SAS, and HOU? Not to mention the Clippers and now Boogie/Brow in New Orleans? Hayward's been there a long time and they never made the playoffs until perhaps this season. Him leaving Utah is not set in stone?

    But I believe even with an embarrassing loss in the 1st or 2nd round this post-season? Blake Griffin has a higher probability of remaining with the Clippers than Hayward does of remaining with the Jazz even if they were to advance to the 2nd round. I've never felt Hayward was 'crazy' about Utah. I've always felt he was just being a professional by playing out his extension in SLC. But if the offer is high enough and the situation is good, I think he bolts. Blake could too but remember Blake would be leaving behind a hall of fame point guard who's only 31, and a borderline elite center in DeAndre Jordan. Not to mention a hall of fame coach in Doc Rivers.
    Last edited by Grimp; 03-08-2017 at 06:22 PM.

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    Default Re: 2017 Free Agent Targets

    Quote Originally Posted by Grimp View Post
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    He won't get many shots in Boston though. IT dominates the ball. Bradley needs his shots. Horford, Crowder, Brown, Smart, also their pick this Summer as well. In Indiana... the offense on the perimeter will run through him and Paul. Teague can score but prefers to assist most of the time. Although he can put together stretches where he averages 20 pts and 10 assists. It's not his thing most of the time. Also he has family here in Indy so I imagine getting to see family and play in your home town would take preference over reuniting with your college coach. Not to mention Boston has no real superstar player like we do.
    Isaiah Thomas is no slouch.

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    Default Re: 2017 Free Agent Targets

    Quote Originally Posted by Handoverfist View Post
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    Isaiah Thomas is no slouch.
    Absolutely not. But Jeff Teague is more of a passer with the ability to score. Teague can put up 12 in a quarter and finish the game with 16 and 11 and be content. Thomas has to drop above 20 for Boston to have a chance. Even then he just doesn't stop. It was the same problem in Sacramento. He dominates the ball and for a scorer looking at free agency, he needs to know he's gonna get the ball in the offense. Beyond that, Bradley is still unhappy about his contract and then he'd be told to come off the bench for Hayward.

    Boston has talent, this is true. But adding Hayward plus their top 3 pick this Summer? That's two more people who need the ball from a point guard who prefers to score the ball. On top of a team that already has a lot of players who need the ball. You can build a team with many scorers in the NBA. But your point guard has to be a willing passer. He has to be content with averaging 10 and 10 a night. IT is not one of those guys.

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