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Thread: Political News and Policies

  1. #1426
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    Default Re: Political News and Policies

    Quote Originally Posted by Kid Minneapolis View Post
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    Ehhhhh.... Comparing individuals to companies doesnt work. Companies and industry lobbyists not only lobby and do under-the table crap with legislators to get sneaky stuff passed through the small print in bills to get further tax breaks that benefit them specifically, they then set up off-shore junk to avoid paying anything at all, a few of many loops.

    So while Joe Schmoes like you and I and Bernie are scraping to use our tax breaks to save 10% on our relatively meager incomes, corporations are dodging on millions upon millions of taxable revenue.
    Which would make sense if Bernie only railed against corps taking tax cuts. But he doesn't, he continually criticizes both corps and individuals for taking loopholes.

    This is a guy who, by his own released tax information, paid 13.5% in taxes in 2015.

    Let me repeat that. This is a guy who paid 13.5%.http://thehill.com/policy/finance/do...derss-tax-rate

    That's a lower effective tax rate than I pay, and I make no where near the $175,000 that he does.

    Bernie Sanders is all for making everyone, corps and individuals, pay their "fair share" as he takes advantage of every loophole he can find.

    Here is Bernie talking about Mitt Romney and his 47% comment.
    http://www.politicususa.com/2012/09/...7-percent.html

    Mitt Romney released his taxes and showed he paid 30% in Federal taxes.
    https://www.forbes.com/sites/charles...-income-taxes/

    So you're objecting to me calling Bernie a massive hypocrite on taxes while Bernie attacks a man who pays 30% for taking loopholes while Bernie paid 13.5% when they're in the same tax bracket......

    Good one.

    And thanks for proving my point about how Bernie skips out of his fair share and how he's defended for it. I guess it's good to be a tax cheat as long as you have a D behind your name.
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    Default Re: Political News and Policies

    https://youtu.be/JdiYPgN_EbA


    He argues that a 90% tax rate isn't too high while he pays 13.5%!!!!

    That alone should disqualify him from having any ground whatsoever to stand on when talking tax policy. To try and argue that businesses and individuals are different, when he thinks both pay to little because of "loopholes" is f'ing hilarious.
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    Default Re: Political News and Policies

    Quote Originally Posted by Since86 View Post
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    Which would make sense if Bernie only railed against corps taking tax cuts. But he doesn't, he continually criticizes both corps and individuals for taking loopholes.

    This is a guy who, by his own released tax information, paid 13.5% in taxes in 2015.

    Let me repeat that. This is a guy who paid 13.5%.http://thehill.com/policy/finance/do...derss-tax-rate

    That's a lower effective tax rate than I pay, and I make no where near the $175,000 that he does.

    Bernie Sanders is all for making everyone, corps and individuals, pay their "fair share" as he takes advantage of every loophole he can find.

    Here is Bernie talking about Mitt Romney and his 47% comment.
    http://www.politicususa.com/2012/09/...7-percent.html

    Mitt Romney released his taxes and showed he paid 30% in Federal taxes.
    https://www.forbes.com/sites/charles...-income-taxes/

    So you're objecting to me calling Bernie a massive hypocrite on taxes while Bernie attacks a man who pays 30% for taking loopholes while Bernie paid 13.5% when they're in the same tax bracket......

    Good one.

    And thanks for proving my point about how Bernie skips out of his fair share and how he's defended for it. I guess it's good to be a tax cheat as long as you have a D behind your name.
    But you were comparing individuals to corporations. That's what I was talking about. You can't compare those. And why do you fault people for taking advantage of tax breaks - you do it, I do it, we all do it. It's part of tax code.

    That said I haven't dove into Bernie's tax statement so I don't know how he got 13 and a half percent but if it was legit then what's the beef?
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    Default Re: Political News and Policies

    Quote Originally Posted by graphic-er View Post
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    I think Bernie is correct that corporate tax cuts do not grow jobs. Job growth is largely dependent on increased demand. Companies might take that tax cut and reinvest in new technologies, which would create demand for other companies. But doesn't mean the other company would need to hire more workers to full fill that demand.

    Very dubious for GOP to ascribe corporate tax cuts as the economic panacea.


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    Tax cuts can, and do, create job growth. The problem with the argument is that it's argued that it's viewed as an automatic growth.

    Allowing businesses to keep more of their own money allows them to reinvest it how they fit. Do they always reinvest into the company? No. But every dollar spent in taxes is a dollar that cannot be reinvested. That is a fact that will never change.
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    Default Re: Political News and Policies

    Quote Originally Posted by Kid Minneapolis View Post
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    But you were comparing individuals to corporations. That's what I was talking about. You can't compare those. And why do you fault people for taking advantage of tax breaks - you do it, I do it, we all do it. It's part of tax code.

    That said I haven't dove into Bernie's tax statement so I don't know how he got 13 and a half percent but if it was legit then what's the beef?
    Again, Bernie continually lumps them together. So I am.

    And I have absolutely no beef with anyone keeping as much of their own money as possible. The problem is the blatant hypocrisy of Bernie that gets ignored in order to prop up his stupid, outlandish ideas.
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    Default Re: Political News and Policies

    Quote Originally Posted by Since86 View Post
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    Tax cuts can, and do, create job growth. The problem with the argument is that it's argued that it's viewed as an automatic growth.

    Allowing businesses to keep more of their own money allows them to reinvest it how they fit. Do they always reinvest into the company? No. But every dollar spent in taxes is a dollar that cannot be reinvested. That is a fact that will never change.

    The reinvesting thing is such bs is not even funny, there is a reason why there are billions of dollars stuck out of the country because this "job creators" have decided to keep that money out unless they get another tax break (they were amnestied during the Bush era).


    I remember listening to the originator of the phrase "job creator" the guy explained that using those two words instead of "rich people" makes it easy for regular people (right wingers love the phrase) to be OK with cutting taxes to rich people, it sounds better, I mean who is going to be against a "job creator" right? the guy did an amazing job to fool millions of people.
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    Default Re: Political News and Policies

    Here is an example of all the money "job creators" have offshore because they don't want to pay taxes (most of them don't pay taxes anyways).

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    Default Re: Political News and Policies

    It was called "repatriation tax holiday" and it created 0 jobs but sure let's do it again..


    A repatriation tax holiday is a tax holiday specifically directed towards individuals and businesses in one country who repatriate to that country income earned in other countries. The theory supporting such an action is that multinational companies

    headquartered in one country, but which earn income in a second country will be unlikely to bring income from the second country back to their home country if high taxes will be assessed on this income when it is brought back. By allowing those companies to

    bring income back to the home country at a reduced tax rate, money will be injected into the economy of the home country that otherwise would remain in the second country.

    In 2004, the United States Congress enacted such a tax holiday for U.S. multinational companies in the American Jobs Creation Act of 2004 (AJCA)) section 965, allowing them to repatriate foreign profits to the United States at a 5.25% tax rate, rather than the

    existing 35% corporate tax rate.[1] Under this law, corporations brought $362 billion into the American economy, primarily for the purposes of paying dividends to investors, repurchasing shares, and purchasing other corporations.[1] The largest multi-national

    companies, Apple Inc., Microsoft Corp., Alphabet Inc., Cisco Systems Inc., and Oracle Corp., recalled only 9% of their cash possessions following the 2004 act.[2] In 2011, Senate Democrats, arguing against another repatriation tax holiday, issued a report

    asserting that the previous effort had actually cost the United States Treasury $3.3 billion, and that companies receiving the tax breaks had thereafter cut over 20,000 jobs.[3] A second repatriation tax holiday was defeated in the United States Senate in 2009.[1]
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    Default Re: Political News and Policies

    Should have given them more tax breaks poor company ...



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    Default Re: Political News and Policies

    This is real simple math, dumbed down to make it extremely easy.

    You have $100. $30 goes to taxes, how much you got left to hire someone?
    You have $100. $15 goes to taxes, how much you got to higher someone?

    When you can explain to me how letting a company keep $15 more of their money, how it can't be used to higher more people, your "bs" line will carry some merit.

    After you figure out how math works, then you can try to attempt to explain why states like Texas has carried job creation in this country for almost a decade.

    No matter how much Socialist warriors deny basic economics facts, reality keeps churning.
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    Default Re: Political News and Policies

    Taxes don't create (private sector) jobs. Taxes limit job creation, because they suck out money from the business. This is basic economics. You can't raise someones taxes and think they'll hire more people, because they have less money to hire. Owners are going to get their shake out of it first. No one starts a company to pay others and not make money for themselves. Common sense.

    When you limit how much money a company has, you limit their hiring abilities. Will they hire more if they have more money? Maybe not. But you give them the ability to do so if they have the resources. If they don't have the resources, then theyre not going to hire.

    This is basic stuff. Denying it happens makes you look a fool.
    “Just because you're offended, doesn't mean you're right.” ― Ricky Gervais.

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    Default Re: Political News and Policies

    Quote Originally Posted by Since86 View Post
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    This is real simple math, dumbed down to make it extremely easy.

    You have $100. $30 goes to taxes, how much you got left to hire someone?
    You have $100. $15 goes to taxes, how much you got to higher someone?

    When you can explain to me how letting a company keep $15 more of their money, how it can't be used to higher more people, your "bs" line will carry some merit.

    After you figure out how math works, then you can try to attempt to explain why states like Texas has carried job creation in this country for almost a decade.

    No matter how much Socialist warriors deny basic economics facts, reality keeps churning.
    That means I have $15 to send offshore and I'm going to wait to see who is the next republican president that is going to amnesty my company once again so I can "create more jobs".
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    Default Re: Political News and Policies

    Quote Originally Posted by Since86 View Post
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    This is real simple math, dumbed down to make it extremely easy.

    You have $100. $30 goes to taxes, how much you got left to hire someone?
    You have $100. $15 goes to taxes, how much you got to higher someone?

    When you can explain to me how letting a company keep $15 more of their money, how it can't be used to higher more people, your "bs" line will carry some merit.

    After you figure out how math works, then you can try to attempt to explain why states like Texas has carried job creation in this country for almost a decade.

    No matter how much Socialist warriors deny basic economics facts, reality keeps churning.
    Logic must consistently apply, so you are really saying that companies should have to pay no taxes at all. Right! Same would apply to people's individual income. So you must be in support of only a national sales tax.


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    Default Re: Political News and Policies

    flipping channels and saw the MSNBC chyron say something about Trump not wanting the Comey letter to come out to the public or something, can't remember it verbatim, for a split second thought it said Trump didn't want letter of his coming out to be made public and said whaaat now lol

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    Default Re: Political News and Policies

    Quote Originally Posted by Since86 View Post
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    This is real simple math, dumbed down to make it extremely easy.

    You have $100. $30 goes to taxes, how much you got left to hire someone?
    You have $100. $15 goes to taxes, how much you got to higher someone?

    When you can explain to me how letting a company keep $15 more of their money, how it can't be used to higher more people, your "bs" line will carry some merit.

    After you figure out how math works, then you can try to attempt to explain why states like Texas has carried job creation in this country for almost a decade.

    No matter how much Socialist warriors deny basic economics facts, reality keeps churning.
    This is way oversimplified, but say you are a low income neighborhood grocery store owner. Taxes are lowered on rich corporations. Programs like SNAP suffer. The local grocery store makes less money. Can't buy as much local produce and products, farmers and manufacturers suffer, also can't hire neighborhood employees. All the while the neighborhood is low income, so of course the lowered taxes for the rich is going to hurt them the most.

    Will the lower taxes for big corporations reach this neighborhood? Probably not. Probably raises for CEOs. As a business owner myself, I'm going to expand because I have more demand for my product in more areas, not because of a tax rate.

    And BTW, cities give absurd tax breaks to companies creating jobs, its called corporate welfare. Many of the companies don't even follow through with the job promises and still get the tax breaks. So with or without lower taxes, there are still plenty tax incentives when creating jobs.

    But these tax breaks are purely to make rich people richer. Can't believe people honestly believe that politicians (dem and republican) actually are thinking about job creators when they lower taxes for the rich. How easy would it be to pass a bipartisan law that lowers taxes only if you create jobs? It would never happen, because the job creator claim is ********.

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    Default Re: Political News and Policies

    Quote Originally Posted by Since86 View Post
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    Which would make sense if Bernie only railed against corps taking tax cuts. But he doesn't, he continually criticizes both corps and individuals for taking loopholes.

    This is a guy who, by his own released tax information, paid 13.5% in taxes in 2015.

    Let me repeat that. This is a guy who paid 13.5%.http://thehill.com/policy/finance/do...derss-tax-rate

    That's a lower effective tax rate than I pay, and I make no where near the $175,000 that he does.

    Bernie Sanders is all for making everyone, corps and individuals, pay their "fair share" as he takes advantage of every loophole he can find.

    Here is Bernie talking about Mitt Romney and his 47% comment.
    http://www.politicususa.com/2012/09/...7-percent.html

    Mitt Romney released his taxes and showed he paid 30% in Federal taxes.
    https://www.forbes.com/sites/charles...-income-taxes/

    So you're objecting to me calling Bernie a massive hypocrite on taxes while Bernie attacks a man who pays 30% for taking loopholes while Bernie paid 13.5% when they're in the same tax bracket......

    Good one.

    And thanks for proving my point about how Bernie skips out of his fair share and how he's defended for it. I guess it's good to be a tax cheat as long as you have a D behind your name.
    I don't have a problem with someone living on the East coast making 175k using tax breaks. That's like 100k in Indy money. Like others have said, not hypocritical to expect corporations to pay their fair share when you put Bernie's situation in perspective.

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    Default Re: Political News and Policies

    Quote Originally Posted by graphic-er View Post
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    I think Bernie is correct that corporate tax cuts do not grow jobs. Job growth is largely dependent on increased demand. Companies might take that tax cut and reinvest in new technologies, which would create demand for other companies. But doesn't mean the other company would need to hire more workers to full fill that demand.

    Very dubious for GOP to ascribe corporate tax cuts as the economic panacea.


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    Lol, I read this after my long post. But yes! Supply and demand creates jobs, not tax breaks.

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    Default Re: Political News and Policies

    Quote Originally Posted by Since86 View Post
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    Taxes don't create (private sector) jobs. Taxes limit job creation, because they suck out money from the business. This is basic economics. You can't raise someones taxes and think they'll hire more people, because they have less money to hire. Owners are going to get their shake out of it first. No one starts a company to pay others and not make money for themselves. Common sense.

    When you limit how much money a company has, you limit their hiring abilities. Will they hire more if they have more money? Maybe not. But you give them the ability to do so if they have the resources. If they don't have the resources, then theyre not going to hire.

    This is basic stuff. Denying it happens makes you look a fool.
    But if there isn't demand for your company the tax money just goes to your pocket. Why hire people you don't need? If there is demand then you will hire more people because you'll make more money meeting that demand.

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    Default Re: Political News and Policies

    This is especially hilarious because a true conservative wants to lower the national debt. One of the biggest parts of Bush tax cuts was capital gains. Please explain the positive impact on job growth in middle and poor America lowering capital gains rate? All it did was drive up the national debt and grow income inequality to a level never seen before.

    Only reason people put up with this **** is because everyone that has a computer, TV, iPhone, air conditioner, etc. thinks they're middle class and not poor. Tax cuts for the rich is the biggest reason why the middle class is dead.

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    Default Re: Political News and Policies

    So are all the Trump supporters in this thread dead or?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Hibbert View Post
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    So are all the Trump supporters in this thread dead or?
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    Default Re: Political News and Policies

    I'm not trying to be too political here....or stereo type people....but I honestly thought that there would be more Conservative folks here given that Indiana appears to be more of a Right Leaning State. Maybe that is truer the further you get away from Indianapolis itself?
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    Default Re: Political News and Policies

    Quote Originally Posted by vnzla81 View Post
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    The reinvesting thing is such bs is not even funny, there is a reason why there are billions of dollars stuck out of the country because this "job creators" have decided to keep that money out unless they get another tax break (they were amnestied during the Bush era)
    Unless the tax breaks are tied to actual expansion and business creation then they are ineffective at best at creating any job growth.
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    Quote Originally Posted by CableKC View Post
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    I'm not trying to be too political here....or stereo type people....but I honestly thought that there would be more Conservative folks here given that Indiana appears to be more of a Right Leaning State. Maybe that is truer the further you get away from Indianapolis itself?
    BnG got banned. He would be the loudest conservative voice.

    As far as conservative voices go... you should deal with this area. Ultra right to the point of being regressives. Any proposed change is "socialism", "communism", "liberalism", or some other slam as they think they are wrapping themselves in the flag and fighting against the "red menace".
    Nuntius was right for a while. I was wrong for a while. But ultimately I was right and Frank Vogel has been let go.

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    Default Re: Political News and Policies

    Quote Originally Posted by CableKC View Post
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    I'm not trying to be too political here....or stereo type people....but I honestly thought that there would be more Conservative folks here given that Indiana appears to be more of a Right Leaning State. Maybe that is truer the further you get away from Indianapolis itself?
    I think all the subtle racists are now scared to talk now that Trump has magnified their quiet racism for what it really is.

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