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Rule #1

Pacers Digest is intended to be a place to discuss basketball without having to deal with the kinds of behaviors or attitudes that distract people from sticking with the discussion of the topics at hand. These unwanted distractions can come in many forms, and admittedly it can sometimes be tricky to pin down each and every kind that can rear its ugly head, but we feel that the following examples and explanations cover at least a good portion of that ground and should at least give people a pretty good idea of the kinds of things we actively discourage:

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We also dissuade passive aggressive behavior. This can be various things, but common examples include statements that are basically meant to imply someone is either stupid or otherwise incapable of holding a rational conversation. This can include (but is not limited to) laughing at someone's conclusions rather than offering an honest rebuttal, asking people what game they were watching, or another common problem is Poster X will say "that player isn't that bad" and then Poster Y will say something akin to "LOL you think that player is good". We're not going to tolerate those kinds of comments out of respect for the community at large and for the sake of trying to just have an honest conversation.

Now, does the above cover absolutely every single kind of distraction that is unwanted? Probably not, but you should by now have a good idea of the general types of things we will be discouraging. The above examples are meant to give you a good feel for / idea of what we're looking for. If something new or different than the above happens to come along and results in the same problem (that being, any other attitude or behavior that ultimately distracts from actually just discussing the topic at hand, or that is otherwise disrespectful to other posters), we can and we will take action to curb this as well, so please don't take this to mean that if you managed to technically avoid saying something exactly like one of the above examples that you are then somehow off the hook.

That all having been said, our goal is to do so in a generally kind and respectful way, and that doesn't mean the moment we see something we don't like that somebody is going to be suspended or banned, either. It just means that at the very least we will probably say something about it, quite possibly snipping out the distracting parts of the post in question while leaving alone the parts that are actually just discussing the topics, and in the event of a repeating or excessive problem, then we will start issuing infractions to try to further discourage further repeat problems, and if it just never seems to improve, then finally suspensions or bans will come into play. We would prefer it never went that far, and most of the time for most of our posters, it won't ever have to.

A slip up every once and a while is pretty normal, but, again, when it becomes repetitive or excessive, something will be done. Something occasional is probably going to be let go (within reason), but when it starts to become habitual or otherwise a pattern, odds are very good that we will step in.

There's always a small minority that like to push people's buttons and/or test their own boundaries with regards to the administrators, and in the case of someone acting like that, please be aware that this is not a court of law, but a private website run by people who are simply trying to do the right thing as they see it. If we feel that you are a special case that needs to be dealt with in an exceptional way because your behavior isn't explicitly mirroring one of our above examples of what we generally discourage, we can and we will take atypical action to prevent this from continuing if you are not cooperative with us.

Also please be aware that you will not be given a pass simply by claiming that you were 'only joking,' because quite honestly, when someone really is just joking, for one thing most people tend to pick up on the joke, including the person or group that is the target of the joke, and for another thing, in the event where an honest joke gets taken seriously and it upsets or angers someone, the person who is truly 'only joking' will quite commonly go out of his / her way to apologize and will try to mend fences. People who are dishonest about their statements being 'jokes' do not do so, and in turn that becomes a clear sign of what is really going on. It's nothing new.

In any case, quite frankly, the overall quality and health of the entire forum's community is more important than any one troublesome user will ever be, regardless of exactly how a problem is exhibiting itself, and if it comes down to us having to make a choice between you versus the greater health and happiness of the entire community, the community of this forum will win every time.

Lastly, there are also some posters, who are generally great contributors and do not otherwise cause any problems, who sometimes feel it's their place to provoke or to otherwise 'mess with' that small minority of people described in the last paragraph, and while we possibly might understand why you might feel you WANT to do something like that, the truth is we can't actually tolerate that kind of behavior from you any more than we can tolerate the behavior from them. So if we feel that you are trying to provoke those other posters into doing or saying something that will get themselves into trouble, then we will start to view you as a problem as well, because of the same reason as before: The overall health of the forum comes first, and trying to stir the pot with someone like that doesn't help, it just makes it worse. Some will simply disagree with this philosophy, but if so, then so be it because ultimately we have to do what we think is best so long as it's up to us.

If you see a problem that we haven't addressed, the best and most appropriate course for a forum member to take here is to look over to the left of the post in question. See underneath that poster's name, avatar, and other info, down where there's a little triangle with an exclamation point (!) in it? Click that. That allows you to report the post to the admins so we can definitely notice it and give it a look to see what we feel we should do about it. Beyond that, obviously it's human nature sometimes to want to speak up to the poster in question who has bothered you, but we would ask that you try to refrain from doing so because quite often what happens is two or more posters all start going back and forth about the original offending post, and suddenly the entire thread is off topic or otherwise derailed. So while the urge to police it yourself is understandable, it's best to just report it to us and let us handle it. Thank you!

All of the above is going to be subject to a case by case basis, but generally and broadly speaking, this should give everyone a pretty good idea of how things will typically / most often be handled.

Rule #2

If the actions of an administrator inspire you to make a comment, criticism, or express a concern about it, there is a wrong place and a couple of right places to do so.

The wrong place is to do so in the original thread in which the administrator took action. For example, if a post gets an infraction, or a post gets deleted, or a comment within a larger post gets clipped out, in a thread discussing Paul George, the wrong thing to do is to distract from the discussion of Paul George by adding your off topic thoughts on what the administrator did.

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If this is done the wrong way, those comments will be deleted, and if it's a repeating problem then it may also receive an infraction as well.

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When you ignore a user, you will unfortunately still see some hints of their existence (nothing we can do about that), however, it does the following key things:

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Regarding infractions, currently they carry a value of one point each, and that point will expire in 31 days. If at any point a poster is carrying three points at the same time, that poster will be suspended until the oldest of the three points expires.

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Indianapolis Star

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It may or may not go without saying, but this goes for threads and posts as well, particularly when it's not made on the off-topic board (Market Square).

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However, once the discussion seems to be more/mostly about the political issues instead of the sports figure or his specific situation, the thread is usually closed.

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We prefer self-restraint and/or modesty when making jokes or off topic comments in a sports discussion thread. They can be fun, but sometimes they derail or distract from a topic, and we don't want to see that happen. If we feel it is a problem, we will either delete or move those posts from the thread.

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I would trade Paul George before the deadline

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  • #61
    Re: I would trade Paul George before the deadline

    Originally posted by Heisenberg View Post
    I'm ready for Bird to head to Florida permanently really, need a "new voice," but you guys really aren't excusing PG are you? the stuff with Roy or Hill or Lance or whomever in the past, I can see how you'd call that scapegoating. calling out PG for honestly, in my opinion, just going through the motions until he can leave, isn't scapegoating. everything about the dude's body language reads like a foot out the door to me. and hell, I get it, I'd be frustrated too if I were him. but if he's supposed to be the Pacers cornerstone for his entire career he can't be sulking and whining about refs and all that ****. he is, and he's not that, so just why waste time? get the haul for him this summer and move on. PG's 7 years in, he's in his prime right now and we're going nowhere but the 15th pick range again.

    I'm just tired of it man. Show me a plan, show me a vision of growth past Cleveland's twilight.
    I think the plan and vision are there but if your "star" is pulling a Dwight Howard (about how he wants touches and misses his old teammates) then it doesn't matter what you have.
    @WhatTheFFacts: Studies show that sarcasm enhances the ability of the human mind to solve complex problems!

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    • #62
      Re: I would trade Paul George before the deadline

      One intriguing team to pull a trade with could be OKC, they want an star next to Westbrook and I believe they have few good picks to ad to any trade.


      I'm thinking, Adams+Dipo+ picks for PG, Teague, Dipo, Turner and Adams for the future is pretty good.
      @WhatTheFFacts: Studies show that sarcasm enhances the ability of the human mind to solve complex problems!

      Comment


      • #63
        Re: I would trade Paul George before the deadline

        Originally posted by vnzla81 View Post
        I think the plan and vision are there but if your "star" is pulling a Dwight Howard (about how he wants touches and misses his old teammates) then it doesn't matter what you have.
        True. So, the best thing might then be for our current brass to start sending signals to selective parties that we are interested in some of their players and/or picks before we get much more moaning and things that detract from Paul's current trade value?
        Last edited by Mourning; 01-23-2017, 01:35 PM.
        2012 PD ABA Fantasy Keeper League Champion, sports.ws

        2011 PD ABA Fantasy Keeper League Champion, sports.ws

        2006 PD ABA Fantasy League runner up, sports.ws

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        • #64
          Re: I would trade Paul George before the deadline

          Originally posted by Mourning View Post
          True. So, the best thing might then be for our current brass to start sending signals to selective parties that we are interested in some of their players and/or picks before we get much more moaning and things that detract from Paul's current trade value?
          I think so, do it at the trade deadline or this summer if possible because at this point I don't know how you get PG to give a **** again, the longer you keep him the less value you are going to get for him.
          @WhatTheFFacts: Studies show that sarcasm enhances the ability of the human mind to solve complex problems!

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          • #65
            Re: I would trade Paul George before the deadline

            Originally posted by HickeyS2000 View Post
            So you have no issues with the way PG is playing this year?
            I think he's playing at 80% effort instead of 100%, i.e. he's coasting. Is that bad? Yes. Does that mean I want to chuck him out for whatever draft picks? No. PG is still our best player by far even at 80% and no draft pick is likely to come close to his on-court value.

            My problem with scapegoating is that it presents a too simple solution to the complex problem of "why do we suck". Scapegoating presents a simple, seductive answer: it's all Player X's fault! Just get rid of him and all our ills will be solved. In reality it's rarely that simple. For example, we're all high on Turner right now because he's young and putting up stats and maybe because Bird called him potentially the best Pacer ever (just don't forget that Bird described Lance in similar terms before!) Give it a couple of years though, and people will pick him apart endlessly. So what does dumping PG accomplish? We'd just be setting up Turner for the same sort of disappointment, whenever the next draft pick starts to look good.

            This is not to say that I'm immune to the temptation of scapegoating either. For instance, I'm a big Monta critic, but I try to avoid making the argument that all our problems will be solved just by moving Monta. Indeed, as we see after Monta's benching, there are still clear issues with the team.

            There are many reasons why we aren't playing well right now, and definitely PG is a factor in that. I just can't imagine any sort of outcome where PG doesn't play a big part in the solution though.
            Last edited by wintermute; 01-23-2017, 03:18 PM.

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            • #66
              Re: I would trade Paul George before the deadline

              I can't believe I actually agree with OP. This roster is not gonna cut it, we need to get younger and build around Myles. Moving PG is the obvious way. I personally would love to get Booker + Chandler from PHX, which would work salary wise. Move Myles to the 4 with Tyson at the 5, rebounding problems would go away fast. Its a pipe dream, but these types of trades can happen when you have a top 15 player to work with.

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              • #67
                Re: I would trade Paul George before the deadline

                I hope we can get 2 bags of Fritos for him, not those damn generic corn chips.
                BillS

                A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush.
                Or throw in a first-round pick and flip it for a max-level point guard...

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                • #68
                  Re: I would trade Paul George before the deadline

                  Reminder for the forgetful, we're just 8 months removed from PG's superstar performance against the Raptors in the playoffs. Didn't hear anyone complaining back then.

                  Slag off PG all you want for saving his heroics for the postseason, but there's a certain Pacers legend who did exactly the same.

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                  • #69
                    Re: I would trade Paul George before the deadline

                    Originally posted by wintermute View Post
                    I think he's playing at 80% effort instead of 100%, i.e. he's coasting. Is that bad? Yes. Does that mean I want to chuck him out for whatever draft picks? No. PG is still our best player by far even at 80% and no draft pick is likely to come close to his on-court value.
                    Thanks for the response, I completely agree PG is coasting. My problem with him right now is that his coasting and sloppiness is a large part of the problem, yet he always finds a way to blame someone else. Lately it has been the refs. He just doesn't seem to be mentally in it. It is natural to wonder if he has already checked out of Indy as his free-agency looms. It is a bit cynical, but the Durant deal has the entire league on notice.

                    Keeping your best player isn't always the answer. Trading PG and going young around Turner is an enticing option and interest should at least be gauged. However I don't think Bird is that GM, as he likely doesn't want to be part of a re-build, and we all know he doesn't like to admit failure.

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                    • #70
                      Re: I would trade Paul George before the deadline

                      Originally posted by Heisenberg View Post
                      I'm ready for Bird to head to Florida permanently really, need a "new voice," but you guys really aren't excusing PG are you? the stuff with Roy or Hill or Lance or whomever in the past, I can see how you'd call that scapegoating. calling out PG for honestly, in my opinion, just going through the motions until he can leave, isn't scapegoating. everything about the dude's body language reads like a foot out the door to me. and hell, I get it, I'd be frustrated too if I were him. but if he's supposed to be the Pacers cornerstone for his entire career he can't be sulking and whining about refs and all that ****. he is, and he's not that, so just why waste time? get the haul for him this summer and move on. PG's 7 years in, he's in his prime right now and we're going nowhere but the 15th pick range again.

                      I'm just tired of it man. Show me a plan, show me a vision of growth past Cleveland's twilight.
                      Just me personally? I'm not giving PG13 a pass.......I'm just saying that my scapegoat for this season is the guy at the top of this heap ( not PG13 ).

                      I'm with you, I'm ready for a new voice.....now, I have no clue who that new voice will be.......but I'm not going to regret it if Bird decides to ride his tractor into retirement at his huge house in French Lick Indiana.
                      Ash from Army of Darkness: Good...Bad...I'm the guy with the gun.

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                      • #71
                        Re: I would trade Paul George before the deadline

                        Originally posted by wintermute View Post
                        I think he's playing at 80% effort instead of 100%, i.e. he's coasting. Is that bad? Yes. Does that mean I want to chuck him out for whatever draft picks? No. PG is still our best player by far even at 80% and no draft pick is likely to come close to his on-court value.

                        My problem with scapegoating is that it presents a too simple solution to the complex problem of "why do we suck". Scapegoating presents a simple, seductive answer: it's all Player X's fault! Just get rid of him and all our ills will be solved. In reality it's rarely that simple. For example, we're all high on Turner right now because he's young and putting up stats and maybe because Bird called him potentially the best Pacer ever (just don't forget that Bird described Lance in similar terms before!) Give it a couple of years though, and people will pick him apart endlessly. So what does dumping PG accomplish? We'd just be setting up Turner for the same sort of disappointment, whenever the next draft pick starts to look good.

                        This is not to say that I'm immune to the temptation of scapegoating either. For instance, I'm a big Monta critic, but I try to avoid making the argument that all our problems will be solved just by moving Monta. Indeed, as we see after Monta's benching, there are still clear issues with the team.

                        There are many reasons why we aren't playing well right now, and definitely PG is a factor in that. I just can't imagine any sort of outcome where PG doesn't play a big part in the solution though.
                        I personally am far from ready to give up on Paul.

                        However, as you've rightfully pointed out, he is the key to resolving many of our current plights.

                        We are not playing up to our capabilities, and it's up to our team's leader to create some accountability or demonstrate by action/example the high standards consistent with championship contention.

                        Look at what Westbrook, Butler, and Harden are doing this year as references.

                        His manner is consistent with "not giving much of a damn", and that's concerning to me.
                        Last edited by docpaul; 01-23-2017, 03:56 PM.

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                        • #72
                          Re: I would trade Paul George before the deadline

                          Originally posted by wintermute View Post
                          I think he's playing at 80% effort instead of 100%, i.e. he's coasting. Is that bad? Yes. Does that mean I want to chuck him out for whatever draft picks? No. PG is still our best player by far even at 80% and no draft pick is likely to come close to his on-court value.

                          My problem with scapegoating is that it presents a too simple solution to the complex problem of "why do we suck". Scapegoating presents a simple, seductive answer: it's all Player X's fault! Just get rid of him and all our ills will be solved. In reality it's rarely that simple. For example, we're all high on Turner right now because he's young and putting up stats and maybe because Bird called him potentially the best Pacer ever (just don't forget that Bird described Lance in similar terms before!) Give it a couple of years though, and people will pick him apart endlessly. So what does dumping PG accomplish? We'd just be setting up Turner for the same sort of disappointment, whenever the next draft pick starts to look good.

                          This is not to say that I'm immune to the temptation of scapegoating either. For instance, I'm a big Monta critic, but I try to avoid making the argument that all our problems will be solved just by moving Monta. Indeed, as we see after Monta's benching, there are still clear issues with the team.

                          There are many reasons why we aren't playing well right now, and definitely PG is a factor in that. I just can't imagine any sort of outcome where PG doesn't play a big part in the solution though.

                          I really don't think the solution is that complex, if PG is pulling a Howard and draining the fun out of the team while crying and not giving 100% then the solution is simple IMO.
                          @WhatTheFFacts: Studies show that sarcasm enhances the ability of the human mind to solve complex problems!

                          Comment


                          • #73
                            Re: I would trade Paul George before the deadline

                            Give him to the Lakers for Ingram, Russell and Nance Jr
                            Why so SERIOUS

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                            • #74
                              Re: I would trade Paul George before the deadline

                              Originally posted by Really? View Post
                              Give him to the Lakers for Ingram, Russell and Nance Jr
                              No thanks.
                              @WhatTheFFacts: Studies show that sarcasm enhances the ability of the human mind to solve complex problems!

                              Comment


                              • #75
                                Re: I would trade Paul George before the deadline

                                Originally posted by vnzla81 View Post
                                No thanks.
                                Cost savings, Young guys that still can develop, Nance is a good role player and should be years to come. I think Russell can grow into a winning piece for an NBA team, and Ingram is learning, come one year from now I would say there is no way this deal would happen on LA's side, but right now they need a STAR, would be good for them, good for us and good for PG. He would hopefully be revitalized by being home, and being a Laker. Teague/Russell/Ingram/Young/Turner/ with Monte coming in as a 6th man. Sounds like a good young group to build around.
                                Why so SERIOUS

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