Announcement

Collapse

The Rules of Pacers Digest

Hello everyone,

Whether your are a long standing forum member or whether you have just registered today, it's a good idea to read and review the rules below so that you have a very good idea of what to expect when you come to Pacers Digest.

A quick note to new members: Your posts will not immediately show up when you make them. An administrator has to approve at least your first post before the forum software will later upgrade your account to the status of a fully-registered member. This usually happens within a couple of hours or so after your post(s) is/are approved, so you may need to be a little patient at first.

Why do we do this? So that it's more difficult for spammers (be they human or robot) to post, and so users who are banned cannot immediately re-register and start dousing people with verbal flames.

Below are the rules of Pacers Digest. After you have read them, you will have a very good sense of where we are coming from, what we expect, what we don't want to see, and how we react to things.

Rule #1

Pacers Digest is intended to be a place to discuss basketball without having to deal with the kinds of behaviors or attitudes that distract people from sticking with the discussion of the topics at hand. These unwanted distractions can come in many forms, and admittedly it can sometimes be tricky to pin down each and every kind that can rear its ugly head, but we feel that the following examples and explanations cover at least a good portion of that ground and should at least give people a pretty good idea of the kinds of things we actively discourage:

"Anyone who __________ is a liar / a fool / an idiot / a blind homer / has their head buried in the sand / a blind hater / doesn't know basketball / doesn't watch the games"

"People with intelligence will agree with me when I say that __________"

"Only stupid people think / believe / do ___________"

"I can't wait to hear something from PosterX when he/she sees that **insert a given incident or current event that will have probably upset or disappointed PosterX here**"

"He/she is just delusional"

"This thread is stupid / worthless / embarrassing"

"I'm going to take a moment to point and / laugh at PosterX / GroupOfPeopleY who thought / believed *insert though/belief here*"

"Remember when PosterX said OldCommentY that no longer looks good? "

In general, if a comment goes from purely on topic to something 'ad hominem' (personal jabs, personal shots, attacks, flames, however you want to call it, towards a person, or a group of people, or a given city/state/country of people), those are most likely going to be found intolerable.

We also dissuade passive aggressive behavior. This can be various things, but common examples include statements that are basically meant to imply someone is either stupid or otherwise incapable of holding a rational conversation. This can include (but is not limited to) laughing at someone's conclusions rather than offering an honest rebuttal, asking people what game they were watching, or another common problem is Poster X will say "that player isn't that bad" and then Poster Y will say something akin to "LOL you think that player is good". We're not going to tolerate those kinds of comments out of respect for the community at large and for the sake of trying to just have an honest conversation.

Now, does the above cover absolutely every single kind of distraction that is unwanted? Probably not, but you should by now have a good idea of the general types of things we will be discouraging. The above examples are meant to give you a good feel for / idea of what we're looking for. If something new or different than the above happens to come along and results in the same problem (that being, any other attitude or behavior that ultimately distracts from actually just discussing the topic at hand, or that is otherwise disrespectful to other posters), we can and we will take action to curb this as well, so please don't take this to mean that if you managed to technically avoid saying something exactly like one of the above examples that you are then somehow off the hook.

That all having been said, our goal is to do so in a generally kind and respectful way, and that doesn't mean the moment we see something we don't like that somebody is going to be suspended or banned, either. It just means that at the very least we will probably say something about it, quite possibly snipping out the distracting parts of the post in question while leaving alone the parts that are actually just discussing the topics, and in the event of a repeating or excessive problem, then we will start issuing infractions to try to further discourage further repeat problems, and if it just never seems to improve, then finally suspensions or bans will come into play. We would prefer it never went that far, and most of the time for most of our posters, it won't ever have to.

A slip up every once and a while is pretty normal, but, again, when it becomes repetitive or excessive, something will be done. Something occasional is probably going to be let go (within reason), but when it starts to become habitual or otherwise a pattern, odds are very good that we will step in.

There's always a small minority that like to push people's buttons and/or test their own boundaries with regards to the administrators, and in the case of someone acting like that, please be aware that this is not a court of law, but a private website run by people who are simply trying to do the right thing as they see it. If we feel that you are a special case that needs to be dealt with in an exceptional way because your behavior isn't explicitly mirroring one of our above examples of what we generally discourage, we can and we will take atypical action to prevent this from continuing if you are not cooperative with us.

Also please be aware that you will not be given a pass simply by claiming that you were 'only joking,' because quite honestly, when someone really is just joking, for one thing most people tend to pick up on the joke, including the person or group that is the target of the joke, and for another thing, in the event where an honest joke gets taken seriously and it upsets or angers someone, the person who is truly 'only joking' will quite commonly go out of his / her way to apologize and will try to mend fences. People who are dishonest about their statements being 'jokes' do not do so, and in turn that becomes a clear sign of what is really going on. It's nothing new.

In any case, quite frankly, the overall quality and health of the entire forum's community is more important than any one troublesome user will ever be, regardless of exactly how a problem is exhibiting itself, and if it comes down to us having to make a choice between you versus the greater health and happiness of the entire community, the community of this forum will win every time.

Lastly, there are also some posters, who are generally great contributors and do not otherwise cause any problems, who sometimes feel it's their place to provoke or to otherwise 'mess with' that small minority of people described in the last paragraph, and while we possibly might understand why you might feel you WANT to do something like that, the truth is we can't actually tolerate that kind of behavior from you any more than we can tolerate the behavior from them. So if we feel that you are trying to provoke those other posters into doing or saying something that will get themselves into trouble, then we will start to view you as a problem as well, because of the same reason as before: The overall health of the forum comes first, and trying to stir the pot with someone like that doesn't help, it just makes it worse. Some will simply disagree with this philosophy, but if so, then so be it because ultimately we have to do what we think is best so long as it's up to us.

If you see a problem that we haven't addressed, the best and most appropriate course for a forum member to take here is to look over to the left of the post in question. See underneath that poster's name, avatar, and other info, down where there's a little triangle with an exclamation point (!) in it? Click that. That allows you to report the post to the admins so we can definitely notice it and give it a look to see what we feel we should do about it. Beyond that, obviously it's human nature sometimes to want to speak up to the poster in question who has bothered you, but we would ask that you try to refrain from doing so because quite often what happens is two or more posters all start going back and forth about the original offending post, and suddenly the entire thread is off topic or otherwise derailed. So while the urge to police it yourself is understandable, it's best to just report it to us and let us handle it. Thank you!

All of the above is going to be subject to a case by case basis, but generally and broadly speaking, this should give everyone a pretty good idea of how things will typically / most often be handled.

Rule #2

If the actions of an administrator inspire you to make a comment, criticism, or express a concern about it, there is a wrong place and a couple of right places to do so.

The wrong place is to do so in the original thread in which the administrator took action. For example, if a post gets an infraction, or a post gets deleted, or a comment within a larger post gets clipped out, in a thread discussing Paul George, the wrong thing to do is to distract from the discussion of Paul George by adding your off topic thoughts on what the administrator did.

The right places to do so are:

A) Start a thread about the specific incident you want to talk about on the Feedback board. This way you are able to express yourself in an area that doesn't throw another thread off topic, and this way others can add their two cents as well if they wish, and additionally if there's something that needs to be said by the administrators, that is where they will respond to it.

B) Send a private message to the administrators, and they can respond to you that way.

If this is done the wrong way, those comments will be deleted, and if it's a repeating problem then it may also receive an infraction as well.

Rule #3

If a poster is bothering you, and an administrator has not or will not deal with that poster to the extent that you would prefer, you have a powerful tool at your disposal, one that has recently been upgraded and is now better than ever: The ability to ignore a user.

When you ignore a user, you will unfortunately still see some hints of their existence (nothing we can do about that), however, it does the following key things:

A) Any post they make will be completely invisible as you scroll through a thread.

B) The new addition to this feature: If someone QUOTES a user you are ignoring, you do not have to read who it was, or what that poster said, unless you go out of your way to click on a link to find out who it is and what they said.

To utilize this feature, from any page on Pacers Digest, scroll to the top of the page, look to the top right where it says 'Settings' and click that. From the settings page, look to the left side of the page where it says 'My Settings', and look down from there until you see 'Edit Ignore List' and click that. From here, it will say 'Add a Member to Your List...' Beneath that, click in the text box to the right of 'User Name', type in or copy & paste the username of the poster you are ignoring, and once their name is in the box, look over to the far right and click the 'Okay' button. All done!

Rule #4

Regarding infractions, currently they carry a value of one point each, and that point will expire in 31 days. If at any point a poster is carrying three points at the same time, that poster will be suspended until the oldest of the three points expires.

Rule #5

When you share or paste content or articles from another website, you must include the URL/link back to where you found it, who wrote it, and what website it's from. Said content will be removed if this doesn't happen.

An example:

If I copy and paste an article from the Indianapolis Star website, I would post something like this:

http://www.linktothearticlegoeshere.com/article
Title of the Article
Author's Name
Indianapolis Star

Rule #6

We cannot tolerate illegal videos on Pacers Digest. This means do not share any links to them, do not mention any websites that host them or link to them, do not describe how to find them in any way, and do not ask about them. Posts doing anything of the sort will be removed, the offenders will be contacted privately, and if the problem becomes habitual, you will be suspended, and if it still persists, you will probably be banned.

The legal means of watching or listening to NBA games are NBA League Pass Broadband (for US, or for International; both cost money) and NBA Audio League Pass (which is free). Look for them on NBA.com.

Rule #7

Provocative statements in a signature, or as an avatar, or as the 'tagline' beneath a poster's username (where it says 'Member' or 'Administrator' by default, if it is not altered) are an unwanted distraction that will more than likely be removed on sight. There can be shades of gray to this, but in general this could be something political or religious that is likely going to provoke or upset people, or otherwise something that is mean-spirited at the expense of a poster, a group of people, or a population.

It may or may not go without saying, but this goes for threads and posts as well, particularly when it's not made on the off-topic board (Market Square).

We do make exceptions if we feel the content is both innocuous and unlikely to cause social problems on the forum (such as wishing someone a Merry Christmas or a Happy Easter), and we also also make exceptions if such topics come up with regards to a sports figure (such as the Lance Stephenson situation bringing up discussions of domestic abuse and the law, or when Jason Collins came out as gay and how that lead to some discussion about gay rights).

However, once the discussion seems to be more/mostly about the political issues instead of the sports figure or his specific situation, the thread is usually closed.

Rule #8

We prefer self-restraint and/or modesty when making jokes or off topic comments in a sports discussion thread. They can be fun, but sometimes they derail or distract from a topic, and we don't want to see that happen. If we feel it is a problem, we will either delete or move those posts from the thread.

Rule #9

Generally speaking, we try to be a "PG-13" rated board, and we don't want to see sexual content or similarly suggestive content. Vulgarity is a more muddled issue, though again we prefer things to lean more towards "PG-13" than "R". If we feel things have gone too far, we will step in.

Rule #10

We like small signatures, not big signatures. The bigger the signature, the more likely it is an annoying or distracting signature.

Rule #11

Do not advertise anything without talking about it with the administrators first. This includes advertising with your signature, with your avatar, through private messaging, and/or by making a thread or post.
See more
See less

This Team is Built for the Regular Season

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • #16
    Re: This Team is Built for the Regular Season

    Ron
    J.O.
    Jax
    Tins
    DD
    Freddie
    Foster
    Cro
    Pollard
    Harrison
    AJ
    Gill

    ...and possibly (though not likely) Reggie.

    Some flaws there, but healthy and together for a whole season that's an INCREDIBLE line-up. In fact, with Reggie in there (take out Gill or whomever) I challenge all takers to find me a better 12-man roster in the past 10 years.

    Comment


    • #17
      Re: This Team is Built for the Regular Season

      Originally posted by Jay@Section204
      As promised...

      < My favorite smiley

      Well, its in outline form, but you'll get the point. Its already taken too long and as you've seen, I just get angry when I work on it.

      My working title, as you know, has been Why This Team is Built for the Regular Season, but I think a better title might be, Why I Wouldn't Mind if this Team Were Blown Up This Summer.

      Although you can nit-pick, make excuses, or point out extenuating circumstances for many of the points, the Pacers - as currenlty assembled - need just about every one of these concerns to be resolved in their favor to return to elite status. Some of you are magically expecting the team to magically "flip a switch" and become contenders again when they walk into training camp at the beginning of next season, but I don't see it.

      Here's a bummer, if JO has surgery in early April, and it takes 4-6 months to heal, he's just barely going to have begun basketball-type workouts (as opposed to physical therapy) when training camp starts. If Tinsley's torn ligament requires surgery, he too might not be ready for training camp.

      I believe this team's window of opportunity, based on both internal (Reggie) and external (the East isn't as weak anymore) factors, was last season and this season. And yet its come to very similar conclusions in each of the last two seasons: a meltdown by Ron and injuries to JO and Tinsley have combined to eliminate any hope of a championship.

      IMO, we'll need to make major changes among our so-called big three to get back to the elite next season. Although its no secret that I hope the team gets rid of Ron, I'm not sure that trading him (and getting a starting-caliber SF in return) is enough.

      Anyway, here's my working outline to Why I Wouldn't Mind if this Team Were Blown Up This Summer:
      1. The team’s best player/ first option
        • Can be solved during a seven-game series by either ‘gimmick’ defenses such as SVG’s swarming defense or double-teams that push him out from the post.
        • Isn’t very good at passing out of the double-team.
        • Has the skills to play center but breaks down physically if he spends too much time as the primary post defender
        • Is he a guy that can lead a team to a championship (like Duncan, Shaq, Hakeem, etc.) or is he a guy that can just lead a team into thrilling but futile playoff runs (like Uncle Reggie, Barkley, Ewing, Iverson, Garnett, etc.)
      2. Chemistry?
        • Lots of fans pooh-poohed the idea that our team’s chemistry might not be very good * before * the “Promote my CD” situation
        • There isn’t any reason to believe that, when the full team gets together again, the chemistry problems will have been solved – especially if there is any truth to the rumor that JO and Ron are struggling to co-exist on the same team
        • Subtracting Reggie from the team, even though he’s never been a “vocal leader”, could remove the one calming influence in the locker room
          • There’s no guarantee Dale will re-sign with the Pacers
      3. The guy many fans believe to be the team’s “second best player” (and some actually consider him to be the team’s MVP) is completely un-reliable when the pressure rises. Enough said.
      4. The team’s “cog” – the guy that’s truly their second-most important player - their PG – struggles with his physical conditioning
        • Generally unable to play more than 30-mpg without a breakdown
        • Claims every summer “to be in even better condition than last season” but has yet to show any results late in the season.
        • Notable exception – last season. He was benched for the first two months, which effectively postponed his annual breakdown from mid-March to mid-May
      5. We weren’t even the favorite to win the East this season, and the rest of the conference is improving while we’re in neutral
        • Everybody that said last summer that Shaq and Wade weren’t enough to make Miami a contender was just plain wrong
        • We’re playing in the same division as the defending champs
        • Chicago, Washington, Cleveland, Orlando, etc. have made improvements to close the “talent gap” while our team is largely unchanged, except for our sixth-man
      6. Even if we were to win the East, we match up well with San Antonio but they’re just a little bit better at every position (except perhaps PG)
      7. Our coach’s philosophy is to “win now.” He prefers veterans, but our team still has very young players in key positions.
        • Is Rick’s lack of patience appropriate for this team, as assembled?
        • Should we trade some of our young guys and/ or our upcoming mid-first-round pick for veterans if he’s not going to let them develop?
        • I’d be fine with Rick’s approach if he had a veteran team like the teams Bird had, but that’s not the hand he’s been dealt.
      8. The team’s backup PGs are inadequate replacements at initiating the offense
        • Can occasionally have good games
        • Offense grows stagnant
        • Tendency to let big leads disappear
      9. Rule changes – already in place for this season – are not favorable to the Pacers
        • Hurt our physical defense as the officials are calling more fouls for bumping, holding, etc.
        • Our only perimeter player that has been able to take advantage of the rule changes, offensively, is 39 years old and retiring
      10. The team’s “Center of the future” – for whatever reason – has regressed significantly during his rookie season
        • Maybe the rest of the league has figured out how to play him
        • Foul magnet
        • Pre-draft rumors of always being out-of-shape
        • Because the team hasn’t committed the necessary in-game investment, he won’t be ready to start next season, and he might not even be ready to be a permanent member of the rotation
        • Individual rebounding still leaves a lot to be desired
        • We just gave up on a high-post center that might’ve complimented JO very well because he never received the necessary in-game investment, either
        • Even though I was smitten with him early in the season, I’m now 50%/50% between, “He’ll be a legit starting center (Dampier)” and “He’ll drive us all mad with his unfulfilled potential (Jerome James).”
        • Regardless, Jeff Foster, would be better suited to be a backup (and as said above, there's no guarantee Dale will re-sign with the Pacers this summer)
      11. Our SGs not named Reggie are either:
        • Very streaky and emotional; or
        • Rock solid yet undersized
      Sure, this team also has some positives, I'm not denying those, that's just not the point of this essay. JO's obviously a great player, and Tinsley, IMO, is one of the best PGs in the game. Rick is, in general a very, very good coach even though he has some flaws that irritate me. Is that enough, given everything that's gone bad over the past twelve months, to point this team back to the elite? Or will it require a bold shakeup help get them there?


      I know what we're going to hear preached to us - from the front office, from the Walsh Warriors, etc.: patience, building from within, etc.



      That's led the Pacers to as many championships as Ron has (and Reggie, for that matter). I'm ready to try something different and bold.



      Okay, fire away...
      I'm shocked that you have not been ripped on more than you have. While what you say makes sense to me I know that really is setting off the bells to announce Ragnarok (Doom of the Gods in Norse mythology) to some of the sunshine brigade. I know U.B. is either busy & hasn't seen this yet or he has fallen into a seizure induced coma under his computer or is just ignoring you or is as we speak typing a post the size of war & peace.

      I will freely admit that Dale Davis being home has taken the bitter winds out of me. It's as though my world has been set straight again.

      However if Dale hadn't come home I would not only be agreeing with you I would be calling you an amatuer in your use of the darkside force . There is far more fertile ground to till here than you have even touched.

      But having said that Dale being home has filled up one huge hole for me & I'm consistant on this as I've said it for two straight seasons now. I was never as worried about any other position on the floor as I was the power position.

      I always focused my anger at this on Foster because O'Neal just would not do it & I guess he is the franchise so I felt that Foster was the problem.

      Unlike some of the others I do NOT feel as though Jeff Foster is a good fit with J.O. Actually I felt he was a detriment on many occasions. However I do feel that a combo of Dale & Jermaine may be something to see. Jermaine has begged for two years now for a player to help him down low & there will be nobody better at baning down low & not needing offense than Dale Davis.

      However, & here is where you have some ammo again, it really should never have come down to the needing help in the middle because we HAD a center who did all of that & was able to score yet we just threw him away like yesterdays newspaper with dog crap on it.

      You are being way to easy on the Artest fans when you don't make them account as to why they actually beleive anything will be differant.

      I don't think you even touched on Bender. The God awfull long term contract of Anthony Johnson & the inability to keep Jamaal on the floor even half of the games this year.

      But since Dale is home, it's all good.


      Basketball isn't played with computers, spreadsheets, and simulations. ChicagoJ 4/21/13

      Comment


      • #18
        Re: This Team is Built for the Regular Season

        Originally posted by rabidpacersfan
        Ron
        J.O.
        Jax
        Tins
        DD
        Freddie
        Foster
        Cro
        Pollard
        Harrison
        AJ
        Gill

        ...and possibly (though not likely) Reggie.

        Some flaws there, but healthy and together for a whole season that's an INCREDIBLE line-up. In fact, with Reggie in there (take out Gill or whomever) I challenge all takers to find me a better 12-man roster in the past 10 years.
        The bulls in the 90s.
        Don't ask Marvin Harrison what he did during the bye week. "Batman never told where the Bat Cave is," he explained.

        Comment


        • #19
          Re: This Team is Built for the Regular Season

          Starting 5 sure, but not down to the 12th man. And I'm not trying to be Mr Sunshine when I say that either.

          Comment


          • #20
            Re: This Team is Built for the Regular Season

            Won't surprise anyone but I disagree in fact I could not disagree anymore than I do.

            Last year was not an aberration, this is a 60 win team, there is no doubt in my mind, and I'll say this again, JO and Ron form the best tandem in the whole NBA and they will win a championship very, very soon.

            So Jay you can blow this team up if you want and spend 3 years at least (without any guarantees they will ever get to a 60 win level) just trying to match what we already have.

            I say no thanks.

            I've never been more convinced after seeing the effect that Dale has had on the team that this team will win a championship very soon.


            And before someone discounts my comments because I'm a member of the "sunshine brigade", for the record I've never, ever said anything like this before. Never during the 90's have I said they were going to win a championship. To be honest, I thought they maxed out doing as well as they did from 1994 - 2000.

            This current team will be better

            Comment


            • #21
              Re: This Team is Built for the Regular Season

              Just to be clear:

              fluke
              n.
              A stroke of good luck.
              A chance occurrence; an accident.
              Games. An accidentally good or successful stroke in billiards or pool.

              aberration
              n.
              A deviation from the proper or expected course. See Synonyms at deviation.


              Not the same thing. I said aberration, and statistically I'm certainly right.

              2000-01 41-41
              2001-02 42-40
              2002-03 48-34 (and falling apart at the seams)
              2003-04 61-21 (with a playoff collapse)
              2004-05 32-31 and counting

              I didn't say last year's team was lucky, or a fluke. But I do believe this version of the team peaked last season.
              Why do the things that we treasure most, slip away in time
              Till to the music we grow deaf, to God's beauty blind
              Why do the things that connect us slowly pull us apart?
              Till we fall away in our own darkness, a stranger to our own hearts
              And life itself, rushing over me
              Life itself, the wind in black elms,
              Life itself in your heart and in your eyes, I can't make it without you

              Comment


              • #22
                Re: This Team is Built for the Regular Season

                Originally posted by PacersandIU
                -snip- Ron and JO, i think, would put their differences aside if they are serious about winning a championship.
                I'm intentionally not spending much effort in this post to say what you all know I think about Ron...

                But after Ron basically quit on the team and got in the series of altercations with JO, how or when will we ever know (1) that Ron is serious about winning a championship or (2) that JO has any real interest in mending fences with a guy that 'quit on his team'.

                And JO probably deserves some blame for apparently being petty from time-to-time as well.
                Why do the things that we treasure most, slip away in time
                Till to the music we grow deaf, to God's beauty blind
                Why do the things that connect us slowly pull us apart?
                Till we fall away in our own darkness, a stranger to our own hearts
                And life itself, rushing over me
                Life itself, the wind in black elms,
                Life itself in your heart and in your eyes, I can't make it without you

                Comment


                • #23
                  Re: This Team is Built for the Regular Season

                  Originally posted by Unclebuck
                  -snip-So Jay you can blow this team up and spend 3 years at least (without any guarantees they will ever get to a 60 win level) just trying to match what we already have.

                  I say no thanks. -snip-
                  Miami, Detroit, Cleveland, etc....we'll be lucky to get back to the ECFs if we stand pat with the current team.

                  There's no guarantees either way.
                  Why do the things that we treasure most, slip away in time
                  Till to the music we grow deaf, to God's beauty blind
                  Why do the things that connect us slowly pull us apart?
                  Till we fall away in our own darkness, a stranger to our own hearts
                  And life itself, rushing over me
                  Life itself, the wind in black elms,
                  Life itself in your heart and in your eyes, I can't make it without you

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Re: This Team is Built for the Regular Season

                    Originally posted by Peck
                    -snip-

                    However if Dale hadn't come home I would not only be agreeing with you I would be calling you an amatuer in your use of the darkside force . There is far more fertile ground to till here than you have even touched.
                    -snip-

                    Yeah, I got tired of how bitter it was making me to write it, so I just cut it off and posted it as an incomplete outline. Besides, there were a couple of topics you mentioned that I didn't want to waste any more keystrokes on.
                    Why do the things that we treasure most, slip away in time
                    Till to the music we grow deaf, to God's beauty blind
                    Why do the things that connect us slowly pull us apart?
                    Till we fall away in our own darkness, a stranger to our own hearts
                    And life itself, rushing over me
                    Life itself, the wind in black elms,
                    Life itself in your heart and in your eyes, I can't make it without you

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Re: This Team is Built for the Regular Season

                      I thought everyone at Pacers Digest agreed on everything and just came here to hang around, pass inside jokes and exclude others at the expense of free speech?
                      “Success is not final, failure is not fatal: it is the courage to continue that counts.” - Winston Churchill

                      “If you can't be a good example, then you'll just have to serve as a horrible warning.” - Catherine Aird

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Re: This Team is Built for the Regular Season

                        Originally posted by Los Angeles
                        I thought everyone at Pacers Digest agreed on everything and just came here to hang around, pass inside jokes and exclude others at the expense of free speech?
                        Pretty much that's it.


                        Basketball isn't played with computers, spreadsheets, and simulations. ChicagoJ 4/21/13

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Re: This Team is Built for the Regular Season

                          Originally posted by Jay@Section204
                          2000-01 41-41
                          2001-02 42-40
                          2002-03 48-34 (and falling apart at the seams)
                          2003-04 61-21 (with a playoff collapse)
                          2004-05 32-31 and counting
                          I would throw out 2001, that wasn't even close to the makeup of last year's team. 2002 is a stretch, we'd just had the Jalen trade in effect for a couple of months. I'd only lump 02-03, 03-04, and 04-05 together. 02-03 was a combination of youth and immaturity that comes with it, average at best coaching, and a lot of distraction. One was Artest, and I'll get back to him, but the others were JO's stepdad and Tinsley's mom. That has to be a hell of a distraction when you're only in your mid-20s and that goes on.

                          Next season, we go from an average coach to a very good one, and despite the loss of an all-star center we still did far and away better than the year before. Ron still had his moments, but compared to 02-03 he was much better behaved, and I think the proof of that is reflected in our performance last season, in record and in playoff length.

                          This year, we were seeing hints of being snake-bit in the preseason, but with what we had to start the season, we were looking like we could be as good or better this year than the last. 11/19 ****ed it all up.

                          I think of all you've listed, Ron's the only true major hurtle. If he cleans up, this team probably wins a couple titles. If he doesn't, we never get over the hump. I think the rest will sort itself out. Rick's still a hell of a coach, and has proven many times over he can and does adjust when he needs to, and there's no reason to believe he'll stop now. JO and Tinsley may or may not always get hurt, but it will take a couple more injuries to convince me this is more than just "a thing". As someone pointed out, a lot of great players got hurt at least once during their younger years, which is where JO and JT still are. Once they got a little older, they started to stay healthy consistently.

                          It all comes down to Artest. Given his and most of this team's age, blowing them up now is too soon. You have to see were things are headed by sticking with it for a time. That time isn't quite up yet. If next year resembles this year or 02-03 or the slips of 03-04 in the Artest department, then I think you pull the plug. But I want to see how he looks next year before I make my final assessment of Ron and this team.

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Re: This Team is Built for the Regular Season

                            Jay, the most objectionable thing you have posted in this whole thread is that last year's playoff loss was a collapse. That is an assinine comment. 2003 was a collapse, but losing 4-2 to the World Champs was not. Come on you are ruining your credibility with comments like that.

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Re: This Team is Built for the Regular Season

                              Originally posted by Jay@Section204
                              Miami, Detroit, Cleveland, etc....we'll be lucky to get back to the ECFs if we stand pat with the current team.

                              There's no guarantees either way.
                              How do you know? The few times we faced those 3 with anything close to our normal roster, we beat them all, the best of the 3, by double digits. It's not about the players' ability, their ability is enough to beat these teams. There are no guarantees, but I have a lot of confidence in the ability of a JT-Jack-Ron-JO-Dale squad to get the job done. That's a lot of defense, a lot of offense, a lot of toughness, and a lot of rebounding.

                              In the end, it will all hinge on Ron. Not his game, but his off-court actions. The rest I have a LOT of confidence in working itself out.

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Re: This Team is Built for the Regular Season

                                Originally posted by Unclebuck
                                Jay, the most objectionable thing you have posted in this whole thread is that last year's playoff loss was a collapse. That is an assinine comment. 2003 was a collapse, but losing 4-2 to the World Champs was not. Come on you are ruining your credibility with comments like that.
                                I have to agree. For a team's first visit to a deep playoff series, against a great team, they hung tough and played hard. It wasn't until the injuries piled up that we started to collapse, and really that was only game 5. Game 6 was still very hard fought, and close.

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X