edit: let me clean this up a tad
edit: let me clean this up a tad
Do you think that everyone from the Big Ten tournament is from Indy? Of course not. Indy should host the Big Ten tournament not because it's a great sports town (I used to believe it was, but I've changed my mind), but because it has a perfect set-up:
a). Central Location in the Midwest
b). The best basketball arena in the country.Code:
Driving Distance from Indianapolis
Ann Arbor 4 1/3 hrs.
Bloomington 1 1/4 hrs.
Champaign 2 hrs.
Columbus 3 hrs.
East Lansing 4 hrs.
Evanston 3 1/2 hrs.
Iowa City 6 hrs.
Madison 5 1/2 hrs.
Minneapolis 9 3/4 hrs.
State College 8 1/2 hrs.
West Lafayette 1 1/3 hrs.
c). The best basketball arena in the country located DOWNTOWN. Although Chicago's downtown is 100x better than Indy's, the United Center is not located in the middle of the city.
d). Headquarters of the NCAA (an obvious factor)
e). A compact downtown with plenty of hotels, bars, and restaurants (and unfortunately, abundance of chain restaurants which offer safe dining options), and a full scale mall. On a free day, you could walk from your hotel to plenty of monuments/memorials, visit the NCAA Hall of Champions, walk the Canal, and eat on Mass Ave.
f). A mall, convention center, and hotels connected via a Skywalk system incase it's too chilly outside.
That's why we're hosting the Big 10 tournament, not because we're a great sports town.
The Blazers didn't get "lucky" in the 2006 draft to get Aldridge. In fact, they were UNLUCKY. They had the worst record in the league and wound up with the #4 pick in the draft, the worst possible lottery scenario. Nobody cried for them when this happened.
They moved up to #2 in a trade with Chicago. Call them lucky for John Paxson being a moron.
Then they traded Sebastian Telfair and took on an extra year of Raef Lafrentz's contract (and traded away Theo Ratliff who expiries a year earlier) to get Brandon Roy. Definitely took the owner's wallet to do that, but took some good GMing as well.
They also drafted Travis Outlaw, a relatively unknown highschooler in 2003, with a pick in the 20's.
The Blazers still have not cut Darius Miles. He's still on their roster and they haven't bought him out. The guys they've bought out have been Shawn Kemp and Steve Francis (who had a shorter deal than Zach Randolph).
No you can't. You can't even guarantee that you'll be alive tomorrow. None of us can guarantee anything.
Rather than surmising about a hypothetical "you," let's talk about the real Pacers. David Harrison -- who as of today is on the Pacers roster -- regularly gets stoned on illegal drugs. He isn't even willing to stay clean -- what chance is there of his ever playing with all his heart? I think he stated pretty clearly during his interview after the suspension that he prefers NBA journeymanship+marijuana to self-discipline+potential stardom.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kemo
Kemo, your point is well taken, and I think most of us who who criticize the bad guys on the Pacers team yearn for the day when Foster, Granger, Dunleavy, Diener, Rush, Murphy, Owens, Graham and a few other good guys are the face of the Pacers. But that day has not arrived yet.
the Pacers currently. Plus this town is really only able to handle WELL one professional team.
Two teams really put the strain on what fans are willing to spend. Throw in all the other factors at play as Geez said and you have what you have.
My thought was, even if K. P. was our GM, I don't know if we would get the same results because of where the owner is with spending more money when we are this far away. I know the Simons spent when we were close and before the Luxary Tax, but we are far away and now there is the Tax.
OK this is how I see it. And I had 4 season tix 4 rows from the floor at the 3 pt line during the 80's....the 80's for Pete's sake, There are a ton of reasons the fans fail to show up to the games now...but as sated earlier, that doesn't mean they aren't watching. I can watch from the compfort of my Barkolounger and not have to shell out $300/game (if I take the family, which they don't even watch at home so why take em?) that doesn't mean I'm not interested, only pragmatic.
But here's the problem...and I am prolly more dogmatic that most about the P's...
If the Pacers left Indy today, I would never watch another NBA game. at least not until another team moved here...and that wouldn't be long IMO. I'm a Pacer fan...NOT an NBA fan and I'm 100% convinced that is true of most "fans" in Indy.
You know what? This whole subject is really starting to :censored: me off! :mad:
If I decide I don't want to pay to watch a team play that's my prerogative. It doesn't mean I'm not a real sports fan.
I quit getting Pacers season tickets because Reggie retired and the team was raising the price my ticket to a level I didn't think was worth paying in relation to the enjoyment I was getting out of going to the games. (And that was when the team was good.)
What kind of BS is that?!Quote:
Originally Posted by Benner
As I recall when Stephen Jackson was here and he was getting booed people were raising a big stink about it. Now we're supposed to go to games and boo? I don't know about anyone else but I'm not spending $3.45/gallon on gas plus the price of a ticket just so I can go boo at a team. Not when I can stay at home and watch IUPUI and Butler play in their tournament final games. Heck, these days I'd rather go watch a high school team play than watch an NBA team.
It seems a few of you don't understand what Benner meant when he said what he did about race. Though it's a lot deeper to me than I care to explain (UB already touched on it a bit), I'll say this much.
I hate the word "thug" and the way its used to describe black NBA players that find themselves in a bad position with the law. I call Rae Carruth a thug. That's because he actually did something that the true definition of a thug does. He killed.
Thug: 1. a cruel or vicious ruffian, robber, or murderer.
Yet I only hear the word referenced to black players, and recently black people. I take offense to it because it's being used like it's the new 'N' word, not for it's true meaning. Ron Artest, Jamaal Tinsley, Stephen Jackson, Marquis Daniels, and recently Shawne Williams have all been called thugs. Going by the words definition I don't see them as thugs. Lacking judgement, hard headed, troublesome, idiot, etc. ok, that's a good definition of them. But thug is definitely not.
Funny part is that when I was younger, a "thug" in terms of basketball was an enforcer/dirty player. It was interchangable with "goon" or "hack". Rick Mahorn was a thug. Maurice Lucas. Jeff Ruland. Bill Laimbeer.
Now, however, there's a new, nastier connotation, and I do agree with those who say it has racial undertones. I think it's a broad brush that gets used too easily these days.
Everybody needs some sunshine.:angel:
Some people think it's the losing. Some think it's the incidents.
The truth is, it's both.
You have to ask why the Pacers are LAST in the NBA in attendance when they are not the smallest market and not even close to the worst record.
Some conveniently explain this away by stereotyping Indiana fans as being some monolithic mass that can be characterized as fickle fans. That's grasping a false conclusion to avoid the truth.
Again, the truth is, it's both. Why isn't the same being said of other cities? What about Memphis? How in the world is their attendance significantly higher than the Pacers?
The truth is, sharing the Pacers with a friend is like sharing a disease. Sharing the Pacers with a client is equivalent to losing your client. Sharing the Pacers with your children is child abuse. At least, that's the reputation...and it does matter to *SOME* people....both when they decide to spend their entertainment dollars...and when they decide to buy merchandise.
Now, losing probably still accounts for 70-80% of the attendance drop....but that extra 20-30% is worth a solid 1000 fans...which would make all the difference in the world.........
ESPN NBA ATTENDANCE 2007-08
I remember back the year of the brawl when we were playing the Orlando Magic on TNT a week or so after the brawl. During halftime, Charles Barkley brought up the exact use of the word I'm talking about now and how it has some racial undertones. Kenny Smith kept nodding their heads agreeing with Charles. Maybe it's an argument only black people can really understand.
And that Jason Williams kid down in Miami. It's racist to call him a thug.
Just cut out all the racism, you guys. It's just not right!
Personally, I simply don't make a connection with race at all. I may have used the term before, but it's not commonly used in my arsenal of slams. Now, I do think that the term "gangsta" has racial connotations....
BTW, most words have multiple definitions. Here is another one:
Thug: an aggressive and violent young criminal [syn: hood]
IMO, regardless of the term, that definition applies to some of our players based on their own actions. For example, Jackson fits that definition at Club Rio. Tinsley is facing an felony intimidation charge. Both guys are fairly young and facing criminal charges involving aggression/violence. So, thug is a perfect definition here and it could just be that people are using this definition.
BTW, how do you explain the poster who loves Granger or Reggie and calls Jackson and Tinsley thugs? Is he a racist? Or is he sick of off court incidents? Seriously, I doubt people are using the term the way you think they are. In any event, I will refrain from using that word here just to be civil.