Announcement

Collapse

The Rules of Pacers Digest

Hello everyone,

Whether your are a long standing forum member or whether you have just registered today, it's a good idea to read and review the rules below so that you have a very good idea of what to expect when you come to Pacers Digest.

A quick note to new members: Your posts will not immediately show up when you make them. An administrator has to approve at least your first post before the forum software will later upgrade your account to the status of a fully-registered member. This usually happens within a couple of hours or so after your post(s) is/are approved, so you may need to be a little patient at first.

Why do we do this? So that it's more difficult for spammers (be they human or robot) to post, and so users who are banned cannot immediately re-register and start dousing people with verbal flames.

Below are the rules of Pacers Digest. After you have read them, you will have a very good sense of where we are coming from, what we expect, what we don't want to see, and how we react to things.

Rule #1

Pacers Digest is intended to be a place to discuss basketball without having to deal with the kinds of behaviors or attitudes that distract people from sticking with the discussion of the topics at hand. These unwanted distractions can come in many forms, and admittedly it can sometimes be tricky to pin down each and every kind that can rear its ugly head, but we feel that the following examples and explanations cover at least a good portion of that ground and should at least give people a pretty good idea of the kinds of things we actively discourage:

"Anyone who __________ is a liar / a fool / an idiot / a blind homer / has their head buried in the sand / a blind hater / doesn't know basketball / doesn't watch the games"

"People with intelligence will agree with me when I say that __________"

"Only stupid people think / believe / do ___________"

"I can't wait to hear something from PosterX when he/she sees that **insert a given incident or current event that will have probably upset or disappointed PosterX here**"

"He/she is just delusional"

"This thread is stupid / worthless / embarrassing"

"I'm going to take a moment to point and / laugh at PosterX / GroupOfPeopleY who thought / believed *insert though/belief here*"

"Remember when PosterX said OldCommentY that no longer looks good? "

In general, if a comment goes from purely on topic to something 'ad hominem' (personal jabs, personal shots, attacks, flames, however you want to call it, towards a person, or a group of people, or a given city/state/country of people), those are most likely going to be found intolerable.

We also dissuade passive aggressive behavior. This can be various things, but common examples include statements that are basically meant to imply someone is either stupid or otherwise incapable of holding a rational conversation. This can include (but is not limited to) laughing at someone's conclusions rather than offering an honest rebuttal, asking people what game they were watching, or another common problem is Poster X will say "that player isn't that bad" and then Poster Y will say something akin to "LOL you think that player is good". We're not going to tolerate those kinds of comments out of respect for the community at large and for the sake of trying to just have an honest conversation.

Now, does the above cover absolutely every single kind of distraction that is unwanted? Probably not, but you should by now have a good idea of the general types of things we will be discouraging. The above examples are meant to give you a good feel for / idea of what we're looking for. If something new or different than the above happens to come along and results in the same problem (that being, any other attitude or behavior that ultimately distracts from actually just discussing the topic at hand, or that is otherwise disrespectful to other posters), we can and we will take action to curb this as well, so please don't take this to mean that if you managed to technically avoid saying something exactly like one of the above examples that you are then somehow off the hook.

That all having been said, our goal is to do so in a generally kind and respectful way, and that doesn't mean the moment we see something we don't like that somebody is going to be suspended or banned, either. It just means that at the very least we will probably say something about it, quite possibly snipping out the distracting parts of the post in question while leaving alone the parts that are actually just discussing the topics, and in the event of a repeating or excessive problem, then we will start issuing infractions to try to further discourage further repeat problems, and if it just never seems to improve, then finally suspensions or bans will come into play. We would prefer it never went that far, and most of the time for most of our posters, it won't ever have to.

A slip up every once and a while is pretty normal, but, again, when it becomes repetitive or excessive, something will be done. Something occasional is probably going to be let go (within reason), but when it starts to become habitual or otherwise a pattern, odds are very good that we will step in.

There's always a small minority that like to push people's buttons and/or test their own boundaries with regards to the administrators, and in the case of someone acting like that, please be aware that this is not a court of law, but a private website run by people who are simply trying to do the right thing as they see it. If we feel that you are a special case that needs to be dealt with in an exceptional way because your behavior isn't explicitly mirroring one of our above examples of what we generally discourage, we can and we will take atypical action to prevent this from continuing if you are not cooperative with us.

Also please be aware that you will not be given a pass simply by claiming that you were 'only joking,' because quite honestly, when someone really is just joking, for one thing most people tend to pick up on the joke, including the person or group that is the target of the joke, and for another thing, in the event where an honest joke gets taken seriously and it upsets or angers someone, the person who is truly 'only joking' will quite commonly go out of his / her way to apologize and will try to mend fences. People who are dishonest about their statements being 'jokes' do not do so, and in turn that becomes a clear sign of what is really going on. It's nothing new.

In any case, quite frankly, the overall quality and health of the entire forum's community is more important than any one troublesome user will ever be, regardless of exactly how a problem is exhibiting itself, and if it comes down to us having to make a choice between you versus the greater health and happiness of the entire community, the community of this forum will win every time.

Lastly, there are also some posters, who are generally great contributors and do not otherwise cause any problems, who sometimes feel it's their place to provoke or to otherwise 'mess with' that small minority of people described in the last paragraph, and while we possibly might understand why you might feel you WANT to do something like that, the truth is we can't actually tolerate that kind of behavior from you any more than we can tolerate the behavior from them. So if we feel that you are trying to provoke those other posters into doing or saying something that will get themselves into trouble, then we will start to view you as a problem as well, because of the same reason as before: The overall health of the forum comes first, and trying to stir the pot with someone like that doesn't help, it just makes it worse. Some will simply disagree with this philosophy, but if so, then so be it because ultimately we have to do what we think is best so long as it's up to us.

If you see a problem that we haven't addressed, the best and most appropriate course for a forum member to take here is to look over to the left of the post in question. See underneath that poster's name, avatar, and other info, down where there's a little triangle with an exclamation point (!) in it? Click that. That allows you to report the post to the admins so we can definitely notice it and give it a look to see what we feel we should do about it. Beyond that, obviously it's human nature sometimes to want to speak up to the poster in question who has bothered you, but we would ask that you try to refrain from doing so because quite often what happens is two or more posters all start going back and forth about the original offending post, and suddenly the entire thread is off topic or otherwise derailed. So while the urge to police it yourself is understandable, it's best to just report it to us and let us handle it. Thank you!

All of the above is going to be subject to a case by case basis, but generally and broadly speaking, this should give everyone a pretty good idea of how things will typically / most often be handled.

Rule #2

If the actions of an administrator inspire you to make a comment, criticism, or express a concern about it, there is a wrong place and a couple of right places to do so.

The wrong place is to do so in the original thread in which the administrator took action. For example, if a post gets an infraction, or a post gets deleted, or a comment within a larger post gets clipped out, in a thread discussing Paul George, the wrong thing to do is to distract from the discussion of Paul George by adding your off topic thoughts on what the administrator did.

The right places to do so are:

A) Start a thread about the specific incident you want to talk about on the Feedback board. This way you are able to express yourself in an area that doesn't throw another thread off topic, and this way others can add their two cents as well if they wish, and additionally if there's something that needs to be said by the administrators, that is where they will respond to it.

B) Send a private message to the administrators, and they can respond to you that way.

If this is done the wrong way, those comments will be deleted, and if it's a repeating problem then it may also receive an infraction as well.

Rule #3

If a poster is bothering you, and an administrator has not or will not deal with that poster to the extent that you would prefer, you have a powerful tool at your disposal, one that has recently been upgraded and is now better than ever: The ability to ignore a user.

When you ignore a user, you will unfortunately still see some hints of their existence (nothing we can do about that), however, it does the following key things:

A) Any post they make will be completely invisible as you scroll through a thread.

B) The new addition to this feature: If someone QUOTES a user you are ignoring, you do not have to read who it was, or what that poster said, unless you go out of your way to click on a link to find out who it is and what they said.

To utilize this feature, from any page on Pacers Digest, scroll to the top of the page, look to the top right where it says 'Settings' and click that. From the settings page, look to the left side of the page where it says 'My Settings', and look down from there until you see 'Edit Ignore List' and click that. From here, it will say 'Add a Member to Your List...' Beneath that, click in the text box to the right of 'User Name', type in or copy & paste the username of the poster you are ignoring, and once their name is in the box, look over to the far right and click the 'Okay' button. All done!

Rule #4

Regarding infractions, currently they carry a value of one point each, and that point will expire in 31 days. If at any point a poster is carrying three points at the same time, that poster will be suspended until the oldest of the three points expires.

Rule #5

When you share or paste content or articles from another website, you must include the URL/link back to where you found it, who wrote it, and what website it's from. Said content will be removed if this doesn't happen.

An example:

If I copy and paste an article from the Indianapolis Star website, I would post something like this:

http://www.linktothearticlegoeshere.com/article
Title of the Article
Author's Name
Indianapolis Star

Rule #6

We cannot tolerate illegal videos on Pacers Digest. This means do not share any links to them, do not mention any websites that host them or link to them, do not describe how to find them in any way, and do not ask about them. Posts doing anything of the sort will be removed, the offenders will be contacted privately, and if the problem becomes habitual, you will be suspended, and if it still persists, you will probably be banned.

The legal means of watching or listening to NBA games are NBA League Pass Broadband (for US, or for International; both cost money) and NBA Audio League Pass (which is free). Look for them on NBA.com.

Rule #7

Provocative statements in a signature, or as an avatar, or as the 'tagline' beneath a poster's username (where it says 'Member' or 'Administrator' by default, if it is not altered) are an unwanted distraction that will more than likely be removed on sight. There can be shades of gray to this, but in general this could be something political or religious that is likely going to provoke or upset people, or otherwise something that is mean-spirited at the expense of a poster, a group of people, or a population.

It may or may not go without saying, but this goes for threads and posts as well, particularly when it's not made on the off-topic board (Market Square).

We do make exceptions if we feel the content is both innocuous and unlikely to cause social problems on the forum (such as wishing someone a Merry Christmas or a Happy Easter), and we also also make exceptions if such topics come up with regards to a sports figure (such as the Lance Stephenson situation bringing up discussions of domestic abuse and the law, or when Jason Collins came out as gay and how that lead to some discussion about gay rights).

However, once the discussion seems to be more/mostly about the political issues instead of the sports figure or his specific situation, the thread is usually closed.

Rule #8

We prefer self-restraint and/or modesty when making jokes or off topic comments in a sports discussion thread. They can be fun, but sometimes they derail or distract from a topic, and we don't want to see that happen. If we feel it is a problem, we will either delete or move those posts from the thread.

Rule #9

Generally speaking, we try to be a "PG-13" rated board, and we don't want to see sexual content or similarly suggestive content. Vulgarity is a more muddled issue, though again we prefer things to lean more towards "PG-13" than "R". If we feel things have gone too far, we will step in.

Rule #10

We like small signatures, not big signatures. The bigger the signature, the more likely it is an annoying or distracting signature.

Rule #11

Do not advertise anything without talking about it with the administrators first. This includes advertising with your signature, with your avatar, through private messaging, and/or by making a thread or post.
See more
See less

Indy 500 Photos and comments

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Indy 500 Photos and comments



    Pre-race favorite Castroneves stalled the car in the pits which shuffled him back and caused the team to roll the dice on a fuel strategy to get him back up front. Not getting a needed yellow he was forced to pit in the waning laps costing him any chance at the win.
    ----



    Graham Rahal was assessed a costly black flag for blocking.

    ---


    Tomas Sheckter leaves the pits.

    ---




    KV Racing and driver Takuma Sato brought back the famous green and yellow Lotus paint scheme to the speedway.

    ---


    Jack Nicholoson waved the green flag to start the race... then hung around in the flag stand to wave the flag a couple more times for restarts after some early yellow flags.

    ---


    Yes, Georgetown RD is open for vehicular traffic...


    ----



    Tony Kanan drove his heart out. It's a shame his final finishing position didn't ultimately indicate the top 3 position he deserved.

    ---


    Vitor Meira returned to Indy after a bad crash last year.
    It's a good time to point out that the AJ Foyt owned car is sponsored by ABC SUPPLY Company... not ABC the television network. It's interesting how the ABC announcers never mention that or clarify it.

    ---


    Dan Wheldon had a seemingly quiet but excellent race making it all the way to P2 for the finish and also leaving a lot of question marks about whether he could've overtaken Dario on that final lap as Dario tried to conserve fuel. The yellow flag on the last lap made the point moot.

    ---


    Name the driver that's 15 minutes of fame are about up-
    Former crowd favorite Danica Patrick pictured above.

    ---




    Race winner Dario Franchitti heads to Victory Circle after winning the 2010 Indy 500.

    ------------------------------------

    Comments-
    Hard to say Dario didn't deserve this win. He was hooked up all day long. Still, the fuel strategies at the end could've changed everything if there'd been an earlier yellow... or no last lap yellow at all. Dario was conserving all the fuel he could and there will always be some question if he could've withstood a last lap challenge and still had enough fuel to make it. Meanwhile, cars that were ahead of him in the final laps were going to have to stop for fuel (splash and go) unless they got a long yellow that would allow THEM to conserve enough to run to the end.

    It was interesting (and to me it was funny) to hear the boos when Danica was introduced before the race. IMHO the crowd didn't sour on her when she threw her team under the bus at quals... that was just the tipping point when the general public had enough of the princess. She is a total media creation who has parlayed some hype and sex appeal, raw talent, and advertising money into a couple of good rides. But she's not really done much special with those rides in whole and realistically has probably underperformed all things considered. Yes, she finished 6th today... but probably deserved 15-16th... But she again drove just fast enough that her team can utilize a conservative strategy to move her up by fuel/pit strategies. Last year she did have a decent season but again she wasn't a threat to win. I see her problem two-fold: She's not as good as she thinks she is and she's not actually evolving as a driver who knows her machine (She would rather spend time marketing herself than concentrate on understanding her car and the nuts and bolts of racing).... AND.... the field is more talented as a whole and the cars are so well figured out that the separation between her and other drivers has grown. Plus I believe Indycar took away the weight advantage she had and mandated ballast be added to equalize car and driver weights (I could be wrong about that... although it was discussed and I thought implemented). That's probably why her qualifying has dropped off.

    Anyway, Danica needs to put a quarter in the fame machine because her 15 minutes is about to run out. It's to the point now that if she was to win the 500 I'm afraid it wouldn't be a crowning achievement and a media bonanza.... It would be questions about how far Indy has fallen when Danica Patrick can win it.

    IZOD's plan of upping the star power of Indy is apparent. Whether that pays dividends in the future I don't know. I think a bigger star in the Pace car would be smart.

    I harp on this every year- Empty seats breed empty seats. The Tower Terrace seats on the north west side of the speedway are not getting filled. They just aren't that good of seats. I'm not sure how much they cost but I suspect 75.00... They should be more like 35... or 25.00. And maybe they are. If so, that's certainly not good. If it was me, I'd admit defeat on those seats, lower the price first and foremost, and consider painting them blue or green and declare them 'general admission... first come first served' or just rip the lower ones out and replace them with shops or a VIP lounge with windows or something.... and leave the more desirable higher seats.

    It seemed like traffic indicated a bigger crowd, but I still saw empty patches of seats where I wouldn't expect them (besides the aforementioned Tower Terrace seats). I'm curious if the heavier traffic I'm experiencing is really more people or just a shift in the time people are arriving. And if it is more people, is it general admission people?

    I also noticed a lot of empty seats as the race went on that were filled earlier in the race. Do these people just come to see the start and the festivities and leave (to beat the traffic?)?? Do they move to the infield? Today it seemed more noticeable than before so maybe the heat cooked some people out.

    I hope the new management at the speedway see the need to allow some innovation back into the Indy 500 if not the series. They've dumbed it down and allowed the current cars to mature to the point that they are costing themselves money in the name of saving money for teams IMHO. When the lack of innovation creates a lack of interest it DRAINS money away from the event/series.

    More than anything I think qualifying speeds need to be allowed to creep back up. I'm fine with using technology to keep racing speeds down but the cars need to be touching up against qualifying speeds that make you go "wow". ...Not running the same speeds for several years. Maybe mandate a qualifying motor and a more conservative racing motor. Of course safety is important but there has to be a line and technology should be able to move and improve that safety line as the speeds creep up too.

    You combine "A neeeeeeew traaaaaack record" with the new qualifying format and I think you have something.

    I'm warming to the idea that Brian Barnhart needs replaced as part of the housecleaning. The race start needs tightened up again and his reasoning for not doing it doesn't hold water with me. It's part of what makes the start of the race exciting. Barnhart seems to be a little too conservative and little stubborn to boot. I also thought some of the black flags today were iffy and probably quick. And probably not consistent either.

    I know having "Indy Specialists" (Indy one off drivers) has been around a long time. I'm wondering if the new oval AND road/street course championships (as well as the overall series championship) could be used in a way to get some of these oval specialists rides for just the ovals... Just as it gets them rides just for Indy. I guess it depends on what when the oval or street/road championship pays (if anything, besides a trophy and your name in print).

    Yes, it was hot today... .but my seats are shaded so it wasn't too bad. OTOH the walk back to the car was pretty brutal with the sun bearing down.
    Last edited by Bball; 05-31-2010, 02:04 AM.
    Nuntius was right for a while. I was wrong for a while. But ultimately I was right and Frank Vogel has been let go.

    ------

    "A player who makes a team great is more valuable than a great player. Losing yourself in the group, for the good of the group, thatís teamwork."

    -John Wooden

  • #2
    Re: Indy 500 Photos and comments

    Great pics Bball. I was really rooting for TK to come from last to first and he raced so hard but Dario was just so fast. On a Pacers note...I did run into Jeff Foster and his wife behind the pits and he seemed to be doing very well.
    Vita sine honore vivere not est.

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Indy 500 Photos and comments

      I was rooting for TK, but I am glad that Dario got it. Ever since he was with Andretti I've been a fan.

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Indy 500 Photos and comments

        Originally posted by Bball
        I'm warming to the idea that Brian Barnhart needs replaced as part of the housecleaning. The race start needs tightened up again and his reasoning for not doing it doesn't hold water with me. It's part of what makes the start of the race exciting. Barnhart seems to be a little too conservative and little stubborn to boot. I also thought some of the black flags today were iffy and probably quick. And probably not consistent either.
        I heard on Versus that the revamped qualifying was Brian's idea. As for the start of the race sure it could have been cleaner, but how anti-climatic is it to not start when they're supposed to? I'd rather have them spaced out and not wreck in first turn. Personally I didn't have a problem with the black flags. They're never going to catch them all. As for the iggy ones it might just have been a culmination of a few iffy ones by the same driver.

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Indy 500 Photos and comments

          Originally posted by grace View Post
          I heard on Versus that the revamped qualifying was Brian's idea. As for the start of the race sure it could have been cleaner, but how anti-climatic is it to not start when they're supposed to?

          You mean throwing a yellow and making them do it again? It's happened before... like last year...
          And I agree, that's pretty anti-climatic!

          I was talking more about making some changes in the start back to how it was pre-IRL. I'd like to see the tighten the rows up with a tighter gap between rows. The reason they don't is Barnhart thinks this minimizes the chance of a wreck taking out a chunk of the field at the start. Well, that would've been true for 1990 as it is in 2010. Part of the excitement of the start is the drama and skill needed to navigate the start. Dumbing it down when drivers like Jack Miller, Marty Roth, or Milka Duno were making the field might've been a good idea. But the overall quality level of the field is back to being as balanced as it's ever been.

          But this is a two part complaint... Even if you don't tighten the rows back up they need to move the acceleration point for the start to the straightaway. It looked to me like Helio, and then the whole front row were on the gas before they even got into turn 4. And before the green was even out.

          There's always been a risk of a wreck at the start. There's lots of things that can be done to minimize the chance of wrecks throughout the entire race but at some point they become counter-productive to the drama of man and machine... man vs machine...

          I suppose if they tighten the start and move the acceleration point back to the front stretch and we get 2-3 years in a row of botched starts then they could go back. But for years and years we had tight starts.


          I'd rather have them spaced out and not wreck in first turn. Personally I didn't have a problem with the black flags. They're never going to catch them all. As for the iggy ones it might just have been a culmination of a few iffy ones by the same driver.
          Rahal did block... but it wasn't the most blatant or dangerous block I'd ever seen. One man's block is another man's 'protecting his position'. I think Wheldon's reaction made Rahal's block look worse than it really was. Especially when you look at the in car view. But the penalty was assessed before Graham got to T4. Pretty quick trigger finger to have really taken time to look at the various angles and make sure officials saw what they thought they saw.

          But I suppose my point here may not be that there shouldn't be a penalty... just that there should be levels of penalty depending on how blatant the move was. Like maybe an extra warning or two...or a fine for blocking... and the next stage of the penalty be either the driver forced to give up a position (or take a time penalty at the next pitstop).... and THEN a black flag if it keeps happening.
          Nuntius was right for a while. I was wrong for a while. But ultimately I was right and Frank Vogel has been let go.

          ------

          "A player who makes a team great is more valuable than a great player. Losing yourself in the group, for the good of the group, thatís teamwork."

          -John Wooden

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Indy 500 Photos and comments

            Sure you can put the rows closer together at the start. Just ask Mario how well that worked in '82.

            In the drivers meeting I don't know what was said about blocking. I'm sure they were warned; therefore, it's their down fault if they got caught.

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Indy 500 Photos and comments

              Originally posted by grace View Post
              Sure you can put the rows closer together at the start. Just ask Mario how well that worked in '82.
              I'm gonna ask that "damned Coogan"

              In the drivers meeting I don't know what was said about blocking. I'm sure they were warned; therefore, it's their down fault if they got caught.
              I don't disagree. I'm just saying for something that has different degrees to it, plus something that can be a judgment call, perhaps the penalty should have more degrees to it as well including a hefty fine that would still penalize the driver/team but not necessarily penalize the fans or the race itself.
              Nuntius was right for a while. I was wrong for a while. But ultimately I was right and Frank Vogel has been let go.

              ------

              "A player who makes a team great is more valuable than a great player. Losing yourself in the group, for the good of the group, thatís teamwork."

              -John Wooden

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Indy 500 Photos and comments

                http://www.scottrichardsonphotograph...wreck-5-30-10/

                Go to the above site and scroll down to see a series of excellent still photos of the Conway crash. Pretty amazing his injuries were not much worse than they were. These photos really show you that there were a series of close calls with the way things played out that went in Conway's favor.
                Nuntius was right for a while. I was wrong for a while. But ultimately I was right and Frank Vogel has been let go.

                ------

                "A player who makes a team great is more valuable than a great player. Losing yourself in the group, for the good of the group, thatís teamwork."

                -John Wooden

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Indy 500 Photos and comments

                  Originally posted by Bball View Post
                  http://www.scottrichardsonphotograph...wreck-5-30-10/

                  Go to the above site and scroll down to see a series of excellent still photos of the Conway crash. Pretty amazing his injuries were not much worse than they were. These photos really show you that there were a series of close calls with the way things played out that went in Conway's favor.
                  I have to admit, while watching that wreck live, I thought for sure we were seeing another tragic death on the track.

                  It was nothing short of amazing/remarkable/miraculous/insert favorite hyperbolic word here, that he came away as he did.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Indy 500 Photos and comments

                    See though, I thought the exact opposite. The car responded in the exact way it is supposed to in those situations. I know this is not a complete rule, but generally it seems lately, the more spectacular the crash (I.E. Flips, parts flying off, etc.) the less likely a driver will suffer fatal injuries. Severe injuries? Yes. Fatal? not as much. This is a result IMO of the flips and things of that nature being the main thing that was focused on from a safety perspective for many years.

                    Now the much less spectacular crashes, blunt force into the wall for example, where the car is always grounded and usually stays in one piece are the ones resulting in the fatalities.


                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Indy 500 Photos and comments

                      Having the car disentigrate on contact? Yeah, that helps spread the energy/ impact out.

                      Having the car sailing, top first, into the wall/ fence with "minimal" protection for the driver's head? That's freaking scary. The roll bar or whatever is up there really did its job.
                      Why do the things that we treasure most, slip away in time
                      Till to the music we grow deaf, to God's beauty blind
                      Why do the things that connect us slowly pull us apart?
                      Till we fall away in our own darkness, a stranger to our own hearts
                      And life itself, rushing over me
                      Life itself, the wind in black elms,
                      Life itself in your heart and in your eyes, I can't make it without you

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Indy 500 Photos and comments

                        Originally posted by Indy View Post
                        See though, I thought the exact opposite. The car responded in the exact way it is supposed to in those situations. I know this is not a complete rule, but generally it seems lately, the more spectacular the crash (I.E. Flips, parts flying off, etc.) the less likely a driver will suffer fatal injuries. Severe injuries? Yes. Fatal? not as much. This is a result IMO of the flips and things of that nature being the main thing that was focused on from a safety perspective for many years.

                        Now the much less spectacular crashes, blunt force into the wall for example, where the car is always grounded and usually stays in one piece are the ones resulting in the fatalities.
                        Everything was there for traumatic or fatal injuries. A car flying into the catch fence and spinning isn't good. His head could've easily contacted one of the steel poles or the concrete wall. Had the car went into the fence with the front first he likely would've suffered major leg and foot injuries (to the point of bringing amputation into the discussion). Coming back to the track he could've land on another car either injuring that driving or himself worse by his head being exposed. Even landing on the track the potential was there for a head impact against the pavement. And yet again, the potential for the exposed tub to have been struck by another car.

                        Any time an Indycar goes into violent flips it isn't good. ...And doubly so if it goes into flight and catches the fence.
                        Nuntius was right for a while. I was wrong for a while. But ultimately I was right and Frank Vogel has been let go.

                        ------

                        "A player who makes a team great is more valuable than a great player. Losing yourself in the group, for the good of the group, thatís teamwork."

                        -John Wooden

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Indy 500 Photos and comments

                          But don't you expect the extended roll bar to do its job of keeping the driver safe?

                          Now of course, if he had gotten hit by another car as he landed that would have been extremely dangerous, but then you are changing the rules of the accident. I don't know I just felt like the car handled the situation exactly the way it was designed to.


                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Indy 500 Photos and comments

                            Originally posted by Trader Joe View Post
                            But don't you expect the extended roll bar to do its job of keeping the driver safe?

                            Now of course, if he had gotten hit by another car as he landed that would have been extremely dangerous, but then you are changing the rules of the accident. I don't know I just felt like the car handled the situation exactly the way it was designed to.
                            On a personal level, I don't ever want to be airborne and sailing, at 200+ mph, head first into a fence/ retaining wall. Roll bar or not.

                            Why do the things that we treasure most, slip away in time
                            Till to the music we grow deaf, to God's beauty blind
                            Why do the things that connect us slowly pull us apart?
                            Till we fall away in our own darkness, a stranger to our own hearts
                            And life itself, rushing over me
                            Life itself, the wind in black elms,
                            Life itself in your heart and in your eyes, I can't make it without you

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Indy 500 Photos and comments

                              I know, but I thought we were dealing with race car drivers?

                              I guess my point is lost, nevermind.


                              Comment

                              Working...
                              X