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The Rules of Pacers Digest

Hello everyone,

Whether your are a long standing forum member or whether you have just registered today, it's a good idea to read and review the rules below so that you have a very good idea of what to expect when you come to Pacers Digest.

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Why do we do this? So that it's more difficult for spammers (be they human or robot) to post, and so users who are banned cannot immediately re-register and start dousing people with verbal flames.

Below are the rules of Pacers Digest. After you have read them, you will have a very good sense of where we are coming from, what we expect, what we don't want to see, and how we react to things.

Rule #1

Pacers Digest is intended to be a place to discuss basketball without having to deal with the kinds of behaviors or attitudes that distract people from sticking with the discussion of the topics at hand. These unwanted distractions can come in many forms, and admittedly it can sometimes be tricky to pin down each and every kind that can rear its ugly head, but we feel that the following examples and explanations cover at least a good portion of that ground and should at least give people a pretty good idea of the kinds of things we actively discourage:

"Anyone who __________ is a liar / a fool / an idiot / a blind homer / has their head buried in the sand / a blind hater / doesn't know basketball / doesn't watch the games"

"People with intelligence will agree with me when I say that __________"

"Only stupid people think / believe / do ___________"

"I can't wait to hear something from PosterX when he/she sees that **insert a given incident or current event that will have probably upset or disappointed PosterX here**"

"He/she is just delusional"

"This thread is stupid / worthless / embarrassing"

"I'm going to take a moment to point and / laugh at PosterX / GroupOfPeopleY who thought / believed *insert though/belief here*"

"Remember when PosterX said OldCommentY that no longer looks good? "

In general, if a comment goes from purely on topic to something 'ad hominem' (personal jabs, personal shots, attacks, flames, however you want to call it, towards a person, or a group of people, or a given city/state/country of people), those are most likely going to be found intolerable.

We also dissuade passive aggressive behavior. This can be various things, but common examples include statements that are basically meant to imply someone is either stupid or otherwise incapable of holding a rational conversation. This can include (but is not limited to) laughing at someone's conclusions rather than offering an honest rebuttal, asking people what game they were watching, or another common problem is Poster X will say "that player isn't that bad" and then Poster Y will say something akin to "LOL you think that player is good". We're not going to tolerate those kinds of comments out of respect for the community at large and for the sake of trying to just have an honest conversation.

Now, does the above cover absolutely every single kind of distraction that is unwanted? Probably not, but you should by now have a good idea of the general types of things we will be discouraging. The above examples are meant to give you a good feel for / idea of what we're looking for. If something new or different than the above happens to come along and results in the same problem (that being, any other attitude or behavior that ultimately distracts from actually just discussing the topic at hand, or that is otherwise disrespectful to other posters), we can and we will take action to curb this as well, so please don't take this to mean that if you managed to technically avoid saying something exactly like one of the above examples that you are then somehow off the hook.

That all having been said, our goal is to do so in a generally kind and respectful way, and that doesn't mean the moment we see something we don't like that somebody is going to be suspended or banned, either. It just means that at the very least we will probably say something about it, quite possibly snipping out the distracting parts of the post in question while leaving alone the parts that are actually just discussing the topics, and in the event of a repeating or excessive problem, then we will start issuing infractions to try to further discourage further repeat problems, and if it just never seems to improve, then finally suspensions or bans will come into play. We would prefer it never went that far, and most of the time for most of our posters, it won't ever have to.

A slip up every once and a while is pretty normal, but, again, when it becomes repetitive or excessive, something will be done. Something occasional is probably going to be let go (within reason), but when it starts to become habitual or otherwise a pattern, odds are very good that we will step in.

There's always a small minority that like to push people's buttons and/or test their own boundaries with regards to the administrators, and in the case of someone acting like that, please be aware that this is not a court of law, but a private website run by people who are simply trying to do the right thing as they see it. If we feel that you are a special case that needs to be dealt with in an exceptional way because your behavior isn't explicitly mirroring one of our above examples of what we generally discourage, we can and we will take atypical action to prevent this from continuing if you are not cooperative with us.

Also please be aware that you will not be given a pass simply by claiming that you were 'only joking,' because quite honestly, when someone really is just joking, for one thing most people tend to pick up on the joke, including the person or group that is the target of the joke, and for another thing, in the event where an honest joke gets taken seriously and it upsets or angers someone, the person who is truly 'only joking' will quite commonly go out of his / her way to apologize and will try to mend fences. People who are dishonest about their statements being 'jokes' do not do so, and in turn that becomes a clear sign of what is really going on. It's nothing new.

In any case, quite frankly, the overall quality and health of the entire forum's community is more important than any one troublesome user will ever be, regardless of exactly how a problem is exhibiting itself, and if it comes down to us having to make a choice between you versus the greater health and happiness of the entire community, the community of this forum will win every time.

Lastly, there are also some posters, who are generally great contributors and do not otherwise cause any problems, who sometimes feel it's their place to provoke or to otherwise 'mess with' that small minority of people described in the last paragraph, and while we possibly might understand why you might feel you WANT to do something like that, the truth is we can't actually tolerate that kind of behavior from you any more than we can tolerate the behavior from them. So if we feel that you are trying to provoke those other posters into doing or saying something that will get themselves into trouble, then we will start to view you as a problem as well, because of the same reason as before: The overall health of the forum comes first, and trying to stir the pot with someone like that doesn't help, it just makes it worse. Some will simply disagree with this philosophy, but if so, then so be it because ultimately we have to do what we think is best so long as it's up to us.

If you see a problem that we haven't addressed, the best and most appropriate course for a forum member to take here is to look over to the left of the post in question. See underneath that poster's name, avatar, and other info, down where there's a little triangle with an exclamation point (!) in it? Click that. That allows you to report the post to the admins so we can definitely notice it and give it a look to see what we feel we should do about it. Beyond that, obviously it's human nature sometimes to want to speak up to the poster in question who has bothered you, but we would ask that you try to refrain from doing so because quite often what happens is two or more posters all start going back and forth about the original offending post, and suddenly the entire thread is off topic or otherwise derailed. So while the urge to police it yourself is understandable, it's best to just report it to us and let us handle it. Thank you!

All of the above is going to be subject to a case by case basis, but generally and broadly speaking, this should give everyone a pretty good idea of how things will typically / most often be handled.

Rule #2

If the actions of an administrator inspire you to make a comment, criticism, or express a concern about it, there is a wrong place and a couple of right places to do so.

The wrong place is to do so in the original thread in which the administrator took action. For example, if a post gets an infraction, or a post gets deleted, or a comment within a larger post gets clipped out, in a thread discussing Paul George, the wrong thing to do is to distract from the discussion of Paul George by adding your off topic thoughts on what the administrator did.

The right places to do so are:

A) Start a thread about the specific incident you want to talk about on the Feedback board. This way you are able to express yourself in an area that doesn't throw another thread off topic, and this way others can add their two cents as well if they wish, and additionally if there's something that needs to be said by the administrators, that is where they will respond to it.

B) Send a private message to the administrators, and they can respond to you that way.

If this is done the wrong way, those comments will be deleted, and if it's a repeating problem then it may also receive an infraction as well.

Rule #3

If a poster is bothering you, and an administrator has not or will not deal with that poster to the extent that you would prefer, you have a powerful tool at your disposal, one that has recently been upgraded and is now better than ever: The ability to ignore a user.

When you ignore a user, you will unfortunately still see some hints of their existence (nothing we can do about that), however, it does the following key things:

A) Any post they make will be completely invisible as you scroll through a thread.

B) The new addition to this feature: If someone QUOTES a user you are ignoring, you do not have to read who it was, or what that poster said, unless you go out of your way to click on a link to find out who it is and what they said.

To utilize this feature, from any page on Pacers Digest, scroll to the top of the page, look to the top right where it says 'Settings' and click that. From the settings page, look to the left side of the page where it says 'My Settings', and look down from there until you see 'Edit Ignore List' and click that. From here, it will say 'Add a Member to Your List...' Beneath that, click in the text box to the right of 'User Name', type in or copy & paste the username of the poster you are ignoring, and once their name is in the box, look over to the far right and click the 'Okay' button. All done!

Rule #4

Regarding infractions, currently they carry a value of one point each, and that point will expire in 31 days. If at any point a poster is carrying three points at the same time, that poster will be suspended until the oldest of the three points expires.

Rule #5

When you share or paste content or articles from another website, you must include the URL/link back to where you found it, who wrote it, and what website it's from. Said content will be removed if this doesn't happen.

An example:

If I copy and paste an article from the Indianapolis Star website, I would post something like this:

http://www.linktothearticlegoeshere.com/article
Title of the Article
Author's Name
Indianapolis Star

Rule #6

We cannot tolerate illegal videos on Pacers Digest. This means do not share any links to them, do not mention any websites that host them or link to them, do not describe how to find them in any way, and do not ask about them. Posts doing anything of the sort will be removed, the offenders will be contacted privately, and if the problem becomes habitual, you will be suspended, and if it still persists, you will probably be banned.

The legal means of watching or listening to NBA games are NBA League Pass Broadband (for US, or for International; both cost money) and NBA Audio League Pass (which is free). Look for them on NBA.com.

Rule #7

Provocative statements in a signature, or as an avatar, or as the 'tagline' beneath a poster's username (where it says 'Member' or 'Administrator' by default, if it is not altered) are an unwanted distraction that will more than likely be removed on sight. There can be shades of gray to this, but in general this could be something political or religious that is likely going to provoke or upset people, or otherwise something that is mean-spirited at the expense of a poster, a group of people, or a population.

It may or may not go without saying, but this goes for threads and posts as well, particularly when it's not made on the off-topic board (Market Square).

We do make exceptions if we feel the content is both innocuous and unlikely to cause social problems on the forum (such as wishing someone a Merry Christmas or a Happy Easter), and we also also make exceptions if such topics come up with regards to a sports figure (such as the Lance Stephenson situation bringing up discussions of domestic abuse and the law, or when Jason Collins came out as gay and how that lead to some discussion about gay rights).

However, once the discussion seems to be more/mostly about the political issues instead of the sports figure or his specific situation, the thread is usually closed.

Rule #8

We prefer self-restraint and/or modesty when making jokes or off topic comments in a sports discussion thread. They can be fun, but sometimes they derail or distract from a topic, and we don't want to see that happen. If we feel it is a problem, we will either delete or move those posts from the thread.

Rule #9

Generally speaking, we try to be a "PG-13" rated board, and we don't want to see sexual content or similarly suggestive content. Vulgarity is a more muddled issue, though again we prefer things to lean more towards "PG-13" than "R". If we feel things have gone too far, we will step in.

Rule #10

We like small signatures, not big signatures. The bigger the signature, the more likely it is an annoying or distracting signature.

Rule #11

Do not advertise anything without talking about it with the administrators first. This includes advertising with your signature, with your avatar, through private messaging, and/or by making a thread or post.
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Is Paul George becoming a star?

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  • Re: Is Paul George becoming a star?

    I think West gets the nod from coaches over Paul just due to age. With that said any chance we see Paul at All star weekend for anything else?
    If games are won and lost on a calculator and piece of paper, then why do we bother to play them?

    @LetsTalkPacers

    Comment


    • Re: Is Paul George becoming a star?

      Originally posted by Goyle View Post
      He's getting it regardless.
      If he's become consistently good enough that he will definitely get offered a max contract, it's a good thing we will still have a 5 year max contract available.
      Time for a new sig.

      Comment


      • Re: Is Paul George becoming a star?

        Originally posted by aamcguy View Post
        If he's become consistently good enough that he will definitely get offered a max contract, it's a good thing we will still have a 5 year max contract available.
        That contract was always meant for him.

        Comment


        • Re: Is Paul George becoming a star?

          Originally posted by ilive4sports View Post
          As a follow up to this: Since PG laid the goose egg in GSW, we have played 15 games. Paul's numbers:
          20.7 ppg
          8.2 rpg
          4.1 apg
          1.0 bpg
          1.8 spg
          47% shooting
          41% from 3
          85% from the line
          4 fta's a game

          PG is playing at a pretty incredible level. Love watching this guy play. Its clicked for him and the Pacers are so much better because of it. We are 11-4 in that stretch.
          Those are All-star numbers. That would be "LeBron-esque" in terms of all-around stat-stuffing.

          Comment


          • Re: Is Paul George becoming a star?

            To give those numbers some scope:

            At 20.7 ppg Paul would be the #8 scorer in the NBA.

            Of players averaging 20+ppg (there are 10 players averaging 20 or more):
            2 average more rebounds than PG. 6 average more apg. 4 shoot the 3 better. 7 have a better shooting % than Paul. 1 averages more blocks. 2 average more steals.

            Now obviously this is a 15 game sample for PG while the entire season for the other 10 (which is 25-30 games). So keep that in mind. But regardless, this 15 game period has been featured some really incredible basketball from PG.

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            • Re: Is Paul George becoming a star?

              Whats the max PG can get coming off his rookie deal?
              If games are won and lost on a calculator and piece of paper, then why do we bother to play them?

              @LetsTalkPacers

              Comment


              • Re: Is Paul George becoming a star?

                Originally posted by LetsTalkPacers84 View Post
                Whats the max PG can get coming off his rookie deal?
                25% of the salary cap that year + the normal escalation value per year. Unless he makes an all-nba team the next two years. In which case it will be 30%.

                So most likely a James harden 5 year/80 million type contract.
                Time for a new sig.

                Comment


                • Re: Is Paul George becoming a star?

                  Originally posted by aamcguy View Post
                  25% of the salary cap that year + the normal escalation value per year. Unless he makes an all-nba team the next two years. In which case it will be 30%.

                  So most likely a James harden 5 year/80 million type contract.


                  Not saying he isn't going to be worth it. But, damn.

                  Lets say that happens, in '14/'15 you'd have:

                  George - $16M
                  Hibbert - $15M
                  Hill - $8M (Really starting to look better and better every day)
                  Mahinmi - $4M
                  Green - $3.5M

                  Total: $46.5M

                  Lets say West gets a 3/$30M, Granger 3/$40M, that gets you up to basically $70M, and you need a backup 1, 4, 2. There's no way, right? Unless you get Granger at a big discount? Like, sub $10M/per, I would think.

                  Man. At times I really hate the business aspect of this game.

                  Comment


                  • Re: Is Paul George becoming a star?

                    Originally posted by Derek2k3 View Post


                    Not saying he isn't going to be worth it. But, damn.

                    Lets say that happens, in '14/'15 you'd have:

                    George - $16M
                    Hibbert - $15M
                    Hill - $8M (Really starting to look better and better every day)
                    Mahinmi - $4M
                    Green - $3.5M

                    Total: $46.5M

                    Lets say West gets a 3/$30M, Granger 3/$40M, that gets you up to basically $70M, and you need a backup 1, 4, 2. There's no way, right? Unless you get Granger at a big discount? Like, sub $10M/per, I would think.

                    Man. At times I really hate the business aspect of this game.
                    At the same time, as a fan when you think about how difficult it's going to be it makes you happy you can decide to just be okay with whatever decision the FO makes and be glad you don't have to make such a public, important decision.

                    There is the possibility we do something like ink West to a longer deal for a lower per year rate and work w/ the front load/back loading of both to give us cap space as George/Hibberts' salaries increase. And there's always the chance Granger doesn't come back as well as we hope from his injury and only merits a 6-8 million a year deal when he re-ups. There's a lot of ifs and that's before you even consider that we might get offered a deal we can't pass up . And Stephenson. Too much to speculate on w/out overthinking I think haha
                    Time for a new sig.

                    Comment


                    • Re: Is Paul George becoming a star?

                      Originally posted by rexnom
                      There is some finagling possible. Definitely with the West and Granger deals.

                      More importantly, we'll probably let Paul hit RFA, which means the Green contract expires when we want to re-sign him. And, his deal will have raises, which means that it will be on the low end while the Granger and West deals are at their highest.

                      Really, you're looking at the following for '14/'15:

                      George - $4.5M
                      Hibbert - $15M
                      Hill - $8M
                      Mahinmi - $4M
                      Green - $3.5M

                      and then, for '15/'16:

                      George - $14(ish)M
                      Hibbert - $15M
                      Hill - $8M
                      Mahinmi - $4M

                      Our salary situation is actually not that bad, if we keep together our core. More important question will arise, however, about Lance and Ian and the types of deals we want to give them.

                      http://hoopshype.com/salaries/indiana.htm
                      We won't have George for 4.5M in 2014. If that happens, that means he's playing on his RFA tender and we've ****** him off so much that he's opted to wait a year in order to hit unrestricted FA. So you're right on the numbers but off on the timing.
                      Time for a new sig.

                      Comment


                      • Re: Is Paul George becoming a star?

                        Originally posted by aamcguy View Post
                        We won't have George for 4.5M in 2014. If that happens, that means he's playing on his RFA tender and we've ****** him off so much that he's opted to wait a year in order to hit unrestricted FA. So you're right on the numbers but off on the timing.
                        Good catch. Read the column incorrectly--didn't think they would have the tender (it's late). The points remain: 1.) low-end of a series of raises in '14/'15 and 2.) bigger questions will be about what to do with Lance/Ian.

                        Comment


                        • Re: Is Paul George becoming a star?

                          Paul George is 11 points away from being the Pacers leading scorer. So here in a few short games, his resume will say, "Pacers leading scorer." That certainly helps his All-star game bid.

                          I'm really starting to think it is going to happen. He is a fantastic defender. The rest of the NBA has noted this. They know what he's doing on that side of the court. He's at 16.9 points per game but that'll continue to rise. He's been throwing up 20 a game.

                          His numbers to start out weren't that efficient but they continue to improve. His TS% is now at 54% on the season. It should be better, but it is better than guys like Rudy Gay, Joe Johnson, Luol Deng, and Josh Smith (for perspective).

                          Comment


                          • Re: Is Paul George becoming a star?

                            Originally posted by mattie View Post
                            Paul George is 11 points away from being the Pacers leading scorer. So here in a few short games, his resume will say, "Pacers leading scorer." That certainly helps his All-star game bid.

                            I'm really starting to think it is going to happen. He is a fantastic defender. The rest of the NBA has noted this. They know what he's doing on that side of the court. He's at 16.9 points per game but that'll continue to rise. He's been throwing up 20 a game.

                            His numbers to start out weren't that efficient but they continue to improve. His TS% is now at 54% on the season. It should be better, but it is better than guys like Rudy Gay, Joe Johnson, Luol Deng, and Josh Smith (for perspective).
                            And to think that at the beginning of the year I was angry that people were expecting too much of him. I was so sure he was going to be an above average scorer and super utility player for his career.
                            Time for a new sig.

                            Comment


                            • Re: Is Paul George becoming a star?

                              George really has a chance to be a special, special player.

                              I'm talking top 10-15 player in the NBA.

                              He's certainly played like an Easy all-star for over a month now. I don't doubt he'll be our leading scorer before long. The next step is George learning to get to the line like he did last night, he has great body control and has been getting into the lane with ease, now he needs to start getting free throws and he'll be a shoe in for 20+ most nights.
                              Goodbye Captain, My Captain. I wish you had the chance to sink or swim with your ship on its quest for the "ship".

                              Comment


                              • Re: Is Paul George becoming a star?

                                Just for those still interested in the McGrady- George comparison over their first few years in the league I thought I'd give an update

                                Tracy McGrady 3rd season, Per 36

                                17.7 ppg
                                7.3 rpg
                                3.8 apg
                                1.3 spg
                                2.2 bpg

                                .509 TS%
                                24.9% USG

                                George

                                16.7 ppg
                                7.8 rpg
                                3.6 apg
                                1.6 spg
                                .7 bpg

                                .520 TS%
                                USG% 23.8

                                Awfully similar numbers on the surface, Paul being a better rebounder and stealer, McGrady having a slight volume scoring advantage (though less efficiently) and being a much better shotblocker.

                                The big difference between the two is that McGrady got the line alot more, (5.7 his 3rd and 6.8 his 4th per 36) whereas Paul gets to the line just 2.8 times per game.

                                If Paul learns to draw fouls more effectively, and making the All-Star game will help with that, then I don't think him scoring in the mid 20's is as out of the realm of probability as I used to think, since he's broken out (and i'm confident in saying that it isn't a fluke after 22 games)

                                He's averaged

                                19.6 ppg
                                8.8 rpg
                                3.9 apg
                                2 spg

                                despite not really getting the benefit of the doubt on calls most nights. He gets his free throw attempts up to about 5-6+ per night, like I believe he can with some love from the refs and continued focus on attacking the basket and I won't be suprised to see him averaging well into the 20's in a year or two. Perhaps even over the last few months of the season if Danny is back and takes some focus off of Paul defensively, conflated with his inclusion in the All-Star game and resulting ref-love that most perimeter stars get.

                                I really believe that Paul is going to be special, and one of the best Pacers ever, I wouldn't be suprised to see 23-25 ppg 8.5-10 rpg 4-5 apg 1.5+ spg from Paul in his prime. He's laying a great foundation this season, and it's getting to the point where he's dropping 18-10 games without my even particularly thinking he's played spectacularly. He is becoming a star, he's something special.
                                Goodbye Captain, My Captain. I wish you had the chance to sink or swim with your ship on its quest for the "ship".

                                Comment

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